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Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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Posted: 12/27/2012 10:49 PM
Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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Posted: 12/27/2012 10:55 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:01 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:03 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:03 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I don't blame him one god danged bit. UNC screwed him over and he should bleed every bit of blood from the stone.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:13 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
We signed the same contract he signed. He fought hard to set up the terms, he deserves the right to reap them.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:30 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I fail to see how UNC screwed him over. If anything, he did it to himself. Leaders should be held accountable for their decisions. He decided to hire John Blake even though there were red flags.
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--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:
I don't blame him one god danged bit. UNC screwed him over and he should bleed every bit of blood from the stone.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/27/2012 11:43 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
He isn't owed, or deserve, any money if he accepts another coaching job. That was the terms of the contract he signed and negotiated. He may be bitter about being fired, and rightfully so(especially after the results of the Martin Report), but UNC should not be tricked by him into paying him money that he agreed to not be paid by the terms of the contract he willingly signed. This move, if true, is tasteless and shows lack of character on his part.
If he had gotten a bigger job that paid more money, this would probably not be an issue. However, the job at FIU does not pay as much, and he probably feels like he couldn't get a better job that paid more because of what happened at UNC...so he wants the money. But still, he should just accept the terms of the contract...agree to the FIU job since he will start the same calender year...and just move on with his life and put all this crap behind him rather than do something that makes him look bad. There is merit in the saying 'Be the bigger man...'.
Granted you can't believe everything reported, so I'll withhold final judgement on the matter until afterwards, but if the story is true, then I stand by my comments.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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Last edited 12/27/2012 11:50 PM by Fedoramases
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:29 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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--- yallreadyforthis wrote:
I fail to see how UNC screwed him over. If anything, he did it to himself. Leaders should be held accountable for their decisions. He decided to hire John Blake even though there were red flags.
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--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:
I don't blame him one god danged bit. UNC screwed him over and he should bleed every bit of blood from the stone.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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which has zero to do with anything.blake was not the reason any of this happened. Your premise does not speak to the point. Anyhoo if FIU chooses to wait that is their business and if they don't it is still their business. Nothing wrong with BD wanting another payment if it fits within the parameters of the agreement.
Last edited 12/28/2012 12:30 AM by HEEL31OK
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:32 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
He isn't owed, or deserve, any money if he accepts another coaching job. That was the terms of the contract he signed and negotiated. He may be bitter about being fired, and rightfully so(especially after the results of the Martin Report), but UNC should not be tricked by him into paying him money that he agreed to not be paid by the terms of the contract he willingly signed. This move, if true, is tasteless and shows lack of character on his part.
If he had gotten a bigger job that paid more money, this would probably not be an issue. However, the job at FIU does not pay as much, and he probably feels like he couldn't get a better job that paid more because of what happened at UNC...so he wants the money. But still, he should just accept the terms of the contract...agree to the FIU job since he will start the same calender year...and just move on with his life and put all this crap behind him rather than do something that makes him look bad. There is merit in the saying 'Be the bigger man...'.
Granted you can't believe everything reported, so I'll withhold final judgement on the matter until afterwards, but if the story is true, then I stand by my comments.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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hardley tasteless to wait. It is owed if he does not have a job by the 15th.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:32 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
He isn't owed, or deserve, any money if he accepts another coaching job. That was the terms of the contract he signed and negotiated. He may be bitter about being fired, and rightfully so(especially after the results of the Martin Report), but UNC should not be tricked by him into paying him money that he agreed to not be paid by the terms of the contract he willingly signed. This move, if true, is tasteless and shows lack of character on his part.
If he had gotten a bigger job that paid more money, this would probably not be an issue. However, the job at FIU does not pay as much, and he probably feels like he couldn't get a better job that paid more because of what happened at UNC...so he wants the money. But still, he should just accept the terms of the contract...agree to the FIU job since he will start the same calender year...and just move on with his life and put all this crap behind him rather than do something that makes him look bad. There is merit in the saying 'Be the bigger man...'.
