I'm not sure "in the minority" does justice to that scenario.

---------------------------------------------
--- Heel2K wrote:

I know I'm in the minority, but I don't think a penn state move to the acc is a 0% chance. More importantly, such a move would stabilize the majority of the college landscape. With PSU, I think Maryland changes its mind. I already think that is a possibility regardless, but PSU, potentially w a full member Notre Dame, Maryland, and yes, possibly Rutgers, puts us at 18, allows a natural north-south split for divisions, and locks the B1G out of the East Coast.

Pipe dream? Probably. But if the Penn State alumni spoke out, it is not impossible.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:

To me the North/ South stuff only goes so far and some are taking too extreme. Personally I hate the conference realignment and super conference idea. I prefer the regional match ups and interactions of universities and fans like there used to be. You remember- like the days when basketball teams used to play everyone in the conference twice- home and away, where there were true conference champions based on the whole year's work as opposed to a weekend conference tournament in March and NC St was actually relevant in bball (sorry- was that last one out loud? Apologies to the wolfys before any here get offended).

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different. You can say the same about the different Northern schools too. Personally, I want the ACC to stay strong and it's own separate conference (with maybe 1 more northern addition from a state on the Mason Dixon line ;) ). The regional appeal of the conferences and fan interaction were what made college sport great back in the day and really made the intersectional match ups that much more interesting and important. We've lost a lot of that over the years and the super conference idea is heading in the wrong direction IMO.

---------------------------------------------

Nominated. Post of the freaking YEAR. Well done, Nit fan.

Smoking a little gets thoughts like this....

---------------------------------------------
--- 18SBC wrote:

I'm not sure "in the minority" does justice to that scenario.

---------------------------------------------
--- Heel2K wrote:

I know I'm in the minority, but I don't think a penn state move to the acc is a 0% chance. More importantly, such a move would stabilize the majority of the college landscape. With PSU, I think Maryland changes its mind. I already think that is a possibility regardless, but PSU, potentially w a full member Notre Dame, Maryland, and yes, possibly Rutgers, puts us at 18, allows a natural north-south split for divisions, and locks the B1G out of the East Coast.

Pipe dream? Probably. But if the Penn State alumni spoke out, it is not impossible.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- therabidrev wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:

To me the North/ South stuff only goes so far and some are taking too extreme. Personally I hate the conference realignment and super conference idea. I prefer the regional match ups and interactions of universities and fans like there used to be. You remember- like the days when basketball teams used to play everyone in the conference twice- home and away, where there were true conference champions based on the whole year's work as opposed to a weekend conference tournament in March and NC St was actually relevant in bball (sorry- was that last one out loud? Apologies to the wolfys before any here get offended).

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different. You can say the same about the different Northern schools too. Personally, I want the ACC to stay strong and it's own separate conference (with maybe 1 more northern addition from a state on the Mason Dixon line ;) ). The regional appeal of the conferences and fan interaction were what made college sport great back in the day and really made the intersectional match ups that much more interesting and important. We've lost a lot of that over the years and the super conference idea is heading in the wrong direction IMO.

---------------------------------------------

psu, I've stated my regional sociological preferences for the South on IC ad nauseum, but I've also consistently been a proponent of adding PSU to the ACC if possible. You're a fine East Coast school with strong academics and athletics, hardly Southern, but a much better addition than BC or Syracuse. We would welcome you to a viable ACC, if such a critter existed. With you and Notre Dame, we could write our own ticket. But ND is just playing us like they played the Big East, and the Rutgers/Maryland addition to the B1G pretty much sealed your fate. Sorry it didn't work out, it would have been a great deal.

As for the above poasters who say no one in the North ever mentions region when meeting Southerners, as if you are all wonderfully inclusive exemplars of tolerance and love, you may be speaking of alleged "Southerners" who have been treated at the Accent Sterilization Clinic and neutered, devoid of any trace or nuance of Southernness. As for those of us who are not ashamed of who we are and where we come from, who prefer to live out our own identity rather than succumb to a plain vanilla, humdrum, generic existence, trust me, we will be and have been subjected to the "Where are you from?" questions. They will be followed by "Do you know any moonshiners?" and "Did your parents have indoor plumbing?" etc. These are exactly the questions I faced recently after articulately performing a funeral for a man with roots in NJ and Long Island, NY. A crowd of nearly 400 was spellbound as I spoke, then treated me as if I were "a credit to my people" after the service. To evoke Andy Griffith, what it was was condescension...

---------------------------------------------
This did not happen in the midwest... Assuming the people of Michigan,Ohio,Indiana Illinois etc. are like Jersey shore because there north of the MD line."Forgetaboutit:. Because they are not. The midwestern culture is much closer to the Carolina's then it is to the Northeast. I Live in NC. My wife and her entire family are from here. Yes I always have to explain where I am from to ppl who dont know me here. I always say I am a midwestern Yankee not northeastern. Because there is a difference.

