|
Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
|
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2013 8:03 PM
Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/11/2013 8:35 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
Not good. Doesn't bode well for the future. What happened to being able to play for one of the best "players coach" in the country and the fanantical Hawkeye fan base as draws for recruits? The Iowa FB program seems to have lost it's appeal to the top flight recruits as we can't seem to reign in any 4* recruits, let alone any 5*'s.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
- I74Hawk
- Sophomore
- 336 posts this site
|
Posted: 1/11/2013 10:37 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
Our coaches are lazy and the results are predictable.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 7:03 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
But according to one of KFs press conferences after the 4 and 8 season...."its not like we have to climb MT Everest" ....yeah... I think KF has lost it upstairs. He lacks imagination, foresight, and motivation. These recruiting woes piss me off to no end...the man coaches his worse season in years and our record sucked...you'd think KF would at least try to improve our edge in the recruiting area. What am I thinking....why should we expect more from captain comfortable.
Last edited 1/12/2013 9:42 AM by IOWA308
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 8:57 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
comfortable, complacent, careful, capitulating, captain Kirk. All this for a mere $4 million per year.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
- hawkjth
- HI Legend
- 7505 posts this site
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 11:42 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
Anyone bother to read the article?
Based on their own numbers, there are only 7 teams ahead of Iowa in overall average stars/recruit at 2.91,with Maryland barely ahead of them at 2.94.
So, basically, we are behind OSU,Mich,MSU,Neb,Wis and PSU.....what a shock! Those programs have every edge in homestate Div 1 preps,and legacy. MSU and Wisky have won their divisions in the last two years,and the other four programs are the ''legacy'' Big 4 programs in the Big Ten,as designated by Delany.
I defy anyone to tell me what coach is going to consistently outrecruit the Big 4 at Iowa.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 11:46 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
2005 Iowa signed a top 10 class in the nation. That class was a huge bust. We typically have better luck when we are nationally ranked in the mid-30's. What our coaches need to keep in mind that for every Bob Sanders, there are 7-8 two star guys that can't play a lick of football. Keep brining in the high 3 star guys and we will be back on track.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 12:09 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
cwhawkeye wrote: 2005 Iowa signed a top 10 class in the nation. That class was a huge bust. We typically have better luck when we are nationally ranked in the mid-30's. What our coaches need to keep in mind that for every Bob Sanders, there are 7-8 two star guys that can't play a lick of football. Keep brining in the high 3 star guys and we will be back on track. Yeah...not so fast. Key contributors to the 2009 Orange Bowl team, from the 05' recruiting class are as follows: Pat Angerer Dace Richardson Rafeal Eubanks Kyle Calloway Trey Stross Tony Moeaki Andy Kuempel Now, most of these guys suffered injury problems. So we didn't get many healthy seasons out of them but you gotta admit that that was most of our OLine for that season and Tony and Pat were indispensable. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 1:22 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
I defy this whole bullshit myth that Iowa can rarely or never out recruit the big four. This all stems from having the same old coach, the same old system, and the same old belief that we are just iowa. This is the thought process some people buy into when your program keeps a coach for over a DECADE!! This is why We are overdue for a whole new ENERGIZED coach and staff. I hope to God someday Iowa can bring in one of the elite coaches out there or a new upcoming aggressive coach in college football to debunk the old KF myth that we are just little ole iowa....KF will never change this attitude as long as he is here...he needs to be thanked for his services at Iowa and shown the door!
---------------------------------------------
--- hawkjth wrote:
Anyone bother to read the article?
Based on their own numbers, there are only 7 teams ahead of Iowa in overall average stars/recruit at 2.91,with Maryland barely ahead of them at 2.94.
So, basically, we are behind OSU,Mich,MSU,Neb,Wis and PSU.....what a shock! Those programs have every edge in homestate Div 1 preps,and legacy. MSU and Wisky have won their divisions in the last two years,and the other four programs are the ''legacy'' Big 4 programs in the Big Ten,as designated by Delany.
