---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:


---------------------------------------------
--- Nittany3G wrote:

I know that almost everyone on this board seems to want to go SEC, but as a Penn Stater living in FL, if the B10 goes to 20, here's my pipe-dream:

-------

WEST (THE OLD BIG 10):

Michigan
Michigan St.
Ohio State
Northwestern
Indiana/Purdue
-
Illinois
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Iowa
Nebraska


EAST (THE NEW EASTERN MEMBERS):

Penn State
Notre Dame
Rutgers
Maryland
Indiana/Purdue
-
Virginia
North Carolina
Clemson
Georgia Tech
Florida St.


-------

- Traditional powers Michigan, Ohio State, Nebraska, Wisc/Iowa/MSU would anchor the west. Traditional powers Notre Dame, Penn State, Florida State and Clemson would anchor the east

- Either Indiana or Purdue would need to play in the east with ND. (Purdue is the more traditional opponant)

- The two divisions can futher be split into pods. However, I would not rotate the pods evenly. It seems like the old-school B10 folks like playing each other every year. It also seems like eastern/southern folks do not really want to play the midwest schools much (as can be seen by the sentiment on this board). It would seem to benefit both groups if you let the eastern pods normally play each other and the western pods normally play each other. Once in awhile you could switch it up to let the other team filter through your stadium.

- I know everybody has FSU and Clemson pegged for the B12. However, Austin (the closest B12 school) is a really, really long drive from FSU (or Clemson for that matter). If you look at the states inbetween, they are SEC states. No additional B12 teams will be added in that area (the void isn't going away). It would benefit the FSU and Clemson athletic departments to keep away venues closer to home. I know that the B10 has the academic component that makes everyone think this can't work. FSU is no worse academically than Nebraska. Also, it is clearly improving. It will never overtake UF, but it is closer to UF than it is USF, UCF, FIU, FAU, etc. Getting the B10 into FL would be huge.

- I see no need for the B10 to add schools north of Penn State/Rutgers.

---------------------------------------------

Compliments, Nittany Lion fan, for thinking outside of the box a little. Taking all three of the ACC's southernmost football-first schools is a good idea.

Just a thought here...if you the pod route, and, do not alternate the opponents each season, then its a waste of time. Its basically two leagues within one, which defeats the purpose of these schools being in a league together.

A 20-team league is kind of cumbersome, and, even with your ideas, I don't know that it'd work well enough to satisfy everybody. But its an interesting idea nonetheless.

---------------------------------------------

16 is preferable, because you can setup 4 4 team pods, play your 3, plus a crossover in each one every year (rivalry type thing) and then rotate the pods every 2 years and you only miss 4 years between play.
One you would have to go to 9 conference games to do it, second if you go to 20, 4 5 team pods, you would need 11 conference games to have the same schedule...ouch!!!!

You can do four five-team pods with one crossover game, but that brings you to 10 conference games. But if your conference is that big, why the hell not?

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn Source: Georgia Tech and Virginia will be announced as Big 10 members #15 and #16 either Monday or Tuesday.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (1/2) Why was North Carolina selected in lieu of Georgia Tech? Both are AAU, but North Carolina would be contiguous.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (2/2) Possibly because North Carolina and Duke want to remain together, as they would in the scenario tweeted about by me Nov 25.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn In that scenario, as I reported Nov 25, the Big 12 would add Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Duke, Connecticut, and San Diego State.


Now I know The Guy has his detractors, but you have to admit the recents events sure have lined up with his tweets from a few days ago.

Simply brilliant, a lot of potential gold in the making with that twitter handle.

it's not that hard to put together

SEC wants into North Carolina, UNC brings that to the SEC, in droves

SEC has two open spots left

No way, no way for a second I believe UNC would pass up the SEC & go to the Big12 just so they could remain with Duke. It's way, WAY to easy to play Duke in the NonCon to make such a bold decision based off that.

I'll say this, & I'm not shocked or surprised, Slive does do one hell of a job keeping out of the spotlight until it's time but you can bet once we start smelling smoke, there will be real fire, not Twitter smoke.