---------------------------------------------
--- phatassjungle wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- therabidrev wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:

To me the North/ South stuff only goes so far and some are taking too extreme. Personally I hate the conference realignment and super conference idea. I prefer the regional match ups and interactions of universities and fans like there used to be. You remember- like the days when basketball teams used to play everyone in the conference twice- home and away, where there were true conference champions based on the whole year's work as opposed to a weekend conference tournament in March and NC St was actually relevant in bball (sorry- was that last one out loud? Apologies to the wolfys before any here get offended).

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different. You can say the same about the different Northern schools too. Personally, I want the ACC to stay strong and it's own separate conference (with maybe 1 more northern addition from a state on the Mason Dixon line ;) ). The regional appeal of the conferences and fan interaction were what made college sport great back in the day and really made the intersectional match ups that much more interesting and important. We've lost a lot of that over the years and the super conference idea is heading in the wrong direction IMO.

---------------------------------------------

psu, I've stated my regional sociological preferences for the South on IC ad nauseum, but I've also consistently been a proponent of adding PSU to the ACC if possible. You're a fine East Coast school with strong academics and athletics, hardly Southern, but a much better addition than BC or Syracuse. We would welcome you to a viable ACC, if such a critter existed. With you and Notre Dame, we could write our own ticket. But ND is just playing us like they played the Big East, and the Rutgers/Maryland addition to the B1G pretty much sealed your fate. Sorry it didn't work out, it would have been a great deal.

As for the above poasters who say no one in the North ever mentions region when meeting Southerners, as if you are all wonderfully inclusive exemplars of tolerance and love, you may be speaking of alleged "Southerners" who have been treated at the Accent Sterilization Clinic and neutered, devoid of any trace or nuance of Southernness. As for those of us who are not ashamed of who we are and where we come from, who prefer to live out our own identity rather than succumb to a plain vanilla, humdrum, generic existence, trust me, we will be and have been subjected to the "Where are you from?" questions. They will be followed by "Do you know any moonshiners?" and "Did your parents have indoor plumbing?" etc. These are exactly the questions I faced recently after articulately performing a funeral for a man with roots in NJ and Long Island, NY. A crowd of nearly 400 was spellbound as I spoke, then treated me as if I were "a credit to my people" after the service. To evoke Andy Griffith, what it was was condescension...

---------------------------------------------
This did not happen in the midwest... Assuming the people of Michigan,Ohio,Indiana Illinois etc. are like Jersey shore because there north of the MD line."Forgetaboutit:. Because they are not. The midwestern culture is much closer to the Carolina's then it is to the Northeast. I Live in NC. My wife and her entire family are from here. Yes I always have to explain where I am from to ppl who dont know me here. I always say I am a midwestern Yankee not northeastern. Because there is a difference.

---------------------------------------------

Indeed, there are regional differences. And Carolina doesn't belong in an artificially constructed league with any of them, ideally. But this is the world in which we live.

The Nit fan makes some good points. But the part about schools such as UNC, UVA, and Duke being "different" from other Southern schools bothers me.

This is one of the things that northerners do not understand about Southerners or the South. What psu00 said sounds like a compliment. And I am sure he/she meant it that way. But it is not. To me, it is akin to telling an articulate black person they are a "credit" to their race.

Why are UNC, UVA, Duke "different"? Is it because we emphasize education, class, refinement? Or are we simply less "uncouth" than other Southern schools? Or do we simply not fit all of their Southern stereotypes?

This is something that northerners do A LOT. Their perceptions of the South don't allow them to accept any that is good as "Southern". It is a subtle dig but as a Southerner who lived for 8 years in the northeast, I have heard it more than once and I recognize it immediately.

To them, anything that does not fit their stereotype of the South cannot be really "Southern", can it? It's like when people try to say that states like NC or VA are not really Southern anymore. Is it because we are becoming more highly educated, affluent, and progressive? Can we not be those things and Southern at the same time?

This is the thing. Yes, UNC, UVA, and Duke are different in some ways than other schools. Absolutely. But that does not make us any less Southern. It IS possible to be a well-respected, world-renowned, high-quality, refined, genteel, highly-ranked, world class educational institution and STILL be Southern.

Carry on.

---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:



Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different.

---------------------------------------------

Nominated. Post of the freaking YEAR. Well done, Nit fan.

