If next season is an upcapped season who should be released?

My list would be

1.ARE

2.Phillp Daniels

3.Renaldo Wynn

4.Todd Collins

5.Stephon Heyer

6.Fred Smoot

My untouchables are

1.Albert Hayhesworth-He is the best Dlineman we have and this line will be dominant with him for at least 4or 5 years

2.Brian Orakpo-He should be at DE him and Albert are beasts

3.London Fletcher- He is still a tackling machine even at his age.

I didn't leave JC out I just want to see how he does the rest of the season of the season before I make my final decsion on him. I said I was going to give him the whole season to prove himself so far he gets a D.

Randle El (force them to use Kelly and Thomas as number 2s)

Cartright (He hasn't done anything on returns in a while)

Betts (can't move a pile, doesn't have breakaway speed, and can't pass protect)

I wouldn't get rid of Heyer, as he is still a cheap tackle that could be a good backup.  He just shouldn't be our starting left tackle.

On the Oline, I would keep Dockery, Williams, Heyer, and Thomas (if he could come back from his injury), the rest might stay as backups, but I would definitely be picking up a new Center and a new Left Tackle (I'ld like a new right tackle too, but that might not be possible in one off season, and if Williams continues to improve, he might be able to hold that spot next year.

Cuts

Haynesworth - makes too much money for a rebuilding team
Hall - see above
Dockery - see above
Samuels - I'd hold on to him (even if he wants to retire now) just to cut him in an uncapped situation.
R. Thomas - Too old and brittle
Portis - makes too much money on a rebuilding team
Moss - makes too much money and is too old for a rebuilding team
ARE - see above
A Carter - see above
P. Daniels - Too old
J. Campbell - Just not a good fit, plus we ruined him.

Untouchable

L Landry - young enough to make and impact in 2013
Orakpo - see above

J. Jarmon
Horton - see above
D. Thomas - see above
M. Kelly - see above
F. Davis - See above
C. Rinhardt - See above

Trade Attempts:
C. Cooley - one of two players that might have value in the market
C. Rogers - quickly playing his way out of the above statement

I forgot to add Rock Cartwright and Ladell Betts to the list we need to start to get younger at the RB postion. 

RAWBACK

MikeLowery wrote:

Cuts

Haynesworth - makes too much money for a rebuilding team
Hall - see above
Dockery - see above
Samuels - I'd hold on to him (even if he wants to retire now) just to cut him in an uncapped situation.
R. Thomas - Too old and brittle
Portis - makes too much money on a rebuilding team
Moss - makes too much money and is too old for a rebuilding team
ARE - see above
A Carter - see above
P. Daniels - Too old
J. Campbell - Just not a good fit, plus we ruined him.

Untouchable

L Landry - young enough to make and impact in 2013
Orakpo - see above

J. Jarmon
Horton - see above
D. Thomas - see above
M. Kelly - see above
F. Davis - See above
C. Rinhardt - See above

Trade Attempts:
C. Cooley - one of two players that might have value in the market
C. Rogers - quickly playing his way out of the above statement

I disagree about Haynesworth we should keep us because he is our best Dlinemen. I do agree about Andre Carter he does make alot of money and he only has had 2 good seasons with us.

Coqui2009 wrote:

 

I disagree about Haynesworth we should keep us because he is our best Dlinemen. 

You don't keep Al because he's our best d-lineman.  You also have to remember that he takes up a huge chunk of our cap and he is not the difference between us and a superbowl.  Remember, we had the #4 defense without him.  By the time we get good, Al will be in his early 30's.  How good will he be at that point?

We may have a one year window to get rid of every mistake.  We have to do it!  If a real GM comes in here I guarantee you he'll completely clean house.  This job is enticing as hell for a GM. 

I'd keep Zorn for at least 2 more years.........i'd bring in a GM ASAP.............. i'd let Zorn coach through the rebuilding stage, then i'd let the GM either keep Zorn or hire who he sees fit after the 2012 season. 