Slive is in NO hurry. He struck gold with aTm and Mizzou locked down his northern flank. He'll wait for schools to come to him. And not just any school.

Just don't forget that Clempzin is sitting out there a couple hrs away with its SEC DNA (it was modeled on Miss St explicitly at its founding) and rabid regional fanbase that does extend across the Carolinas.

I honestly don't know if having GT's former AD at the helm makes Tiger town more or less likely to consider a move, but he d@mn sure got a close look at how the SEC prints money during his time in the ATL.

Resistance from Lesser Carolina is likely at a low ebb right now too, considering Columbia's recent domination. There is probably even a faction of C0ck supporters who'd relish seeing the orange-and-purple get chewed up a few times by an SEC sked.

Not saying it is likely, just possible. Particularly as the 2nd of a pair.

West Virginia troll.

---------------------------------------------
--- lv099 wrote:

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn Source: Georgia Tech and Virginia will be announced as Big 10 members #15 and #16 either Monday or Tuesday.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (1/2) Why was North Carolina selected in lieu of Georgia Tech? Both are AAU, but North Carolina would be contiguous.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (2/2) Possibly because North Carolina and Duke want to remain together, as they would in the scenario tweeted about by me Nov 25.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn In that scenario, as I reported Nov 25, the Big 12 would add Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Duke, Connecticut, and San Diego State.


Now I know The Guy has his detractors, but you have to admit the recents events sure have lined up with his tweets from a few days ago.

---------------------------------------------

Clemson and FSU aren't coming to the big 10. They don't meet the academic profile.

I just hope to watch some fball and bball (and women's soccer) this weekend and put this conference stuff out of my mind - if that is possible! Oh, and do some holiday shopping.

As many of you know, I already have a dog in the B1G; it would be hard on my soul to have my two alma maters meet regularly in all sports. Was bad enough with two games this week. SEC! SEC!

---------------------------------------------
--- TylerBloodyTyler wrote:

Slive is in NO hurry. He struck gold with aTm and Mizzou locked down his northern flank. He'll wait for schools to come to him. And not just any school.

Just don't forget that Clempzin is sitting out there a couple hrs away with its SEC DNA (it was modeled on Miss St explicitly at its founding) and rabid regional fanbase that does extend across the Carolinas.

I honestly don't know if having GT's former AD at the helm makes Tiger town more or less likely to consider a move, but he d@mn sure got a close look at how the SEC prints money during his time in the ATL.

Resistance from Lesser Carolina is likely at a low ebb right now too, considering Columbia's recent domination. There is probably even a faction of C0ck supporters who'd relish seeing the orange-and-purple get chewed up a few times by an SEC sked.

Not saying it is likely, just possible. Particularly as the 2nd of a pair.

---------------------------------------------

Clemson has NO shot at the SEC, none. The Gamecocks would NEVER allow it. Just like Florida will not allow FSU or Miami and how UGa. would never allow Ga Tech into the SEC. Also, Clemson brings nothing (TV wise) to the SEC, they already own the state of South Carolina. The SEC wants new states with new TV markets. They want into the state of North Carolina extremely bad. New eyeballs means new money for the SEC. The SEC wants UNC and UNC should want the SEC if it's got any brains at all.

---------------------------------------------
--- Carolina2009 wrote:

I've seen at least one rumor that if GT bolts to the Big Ten, FSU and Miami will be going to the Big 12 almost immediately thereafter. If that's the case, UVA would certainly go to the Big Ten. Then UNC/Duke go either to the Big Ten--which would almost certainly move to 18 for them--or the SEC. If Big Ten, then NC State and Va Tech to the SEC. Clemson and whoever's left would have to go to the Big 12.

There's a report that Syracuse is trying to go the Big Ten, too.

The Big Twenty?
imageshack.us/a/img339/4163/bigtwentymap.png

---------------------------------------------

The Big Unwieldy?

everyone
Should take advantage, by day's
End today, of inside
Carolina's free 7 day premium trial.