I defy anyone to tell me what coach is going to consistently outrecruit the Big 4 at Iowa.
---------------------------------------------
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 3:00 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
It's not a myth unless you can disprove it. I can't recall Iowa consistently recruiting well. A new staff might improve things for awhile but I still have a hard time seeing Iowa up with Michigan/OSU or the southern schools. I guess it's because I don't recall ever having seen this happen before.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 5:01 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
I see your point burp, but we've had only two coaches in this Iowa system since what...1979? I agree with you that we could never consistently out recruit programs like Mich/OSU....but Hayden's success and notoriety sure gave us a great run for the money at times. I wonder sometimes what iowa would of been like if there had been more turnover in Iowa coaching in the last 25 years....maybe none of us can say for sure what our recruiting limitations are since we've had only one really, true aggressive household name of a coach in the last 30 years.
---------------------------------------------
--- kmurp wrote:
It's not a myth unless you can disprove it. I can't recall Iowa consistently recruiting well. A new staff might improve things for awhile but I still have a hard time seeing Iowa up with Michigan/OSU or the southern schools. I guess it's because I don't recall ever having seen this happen before.
---------------------------------------------
Last edited 1/12/2013 5:08 PM by IOWA308
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 5:27 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
It DOES seem as if the first decade of Hayden and Ferentz was the best and, I agree, it does make one wonder if "new blood" at the head position could re-energize things.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 8:20 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
This is the X factor many don't consider....ill be honest...I get bored with arguments about who was better...HF and KF. After ten years...a NEW coaching change is usually needed. Iowa keeps coaches for too long bottom line...these arguments about how iowa can't recruit are maddening to me. We haven't exactly given many DIFFERENT coaches a chance to change this myth....but I hold KF responsible for this defeatist attitude about recruiting and us not being a powerhouse anymore...were just Iowa doesn't work for me. We can do better and we deserve better. KF has been failure since his new contract...the biggest contract debacle in ALL the NCAA.
---------------------------------------------
--- kmurp wrote:
It DOES seem as if the first decade of Hayden and Ferentz was the best and, I agree, it does make one wonder if "new blood" at the head position could re-energize things.
---------------------------------------------
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/12/2013 9:11 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
kmurp wrote: It's not a myth unless you can disprove it. I can't recall Iowa consistently recruiting well. A new staff might improve things for awhile but I still have a hard time seeing Iowa up with Michigan/OSU or the southern schools. I guess it's because I don't recall ever having seen this happen before. If Iowa had a progressive staff that played 21 century football, oh what a thought!
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2013 7:13 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
IOWA308 wrote: But according to one of KFs press conferences after the 4 and 8 season...."its not like we have to climb MT Everest" ....yeah... I think KF has lost it upstairs. He lacks imagination, foresight, and motivation. These recruiting woes piss me off to no end...the man coaches his worse season in years and our record sucked...you'd think KF would at least try to improve our edge in the recruiting area. What am I thinking....why should we expect more from captain comfortable. I used to give Ferentz the benefit of the doubt on quotes like the one above coming from him- but I don't anymore. I think he lives in a land of fantasy. He believes things are much better than they are right now. He ebelieves he has much more talent in his program than there is. He believes his coaching philosophy and methods need no change and are just fine. This attitude is why this program has completely sunk to the level it has--it's been burning a slow, downward burn for the last 8 years. 2012 was just accelerated. Ferentz is incredibly arrogant when it comes to his profession. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2013 7:18 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
RJSimmons wrote:
cwhawkeye wrote: 2005 Iowa signed a top 10 class in the nation. That class was a huge bust. We typically have better luck when we are nationally ranked in the mid-30's. What our coaches need to keep in mind that for every Bob Sanders, there are 7-8 two star guys that can't play a lick of football. Keep brining in the high 3 star guys and we will be back on track. Yeah...not so fast. Key contributors to the 2009 Orange Bowl team, from the 05' recruiting class are as follows:
Pat Angerer
Dace Richardson
Rafeal Eubanks
Kyle Calloway
Trey Stross
Tony Moeaki
Andy Kuempel
Now, most of these guys suffered injury problems. So we didn't get many healthy seasons out of them but you gotta admit that that was most of our OLine for that season and Tony and Pat were indispensable. I typically agree with most of your posts but certainly not this one. You forgot to add Stanzi to the 2005 class list, but the reality it a bust class was a bust. Few of the guys above were anything above average college players and certainly few in the group ever made it to the next level. 50% or more of the 2005 class was gone by the end of their second year on campus. The class never was going to be a lot when that happened. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2013 11:32 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
trojanswest wrote:
RJSimmons wrote:
cwhawkeye wrote: 2005 Iowa signed a top 10 class in the nation. That class was a huge bust. We typically have better luck when we are nationally ranked in the mid-30's. What our coaches need to keep in mind that for every Bob Sanders, there are 7-8 two star guys that can't play a lick of football. Keep brining in the high 3 star guys and we will be back on track. Yeah...not so fast. Key contributors to the 2009 Orange Bowl team, from the 05' recruiting class are as follows:
Pat Angerer
Dace Richardson
Rafeal Eubanks
Kyle Calloway
Trey Stross
Tony Moeaki
Andy Kuempel
Now, most of these guys suffered injury problems. So we didn't get many healthy seasons out of them but you gotta admit that that was most of our OLine for that season and Tony and Pat were indispensable. I typically agree with most of your posts but certainly not this one. You forgot to add Stanzi to the 2005 class list, but the reality it a bust class was a bust. Few of the guys above were anything above average college players and certainly few in the group ever made it to the next level.
50% or more of the 2005 class was gone by the end of their second year on campus. The class never was going to be a lot when that happened. I dont care about the NFL. Several players of the 2205 class did not pan out but 8 players were 5th yr SRs and 6 of 22 starters (I included Stanzi) is a better than 1/4 of the starters on the 09 team. That's a significant contribution. Especially when you weigh it against the # of 2007 commits that contributed to the 2011 season: A team that went 7-6, with 9 of 22 starters and 10 5th YR SRs. Now that class was a bust. Lebron Daniel Mike Daniels Jordan Bernstine Allen Reisner Bruce Davis Marcus Zusavics Adam gettis Broderick Binns Marvin McNutt Tyler Neilson |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/13/2013 11:45 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
trojanswest wrote:
I typically agree with most of your posts but certainly not this one. You forgot to add Stanzi to the 2005 class list, but the reality it a bust class was a bust. Few of the guys above were anything above average college players and certainly few in the group ever made it to the next level.
50% or more of the 2005 class was gone by the end of their second year on campus. The class never was going to be a lot when that happened. Stanzi was not in the 2005 class. He was a 2006 recruit. For some reason this board loves to call the 2005 class a bust. But that does not make it true. This class won an Outback Bowl as seniors and 4th year juniors, and an Orange Bowl as 5th year seniors. And seven members of this class received All Big Ten recognition (and many higher honors) at least once in their careers. That cannot be said of many other recruiting classes, if any. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2013 1:57 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period!
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
- hawkjth
- HI Legend
- 7505 posts this site
|
Posted: 1/14/2013 4:43 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
KF375 wrote: Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period! Sorry, but this is a dumb comparison. First off, our bb frosh class is not top 15....it was pushed out of the top 25 as the recruiting season wore on. Secondly, in bb you only need two recruits to make a rated class, while in football you need numbers...like 15. Third, Iowa produces far more ranked bb prep talent than football,and Fran's ranked bb players are strictly in-state(Gesell is across the river). Oglesby,Uthoff,Woody,and Gesell are the only top 150 players on the bb roster...all instate. If Jok rises to top 150(not yet) then he will be another in-state ranked player. In football, Iowa rarely produces even one top 250 player,and you need 7 of them to be equivalent to bb. Fran is a tireless recruiter,but he still has yet to land a true out of state ranked recruit. KF has to go out of state for 95% of his recruits...big difference. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/14/2013 5:52 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
hawkjth wrote:
KF375 wrote: Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period!