******Howver, that new coach would have to run the West Coast Offense, that would be the only stipulation.  That's because I would have spent the past two years acquiring West Coast offensive Talent. 

Same would go for the other side of the ball.  If we committed to a 3-4, the only stipulaiton is that the HC would have to be willing to run the 3-4 defense.  For the first time in over a decade we will have a philosophy that is decided by management not coaching.  We will hire coaches based upon OUR philosophy not HIS. 

MikeLowery wrote:

Cuts

Haynesworth - makes too much money for a rebuilding team
Hall - see above
Dockery - see above
Samuels - I'd hold on to him (even if he wants to retire now) just to cut him in an uncapped situation.
R. Thomas - Too old and brittle
Portis - makes too much money on a rebuilding team
Moss - makes too much money and is too old for a rebuilding team
ARE - see above
A Carter - see above
P. Daniels - Too old
J. Campbell - Just not a good fit, plus we ruined him.

Untouchable

L Landry - young enough to make and impact in 2013
Orakpo - see above

J. Jarmon
Horton - see above
D. Thomas - see above
M. Kelly - see above
F. Davis - See above
C. Rinhardt - See above

Trade Attempts:
C. Cooley - one of two players that might have value in the market
C. Rogers - quickly playing his way out of the above statement

There are so, many players on this team that needs to be cut that the roster should look like the month-to-month employment at a call center....  Heavy turnover.

I would keep Haynesworth, Dockery, Moss and Carter....  Albeit, I think the latter three could come in handy at some point with a new regime (I'd use Dock for depth).  I believe Samuels is gonna retire once the season is over.  He's still on his "game" and I know it's hard to give it up....  But, he has more living once his football career is over.   Hell!  Let him take Bugel's spot next season.  LOL 

I would attempt to trade Carlos Rogers, but I would hold onto Cooley.  I believe he and Fred Davis could line up on the field together at some point (with the right regime) and be a nightmare for defenses. 

Otherwise, I think the entire offensive line needs to be rectified....  There is a chance we're gonna have 5 new starters on the O-line come next preseason....  I do not know how we're gonna pull it off, but it needs to be done.

The offense, as a whole should look totally different next season....  No Campbell, No Portis, No Sellers (that's right) and a whole new O-line.  The only starters from this current offense who should remain on the team and as starters are Cooley and Moss.  I still think Moss can produce, if he gets a competent QB.

As, far as the defensive side of the ball....  I think Haynesworth is the linchpin of the defense....  He's a keeper, along with Orakpo and Fletcher (although, we need to soon find a replacement for Fletcher).  I would give walking papers to Griffin, Daniels and Wynn (the latter two should not be on the team right now).

I would attempt to trade Rogers and if, we're not able to get a reasonable bargain for him, then I'd keep him on....  See 'ya later, Smoot!  It was nice to see you back to the team who originally  drafted you, but you're done.  Bye bye!  I'm still iffy on Hall....  I'm not sure whether to keep him or cut him.   I guess I'll lean towards maintaining him since I can't come to a conclusion.  Maybe, with a new defensive coordinator and a better enviroment then we may see a better defense than the one we have at the moment....  Which isn't too shabby.

Overview:  We're going to need an influx of offensive personnel (with the exception of, Cooley and Moss) and a few parts on the defensive side of the ball.  Give us a strong; competent GM and head coach (one can dream, huh?) and we can begin to make some waves. 

Stay tuned!

I have no overwhelming emotional attachment to any of them.   There are some guys I like (Fletcher, Cooley, Jarmon, Orakpo, Davis, and hmmmm) but it's not going to kill me to see anyone go.

Many of the cuts people are mentioning would put us in an untenable situation in a capped year.   Uncapped, who knows.

Why would you get rid of Haynesworth, though?   The guy is our best player.   Admittedly, the best player on a 2-5 lousy team, but he's very good and you can build around him.