---------------------------------------------

BamainCarolina- you completely misunderstand. At the risk of starting WW3- there was no backhanded compliment or dig at "the South" in any way. At all. In all honesty I think you kind of prove a counterpoint that often comes up in these type discussions- that while there are some from both sides who can be insulting over this issue there are also some on both sides who are way too sensitive, (always looking for the insult and to be offended). My point was that not all schools are the same and that just because UNC is in the South doesn't mean they are just like LSU or Auburn (or whoever). Remember the discussion was UNC in the big ten or SEC and my point was keep the ACC because I dont think they fit well in either. There are attributes of the ACC that are different than the SEC. That was the only point. It was in no way a backhanded dig at the south. As a matter of fact I specifically said the same could be said of northern schools in the original post. Respectfully, I suggest that we just discuss the topic without trying to see insults hidden in every phrase. It was absolutely not meant that way.

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

if this happens state and vatech will rule UNC and UVA.

---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

No they won't. Fans are so dramatic and short sighted.

---------------------------------------------
--- heelsince68 wrote:

if this happens state and vatech will rule UNC and UVA.

---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

The perception of this is realistically be the only chance the SEC has of getting UNC and Duke to join. Otherwise, it's UVA, UNC, Duke, and GT to the BIG10.

---------------------------------------------
--- heelsince68 wrote:

if this happens state and vatech will rule UNC and UVA.

---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- BamainCarolina wrote:

The Nit fan makes some good points. But the part about schools such as UNC, UVA, and Duke being "different" from other Southern schools bothers me.

This is one of the things that northerners do not understand about Southerners or the South. What psu00 said sounds like a compliment. And I am sure he/she meant it that way. But it is not. To me, it is akin to telling an articulate black person they are a "credit" to their race.

Why are UNC, UVA, Duke "different"? Is it because we emphasize education, class, refinement? Or are we simply less "uncouth" than other Southern schools? Or do we simply not fit all of their Southern stereotypes?

This is something that northerners do A LOT. Their perceptions of the South don't allow them to accept any that is good as "Southern". It is a subtle dig but as a Southerner who lived for 8 years in the northeast, I have heard it more than once and I recognize it immediately.

To them, anything that does not fit their stereotype of the South cannot be really "Southern", can it? It's like when people try to say that states like NC or VA are not really Southern anymore. Is it because we are becoming more highly educated, affluent, and progressive? Can we not be those things and Southern at the same time?

This is the thing. Yes, UNC, UVA, and Duke are different in some ways than other schools. Absolutely. But that does not make us any less Southern. It IS possible to be a well-respected, world-renowned, high-quality, refined, genteel, highly-ranked, world class educational institution and STILL be Southern.

Carry on.

---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:



Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different.

---------------------------------------------

Nominated. Post of the freaking YEAR. Well done, Nit fan.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

Thank you, Bama. I do not think psu's poast is necessarily condescending, but this is exactly the point about some conversations with Northerners that I was trying to make after I preached that funeral. They're called micro-inequities. Many of us do it (insult another group, whether intentional or not) to members of other racial groups fairly regularly - we don't even realize that we're doing it. It was almost like "you're too smart to be that Southern." Sure, they elected Jimmuh Cahtuh, Slick Willie, and the Bush duo, but all of them went to school somewhere other than in their native land...

RabidRev- with all respect there was no insult- implied or otherwise. You guys are being waaay too sensitive here. There was no statement or implication about being educated as somehow being 'unsouthern' or anything of the like. It was a comparison of the ACC vs SEC and plainly stated the same differences are seen with northern schools. I guess two can play this game and say that these responses show an underlying southern attitude (whether intentional or not noticed as you say) that anyone from the north is characterized as being insulting and obnoxious or too stupid to realize how insulting and obnoxious they really are. Again- respectfully- there was no insult whatsoever in my post. Zero. Too much 'poor me' attitude here.

---------------------------------------------
--- BamainCarolina wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different.

---------------------------------------------

Nominated. Post of the freaking YEAR. Well done, Nit fan.

---------------------------------------------

The Nit fan makes some good points. But the part about schools such as UNC, UVA, and Duke being "different" from other Southern schools bothers me.

This is one of the things that northerners do not understand about Southerners or the South. What psu00 said sounds like a compliment. And I am sure he/she meant it that way. But it is not. To me, it is akin to telling an articulate black person they are a "credit" to their race.

Why are UNC, UVA, Duke "different"? Is it because we emphasize education, class, refinement? Or are we simply less "uncouth" than other Southern schools? Or do we simply not fit all of their Southern stereotypes?

This is something that northerners do A LOT. Their perceptions of the South don't allow them to accept any that is good as "Southern". It is a subtle dig but as a Southerner who lived for 8 years in the northeast, I have heard it more than once and I recognize it immediately.

To them, anything that does not fit their stereotype of the South cannot be really "Southern", can it? It's like when people try to say that states like NC or VA are not really Southern anymore. Is it because we are becoming more highly educated, affluent, and progressive? Can we not be those things and Southern at the same time?