If you're sitting on the fence today over the SEC-B1G decision, watch the UGA/Bama game. Notice two Dawg players. Marshall went to my high school, Millbrook, in Raleigh, a 30 minute drive from our campus in Chapel Hill. Gurley played at Tarboro, which produced the legendary Kelvin Bryant, along with Shaun Draughn, Issac Mooring and countless other Tar Heel footballers. Both programs have gone deep in the state playoffs the last few years, Tarboro's won multiple titles, and both send lots of talent to the next level. And guess where they're sending that talent now? The SEC...

---------------------------------------------
--- therabidrev wrote:

If you're sitting on the fence today over the SEC-B1G decision, watch the UGA/Bama game. Notice two Dawg players. Marshall went to my high school, Millbrook, in Raleigh, a 30 minute drive from our campus in Chapel Hill. Gurley played at Tarboro, which produced the legendary Kelvin Bryant, along with Shaun Draughn, Issac Mooring and countless other Tar Heel footballers. Both programs have gone deep in the state playoffs the last few years, Tarboro's won multiple titles, and both send lots of talent to the next level. And guess where they're sending that talent now? The SEC...

---------------------------------------------

I wish no ill will upon those two young men. I hope they have happy, healthy pro careers and productive lives, and come back to NC and give back to their communities. But I'd much rather see them in Carolina blue than in that nasty red and black, pretending that they're playing for our nation's first state university (Georgia was chartered in 1785, opened in 1801). If they were in heavenly blue they wouldn't have to pretend: to be rather than to seem. Roll Tide!

---------------------------------------------
--- buckeye4573 wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- WesternStormer wrote:


---------------------------------------------
--- Nittany3G wrote:

I know that almost everyone on this board seems to want to go SEC, but as a Penn Stater living in FL, if the B10 goes to 20, here's my pipe-dream:

-------

WEST (THE OLD BIG 10):

Michigan
Michigan St.
Ohio State
Northwestern
Indiana/Purdue
-
Illinois
Wisconsin
Minnesota
Iowa
Nebraska


EAST (THE NEW EASTERN MEMBERS):

Penn State
Notre Dame
Rutgers
Maryland
Indiana/Purdue
-
Virginia
North Carolina
Clemson
Georgia Tech
Florida St.


-------

- Traditional powers Michigan, Ohio State, Nebraska, Wisc/Iowa/MSU would anchor the west. Traditional powers Notre Dame, Penn State, Florida State and Clemson would anchor the east

- Either Indiana or Purdue would need to play in the east with ND. (Purdue is the more traditional opponant)

- The two divisions can futher be split into pods. However, I would not rotate the pods evenly. It seems like the old-school B10 folks like playing each other every year. It also seems like eastern/southern folks do not really want to play the midwest schools much (as can be seen by the sentiment on this board). It would seem to benefit both groups if you let the eastern pods normally play each other and the western pods normally play each other. Once in awhile you could switch it up to let the other team filter through your stadium.

- I know everybody has FSU and Clemson pegged for the B12. However, Austin (the closest B12 school) is a really, really long drive from FSU (or Clemson for that matter). If you look at the states inbetween, they are SEC states. No additional B12 teams will be added in that area (the void isn't going away). It would benefit the FSU and Clemson athletic departments to keep away venues closer to home. I know that the B10 has the academic component that makes everyone think this can't work. FSU is no worse academically than Nebraska. Also, it is clearly improving. It will never overtake UF, but it is closer to UF than it is USF, UCF, FIU, FAU, etc. Getting the B10 into FL would be huge.

- I see no need for the B10 to add schools north of Penn State/Rutgers.

---------------------------------------------

Compliments, Nittany Lion fan, for thinking outside of the box a little. Taking all three of the ACC's southernmost football-first schools is a good idea.

Just a thought here...if you the pod route, and, do not alternate the opponents each season, then its a waste of time. Its basically two leagues within one, which defeats the purpose of these schools being in a league together.

A 20-team league is kind of cumbersome, and, even with your ideas, I don't know that it'd work well enough to satisfy everybody. But its an interesting idea nonetheless.