Granted you can't believe everything reported, so I'll withhold final judgement on the matter until afterwards, but if the story is true, then I stand by my comments.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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what a load.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:52 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
considering how much money UNC made, using Butch Davis, after the 2010 season,until right before the 2011 season, no reason why Butch should not get some of that money back. Or I guess it was just a coincidence that Butch was fired right before the season--after all of the season ticket money, and Blue zone pledges were sent in.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 1:16 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Its just good business on Butch's part.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 5:31 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
- A word of warning FIU - don't view a 4-8 season a "success",cave, and renegotiate the first year. - Don't expect to win a game against Florida Atlantic - You would have thought they would have learned from the IT hire, --------------------------------------------- --- reggaeheel wrote: msn.foxsports.com/collegefootb...122712?m_n=true--------------------------------------------- |
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Posted: 12/28/2012 5:33 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
And since he is so well versed in contracts he should know he could not sign before Jan 15th - unless he thought there was another loophole that wasn't there.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 5:35 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Good poast (especially the first paragraph) - which is the point people are missing.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
He isn't owed, or deserve, any money if he accepts another coaching job. That was the terms of the contract he signed and negotiated. He may be bitter about being fired, and rightfully so(especially after the results of the Martin Report), but UNC should not be tricked by him into paying him money that he agreed to not be paid by the terms of the contract he willingly signed. This move, if true, is tasteless and shows lack of character on his part.
If he had gotten a bigger job that paid more money, this would probably not be an issue. However, the job at FIU does not pay as much, and he probably feels like he couldn't get a better job that paid more because of what happened at UNC...so he wants the money. But still, he should just accept the terms of the contract...agree to the FIU job since he will start the same calender year...and just move on with his life and put all this crap behind him rather than do something that makes him look bad. There is merit in the saying 'Be the bigger man...'.
Granted you can't believe everything reported, so I'll withhold final judgement on the matter until afterwards, but if the story is true, then I stand by my comments.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 5:53 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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Essentially every coaching settlement includes a clause that you stop getting checks if you get a new job. This should come as no surprise to Davis or to his many devotees.
Last edited 12/28/2012 5:54 AM by TekJansensAlphaSquad7
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Posted: 12/28/2012 6:49 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
ALSO Heel Grad, you could have added:
'Don't expect to lose a game to a team that does not care about football and has been a national laughing stock in football for a lot of years. A team that has beaten you once in 25 years.'
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:07 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Ole Butchy is finding it hard sine those Hurricanes days.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:08 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
And Butch made that decision solely on his own? Blake wasn't vetted by UNC? I guess Butch was a dictator coach who did whatever he wanted with no accountability.
Wake up. Did he make a bad hire? Yes. Who in management hasn't? Whomever hired Thorpe made the worse hire of the two.
Butch was fired on a terrible timetable. UNC used him to fund the stadium expansion and maximize season ticket sales. I don't blame him for holding out on his piece of the pie.
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--- yallreadyforthis wrote:
I fail to see how UNC screwed him over. If anything, he did it to himself. Leaders should be held accountable for their decisions. He decided to hire John Blake even though there were red flags.
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--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:
I don't blame him one god danged bit. UNC screwed him over and he should bleed every bit of blood from the stone.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:29 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
UNC didn't use him. Butch Davis wanted the star treatment. He wanted to be the man that took UNC to the next level. He said he knew what it took to win. UNC believed him. You can't have a scandal of this magnitude and not have the coach pay for it. UNC should have known after the first year this was going to be a problem. Who gets a raise after going 4-8?
Thorp is paying for it too. His life (and family's) for the past 2 years has been rough which has caused him to step down.
As for Blake, this isn't the SEC or Big 12. The ACC and UNC have standards that needed to be upheld. There's a reason why other top coaches didn't touch him--risk.
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--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:
And Butch made that decision solely on his own? Blake wasn't vetted by UNC? I guess Butch was a dictator coach who did whatever he wanted with no accountability.
Wake up. Did he make a bad hire? Yes. Who in management hasn't? Whomever hired Thorpe made the worse hire of the two.
Butch was fired on a terrible timetable. UNC used him to fund the stadium expansion and maximize season ticket sales. I don't blame him for holding out on his piece of the pie.
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--- yallreadyforthis wrote:
I fail to see how UNC screwed him over. If anything, he did it to himself. Leaders should be held accountable for their decisions. He decided to hire John Blake even though there were red flags.
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--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:
I don't blame him one god danged bit. UNC screwed him over and he should bleed every bit of blood from the stone.
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
Sounds like that is what he was hoping to do in order get the money, which imho is kinda slimy. He knew the terms of the contract when he signed it. He may be upset with how things went down here, but if this is the case his integrity takes a bit of a hit. UNC has every right to deny him the money because that was the terms of the contract, and him trying to be sneaky and 'wait' until after Jan. 15 is rank no matter how bitter he may feel about his dismissal here.