Sorry, but this is a dumb comparison. Agreed, plus we have always had better basketball talent in the state of Iowa, than football.
First off, our bb frosh class is not top 15....it was pushed out of the top 25 as the recruiting season wore on.
Secondly, in bb you only need two recruits to make a rated class, while in football you need numbers...like 15. Yes and no. If you average out the * ratings, its telling, but again, better in state talent in BB.
Third, Iowa produces far more ranked bb prep talent than football,and Fran's ranked bb players are strictly in-state(Gesell is across the river). Oglesby,Uthoff,Woody,and Gesell are the only top 150 players on the bb roster...all instate. If Jok rises to top 150(not yet) then he will be another in-state ranked player.
In football, Iowa rarely produces even one top 250 player,and you need 7 of them to be equivalent to bb. I think we have had our share of top 250 talent in the state of Iowa, for football but its usually 1 per season or every other season.
Fran is a tireless recruiter,but he still has yet to land a true out of state ranked recruit. KF has to go out of state for 95% of his recruits...big difference. Fran is a tireless recruiter. KF, the OC and DC dont go on the road and recruit. There's your difference.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
- hawkjth
- HI Legend
- 7505 posts this site
|
Posted: 1/15/2013 1:13 PM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
C'mon...KF does not go on the road to recruit? I have read many stories of KF on the road. You know this is not true,so why even state it? As for the OC and DC,yes,KF prefers they stay at home during the season,but they go on the road out of season. KOK and Davis both have done that.
Parker now does it. Norm did not due to health reasons,but KF gave him an exemption...due to his excellence...should he have fired Norm?
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/15/2013 5:58 PM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
hawkjth wrote: C'mon...KF does not go on the road to recruit? I have read many stories of KF on the road. Simmons' posts are not meant to be taken seriously. He is also unaware that head coaches are limited to one home visit per recruit by NCAA rules. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/15/2013 9:10 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
hawkjth wrote:
KF375 wrote: Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period!
Sorry, but this is a dumb comparison.
First off, our bb frosh class is not top 15....it was pushed out of the top 25 as the recruiting season wore on.
Secondly, in bb you only need two recruits to make a rated class, while in football you need numbers...like 15.
Third, Iowa produces far more ranked bb prep talent than football,and Fran's ranked bb players are strictly in-state(Gesell is across the river). Oglesby,Uthoff,Woody,and Gesell are the only top 150 players on the bb roster...all instate. If Jok rises to top 150(not yet) then he will be another in-state ranked player.
In football, Iowa rarely produces even one top 250 player,and you need 7 of them to be equivalent to bb.
Fran is a tireless recruiter,but he still has yet to land a true out of state ranked recruit. KF has to go out of state for 95% of his recruits...big difference. Sorry not a dumb comparison. It's a relative, scaled down. Fran has already been able to get players here that previous coaches never could. Woodbury turned down Carolina!! Thats like KF getting a QB that turned down Alabama. My simple point is good players are good players no matter the sport or how many are in the starting lineup! If he can lure them to IC and build this team from where it started than KF has ZERO excuse!!!!! KF lost French to Oregon in 2011, Amara Darboh to Michigan in 2012, and Jake Campos to Iowa State in 2013! He cant even keep the top in state talent. Looks like Fran will. What will your excuse be when Fran lands the PG from Illinois? Or another stud from out of state? Can we compare them then? The difference is Fran doesnt make excuses or accept failure!