---------------------------------------------

16 is preferable, because you can setup 4 4 team pods, play your 3, plus a crossover in each one every year (rivalry type thing) and then rotate the pods every 2 years and you only miss 4 years between play.
One you would have to go to 9 conference games to do it, second if you go to 20, 4 5 team pods, you would need 11 conference games to have the same schedule...ouch!!!!

---------------------------------------------

I'm surprised y'all do pods up North. I didn't think you ate what we call oak-ree. ;-)

"Such malarkey." -- Joe Biden

Just wrong on so many levels. The name of the game is big public schools with huge, active alumni bases. South Carolina A&M (what Clempzin is in many ways) is attractive because it fits that bill.

"TV markets" is an outdated concept, one which of course still holds sway in ACC country due to the outsized influence of JP/Raycom.

But in any event, the basic point is this: Clempzin is a cultural fit for the SEC, UNC is not and never will be. How anyone could watch the War on Football waged by elements of the admin and faculty these long many months and concluded otherwise escapes me.




---------------------------------------------
--- Chapel Heel wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- TylerBloodyTyler wrote:

Slive is in NO hurry. He struck gold with aTm and Mizzou locked down his northern flank. He'll wait for schools to come to him. And not just any school.

Just don't forget that Clempzin is sitting out there a couple hrs away with its SEC DNA (it was modeled on Miss St explicitly at its founding) and rabid regional fanbase that does extend across the Carolinas.

I honestly don't know if having GT's former AD at the helm makes Tiger town more or less likely to consider a move, but he d@mn sure got a close look at how the SEC prints money during his time in the ATL.

Resistance from Lesser Carolina is likely at a low ebb right now too, considering Columbia's recent domination. There is probably even a faction of C0ck supporters who'd relish seeing the orange-and-purple get chewed up a few times by an SEC sked.

Not saying it is likely, just possible. Particularly as the 2nd of a pair.

---------------------------------------------

Clemson has NO shot at the SEC, none. The Gamecocks would NEVER allow it. Just like Florida will not allow FSU or Miami and how UGa. would never allow Ga Tech into the SEC. Also, Clemson brings nothing (TV wise) to the SEC, they already own the state of South Carolina. The SEC wants new states with new TV markets. They want into the state of North Carolina extremely bad. New eyeballs means new money for the SEC. The SEC wants UNC and UNC should want the SEC if it's got any brains at all.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- gbunce wrote:

espn.go.com/blog/bigten/post/_...-big-ten-rumors

---------------------------------------------

insiders are still saying to look for moves by tech and fsu very soon.

Sez Mr. Foxworthy, a GT alum, "Mayonnaise an awful lot of talk about conference diarrhealignment, and tain't much of it makin' a whole lot of sense."

Kansas in the ACC? Really? Wake in the Mountain West? Boise in the Big East? Why not? Louisville's already joined the ACC, as has Notre Dame, sort of. I guess the Great Lakes and the Ohio River count as the coast now...

No wonder people say we need to teach geography in public schools. Dang!

Step away from the keyboard. Set the cup of coffee down. Have we collectively lost our freaking minds? Softball in Minnesota in February? Ummmm-hmmmm. Football in Nebraska in late November? No offense to Husker football, they have some of the greatest fans in America, and as a hefty grain-fed German-American myself I have to love all of those linemen they've put out over the years named Steinkuhler and Damkroger (although I personally tend to like grocery stores). Omaha is a good place to eat steaks, and is fine in the summer, a nice place for our baseball team to go for their annual CWS appearances, and a nice place for a squadron of fully armed A-10 Warthogs from FayetNam to practice bombing runs on the campus of Cretin University, otherwise, no thanks.

BTW, diarrhealignment is my trademark, not Jeff's. But it accurately describes the panic, like the raging squirts.

this has nothing to do with culture or good football, it's about tv eyeballs and nothing else.
translation, money.