This is the thing. Yes, UNC, UVA, and Duke are different in some ways than other schools. Absolutely. But that does not make us any less Southern. It IS possible to be a well-respected, world-renowned, high-quality, refined, genteel, highly-ranked, world class educational institution and STILL be Southern.

Carry on.

---------------------------------------------

psu00 stated something that is 100 percent true, and, something Carolina prides itself on. And, that IS being different from other universities not just in the South, but, nationally. Personally, I don't take what was posted as a slap. He/she has been a pretty levelheaded guest on here. Not a troll like a few of the Big 10 fans have been.

---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

What if, in four years, the ACC manages to survive in its present form? What then?

---------------------------------------------
--- therabidrev wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- psu00 wrote:

To me the North/ South stuff only goes so far and some are taking too extreme. Personally I hate the conference realignment and super conference idea. I prefer the regional match ups and interactions of universities and fans like there used to be. You remember- like the days when basketball teams used to play everyone in the conference twice- home and away, where there were true conference champions based on the whole year's work as opposed to a weekend conference tournament in March and NC St was actually relevant in bball (sorry- was that last one out loud? Apologies to the wolfys before any here get offended).

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different. You can say the same about the different Northern schools too. Personally, I want the ACC to stay strong and it's own separate conference (with maybe 1 more northern addition from a state on the Mason Dixon line ;) ). The regional appeal of the conferences and fan interaction were what made college sport great back in the day and really made the intersectional match ups that much more interesting and important. We've lost a lot of that over the years and the super conference idea is heading in the wrong direction IMO.

---------------------------------------------

psu, I've stated my regional sociological preferences for the South on IC ad nauseum, but I've also consistently been a proponent of adding PSU to the ACC if possible. You're a fine East Coast school with strong academics and athletics, hardly Southern, but a much better addition than BC or Syracuse. We would welcome you to a viable ACC, if such a critter existed. With you and Notre Dame, we could write our own ticket. But ND is just playing us like they played the Big East, and the Rutgers/Maryland addition to the B1G pretty much sealed your fate. Sorry it didn't work out, it would have been a great deal.

As for the above poasters who say no one in the North ever mentions region when meeting Southerners, as if you are all wonderfully inclusive exemplars of tolerance and love, you may be speaking of alleged "Southerners" who have been treated at the Accent Sterilization Clinic and neutered, devoid of any trace or nuance of Southernness. As for those of us who are not ashamed of who we are and where we come from, who prefer to live out our own identity rather than succumb to a plain vanilla, humdrum, generic existence, trust me, we will be and have been subjected to the "Where are you from?" questions. They will be followed by "Do you know any moonshiners?" and "Did your parents have indoor plumbing?" etc. These are exactly the questions I faced recently after articulately performing a funeral for a man with roots in NJ and Long Island, NY. A crowd of nearly 400 was spellbound as I spoke, then treated me as if I were "a credit to my people" after the service. To evoke Andy Griffith, what it was was condescension...

---------------------------------------------

Rev, in my own experiences outside of our wonderful, blessed by God native South, the only midwestern folks I had treat me with that kind of disrespect were from Chicago, and, Minnesota. The rest have been welcoming and hospitible.

But, on the whole, folks from Noo Yawk, Noo Joisey, and, Bawstin have not been nearly as welcoming, nor, as friendly.

---------------------------------------------
--- ButtCheese wrote:


It's not just the South, the Midwest doesn't like ignorant arrogant pricks either.





---------------------------------------------
--- kjlee wrote:

Born and graduated a Buckeye but I've lived in Tallahassee for the last 25 years and have visited many locales in the South, and absolutely there are many in the South that haven't let go of the Civil War if by no other means of expression than harboring and voicing an innate disdain for anything North. No where in all my life was I subjected to the tired old question of "where ya from?" followed by the ubiquitous "Oh, damn yankee huh." I've taken southern friends and of course my wife and kids home to Ohio many times, most recently taking a Bama friend and grad to the OSU/michigan game, and no one up north gets into questioning them about where they're from, probing them on the lightning rod political issues, or reciting any ignorant stereotypes of the south. I fully understand southern fans' desire to see their team make it to the SEC over the BIG if it ever comes to that point, and I could give a sheet about Mason-Dixon line rhetoric, but the comments about rust belt, and dying region, and bankrupt states, etc is a bit much. And don't throw back the "it's just that BIG fans are telling us we're gonna be in the BIG line." I've seen plenty of ACC fans engage in the EXACT same fantasy game - wich schools might join the ACC (e.g. ND, TX, others). BIG fans have more reason than any other conference to expect further additions, based on many established facts that I don't care to get into. That expectation is the basis of our speculation and it's normal fan behavior to hypothesize what schools could be next. If you do join the BIG, oh maybe because UNC's leaders realize such a decision has to be grounded by other than football considerations being the driving force, I want you to keep carping about it the rest of your life. Oh, and don't forget to teach all the kids and grandbabies about the betrayal and treason that led to UNC becoming a part of the BIG.

