I thought it was an issue with just us, but attendance across the board is just down this year.

Last night was patheric at the OB. The Superdome has gaps everywhere tonight. The Rose Bowl looked full yesterday.

Is it the economy? Is it apathy? Are there too many bowls?

How will this fare for the playoffs in a coule years? HOw can a fan base travel to a conference champ game, then a national semi two weeks later, then a natty game two weeks later, all in different cities if they won't even go to one bowl game currently?

Probably 2 factors at play here. One is the economy - it has gotten awfully expensive to go to a bowl game. The second reason is the timing of these bowls now. If UNC was playing tonight, I would have had to take 2 more days off from work after already taking 2 weeks for Christmas. Bowls used to be scheduled during the Christmas -New Year's break.

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--- HEELS7678 wrote:

Probably 2 factors at play here. One is the economy - it has gotten awfully expensive to go to a bowl game. The second reason is the timing of these bowls now. If UNC was playing tonight, I would have had to take 2 more days off from work after already taking 2 weeks for Christmas. Bowls used to be scheduled during the Christmas -New Year's break.

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I think you're on the money with this one. The bowls were meant to be vacation time. I was flabbergasted when I turned on the Sugar Bowl tonight. I have never seen it this empty.

I'm sitting at the Sugar Bowl now and the attendance is pathetic...

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--- No Dooky wrote:

I'm sitting at the Sugar Bowl now and the attendance is pathetic...

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Great for the TV broadcast companies & conferences/schools, but
Poor for the City hosting the bowl & the fans who actually attend the games.

Some people do have to work, so I think it's a big problem with these games being played mid week, after long holiday...

We know its all Bush's fault.

The Kenyan has nothing to do with our economy.

IMO, all BCS bowl games should be on New Year's Day, except for the NC game. Which should be on the first Sat after NY Day. TV is killing the attendance by scheduling all these games where people have to take extra vacation time, and it makes no sense. If the Heels were playing tonight I would not be able to attend the game, which would be a shame considering all I ( and we ) have had to go through not just the last two years in Football but the last 25 years.

The bowl match ups haven't really fired up a lot of people. I mean, c'mon, FSU-No. Illinois? That sounds like a September game.

The BCS series, which has 10 teams, should have the best 10 teams, regardless of conference. Put Georgia, Michigan, S. Carolina in the Orange Bowl against FSU and you have a lot more butts in the seats.

I think it may be some matchups, but it's the time as others have said, Bowl games used to be Dec12-Jan 1 and the Christmas break everyone got off for the holidays, now it's like Jan 4 on a Tuesday, who the hell is going to get that off for a bowl game.

And the other factor is with the BCS the other ones dont matter since they dont have any factor into the championship. If you team was 4th coming into Jan 1, you could hope the 3 teams above you lost and you could be number one, now you cant do that, so that may have effected interest as well, but it's mostly the date, put these games back to Jan 1 and then play the closest FRid/Sat/Sun evening to it for the BCSCG and attendance would go up some

I have to agree with several of the reasons. Now we all see what happens when greed gets in the way of good ol amatuer football. I hate to sound like an old timer but I used to look forward to the bowls when I was school age. They almost always were good matchups and most importantly it meant something if a team made it to one. Call it nostalgia but the bowls that I remember, Sun bowl(I curse you James Brown), Cotton, Sugar, Liberty, Copper, Peach, Orange, Gator, Rose, Independence, Citrus and Poinsettia were all that I needed. Now it seems like you have to reward an average team with a post-season game. The term we are all looking for is saturation. The bowl season is over saturated with mediocre matchups in a weak economy and competition with HDTV's at home. To be honest I dont even watch the other bowls unless there is absolutely nothing else on TV I want to watch. My supervisor always tells me dont complain offer solutions. So here are mine.