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--- bartholemew wrote:
Sounds like Butch is going to wait until after Jan. 15 before officially signing with FIU so he can get his $590K from UNC.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:31 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I think the question here is why would Butch really want to make FIU wait? (just for the money??) The recruiting class is going to suffer immensely. Doesnt seem to be showing much respect to his new employer to me.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:32 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I don't know the specifics but if this is what happens that UNC writes BD a check on Jan 15 for $590k and then he gets a $500k job, that's just good business. If waiting until Jan 15 means that he gets a $500k job and UNC writes a $90k check, that's still business.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 8:37 AM
RE: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
^ the bottom line is the bottom line. :-)
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:05 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I have zero problem with this. Make Holden sign the check
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:16 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I say if he has verbally agreed to the job then UNC is off the hook --- I come down on the side of integrity on both sides of this stuff -- Butch should have been treated more fairly by the little chancellor, likewise, he should man up and do the right thing. If Marvin Austin, Greg Little and Richard Quinn had displayed a little more integrity none of this would have happened
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:26 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
We screwed him. We should go ahead and write him the check and let him get started. Holden tried to make him the scapegoat for what was clearly an academic problem that was going on long before Butch got here.
FIRE THORPE
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:32 AM
RE: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Some of you guys are nuts. If a person is due a payment within 30 days as long as the person either performs, or does not perform an action, an action, the person will do what is necessary to receive the payment. Imagine it's now November 25th and you're talking to someone about a new role at a different company. They extend an offer and you can start as early as December 1 but can delay acceptance and your start date. Your current employer pays you a year-end bonus on December 15th, but you will forfeit that payment if you leave your role prior to that date. What would you do. A normal person will do what's necessary to get the bonus while not jeopardizing the new opportunity. Butch is simply doing what almost every other person in our capitalist society would do. Flip the scenario and look at it from a business' perspective. If a business, or a university, is contemplating cutting staff and faces paying a huge bonus on a certain date, when will the business cut the staff, before or after the bonus payment date? In sports, teams will often cut a decent player because a huge bonus payment is due if that player remains on the roster. It's business and delaying an action or taking an action to ensure a contractual payment is received or is avoided is simply good business. If Butch is owed a payment on January 15th and he delays accepting a new job until after the contractual payment is received, it is simply good business for him to delay taking action.
Here are some other thoughts to consider. I'm not sure what the contract says but, even after accepting the role, Butch may not forfeit all payments from UNC. UNC may still be obligated to pay the difference between the contractual payments and the salary paid to Butch by FIU. By taking he new role, Butch is in effect mitigating damages. It really depends what the contract says.
Plus, I will also say that if the payment stands in the way of Butch's acceptance of the new role, UNC may want to consider making the payment in order not to make the last two payments. If he doesn't take the job or the school walks away, UNC is on the hook for the full 3 annual payments.
Last edited 12/28/2012 9:34 AM by CharlotteTarHeel
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:32 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Or Robert Quinn!
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--- BobHeel wrote:
I say if he has verbally agreed to the job then UNC is off the hook --- I come down on the side of integrity on both sides of this stuff -- Butch should have been treated more fairly by the little chancellor, likewise, he should man up and do the right thing. If Marvin Austin, Greg Little and Richard Quinn had displayed a little more integrity none of this would have happened
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:39 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Sorry Bob, while I agree with the first part of your post, the last bit is the stupidest thing I have ever heard. What in the he$$ does their integrity have to do with whether Butch should receive the payment?
By the way, Butch can express interest and state he will not accept that role or any other until after Jan. 15 without bringing conflict with his agreement with UNC. Whether you or I or anyone else likes it is another story.
"If Marvin Austin, Greg Little and Richard Quinn had displayed a little more integrity none of this would have happened"
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--- BobHeel wrote:
I say if he has verbally agreed to the job then UNC is off the hook --- I come down on the side of integrity on both sides of this stuff -- Butch should have been treated more fairly by the little chancellor, likewise, he should man up and do the right thing. If Marvin Austin, Greg Little and Richard Quinn had displayed a little more integrity none of this would have happened
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Last edited 12/28/2012 9:41 AM by CharlotteTarHeel
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:43 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
This is basic coaching contract stuff. Get a new job the old job stops paying. That's not a contract squabble, that's just a contract.
How much free money does he need? He walked with 12 million of Randy Lerner's money to NOT coach the Browns. He's still getting paid NOT to coach, even though he's working for the Buccaneers. Now he wants us to honor his buyout but let him start coaching at FIU? Sorry Butch, gotta pick one. Either you are unemployed as a coach and thus get $590 from UNC or you are FIU's coach and you get their money.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:48 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Don't blame him in the least, and I'm glad he's taking UNC to the cleaners. He's earned that right after being vindicated time and time again.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 9:55 AM
RE: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Coach Davis did things the right way, including getting clearance from the NCAA before hiring John Blake.