We didn't have to be a lousy team.   Our front office knew how thin our offensive line was - it was thin last year and it hurt us then.   There were always questions about Jason.  Not sure what other data on the guy is needed.   My feeling is that had we addressed the offensive line, we'd be 5-2 and talking playoffs....that's even with Campbell behind center (a center other than Rabach).

TennesseeCarl wrote:

 

Why would you get rid of Haynesworth, though?   The guy is our best player.   Admittedly, the best player on a 2-5 lousy team, but he's very good and you can build around him.

 

We didn't have to be a lousy team.  

Carl,

This is how I operate.  I look at 2013 and ask myself  "Do I see you as a part of the future of this team starting at that point?"  If the answer is no, then you can go today.  As good as Albert is he will be 31 in 2013 and I really don't want anyone that age on my team that year save a QB. 

As far as not having to be a lousy team.  The current management is always selling us the fact that we don't HAVe to be lousy.  Well I think we do, if we every really want to get better and be good over an extended period of time.  We have to blow this thing up.  And fortunately, the uncapped year is going to give us the change to do it.  If we keep Haynesworth, he'll be his normal dominant self for two more years, while we go 5-11.  After those to years, and probably at least one contract renegotation, he will turn into the Portis of the defense.  A cap burden for a moderately productive player for this team.  He has to go NOW.  Let's have some forward thinking for a change. 

CB

Smoot (4.1 mil)

Rogers (trade for picks)(3.2 mil)

LB

Fletcher (4.3 mil)

DE

Wynn (0.5 mil)

Daniels (0.5 mil)

Carter (4.3 mil)

DT

Haynesworth (7.0 mil)

Griffin (3.9 mil)

OT

Samuels (if he doesn't retire, we shouldn't make him go throught this)(7.0 mil)

OG

Thomas (5.0 mil)

TE

Yoder (0.8 mil)

Cooley (trade for picks)(3.0 mil)

RB

Portis (6.2 mil)

Betts (2.3 mil)

WR

Randle El (4.1 mil)

Moss (trade for picks)(6.7 mil)

QB

Campbell (3.9 mil)

Collins (2.5 mil)

If I added that right, its 69.3 mil against our cap we would cut. Not sure how much of that would stay with us.

Cut the following:

Rabach, Thomas, Samuels, Heyer (our line is a mess, do you really think keeping any of them is going to help?)
Portis, Betts, Sellers, Randle-El
Daniels, Griffin, Smoot

...I would not tender JC either...

I think you keep the following 'core guys' unless you can trade one or more for real value.

Orakpo

Jarmon

Landry

Horton

Moore

Doughty

Thomas (Devin, not Randy)

Kelly

Davis

Cooley

Rinehart

Mitchell

Hall

Tryon

Barnes

Brennan (#3 QB)

Hunter the Punter

Sushi the Kicker

Wilson

Blades

Fletcher

Collins (#2 QB)

Carter

Haynesworth

Golston

Montgomery

Alexander

I would try to renegotiate Hall's and Haynesworth's deals, and if they balk, you walk away. Of the two, Haynesworth - in spite of his really bad contract - is the one I would try to keep. I don't mind DHall so much, but he is overpaid for a guy who can't tackle and only some times covers. He is exceptional at big plays, however.

So, by only keeping 25 to 30 or so guys, you still have to find the other half of your 53-man roster. Between the cap hits for cutting guys and cash needed to add guys to fill the gap, 2010 will be a record 'salary' season. BUT, if you do it right, you can build a salary structure going forward that is about half that expensive in 2011.

HogWildNVA wrote: Mike -

We're not 4 years away which is what I see as wrong in your premise and list of cuts.

You don't cut Haynesworth for two reasons: Jarmon and Orakpo. If you want those guys to succeed the easiest thing to do is keep the behemoth in the middle giving them favorable outside match-ups.

