Both post a pic with alcohol and perpetrating disposable income in atypical (non-neighborhood) setting.

Neither are shown consuming the alcohol or spending/receiving any monies.

One is immediately applauded as a prankster and fun-loving guy with all the right stories and a promising career as a rising sophomore and Heisman front runner ( his would be second ).

The other was investigated to the fullest and subsequently expelled from the league launching a two year investigation deep into the bowels of the program. The program tried in the media and convicted in the court of public opinion. Coaches that were not even implicated lost their jobs. Others that were never convicted of Anything lost theirs as well. Players names were tarnished and eligibility was lost for such trivial things as having unpaid parking tickets and spending the night at former teammates and room mates homes.

Sure. There were "infractions" found. In a witch hunt there always are. What I still don't understand and what has been recently re-introduced to my misunderstanding of this travesty via the Manziel news is how all of this came from a simple photograph.

Please tell me what I am missing. Also please explain why, if it "happens everywhere" the same potential situation is not gearing up in College Station. Or is it?

I hate to say it ,but what you are forgetting is the COLOR of their skin!!!!

Really.

The only/best explanation is race.

?

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

NT

No. No. I get it. And I definitely do not want to be in on every other post here but I understand improprieties were discovered. I am just questioning the means by which the discovery process was initiated. I do not think there is one player in our program that could have posted a pic holding Dom and flashing cash in a casino without the NCAA and ESPN crawling all the way up inside our a**hole. Means or not. And yet I hear not even a peep about this with a guy with star power from another program.

Stop acting silly! Yes really ,and it has nothing to do with"something I can think of".Don't get it twisted,it reality!

---------------------------------------------
--- carolinarolls wrote:

Really.

The only/best explanation is race.

?

---------------------------------------------

Come on man,there is a different when everyone knows your family n they played pro ball! I really dont see how you can compare the two!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------
+1

Manziel was with his parents at the place in the picture. It was after the bowl game and in Texas it is legal to drink with your parents when served by them.

Nothing to do with race or sec.

**edit**
aol.sportingnews.com/ncaa-foot...win-club-21-age

How did race figure into the TWO Clemson players pictured fanning unusually large amounts of cash without triggering an NCAA investigation?

The most apparent difference between the tow is that one of them showed their talent on every single down and the other showed more promise than performance. That's why one won the Heisman and the other one had nice dreads.

Ok so far we have race and I'm not going there, and perceived financial means.

Do alarms go off when this type of pic is posted and the "understanding" is that a kid has or has not the means to, and lets be honest here, beat the rap? Does that perceived knowledge of the situation represent valid enough reason to launch an investigation?

Is that investigation launched more readily against players without perceived financial means to beat it?

Lets face it. There are As many or more slime las trying to "get at" Johnny Football as there are/were Marvin.
Also, the fact that parents were or were not present does not automatically rule out foul play.

I don't want the a&m kid to get the business here and I am not bitter about Marvin and what ensued. I do see liberties being taken akin to profiling on some level and I wonder how far it goes and what the media vampires are looking for.

Was it the school? A Prestigious public with impeccable history.
Was it the program? Basketball powerhouse trying to double dip.

Something is off.

Manziel comes from a family with money, pretty sure his dad is in the oil business. Probably one reason why it is isn't so suspicious seeing him flaunt money. With that said I think he is quickly learning he now has a target on his back and he needs to be careful about how he presents himself especially through social media.

How is it different if it is known that your family has money? We know those two examples I gave have money (or should have money) because of sports. Why is it so hard to figure out someone else has money because they are known in business?

Again, none of us know what questions Manziel has answered. The assumption every time these threads start is that there has not been a peep. How do you know the NCAA hasn't called A+M? How do you know they didn't have someone speak to him after winning the Heisman, explaining what benefits he can accept based on winning the award?



---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

Come on man,there is a different when everyone knows your family n they played pro ball! I really dont see how you can compare the two!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

My point exactly,it seems like you want to point to everything but whats clear!If Manziel's parents were FAMOUS( in which people know this) for being good buisness people.Thats different ,but they are not know around the US for this! So you dont think race plays a roll in this?

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

How is it different if it is known that your family has money? We know those two examples I gave have money (or should have money) because of sports. Why is it so hard to figure out someone else has money because they are known in business?

Again, none of us know what questions Manziel has answered. The assumption every time these threads start is that there has not been a peep. How do you know the NCAA hasn't called A+M? How do you know they didn't have someone speak to him after winning the Heisman, explaining what benefits he can accept based on winning the award?