---------------------------------------------

I suggest you go read the posts on the OSU or Michigan boards where expansion is discussed and see for yourself how the southern schools and southerners are addressed. If you think that southern people aren't ridiculed and treated with tremendous disrespect, you are very mistaken. This land you allegedly visit where northern people never ask a southern man where he is from and don't believe in and wholeheartedly embrace the stereotypes-of southerners, you are out of touch.-The disdain flows heavier from north to south, not south to north. -----------------------------------------

psu00 take on identifying 'Southern' schools has merit. If the criteria is the demographic makeup of the current student body, unquestionably Duke falls out of the Southern identity. I suspect UVa receives the bulk of its in-state students from prep schools in NOVA, and can that be construed as traditionally Southern?

And as far as UNC, from my personal experience on campus and in classrooms, I reckon, at most, a quarter of the folks there were traditional or conservative, or could be identified as Southern.

But again I'm speaking strictly in terms of the people matriculating through these places nowadays. Of course if you throw in alumni and fans, the 3 schools don't truly fit in with the Midwest or Northeastern athletic groups. I just hope its the latter component that determines the course of action in realignment.

---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

What if, in four years, the ACC manages to survive in its present form? What then?

---------------------------------------------

I would be floored if that happened. Look for GT, with possibly UVa, to kick it off. UVa is the wild card...

---------------------------------------------
--- ShadowSpawne wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

What if, in four years, the ACC manages to survive in its present form? What then?

---------------------------------------------

I would be floored if that happened. Look for GT, with possibly UVa, to kick it off. UVa is the wild card...

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You and I think along similar lines on this.

I was wondering what the Buckeye fan's POV is. He made a pretty bold assertion that the ACC would not be one of them. I'm curious as to what the plan is if they do survive and thrive.

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--- psu00 wrote:

RabidRev- with all respect there was no insult- implied or otherwise. You guys are being waaay too sensitive here. There was no statement or implication about being educated as somehow being 'unsouthern' or anything of the like. It was a comparison of the ACC vs SEC and plainly stated the same differences are seen with northern schools. I guess two can play this game and say that these responses show an underlying southern attitude (whether intentional or not noticed as you say) that anyone from the north is characterized as being insulting and obnoxious or too stupid to realize how insulting and obnoxious they really are. Again- respectfully- there was no insult whatsoever in my post. Zero. Too much 'poor me' attitude here.

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Likewise I am trying to treat you with respect as a guest. As I stated above, I don't think your poast was condescending or insulting. I compliment your school and you as a poaster. But to deny that many manifest this attitude of which Bama and I speak does not ring true to my Southern-fried ears. Numerous other Big 10 poasters on IC have been downright obnoxious. Thanks for being better than that.

And we can agree to disagree on certain points and still be civil.

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--- WesternStormer wrote:



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--- therabidrev wrote:

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--- psu00 wrote:

To me the North/ South stuff only goes so far and some are taking too extreme. Personally I hate the conference realignment and super conference idea. I prefer the regional match ups and interactions of universities and fans like there used to be. You remember- like the days when basketball teams used to play everyone in the conference twice- home and away, where there were true conference champions based on the whole year's work as opposed to a weekend conference tournament in March and NC St was actually relevant in bball (sorry- was that last one out loud? Apologies to the wolfys before any here get offended).

Yeah UNC is a southern school and IMO belongs in the big ten as much as San Diego St or Boise belong in the big east. That said, I see the ACC schools like UNC, Duke, UVA etc as different from the SEC too. I don't know quite how to explain it- whether it's the difference in approach to sports (staying away from sone of the 'shadiness' that tends to be a little more common in the SEC) or the focus on academics of the university (not talked about by the Musberger's on Fall Saturdays but still with intrinsic value) or whatever- they just seem different. Yes they are all southern but different. You can say the same about the different Northern schools too. Personally, I want the ACC to stay strong and it's own separate conference (with maybe 1 more northern addition from a state on the Mason Dixon line ;) ). The regional appeal of the conferences and fan interaction were what made college sport great back in the day and really made the intersectional match ups that much more interesting and important. We've lost a lot of that over the years and the super conference idea is heading in the wrong direction IMO.

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psu, I've stated my regional sociological preferences for the South on IC ad nauseum, but I've also consistently been a proponent of adding PSU to the ACC if possible. You're a fine East Coast school with strong academics and athletics, hardly Southern, but a much better addition than BC or Syracuse. We would welcome you to a viable ACC, if such a critter existed. With you and Notre Dame, we could write our own ticket. But ND is just playing us like they played the Big East, and the Rutgers/Maryland addition to the B1G pretty much sealed your fate. Sorry it didn't work out, it would have been a great deal.