1. Raise the bowl eligibility to 8 wins. This will ensure that the lower tier bowls are still getting better than average teams and the match-ups are noteworthy

2. Reduce the number of bowl(no brainer) It was a good try to have teams go to bowls in their geographical area but sorry the attendence just doesnt justifiy the TV contract deals-hint to ESPN-no one cares to see Ball St vs USF except Ball St and USF fans...If that sound harsh then sorr but its reality

3. As mentioned earlier-all bowl games should be played during the times most of us are off. I am fortunate that if need be I can take holiday time pretty much anytime I want so I am flexible but everybody doesn't have that luxury. These organizers assume that that those who cant make it will be offset somehow IDK.

Just thought of something. If the bowls are reduced then increasing the win total would be conteractive. Well if thats the case then a selection team could determine the best candidates for that bowl slot if there were shortages. Obviously there would consideration to confernce affiliation. I dont think we will see an FSU-NIU matchup again but a selection team would eliminate that from happening.

It's all about TV folks. That's why the games are spread out so as not to split the TV audience. That's why we have so many conference realignment threads. A playoff system is all about TV not travelling fan bases.

TV is King

and when attendence is down the schools eat even more money from the guaranteed hotel blocks loaded into these bowl contracts. The ones guaranteed to make money are the bowl reps and contractually obligated vendors. Everyone else fights to break even.

Florida sold 7k tickets to the Sugar Bowl.

SB attendance was 54,178 Lowest ever for a BCS game.

That's ridiculous.

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--- mcs333 wrote:

SB attendance was 54,178 Lowest ever for a BCS game.

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Having a national championship game has made all other games/bowls meaningless to some fanbases. Whatever happened to inviting a team and letting the seniors vote on accepting? If Florida felt disappointed at not being in the championship game and just dogged it in the bowl game, shame on them! Gators, next time decline the invitation and let somebody go that will appreciate the experience. BTW, I thought that SEC fans showed up in huge numbers at every game? 7k? Are you kidding me?

Absolutely, economics within households is the biggest contributing factor to reduced bowl attendance. Additionally, the reduced price points of High-Definition TVs makes it easier to watch your favorite team at home rather than dwelling over the economics of how do I justify the tickets, travel, meals, hotel accomodations, etc. associated with supporting your team in a bowl regardless of its tier. For instance, if the Heels were to barely squeak into Hyundai Sun Bowl due to poor record, I probably would not go out the limb to purchase airfare for three (3), car rental, hotel, etc. and would be content to watch the game in my Tar Heel mancave.....simple economics, affordability and the lack of interest in El Paso, TX.

I've never really understood the perceived relationship between too many bowls and poor bowl attendance. Afterall, most fans only attend the one single bowl game of their favorite team. Personally, I've never attended a bowl game where the Tar Heels were not playing. I live in Charlotte and would rather watch the local Belk Bowl on TV rather than spend money and time on two (2) teams where I have no vested interest.

Probably because there isn't one. No one is planning on going to Sugar then decides against it because they'd rather see the New Orleans bowl.

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--- UNC85Heels wrote:

I've never really understood the perceived relationship between too many bowls and poor bowl attendance. Afterall, most fans only attend the one single bowl game of their favorite team. Personally, I've never attended a bowl game where the Tar Heels were not playing. I live in Charlotte and would rather watch the local Belk Bowl on TV rather than spend money and time on two (2) teams where I have no vested interest.

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--- NCtaxguy wrote:

That's ridiculous.

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--- mcs333 wrote:

SB attendance was 54,178 Lowest ever for a BCS game.

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Who would have ever thought that the Sugar Bowl, with an SEC team, couldn't sell it out. TV is making all the money folks, dam* the fans, cities, concessions, restaurants, etc

I never realized it was possible to type without actually possessing a brain. Amazing.

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--- imokub2 wrote:


We know its all Bush's fault.

The Kenyan has nothing to do with our economy.

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You think attendance is bad now, wait until the conference realignments settle in!

When we end up with six or seven "major" conferences there MIGHT be some initial interest in watching the 5th-Place SEC team play the 5th-Place B16 team..........MAYBE.

But the fan interest in these type games will VERY QUICKLY dissipate as people begin to wonder why they are spending THOUSANDS of dollars to take their family to a game pitting their 6-6 Alma Mater play in a game without any significance against another mediocre 6-6 team. I believe that this lack of fan interest will quickly bleed over to impact television ratings.