I'm absolutely shocked you don't have Griffin on your cut list - way too much money for a guy that's probably our 3rd DT and declining thanks to injuries.

I also don't see why you're so high on Landry - the guy has regressed every year in the league. We should try to trade him while he still has any perceived value.

With the right coaching and management and some shrewd moves this could be a playoff team next season assuming its an uncapped year. Just give players all their money in the first year salary rather than obscene bonuses - its not as bad as you make it seem.

We're not 4 years away

We're not 3 years away

Rebuilding is not in Danny's vocabulary....

Well it's not in a lot of the fans vocabulary either.  Who thought Albert was a good pick up???????  If you did......he wasn't.  He brought us what we thought he would....dominance in the middle.  So what?  It hasn't helped this team and in the long run I believe his contract will hurt it.   

We have a once in a lifetime chance to rid this team of contracts and a lot of you want to keep most of them. 

HogWild,

I'm high on all of our drafted young players, including Landry, because I'm so low on our coaching.  Landry is playing out of position.  We all know that.  In 2013 he'll be 26.  Therefore he can stay. 

You say we're not 4 years away?????

We have no QB or Oline.  I'm suppose you recommend spending free agent dollars huh? 

What's the first step of a 12 step program????

You have to realize you have a problem.  Some of you guys have been so conditioned by this ownership that you think just like them.  Even when you really don't want to.   

Hungry for more of the same.

We are just a ________________ away. Then Danny goes out and gets it. All are estatic, then they realize that we were more than just a ______________________ away. Some even blame the _________________________ Danny went out and got.  Others blame Danny for going out and getting the very _____________________ they said we needed.  While a few others simply shake their heads in utter disgust at the whole process. 

But like clockwork, when that season is over, those same people say, we are only a ______________________ away. Danny sits in his office loving it. It's easy to go out and pay top dollar for ________________________. "They'll never turn their back on me" he says. "Because I'll keep making them think we are a ________________________ away every year."

"Just like I taught them. There's no such thing as rebuilding."



I love you guys, but most of you all have been burnt beyond recognition by this organization.

There's no reason we can't compete next year huh AK47Cooley. Always next year. Danny would kiss you right on the mouth if he could get his hands on you.

#1 I get rid of Vinny

Then Zorn goes with Jason

I like Cooley but I trade him to increase picks

Ditto for Portis if trade is available.

Maybe try to trade Kelly or Thomas if available

I release R El, Heyer,Thomas,Betts,Samuels,Sellers

The only D player I release is C.Rogers.

I use all the picks for Offense only and maybe a mid priced amount on a FA.

AK47Cooley wrote: Why would we wait until 2013 to be competitive? Look at the `98 Colts going 3-13, then 13-3 the following year. Granted they had a young Peyton Manning, but it doesn't take releasing all of our good players because they make too much money. The main reason we stink is our offense and if we build up our line and get a decent QB here, there's NO reason we can't compete next year.

You know actually this speaks to my point.  Those same Colts, headed by the very GM that most salivate over (Polian) blew it up by trading Marshall Faulk.

Some of you clowns get up in arms over the suggestion of trading Chris Cooley. 

Wow guys a little overkill here, but i'll play. First off we are not a bad team just snakebitten on offense, which leads to some not many though mental breakdowns on a 2009 top ranked defense.  Plus i still don't get this one but how is giving the best dlineman in the nfl at the beginning of his prime 40% of his contract a bad one. See all contracts please.

Cut:

JC- Gutless

portis- imature

betts

rock

A.R.E.

R. Thomas

Rogers or trade em

Smoot

Collins

Don't resign

Griffen

Daniels

Resign

Gohlston

Monty

heyer

Mike Williams

Rocky M.

Keep

Colt, Mason, Mossy, Devin, Malcom, Cooley, Davis samuels(unless he retires), Dock, Rhineheart, E. Williams, Marko, Big AL, RAK, Carter(not a bad Deal in 2010) Jarmon, Fletcher, Henson, Hall (Baller), Landry, Horton, Moore, Tryon, Barnes, Wilson.