As for the above poasters who say no one in the North ever mentions region when meeting Southerners, as if you are all wonderfully inclusive exemplars of tolerance and love, you may be speaking of alleged "Southerners" who have been treated at the Accent Sterilization Clinic and neutered, devoid of any trace or nuance of Southernness. As for those of us who are not ashamed of who we are and where we come from, who prefer to live out our own identity rather than succumb to a plain vanilla, humdrum, generic existence, trust me, we will be and have been subjected to the "Where are you from?" questions. They will be followed by "Do you know any moonshiners?" and "Did your parents have indoor plumbing?" etc. These are exactly the questions I faced recently after articulately performing a funeral for a man with roots in NJ and Long Island, NY. A crowd of nearly 400 was spellbound as I spoke, then treated me as if I were "a credit to my people" after the service. To evoke Andy Griffith, what it was was condescension...

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Rev, in my own experiences outside of our wonderful, blessed by God native South, the only midwestern folks I had treat me with that kind of disrespect were from Chicago, and, Minnesota. The rest have been welcoming and hospitible.

But, on the whole, folks from Noo Yawk, Noo Joisey, and, Bawstin have not been nearly as welcoming, nor, as friendly.

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Indeed, our nation is made up of a variety of subcultural groups, some of them primarily based on region, others on race, religion, etc.

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--- msjaskon wrote:

And as far as UNC, from my personal experience on campus and in classrooms, I reckon, at most, a quarter of the folks there were traditional or conservative...

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This isn't just UNC. This is the case on most college campuses, and it's the reason why the Obama campaign so heavily targeted those voters. Fortunately, after those students graduate and get out into the real world, the numbers get much closer to 50-50, and a recent survey showed that's the case with UNC's graduates.

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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

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To be kind, you are the randman of sports forums. If you think for a second that the congressmen from the schools being left out will not nail you extremists you are in for a very rude awakening. 50,000 undergrads and you are the best OSU can provide here? What an indictment. It is no wonder Michigan looks down on the largest community college in America.

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--- expatriateheel wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

To be kind, you are the randman of sports forums. If you think for a second that the congressmen from the schools being left out will not nail you extremists you are in for a very rude awakening. 50,000 undergrads and you are the best OSU can provide here? What an indictment. It is no wonder Michigan looks down on the largest community college in America.

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Wow, you sound bitter and must have had a rough day. Sorry to get you so worked up. Ouch!

This is just a discussion board. Just letting UNC fans know what I've been hearing. Sorry you don't like what I've been hearing. Keep insulting me, you sound brilliant. I love when posters have nothing to say so they throw the insults. Awesome, you bring a lot to the board. 😎👍

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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:



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--- expatriateheel wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

To be kind, you are the randman of sports forums. If you think for a second that the congressmen from the schools being left out will not nail you extremists you are in for a very rude awakening. 50,000 undergrads and you are the best OSU can provide here? What an indictment. It is no wonder Michigan looks down on the largest community college in America.

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Wow, you sound bitter and must have had a rough day. Sorry to get you so worked up. Ouch!

This is just a discussion board. Just letting UNC fans know what I've been hearing. Sorry you don't like what I've been hearing. Keep insulting me, you sound brilliant. I love when posters have nothing to say so they throw the insults. Awesome, you bring a lot to the board. 😎👍

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"What you have been hearing?" LOL. I am not insulting you, you are insulting all Carolina supporters with your drivel. You as an individual might be condemned to living in the wasteland known as the midwest but graduates of the conference that can't count are moving (invading) the South East at an astounding rate. Their kids will be attending our universities. Your region and schools are doomed. Carolina and its alumni want no part of it.

Largest CC in the country. Ouch. Seriously though I know the Big 10 prides itself on blanket AAU membership so I imagine tOSU hold some venerable undergraduate and postgrad programs.

I think the main point of contention with your speculation is that while adding Duke and UNC is one thing, I highly doubt Big 10 can pry away Irish from their lucrative NBC contract or Kansas from the GOR. Just not realistic. I do see Ga Tech/UVa making a move.

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--- expatriateheel wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:



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--- expatriateheel wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

To be kind, you are the randman of sports forums. If you think for a second that the congressmen from the schools being left out will not nail you extremists you are in for a very rude awakening. 50,000 undergrads and you are the best OSU can provide here? What an indictment. It is no wonder Michigan looks down on the largest community college in America.

---------------------------------------------

Wow, you sound bitter and must have had a rough day. Sorry to get you so worked up. Ouch!