Get...off...the...crack pipe. The mind is a terrible thing to waste.
---------------------------------------------
--- lv099 wrote:

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn Source: Georgia Tech and Virginia will be announced as Big 10 members #15 and #16 either Monday or Tuesday.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (1/2) Why was North Carolina selected in lieu of Georgia Tech? Both are AAU, but North Carolina would be contiguous.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (2/2) Possibly because North Carolina and Duke want to remain together, as they would in the scenario tweeted about by me Nov 25.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn In that scenario, as I reported Nov 25, the Big 12 would add Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Duke, Connecticut, and San Diego State.


Now I know The Guy has his detractors, but you have to admit the recents events sure have lined up with his tweets from a few days ago.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
--- darkhorse80 wrote:


Get...off...the...crack pipe. The mind is a terrible thing to waste.
---------------------------------------------
--- lv099 wrote:

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn Source: Georgia Tech and Virginia will be announced as Big 10 members #15 and #16 either Monday or Tuesday.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (1/2) Why was North Carolina selected in lieu of Georgia Tech? Both are AAU, but North Carolina would be contiguous.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (2/2) Possibly because North Carolina and Duke want to remain together, as they would in the scenario tweeted about by me Nov 25.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn In that scenario, as I reported Nov 25, the Big 12 would add Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Duke, Connecticut, and San Diego State.


Now I know The Guy has his detractors, but you have to admit the recents events sure have lined up with his tweets from a few days ago.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

UNC fans would riot. Going to the Big 12, with those schools, is unacceptable.

Who cares?

---------------------------------------------
--- jsf5259 wrote:

Not the basketball board, but if Carolina were to change to a conference different from Duke, would they still be able to play twice a season? I realize that out of conference schedules are limited, but would be a shame to not see them play home and homes like they have for years and years.

---------------------------------------------

If you think Clemson is going to the SEC, then you don't understand how it works.

NC fits in the BIG like a glove.

---------------------------------------------
--- phatassjungle wrote:

NC fits in the BIG like a glove.

---------------------------------------------

A jesters glove

if the glove don't fit you must acquit

Like a left handed glove for a right handed person

---------------------------------------------
--- phatassjungle wrote:

NC fits in the BIG like a glove.

---------------------------------------------

If we do leave why should it be as a tandem with Duke. They bring very little to the table and shouldn't be able to piggy back ride with us into a big conference when they in reality should be an independent or a big east school after all the dust settles. None of the these power conferences would wont Duke when Football is the largest part of the eqaution. There is nothing more than at the end of the day I would like to see Duke without a conference to call home.

why would the Big 10 have picked Maryland and Rutgers ? .... both schools may lots of alumni .,...... but their alumni are certainly not notable for their support of the universities' sports teams ....



---------------------------------------------
--- TylerBloodyTyler wrote:

Just wrong on so many levels. The name of the game is big public schools with huge, active alumni bases. South Carolina A&M (what Clempzin is in many ways) is attractive because it fits that bill.

"TV markets" is an outdated concept, one which of course still holds sway in ACC country due to the outsized influence of JP/Raycom.

---------------------------------------------
--- TylerBloodyTyler wrote:

Just wrong on so many levels. The name of the game is big public schools with huge, active alumni bases. South Carolina A&M (what Clempzin is in many ways) is attractive because it fits that bill.

"TV markets" is an outdated concept, one which of course still holds sway in ACC country due to the outsized influence of JP/Raycom.

But in any event, the basic point is this: Clempzin is a cultural fit for the SEC, UNC is not and never will be. How anyone could watch the War on Football waged by elements of the admin and faculty these long many months and concluded otherwise escapes me.




---------------------------------------------
--- Chapel Heel wrote:



---------------------------------------------
--- TylerBloodyTyler wrote:

Slive is in NO hurry. He struck gold with aTm and Mizzou locked down his northern flank. He'll wait for schools to come to him. And not just any school.

Just don't forget that Clempzin is sitting out there a couple hrs away with its SEC DNA (it was modeled on Miss St explicitly at its founding) and rabid regional fanbase that does extend across the Carolinas.

I honestly don't know if having GT's former AD at the helm makes Tiger town more or less likely to consider a move, but he d@mn sure got a close look at how the SEC prints money during his time in the ATL.