And, yes, it is all about television. I also believe that the networks are sitting back laughing their asses off as the nitwits running college sports scramble to form the mega-conferences that will only lead to a LOWER cost-per-game for the networks. Seriously, if you were a network exec and you were talking to the nitwit in charge of the the B16 (or any other conference), then how could that nitwit possibly counter your argument that you WILL pay for the Top-20 match-ups and the TRADITIONAL rivalry games, but you're not going to pay extra to televise Maryland-vs-Purdue or other similar games.

Yep. The networks have sold College Athletics a line and the nitwits swallowed it, "hook, line, and sinker". In a year or two schools will realize that the calculators in the athletic department did, in fact, work - it was the operator that was making the miscalculations. The networks will see their "average payment per team" drop from the current $20-25 million to $15-20 million.

In five or ten years the conferences will once again go through a massive realignment, but to much more geographical and SMALLER groupings such as:
ACC = UNC, NCSU, dook, weak forest, usc, Clemson, UVa, and VaTech
SEC = Ala, Auburn, Fla, FSU, Miami, UGa, GaTech, and UAB
GCC = (Gulf Coast Conference) = Miss, MissSt, SoMiss, LSU, UAB, Tulane, Houston, and Rice
Big8 = Texas, TCU, aTm, Baylor, SMU, TexTech, Okla, and OSU
BigSouth = Vandy, Tenn, Memphis, Kensucky, Louisville, Arkansas, Arkansas St, and MTSU or WesternKy
etc. etc.

Such conference alignments will generate more fan interest, better attendance, and more interest in Bowl/Playoff match-ups since many of the match-ups could still generate regional interest (e.g. LSU vs Alabama, or Clemson vs Georgia). I believe the sum total of the regional interests greatly outweigh the totals of the national interest games. The networks know this, but they (like any other business) want to reduce their overall costs.

I'm not sure of the details of how the conference football tv package is set up. But to me it seems like the ACC could go to the network and say, "if you want a Duke-Carolina basketball game and a Duke or Carolina vs. Louisville bball game, etc. then you must give us more prime time football spots. In other words, are we "bundling" as best we can?

I think economics have a lot to do with it along with television. Some of these bowls should have been played just shortly before Christmas or right after same - even if it was on Sunday when the NFL was playing.

Or reply without realizing the comment is actually correct.

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--- bartholemew wrote:

I never realized it was possible to type without actually possessing a brain. Amazing.

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--- imokub2 wrote:


We know its all Bush's fault.

The Kenyan has nothing to do with our economy.

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Move on, nothing to see here.

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--- Jheiser3 wrote:

and when attendence is down the schools eat even more money from the guaranteed hotel blocks loaded into these bowl contracts. The ones guaranteed to make money are the bowl reps and contractually obligated vendors. Everyone else fights to break even.

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I dont know if it's true or not but I remember reading that the year UCONN made the BCS they actually lost money on the whole deal.

Well I live in memphis, so I like to go to the liberty bowl...its fun. People from the host town should go, great experience....I got free tickets the first time and took my brothermand it was a lot of fun, ive paid to go...eventhoughi dont care about the teams...its stil a fun day.
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--- UNC85Heels wrote:

Absolutely, economics within households is the biggest contributing factor to reduced bowl attendance. Additionally, the reduced price points of High-Definition TVs makes it easier to watch your favorite team at home rather than dwelling over the economics of how do I justify the tickets, travel, meals, hotel accomodations, etc. associated with supporting your team in a bowl regardless of its tier. For instance, if the Heels were to barely squeak into Hyundai Sun Bowl due to poor record, I probably would not go out the limb to purchase airfare for three (3), car rental, hotel, etc. and would be content to watch the game in my Tar Heel mancave.....simple economics, affordability and the lack of interest in El Paso, TX.