This is just a discussion board. Just letting UNC fans know what I've been hearing. Sorry you don't like what I've been hearing. Keep insulting me, you sound brilliant. I love when posters have nothing to say so they throw the insults. Awesome, you bring a lot to the board. 😎👍

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"What you have been hearing?" LOL. I am not insulting you, you are insulting all Carolina supporters with your drivel. You as an individual might be condemned to living in the wasteland known as the midwest but graduates of the conference that can't count are moving (invading) the South East at an astounding rate. Their kids will be attending our universities. Your region and schools are doomed. Carolina and its alumni want no part of it.

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Pot meet kettle...

And for your part you've brought nothing so far. But keep up the good work...you're off to a fine start at representing yourself as a another message board expert that HAS to share their inane level of knowledge with us.

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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:



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--- expatriateheel wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

---------------------------------------------

To be kind, you are the randman of sports forums. If you think for a second that the congressmen from the schools being left out will not nail you extremists you are in for a very rude awakening. 50,000 undergrads and you are the best OSU can provide here? What an indictment. It is no wonder Michigan looks down on the largest community college in America.

---------------------------------------------

Wow, you sound bitter and must have had a rough day. Sorry to get you so worked up. Ouch!

This is just a discussion board. Just letting UNC fans know what I've been hearing. Sorry you don't like what I've been hearing. Keep insulting me, you sound brilliant. I love when posters have nothing to say so they throw the insults. Awesome, you bring a lot to the board. 😎👍

---------------------------------------------

And for your part you've brought nothing so far. But keep up the good work...you're off to a fine start at representing yourself as a another message board expert that HAS to share their inane level of knowledge with us.

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

UNC is a crown jewel of the ACC. The B1G wants UNC. It's not that hard to understand.

UNC fans should feel good about being wanted to badly. On the other side of the coin is WF.

The B1G is in a position of power right now due to their large alumni/fan support, large state populations (that are even growing but slower than sunbelt), huge research dollars with the CIC, and very cash lucrative media contracts.

The parts of the ACC are worth more than the sum. The ACC has a very bad network tv deal and way too many overlapping markets for one conference. It is expected by 2017 that B1G schools will be making over double what the ACC schools earn. That just doesn't work. SEC and Big12 will be expanding and want a piece of the pie as well.

No one is saying the ACC is bad or anything like that. When I look at expansion, it's all about dollars and new markets. It's nothing personal.

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--- buckEYEdr2B wrote:

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

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Keep reading then...and recruit your friends to do the same thing.

As if anyone cares what your opinion is as to whether Ohio State "wants" us in the Big Ten. And folks call UNC fans pretentious...

We don't want to be in the Big Ten so if you don't want us, I think I speak for every UNC fan when I say we're okay with that.

Amen collards! I can tell you if they are counting on putting fannies in the seats in Kenan, then they willbe going SEC not Big whatever!

LJ12

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--- CornbreadandCollards wrote:


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--- buckEYEdr2B wrote:

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

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Keep reading then...and recruit your friends to do the same thing.

As if anyone cares what your opinion is as to whether Ohio State "wants" us in the Big Ten. And folks call UNC fans pretentious...

We don't want to be in the Big Ten so if you don't want us, I think I speak for every UNC fan when I say we're okay with that.

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Nah we really dont care, UNC would be nice, but I hope they grab GaTech and FSU (And yes we should allow an AAU exemption for FSU).

I just find the academic snobbery funny when bashing State and such, but then wanting to go to a conference with LSU.....a school so bad, it's ranked with Ohio U (not OHIO STATE, but OHIO U) and that doesent include Arkansas and Ole Miss, Miss ST....which rival Louisville academics

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--- buckEYEdr2B wrote:

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

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and the more we're inundated with your presence...the less we see the B1G as even a number 2 option after the SEC

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--- buckeye4573 wrote:


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--- CornbreadandCollards wrote:


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--- buckEYEdr2B wrote:

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

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Keep reading then...and recruit your friends to do the same thing.

As if anyone cares what your opinion is as to whether Ohio State "wants" us in the Big Ten. And folks call UNC fans pretentious...

We don't want to be in the Big Ten so if you don't want us, I think I speak for every UNC fan when I say we're okay with that.

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Nah we really dont care, UNC would be nice, but I hope they grab GaTech and FSU (And yes we should allow an AAU exemption for FSU).

I just find the academic snobbery funny when bashing State and such, but then wanting to go to a conference with LSU.....a school so bad, it's ranked with Ohio U (not OHIO STATE, but OHIO U) and that doesent include Arkansas and Ole Miss, Miss ST....which rival Louisville academics

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You really believe that FSU and the Big10 are destined for each other. If so, I have some ocean front propery in Columbus, OH that I would like to sell to you at a reasonable price. LOL.