Last edited 1/15/2013 9:19 PM by KF375
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/15/2013 9:20 PM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
hawkjth wrote: C'mon...KF does not go on the road to recruit? I have read many stories of KF on the road. You know this is not true,so why even state it? As for the OC and DC,yes,KF prefers they stay at home during the season,but they go on the road out of season. KOK and Davis both have done that.
Parker now does it. Norm did not due to health reasons,but KF gave him an exemption...due to his excellence...should he have fired Norm? He may very well go to see specific recruits, that he really wants, after an assistant coach has done the leg work. Even if I give you that, what's your argument for Careful Kirk having stated, many times, that he doesnt want his coordinators on the road recruiting?That's not me saying that, its Kirk Ferentz! If you want me to dig up the links to press conferences where he has said that very thing, let me know.Do you think Fran would voluntarily exempt any of his assistants from the recruiting trail? I thought not. How about Urban Meyer or Brady Hoke? Do they expect all of their assistant coaches to hit the trail? Edit: You guys think what you want. I don't care to argue with you.
Last edited 1/15/2013 9:53 PM by RJSimmons
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 2:33 AM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
I have been following recruiting for 30+ years and yes Iowa is at a huge Geographical disadvantage. We annually bring in kids from up to a dozen states, it cost more to recruit these kids and every year we seem to get kids who become home sick.
Iowa annually has maybe 2-4 D1 players, look at Ohio (everywhere, Cincy but especially the Cleveland, Akron, Youngstown, Canton area - really good, hard nosed football in these blue collar cities), Michigan(Detroit, Flint,Grand Rapids), Illinois(Chicago), Indiana (Indianapolis) even Wisconsin (Milwaukee). All of Pennsylvania is a hot bed also. I have lived in Ohio, Georgia and now Michigan and have watched high school ball in all three. The talent level is higher, especially in the skill positions.
Yes the Hawks are at a disadvantage and I think Kirk has brought in numerous classes ranked in the low top 25 range with 2005 being an anomoly when Illinois and ND lost there coaches the same year and we cleaned up in Chicago. Anyone who says our staff is lazy is uninformed, because these guys log significant miles and have to do a better job evaluating film on the front end.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 3:42 AM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
We rank low in recruiting at a low point in Iowa football. This is because of our wonderful captain complacent. When in the hell are you chuggers going to realize substandard is now the standard at iowa....our 2012 season and our recruiting SEASON thus far STINKS to high heavens!!! This coaching staff is out dated, under qualified, and is becoming what KF always was...were just Iowa. WE NEED NEW BLOOD IN IOWA. SCREW GEOGRAPHICS...GET AN AGGRESSIVE, VISIONARY COACH HERE AND HE WILL PROVE ALL OF KF DEFEATIST WRONG ABOUT RECRUITING AND WINNING AGAIN!!! QUIT giving our doodah of a coach a pass. WE STINK AND ARE GOING TO GET STINKIER UNDER THIS FILTHY RICH COACH WHO HASNT PRODUCED!!!!!
---------------------------------------------
--- Meterman wrote:
I have been following recruiting for 30+ years and yes Iowa is at a huge Geographical disadvantage. We annually bring in kids from up to a dozen states, it cost more to recruit these kids and every year we seem to get kids who become home sick.
Iowa annually has maybe 2-4 D1 players, look at Ohio (everywhere, Cincy but especially the Cleveland, Akron, Youngstown, Canton area - really good, hard nosed football in these blue collar cities), Michigan(Detroit, Flint,Grand Rapids), Illinois(Chicago), Indiana (Indianapolis) even Wisconsin (Milwaukee). All of Pennsylvania is a hot bed also. I have lived in Ohio, Georgia and now Michigan and have watched high school ball in all three. The talent level is higher, especially in the skill positions.