This teams needs life at the Running Back. A stable Coaching staff And A Real Leader At QB, Without thae latter no Team Ever Wins .

It would be easier for me, just to say who I would keep

Offense

Thomas
Kelly
Mitchell
Cooley
Brennan
Samuels (If he come back, even in a limited role)
Dockery
Williams
Heyer
Reinhart


Defense

I would keep in tact.

I would draft ad raid f/a like mad only picking up guys under 25.

Haynesworth has, by my very rough calculations, at least  $30M in quaranteed money left on his contract.  

I would try to trade Cooley (2nd Round Pick) / Moss (3rd or 4th Round Pick) / Portis (4th Round Pick) /  Carter (3rd Round Pick).

I would cut ARE, Randy Thomas, Samules (Due to Retirement), Rabach, Rock, Yoder, Collins, Griffin, Smoot, Campbell(Restricted F/A due to no cap).

Go into the season with the following:

QB Colt

QB 1st Round Pick

QB Vet that runs new HC offense

RB Betts

RB 4th Round Pick

RB 5th Round Pick

FB Sellers

TE Davis

TE Yoder (Only to Block)

WR Free Agent #1 type

WR Thomas

WR Kelly

WR Marko

OT 2nd Round Pick (Cooley Trade)

OG Dockrey

C  3rd Round Pick (Moss Trade)

OG BMW

OT 2nd Round Pick

OT Levi Jones

OT Heyer

OG Rinehart

OG/C Montgomery

DE Jarmon

DE Orakpo

DE Wilson

DT Haynesworth

DT Golston

DT Monty

LB Rocky

LB Fletcher

LB F/A Starter

LB 3rd Round Pick (Carter Trade)

LB 4th Round Pick (Portis Trade)

CB Rogers - Low Cost Extension

CB Hall

CB Barnes

CB Tyron

S Landry

S Doughty

S Horton

S Moore

We cut the fat and rebuild the LB and O-Line along with getting a stud QB to lay the foundation. 

This is exactly what i've been saying.  The same thing with Miami...  

But let's just trade everyone, including our young all pro TE and the Best DT in the game while we play with a bunch of 2nd and 3rd round rookies and a ton of FA scrubs no one wants.  That'll fix this team...!

Good plan guys maybe we should just lure away Ozzie Newsome,  cut everyone loose and hold open tryouts and field a team with heart and spunk!  That'll show everyone, won't it?

You guys are seeing right now, in KC what good a GM does when you don't have Tom Brady or a headliner HC.  Absolutely jack **** nothing...

HogWildNVA wrote: Wasn't Atlanta a train wreck Mike? Nobody saw their turn around coming yet one coach, one qb and smart draft got them to play-off contention.

How can **** like this possibly be real?

Tosprops wrote: It is probably easier to list only who should be kept.

In no particular order:

F. Davis
Orakpo
Horton
Landry
Fletcher
Betts
Cartwright
Suisham

jsagan77 wrote:

This is exactly what i've been saying.  The same thing with Miami...  

But let's just trade everyone, including our young all pro TE and the Best DT in the game while we play with a bunch of 2nd and 3rd round rookies and a ton of FA scrubs no one wants.  That'll fix this team...!

 

Good plan guys maybe we should just lure away Ozzie Newsome,  cut everyone loose and hold open tryouts and field a team with heart and spunk!  That'll show everyone, won't it?

 

You guys are seeing right now, in KC what good a GM does when you don't have Tom Brady or a headliner HC.  Absolutely jack **** nothing...

HogWildNVA wrote: Wasn't Atlanta a train wreck Mike? Nobody saw their turn around coming yet one coach, one qb and smart draft got them to play-off contention.

 

Right on the mouth he'd kiss you guys.  Right on your hot azz mouths.  You all love how Danny operates.