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--- vigoro wrote:



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--- buckeye4573 wrote:


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--- CornbreadandCollards wrote:


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--- buckEYEdr2B wrote:

The more and more I read this message board.... The less and less I want UNC in the Big Ten.

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Keep reading then...and recruit your friends to do the same thing.

As if anyone cares what your opinion is as to whether Ohio State "wants" us in the Big Ten. And folks call UNC fans pretentious...

We don't want to be in the Big Ten so if you don't want us, I think I speak for every UNC fan when I say we're okay with that.

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Nah we really dont care, UNC would be nice, but I hope they grab GaTech and FSU (And yes we should allow an AAU exemption for FSU).

I just find the academic snobbery funny when bashing State and such, but then wanting to go to a conference with LSU.....a school so bad, it's ranked with Ohio U (not OHIO STATE, but OHIO U) and that doesent include Arkansas and Ole Miss, Miss ST....which rival Louisville academics

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You really believe that FSU and the Big10 are destined for each other. If so, I have some ocean front propery in Columbus, OH that I would like to sell to you at a reasonable price. LOL.

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I didnt say destined.....but I do think FSU with go with Tech, IF the B10 can get over the AAU issue, which is a major factor, but should be overlooked in this case (they can always get an AAU designation later)

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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

UNC is a crown jewel of the ACC. The B1G wants UNC. It's not that hard to understand.

UNC fans should feel good about being wanted to badly. On the other side of the coin is WF.

The B1G is in a position of power right now due to their large alumni/fan support, large state populations (that are even growing but slower than sunbelt), huge research dollars with the CIC, and very cash lucrative media contracts.

The parts of the ACC are worth more than the sum. The ACC has a very bad network tv deal and way too many overlapping markets for one conference. It is expected by 2017 that B1G schools will be making over double what the ACC schools earn. That just doesn't work. SEC and Big12 will be expanding and want a piece of the pie as well.

No one is saying the ACC is bad or anything like that. When I look at expansion, it's all about dollars and new markets. It's nothing personal.

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Winchester, what if the ACC survives and thrives, and, is still here as is, in four years? What then? What will be the plan for high major D1 athletics at that time?

I personally can't stand the idea of NCSU being in the SEC. Are they going to pull a Gamecock and become the power in NC? State has a much better history that the chickens, most everyone does.

UVA may very well be the wild card.

But I honestly can't see UVA, a school that values tradition, leaving the ACC with GT to join UMD (a school which they view with disdain).

Further, I cannot see UVA leaving the ACC first. UVA is not hurting for money like UMD. What reason would they have to leave with GT?

Finally, such a unilateral move by UVA would certainly set off a wild run for the exits in the ACC which would seriously destabilize the rest of the conference. I cannot see a situation where

1) UVA leaves behind all of its traditional rivals unilaterally
2) Destabilizes the ACC in the wake of its departure
3) Leaves VT in a destabilized ACC, or
4) Bolts with GT just for the money

The only way I can see UVA leaving the ACC for the B1G is as a group package deal that would include at least three other ACC schools from the NC/VA area. And such a scenario would represent the end of the ACC.

I'm starting to think all of this talk of UVA to the B1G is nothing more than a smokescreen. I do think the B1G has its eyes on some ACC schools. Maybe just not the ones that we are all thinking.

Consider this - it is clear that the B1G's ultimate goal is to get ND, right? If that is the B1G's ultimate goal, wouldn't taking Syracuse, Pitt, and BC while leaving a 4th spot for ND be a better move? It achieves the goal of destabilizing the ACC and providing all of ND's East Coast rivals.

Syracuse, Pitt, and BC have no long standing ties to the ACC anyway. It could certainly be easier to pry them away than long time ACC members like UVA.

Interestingly, Syracuse is a former AAU member and Pitt is a current one.

As a side benefit, it would also shore up PSU's standing in the Northeast by reuniting them with many of their old Eastern rivals.

ND then would have conference mates that allow them to showcase their program in the big East Coast cities from DC to Philly to New York to Boston.

Just a thought.

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--- ShadowSpawne wrote:



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--- WesternStormer wrote:



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--- WinchesterBUCK wrote:

Bottom line is there will only be four major conferences within the next 4 years. ACC will not be one of them.

B1G will add: GT & Virginia, then Duke & UNC, then ND & Kansas.

SEC will add: VT & NC State.

Big12 will add: FSU, Clemson, & Miami.


The powers that run college football (B1G, SEC, PAC, networks) want another higher division for the four power conferences. In this division, the athletes will get a stipend for their services and the NCAA will not have to regulate the schools. This is draining the budget of the NCAA and they do not have the staff for it as well. This will be for only football. It's happening, right before your eyes.

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What if, in four years, the ACC manages to survive in its present form? What then?

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I would be floored if that happened. Look for GT, with possibly UVa, to kick it off. UVa is the wild card...

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