Yes the Hawks are at a disadvantage and I think Kirk has brought in numerous classes ranked in the low top 25 range with 2005 being an anomoly when Illinois and ND lost there coaches the same year and we cleaned up in Chicago. Anyone who says our staff is lazy is uninformed, because these guys log significant miles and have to do a better job evaluating film on the front end.
---------------------------------------------
Last edited 1/16/2013 3:46 AM by IOWA308
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 10:02 AM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
I agree with you. I would not confuse lazy with incompetence. And not having an "all hands on deck" approach to recruiting is self defeating.
---------------------------------------------
--- Meterman wrote:
I have been following recruiting for 30+ years and yes Iowa is at a huge Geographical disadvantage. We annually bring in kids from up to a dozen states, it cost more to recruit these kids and every year we seem to get kids who become home sick.
Iowa annually has maybe 2-4 D1 players, look at Ohio (everywhere, Cincy but especially the Cleveland, Akron, Youngstown, Canton area - really good, hard nosed football in these blue collar cities), Michigan(Detroit, Flint,Grand Rapids), Illinois(Chicago), Indiana (Indianapolis) even Wisconsin (Milwaukee). All of Pennsylvania is a hot bed also. I have lived in Ohio, Georgia and now Michigan and have watched high school ball in all three. The talent level is higher, especially in the skill positions.
Yes the Hawks are at a disadvantage and I think Kirk has brought in numerous classes ranked in the low top 25 range with 2005 being an anomoly when Illinois and ND lost there coaches the same year and we cleaned up in Chicago. Anyone who says our staff is lazy is uninformed, because these guys log significant miles and have to do a better job evaluating film on the front end.
---------------------------------------------
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 10:28 AM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
Personally, I think 2010, 2011 and 2012 were good years for recruiting. We should reep the benefits from those signings in the next few years. This years class, although not rated highly, could end up very nice with a couple late committments.
Geographic location does matter. Ask Ross Pierschbacher and Delano Hill. Both wanted to play for the team they grew up rooting for. Look at Texas. They have 13 commits so far and 12 of them are from in state. 10 of the 12 are rated 4* or higher. It should not, however, be used as an excuse. Look at what Nebraska does year in and year out. But it does make it more difficult.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 11:35 AM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
It's not a myth unless you can disprove it. I can't recall Iowa consistently recruiting well. A new staff might improve things for awhile but I still have a hard time seeing Iowa up with Michigan/OSU or the southern schools. I guess it's because I don't recall ever having seen this happen before.
Just because it hasnt been done before doesnt mean it cant be done. Recruiting rankings are relatively recent. Rankings existed during Fry's tenure but they werent like they are now, and hell, he even got the number 1 player in the country according to some rankings (Willie Guy).
I guarantee if Iowa had an Urban Meyer they could recruit with the best of them, he is relentless in his efforts. No one is saying that its easy, it would require doing what ISN'T being done now, scouring the nation and doing whatever it takes. At osu, Meyer gets top 5 classes, at Iowa he may only get top 15 clasees but that is still better than what is happening currently. KF's priority is coaching NOT recruiting. Problem is, talent wins in college football |
|
Reply |
Quote |
- hawkjth
- HI Legend
- 7505 posts this site
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 2:34 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
KF375 wrote:
hawkjth wrote:
KF375 wrote: Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period!
Sorry, but this is a dumb comparison.
First off, our bb frosh class is not top 15....it was pushed out of the top 25 as the recruiting season wore on.
Secondly, in bb you only need two recruits to make a rated class, while in football you need numbers...like 15.
Third, Iowa produces far more ranked bb prep talent than football,and Fran's ranked bb players are strictly in-state(Gesell is across the river). Oglesby,Uthoff,Woody,and Gesell are the only top 150 players on the bb roster...all instate. If Jok rises to top 150(not yet) then he will be another in-state ranked player.
In football, Iowa rarely produces even one top 250 player,and you need 7 of them to be equivalent to bb.