Resistance from Lesser Carolina is likely at a low ebb right now too, considering Columbia's recent domination. There is probably even a faction of C0ck supporters who'd relish seeing the orange-and-purple get chewed up a few times by an SEC sked.

Not saying it is likely, just possible. Particularly as the 2nd of a pair.

---------------------------------------------

Clemson has NO shot at the SEC, none. The Gamecocks would NEVER allow it. Just like Florida will not allow FSU or Miami and how UGa. would never allow Ga Tech into the SEC. Also, Clemson brings nothing (TV wise) to the SEC, they already own the state of South Carolina. The SEC wants new states with new TV markets. They want into the state of North Carolina extremely bad. New eyeballs means new money for the SEC. The SEC wants UNC and UNC should want the SEC if it's got any brains at all.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------
Tyler, you have NO IDEA how it works in the SEC, and by reading your posts it's obvious that no one will be able to convince you that you are so wrong "on many levels".

I don't think you understand, it IS all about new TV markets. Anybody and everybody can and will tell you that. If you've paid any attention at all over the last year, everybody has said that from day one. Why do you think all the talk about FSU and Clemson always seems to pertain to the Big 12? Not from some crazy blogger but from folks who know. Do you honestly think that Clemson and FSU would still be in the ACC if they could just walk right through the SEC door? lol

Now I know I won't be able to convince you because you've already convinced yourself that you are right. Hell, even a good friend of mine (who is a die-hard Clemson fan) could even sit you down and tell you that Clemson has no shot at the SEC because of South Carolina's veto power.

---------------------------------------------
--- darkhorse80 wrote:


Get...off...the...crack pipe. The mind is a terrible thing to waste.
---------------------------------------------
--- lv099 wrote:

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn Source: Georgia Tech and Virginia will be announced as Big 10 members #15 and #16 either Monday or Tuesday.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (1/2) Why was North Carolina selected in lieu of Georgia Tech? Both are AAU, but North Carolina would be contiguous.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn (2/2) Possibly because North Carolina and Duke want to remain together, as they would in the scenario tweeted about by me Nov 25.

Guy Jones ‏ @ TheGuyOfUConn In that scenario, as I reported Nov 25, the Big 12 would add Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Duke, Connecticut, and San Diego State.


Now I know The Guy has his detractors, but you have to admit the recents events sure have lined up with his tweets from a few days ago.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

And the waist is a terrible thing to mind.

---------------------------------------------
--- phatassjungle wrote:

NC fits in the BIG like a glove.

---------------------------------------------

OJ, is that you?

+ from all evidence this talk about Fla St and Clempson to the Big 12 does pretty much seem to be internet blogger b.s. ..... and boy there seems to be an explosion in the supply of that lately .......

+ all this - (from TylerBloodyTyler) --> "I know what Slive is thinking - and let me tell you ....." ......... is it just me or do others find this just incredibly obnoxious ? ...........


---------------------------------------------
--- Chapel Heel wrote:


Why do you think all the talk about FSU and Clemson always seems to pertain to the Big 12? Not from some crazy blogger but from folks who know.

---------------------------------------------

There should be 5 super conferences. All based off of geography. It's a pretty simple concept.

---------------------------------------------
--- paintitcarolinablue wrote:

There should be 5 super conferences. All based off of geography. It's a pretty simple concept.

---------------------------------------------

I like geography, but 5 is an odd number.

---------------------------------------------
--- BethelRegiment wrote:

+ from all evidence this talk about Fla St and Clempson to the Big 12 does pretty much seem to be internet blogger b.s. ..... and boy there seems to be an explosion in the supply of that lately .......

+ all this - (from TylerBloodyTyler) --> "I know what Slive is thinking - and let me tell you ....." ......... is it just me or do others find this just incredibly obnoxious ? ...........


---------------------------------------------
--- Chapel Heel wrote:


Why do you think all the talk about FSU and Clemson always seems to pertain to the Big 12? Not from some crazy blogger but from folks who know.

---------------------------------------------

---------------------------------------------

I just don't see FSU and Clemson as quite as desperate as WVU was. And I'm not disrespecting WVU, I wish we'd taken them.