---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

Come on man,there is a different when everyone knows your family n they played pro ball! I really dont see how you can compare the two!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

OK.

So apparently this kid comes from a family with perceived financial means. Some even go so far as to say that his family is famous for being financially savvy and others say that kids with famous parents would seemingly be treated similarly ahd they posted something similarly to what was posted by Marvin and Johnny.

This is wrong. Ethically and morally it is wrong. Think back to before the Marvin story became a story. What happened. What made it a story. Any one of these media knob-heads who ran with it, if put on the stand and answered with immunity, would say that at some point in the "creative process", the thought "this kid is poor and his family is poor" was a large contributing factor to giving this investigation the green light. Furthermore that person would also almost assuredly answer that they had no "real knowledge" or "proof" of the financial status of Marvin. Marvin's immediate family. Marvin's extended family, and Marvin's network of friends and people who have influence with him.

How would they?

The fact that a violation did in fact take place is not the point. The assumptions and conclusions that were drawn in the ramp-up to kicking over the first rock or two is what is wrong. Someone smarter than I can maybe explain why I am being self-righteous here or expound on the point I am making so terribly I hope.

All I know is that based on this, something I just cannot deny after careful consideration, I hope our recruiting efforts begin to take into consideration the financial status of our prospects. As we all know in a witch hunt a witch is always found. So maybe one kid jumps higher, funs faster, and studies harder. We need to consider sacrificing a bit of these decent qualities to insure we don't get falsely investigated and tried ion the court of public opinion ever again. /sarcasm

Seriously though, we need to educate our athletes more on what they share. Especially the poor ones. /sarcasm again.

I agree with the original poster. The witchhunt was on for some reason with our program and it snowballed, no matter what was done.

Whats clear is that you decided it was about race and won't consider any other possible view. I am usually the one that gets a lot of crap for suggesting race plays a role in things. I'm on the other side of this one because there is no basis to back it up. You are using a ridiculous test. They have to be well known around the entire country for it NOT to be about race?? No. And by "it" I mean the fantasy that you believe that there has been zero due diligence into Manziel's spending or benefits.

Please admit you haven't a clue as to whether the NCAA has talked to A+M, talked to the family etc. If you have evidence, proof, a link to back up the fantasy that you are going with please share. Because as it stands what you are saying is that you want a full scale investigation of him and his spending because he is white.

YOU didn't know the family had money, so it must be about race to YOU. You cannot possibly understand how few shts I give about what an uninformed person doesn't know.

It took other fans about 3 minutes of google/internet research to find out that his family has enough money for him to afford to do everything he's been photographed doing 100 times. But no, the NCAA is ignoring these clear violations and extra benefits because he's white, and not because his family has been profiled by the NY Times: www.nytimes.com/2012/11/24/spo...fS%20H7QJfuhZkg

I absolutely think race plays a role in your and other people's fascination with Johnny Manziel and his spending. In fact, thats the only thing you are basing this on. Those of us who took 3 minutes to dig below the surface know better.

That said, lets not forget you don't even know whether your premise (the the NCAA has turned a blind eye) is true!! Not a f'n clue!

---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

My point exactly,it seems like you want to point to everything but whats clear!If Manziel's parents were FAMOUS( in which people know this) for being good buisness people.Thats different ,but they are not know around the US for this! So you dont think race plays a roll in this?

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

How is it different if it is known that your family has money? We know those two examples I gave have money (or should have money) because of sports. Why is it so hard to figure out someone else has money because they are known in business?

Again, none of us know what questions Manziel has answered. The assumption every time these threads start is that there has not been a peep. How do you know the NCAA hasn't called A+M? How do you know they didn't have someone speak to him after winning the Heisman, explaining what benefits he can accept based on winning the award?



---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

Come on man,there is a different when everyone knows your family n they played pro ball! I really dont see how you can compare the two!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

You have me mixed up with someone else. I wish they leave these kids alone,but don't put words in my mouth! I don't care about the nytimes at all! Race does play a role !!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Whats clear is that you decided it was about race and won't consider any other possible view. I am usually the one that gets a lot of crap for suggesting race plays a role in things. I'm on the other side of this one because there is no basis to back it up. You are using a ridiculous test. They have to be well known around the entire country for it NOT to be about race?? No. And by "it" I mean the fantasy that you believe that there has been zero due diligence into Manziel's spending or benefits.