Fran is a tireless recruiter,but he still has yet to land a true out of state ranked recruit. KF has to go out of state for 95% of his recruits...big difference. Sorry not a dumb comparison. It's a relative, scaled down. Fran has already been able to get players here that previous coaches never could. Woodbury turned down Carolina!! Thats like KF getting a QB that turned down Alabama. My simple point is good players are good players no matter the sport or how many are in the starting lineup! If he can lure them to IC and build this team from where it started than KF has ZERO excuse!!!!! KF lost French to Oregon in 2011, Amara Darboh to Michigan in 2012, and Jake Campos to Iowa State in 2013! He cant even keep the top in state talent. Looks like Fran will. What will your excuse be when Fran lands the PG from Illinois? Or another stud from out of state? Can we compare them then? The difference is Fran doesnt make excuses or accept failure! In Frans first class,the top player in Iowa,Harrison Barnes,went to UNC. In his second class the top player in Iowa,Uthoff,went to Wisconsin. IN his third year,the top player in Iowa,Marcus Paige,went to UNC. As for KF, Wegher chose Iowa over Auburn. Pierschbacher chose Iowa over ND and OK. So did Keenan Davis. Here is the point....Fran is doing fine,but guys who grow up UNC or Michigan fans like Paige and Arrington are hard to keep in state. As for Fran doing what no previous coaches had done...not true. Horner,Brunner and Haluska were top 60 players,and SA got them (Haluska with a transfer). Worley was top 30. Reiner was top 35. Evans was a top 10 Juco. SA had a top 10 class in his second year. Some instate guys will get away,like Hinrich,LaFrentz,McDermott,Barnes,Paige and Collison. The good news for Fran is that Iowa produces all-american quality talent like this in bb way more often than in fb. Who was the last Iowa prep who turned out to be an all-american QB? Randy Duncan? Do not even think he was from Iowa. |
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 4:07 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
There is no argument that basketball has better in state talent than football. Year in and year out.
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 4:37 PM
RE: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
RJ, Im sure meterman is a great American....with his experience at following recruiting for 30 + Years and living in hot bed recruiting areas throughout his years ....I want meterman to be our recruiting specialist at iowa...Mavis can be his assistant. I want you RJSimmons ...to be our new head coach....I'm being serious about this.....you know why....BECAUSE you guys could probably do better than KF and HIS staff!!!! You guys catch my drift yet? ANYONE CAN DO BETTER THAN THIS INEPT CREW. Now on another point, I'd like reiterate that we've only had two coaches at Iowa for the last 30 damned years....one of them being a self professed defeatist cuz we're just iowa...That being said, There is no way in hell any of us could know how we would stack up with the BIG four in recruiting if we had an aggressive, progressive, and winning coach here...and please ....spare me on a grown man missing mommy and daddy at home to meterman. a damned football player can do it! IF WE HAD A WINNING COACH HERE...im sure the guy wouldnt hesitate to leave pennsylvannia to play at iowa...lol. We need to quit listening to KFs bullshit and we need to stop making excuses for his comfortable ass.
---------------------------------------------
--- RJSimmons wrote:
I agree with you. I would not confuse lazy with incompetence. And not having an "all hands on deck" approach to recruiting is self defeating.
---------------------------------------------
--- Meterman wrote:
I have been following recruiting for 30+ years and yes Iowa is at a huge Geographical disadvantage. We annually bring in kids from up to a dozen states, it cost more to recruit these kids and every year we seem to get kids who become home sick.
Iowa annually has maybe 2-4 D1 players, look at Ohio (everywhere, Cincy but especially the Cleveland, Akron, Youngstown, Canton area - really good, hard nosed football in these blue collar cities), Michigan(Detroit, Flint,Grand Rapids), Illinois(Chicago), Indiana (Indianapolis) even Wisconsin (Milwaukee). All of Pennsylvania is a hot bed also. I have lived in Ohio, Georgia and now Michigan and have watched high school ball in all three. The talent level is higher, especially in the skill positions.