The NCAA found no wrong doing pertaining to Coach Davis
The Martin Report found no wrong doing pertaining to Coach Davis.
This man was fired without cause. He deserves his January payment and more...
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Posted: 12/28/2012 10:54 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
It appears that my old Coach Davis is going to sit on the sidelines, wait for the mailman on January 15th of 2013, 2014, and 2015 and collect his cool $590,000 from the UNC Athletics Department. Besides, why take an annual $90,000 paycut to accept FIU's paltry offer of $500,000 per year to deal with a bunch of 18 and 19 year olds everyday.
I'll bet Coach got up this morning and marked his calendar......"only 18 more days, then, Santa Claus (in a Carolina Blue and White suit)will arrive at the Davis household ....goodie, goodie, ho...ho....ho"
This is too funny.....Thor-ped-oed!
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Posted: 12/28/2012 10:58 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
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--- yallreadyforthis wrote:
UNC didn't use him. Butch Davis wanted the star treatment. He wanted to be the man that took UNC to the next level. He said he knew what it took to win. UNC believed him. You can't have a scandal of this magnitude and not have the coach pay for it. UNC should have known after the first year this was going to be a problem. Who gets a raise after going 4-8?
Thorp is paying for it too. His life (and family's) for the past 2 years has been rough which has caused him to step down.
As for Blake, this isn't the SEC or Big 12. The ACC and UNC have standards that needed to be upheld. There's a reason why other top coaches didn't touch him--risk.
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WTH are you even talking about? A scandal of this magnitude... gimme a friggin break. The scandal was a academic one not an an athletic one. Something a football coach has no control over... but by all means lets fire athletic coaches when a professor F's up. That'll solve everything.
Thorp should have been paying for this long before Butch. He should have never been given the chance to step down. I'm soooo sorry Mr. Miata's family has had a rough time the last couple of years; I'm sure the Davis family had a walk in the park.
Blake was vetted by UNC and the NCAA... if there had been issues with his hire why didn't anyone raise a red flag then? Hindsight is 20/20...
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Posted: 12/28/2012 11:10 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Cry me a freek'n river ...
Seriously ...
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--- yallreadyforthis wrote:
... Thorp is paying for it too. His life (and family's) for the past 2 years has been rough which has caused him to step down ...
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Posted: 12/28/2012 11:14 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Wow, is this how people really think these days? Good business? No wonder our nation is in the crapper and people with integrity are so hard to find.
I wonder if this is considered good business for UNC as well.
Reading between the lines, of course, the bottom line is he is trying to screw UNC over by practicing what he thinks is 'good business' and people know it as well if they have to resort to calling what he is doing a business decision.
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--- ahoskiecpa wrote:
Its just good business on Butch's part.
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- rcristal
- All-American
- 3050 posts this site
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Posted: 12/28/2012 11:27 AM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
which has zero to do with anything.blake was not the reason any of this happened
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So let me understand this..... IF John Blake committed violations and had gotten away with it that would be fine? In other words, IF Coach Blake committed violations we/he should ONLY be upset with Marvin Austin because he was caught and the trail led, in part, to John Blake..
And we all wonder what is wrong with College Athletics.
Go Heels!
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- Heels77
- All-American
- 2895 posts this site
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:05 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
Pay Butch all you owe him and move on. UNC screwed him and hurt his reputation. Let him have the chance to coach again.
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Posted: 12/28/2012 12:11 PM
Re: Butch Davis to FIU hits major snag...
I like to think of myself as a fairly honest man, but if my employer treated me the way Davis was treated.......i'd milk the contract for all it was worth
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--- Fedoramases wrote:
He isn't owed, or deserve, any money if he accepts another coaching job. That was the terms of the contract he signed and negotiated. He may be bitter about being fired, and rightfully so(especially after the results of the Martin Report), but UNC should not be tricked by him into paying him money that he agreed to not be paid by the terms of the contract he willingly signed. This move, if true, is tasteless and shows lack of character on his part.
If he had gotten a bigger job that paid more money, this would probably not be an issue. However, the job at FIU does not pay as much, and he probably feels like he couldn't get a better job that paid more because of what happened at UNC...so he wants the money. But still, he should just accept the terms of the contract...agree to the FIU job since he will start the same calender year...and just move on with his life and put all this crap behind him rather than do something that makes him look bad. There is merit in the saying 'Be the bigger man...'.
Granted you can't believe everything reported, so I'll withhold final judgement on the matter until afterwards, but if the story is true, then I stand by my comments.
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--- jsf5259 wrote:
Nothing wrong with wanting the money you are owed/deserved.
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