Please admit you haven't a clue as to whether the NCAA has talked to A+M, talked to the family etc. If you have evidence, proof, a link to back up the fantasy that you are going with please share. Because as it stands what you are saying is that you want a full scale investigation of him and his spending because he is white.

YOU didn't know the family had money, so it must be about race to YOU. You cannot possibly understand how few shts I give about what an uninformed person doesn't know.

It took other fans about 3 minutes of google/internet research to find out that his family has enough money for him to afford to do everything he's been photographed doing 100 times. But no, the NCAA is ignoring these clear violations and extra benefits because he's white, and not because his family has been profiled by the NY Times: www.nytimes.com/2012/11/24/spo...fS%20H7QJfuhZkg

I absolutely think race plays a role in your and other people's fascination with Johnny Manziel and his spending. In fact, thats the only thing you are basing this on. Those of us who took 3 minutes to dig below the surface know better.

That said, lets not forget you don't even know whether your premise (the the NCAA has turned a blind eye) is true!! Not a f'n clue!

---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

My point exactly,it seems like you want to point to everything but whats clear!If Manziel's parents were FAMOUS( in which people know this) for being good buisness people.Thats different ,but they are not know around the US for this! So you dont think race plays a roll in this?

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

How is it different if it is known that your family has money? We know those two examples I gave have money (or should have money) because of sports. Why is it so hard to figure out someone else has money because they are known in business?

Again, none of us know what qu
estions Manziel has answered. The assumption every time these threads start is that there has not been a peep. How do you know the NCAA hasn't called A+M? How do you know they didn't have someone speak to him after winning the Heisman, explaining what benefits he can accept based on winning the award?



---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

Come on man,there is a different when everyone knows your family n they played pro ball! I really dont see how you can compare the two!

---------------------------------------------
--- Jheiser3 wrote:

Did you forget the part where Marvin was "in Miami" at a club, talking about spending big money? Thats what raised the flag. The so-called witch hunt into whether he accepted extra benefits... found that he, Quinn and others had accepted extra benefits. money, jewelry etc against NCAA rules.

We don't know anything, ANYTHING, about what questions the NCAA has asked of Manziel. What receipts he has had to show them etc. We do know he has the means, via his family, to pay straight cash for everything he has done that would raise flags such as being courtside at a Mavs game or (gasp) partying after a bowl win. As far as I know there is no NCAA rule against underage drinking.

This is no different than if Tim Hardaway Jr, or Juwan Howard Jr was seen courtside, or in a box at an NFL playoff game. So I don't see how race plays into this one except that the guy that got caught taking money and jewelry here was black.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- jimmydaheel wrote:

How did race figure into the TWO Clemson players pictured fanning unusually large amounts of cash without triggering an NCAA investigation?

---------------------------------------------

Weed be wise to contact the girl who photographed the Clemson players, Mary Jane Sellers. Here's the straight dope: where there's smoke, there's fire. The buzz on the street is that these two playaz were called for holding...

I don't buy that crap.It was an attack on the university.If you're willing to dig, you'll find that at every school.(IMO)

---------------------------------------------
--- TrueKnowledge wrote:

I hate to say it ,but what you are forgetting is the COLOR of their skin!!!!

---------------------------------------------

The lead investigator was Miami's ex AD, who Butch left high and dry

---------------------------------------------
--- stujones23 wrote:

The lead investigator was Miami's ex AD, who Butch left high and dry

---------------------------------------------

Yes, it was a personal vendetta. Forget Gerald, Butch was the real victim here.

Oh please.
---------------------------------------------
--- therabidrev wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- stujones23 wrote:

The lead investigator was Miami's ex AD, who Butch left high and dry

---------------------------------------------

Yes, it was a personal vendetta. Forget Gerald, Butch was the real victim here.

---------------------------------------------

It seems to me that our way of handling these things is to assist them in crawling up there.

---------------------------------------------
--- carolinarolls wrote:

No. No. I get it. And I definitely do not want to be in on every other post here but I understand improprieties were discovered. I am just questioning the means by which the discovery process was initiated. I do not think there is one player in our program that could have posted a pic holding Dom and flashing cash in a casino without the NCAA and ESPN crawling all the way up inside our a**hole. Means or not. And yet I hear not even a peep about this with a guy with star power from another program.

---------------------------------------------

It's more about which one could be prosecuted with the support of the administration which opened the doors wide. It is not about race. Plus the SEC angle.