Yes the Hawks are at a disadvantage and I think Kirk has brought in numerous classes ranked in the low top 25 range with 2005 being an anomoly when Illinois and ND lost there coaches the same year and we cleaned up in Chicago. Anyone who says our staff is lazy is uninformed, because these guys log significant miles and have to do a better job evaluating film on the front end.
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
|
|
Posted: 1/16/2013 4:40 PM
Re: Newest BIG recruiting rankings. Hawks are 11th.
hawkjth wrote:
KF375 wrote:
hawkjth wrote:
KF375 wrote: Sure doesnt seem like Fran is going to have a hard time bringing great players to lil ole Iowa. He just had a top 15 class and I expect he will keep it up! With Uthoff and Jok next year thats a great class! So why can Fran do it on the heels of the worst basketball in Iowa history but KF can't do it on the heels of all his past glory??
He is just lazy! Fran would work circles around him period!
Sorry, but this is a dumb comparison.
First off, our bb frosh class is not top 15....it was pushed out of the top 25 as the recruiting season wore on.
Secondly, in bb you only need two recruits to make a rated class, while in football you need numbers...like 15.
Third, Iowa produces far more ranked bb prep talent than football,and Fran's ranked bb players are strictly in-state(Gesell is across the river). Oglesby,Uthoff,Woody,and Gesell are the only top 150 players on the bb roster...all instate. If Jok rises to top 150(not yet) then he will be another in-state ranked player.
In football, Iowa rarely produces even one top 250 player,and you need 7 of them to be equivalent to bb.
Fran is a tireless recruiter,but he still has yet to land a true out of state ranked recruit. KF has to go out of state for 95% of his recruits...big difference. Sorry not a dumb comparison. It's a relative, scaled down. Fran has already been able to get players here that previous coaches never could. Woodbury turned down Carolina!! Thats like KF getting a QB that turned down Alabama. My simple point is good players are good players no matter the sport or how many are in the starting lineup! If he can lure them to IC and build this team from where it started than KF has ZERO excuse!!!!! KF lost French to Oregon in 2011, Amara Darboh to Michigan in 2012, and Jake Campos to Iowa State in 2013! He cant even keep the top in state talent. Looks like Fran will. What will your excuse be when Fran lands the PG from Illinois? Or another stud from out of state? Can we compare them then? The difference is Fran doesnt make excuses or accept failure!
In Frans first class,the top player in Iowa,Harrison Barnes,went to UNC. In his second class the top player in Iowa,Uthoff,went to Wisconsin. IN his third year,the top player in Iowa,Marcus Paige,went to UNC. As for KF, Wegher chose Iowa over Auburn. Pierschbacher chose Iowa over ND and OK. So did Keenan Davis.
Here is the point....Fran is doing fine,but guys who grow up UNC or Michigan fans like Paige and Arrington are hard to keep in state. As for Fran doing what no previous coaches had done...not true. Horner,Brunner and Haluska were top 60 players,and SA got them (Haluska with a transfer). Worley was top 30. Reiner was top 35. Evans was a top 10 Juco. SA had a top 10 class in his second year.
Some instate guys will get away,like Hinrich,LaFrentz,McDermott,Barnes,Paige and Collison. The good news for Fran is that Iowa produces all-american quality talent like this in bb way more often than in fb. Who was the last Iowa prep who turned out to be an all-american QB? Randy Duncan? Do not even think he was from Iowa. You make some good points! The difference is I think there will come a point sooner rather than later, that Fran gets those out of state kids too. He will get some players that pick us over the elite schools as well as keep the in state talent here. If he can lure the out of state talent here then Ferentz ought to be able to as well. So I guess for now the jury is still out but I sure like where Fran is headed more than KF!!!!
Last edited 1/16/2013 4:41 PM by KF375
|
|
Reply |
Quote |
The Swarm