I've never really understood the perceived relationship between too many bowls and poor bowl attendance. Afterall, most fans only attend the one single bowl game of their favorite team. Personally, I've never attended a bowl game where the Tar Heels were not playing. I live in Charlotte and would rather watch the local Belk Bowl on TV rather than spend money and time on two (2) teams where I have no vested interest.

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Interesting: tonight's Fiesta Bowl looks jam packed. Both fan bases had a long way to travel, but they're out in force. This makes the Sugar Bowl attendance all the more puzzling to me. Louisville fans were there. It was Gator fans that failed to show. I would never have predicted that.

Rose was packed too, OB had a poor draw so it kinda made sense. I really don't get the Sugar lack of fan support. Could they have taken LSU over FL? Guess if they could they would have.
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--- TimTarHeel wrote:

Interesting: tonight's Fiesta Bowl looks jam packed. Both fan bases had a long way to travel, but they're out in force. This makes the Sugar Bowl attendance all the more puzzling to me. Louisville fans were there. It was Gator fans that failed to show. I would never have predicted that.

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Crowds are down due to the economy as many of you have stated but scheduling is also a factor. Games during the week after the holidays or to close after Christmas also affects attendance. Plus how many fans want to see their 6-6 team play another 6-6 team too many bowls now. Also some of the destinations are not the greatest to some fan bases. Lots of factors now plus every game is on TV which makes it easier for some fans too stay home vs. spending that $$.

1. The economy
2. DVR's make the game watchable at any time and TV gives better coverage. These tie in directly to the next number.
3. People don't have time due to so many commitments (how many families do you know whose kids are on travelling sports teams?).
4. Too many bowl games; the market is watered down. Bowls games used to be special, now they are literally a dime-a-dozen.

Go back and review the games played by Florida, Georgia, LSU and Mississippi State. Quite frankly, those players did not want to be there. And the fans didn't want to be there. In fact, they didn't go. Florida may have been the best example. They just missed out on the big one, and having to play Louisville was a huge blow to their egos. Louisville played like gangbusters because they could make a statement to the world that they were just as good a top rung SEC team. But Louisville isn't that good. I would love to see that matchup during regular season.

If Alabama weren't playing for all the marbles, the same would be true for them also. Remember a couple of years ago when Utah whupped up real good on Alabama right after Alabama had been in contention for the championship game? Utah!!! of all schools! Ever heard of them? With so many bowls, it comes down to only one real bowl--the national championship. All the others count for nothing. And attendance backs that up.

We need that playoff real soon even though it means ultimately only 4-16 teams will be involved. That's a wide spread but it has to do with how one views conference championship games. Until that happens we are going to be bored to death with five thousand teams playing to empty stands in bowls such as the Saltine Crackers Blade of Grass Bowl in Ozark, Alabama or Anderson, South Carolina.

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--- NCtaxguy wrote:

I thought it was an issue with just us, but attendance across the board is just down this year.

Last night was patheric at the OB. The Superdome has gaps everywhere tonight. The Rose Bowl looked full yesterday.

Is it the economy? Is it apathy? Are there too many bowls?

How will this fare for the playoffs in a coule years? HOw can a fan base travel to a conference champ game, then a national semi two weeks later, then a natty game two weeks later, all in different cities if they won't even go to one bowl game currently?

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I returned from the Sugar Bowl on Thursday. We arrived Tuesday morning. Many Louisville fans arrived Sat. Or Sun. We saw few UF fans on Tues. I would estimate we had 30,000 fans with maybe 2000 who went with family but did not attend the game. More UF fans arrived on game day. I estimate 15000 to 20000 UF fans at game. Most spent 1 day in New Orleans, went back to their room or airport after the game. Not putting much money into the local economy. We booked hotels for multiple nights, filled restaurants, bars, and stores and partied hard! We would have possibly had another 4,000 to 5,000 fans attending but we had a conference basketball game the same day. Families were split, with some staying home to use their season basketball tickets, who might otherwise have traveled with family or friends. New Orleans locals love a party! They were great hosts after the game. Selling beer on Bourbon street for $2 a bottle, double shot mixed drinks for reg price. Never seen anything like it before. My wallet is flat, my heart is full,and my body is in recovery mode!