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A problem at center?

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Posted: 8/25/2014 4:38 PM

A problem at center? 


Unfortunately, the Giants really need Richburg at guard now, otherwise I think he would take over the starting center position.  It is becoming clear that the Giants may lack sufficient depth in the interior of the OL.

There is a lot of talk about Mosley not playing well, but J.D. Walton has been the worst performer on the OL in the preseason games.  His overall cumulative grade is -6.5, with a -1.7 pass blocking grade and a putrid -5.4 run blocking grade (107 snaps in the preseason).

I read the following review of Walton's performance in the Jets game over at BBI:

Without a doubt, the worst player on the field Friday night may have been J.D. Walton. Whenever, seriously, whenever, Manning was pressured, someone got past Walton. I specifically found the following plays:
  • Sheldon Richardson blew past Walton to disrupt Manning on a deep ball to Rueben Randle. Manning knew he had Randle, was lining up to throw to Randle, but couldn’t step into the throw because Richardson was in his face.
  • Calvin Pryor blitzed, Walton whiffed on it which caused Manning to roll out to his right and throw off balanced.
  • On a Rashad Jennings run, Richardson drove Walton about three yards into the backfield and into the lap of Jennings.
  • On a two-man rush, Richardson still managed to put pressure on Manning by pushing himself past Walton.


http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/2014/08/25/preseason-game-review-new-york-giants-new-york-jets-august-22-2014/

                Remember Joe Delaney
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Posted: 8/25/2014 4:41 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


This might be my starting OL (with Schwartz out):

Beatty (LT), Brewer (LG), Richburg (C), Mosley (RG), Pugh (RT)

                Remember Joe Delaney
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Posted: 8/25/2014 4:54 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


Richburg is the future center. They should draft an offensive lineman early in next years draft. Id even draft two in the first three picks.

But until then, our best offensive line is Beatty (LT), Richburg (LG), Walton (C), Jerry (RG), Pugh (RT).
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Posted: 8/25/2014 5:10 PM

Re: A problem at center? 



callmeSage wrote:
There is a lot of talk about Mosley not playing well, but J.D. Walton has been the worst performer on the OL in the preseason games.  His overall cumulative grade is -6.5, with a -1.7 pass blocking grade and a putrid -5.4 run blocking grade (107 snaps in the preseason).
This isn't surprising. Walton was bad for two years, had a good month, and then missed two years. Management should not have expected him to get out of the gate strong. It makes you wonder if there ever was a plan for the OL.
“No matter how much you've won, no matter how many games, no matter how many championships, no matter how many Super Bowls, you're not winning now, so you stink.” -Bill Parcells
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Posted: 8/25/2014 11:38 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


I would like to see TC try Gaines at Guard...not a fan of Mosley!
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Posted: 8/26/2014 9:46 AM

Re: A problem at center? 


Well........Richburg could always slide back into Center if it turns out Walton is a complete bust.    Although the Giants didn't exactly spend big money on Walton.   So I am not sure that the Giants were expecting a huge recovery.....esp considering they drafted Richburg.    


This offensive line is a completely different ball of wax this season.    Lots of new faces......a new offensive philosophy.    It's absolutely a work in progress.      


Richardson is one of the most disruptive DT's in the league Sage......so I can't totally get on Walton.   Plus Schwartz wasn't exactly providing additional help while he was in the lineup.    Still......it was a poor performance, no doubt.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:04 AM

Re: A problem at center? 



oldblue1 wrote: I would like to see TC try Gaines at Guard...not a fan of Mosley!

Give me John Jerry at RG

+11.0 pass-block the last 2 seasons (+4.0 in 2012, +7.0 in 2013)

Best interior pass-blocker we have on the roster

If you want to see Eli throwing from a clean pocket, then Jerry is the guy

Last edited 8/26/2014 10:17 AM by EliMcAdoo2014

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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:36 AM

Re: A problem at center? 



EliMcAdoo2014 wrote:
 

Give me John Jerry at RG

+11.0 pass-block the last 2 seasons (+4.0 in 2012, +7.0 in 2013)

Best interior pass-blocker we have on the roster

If you want to see Eli throwing from a clean pocket, then Jerry is the guy
and the good thing about jerry, is if the others dont hold up their end of the line, he will bully, berate and probably give them "wedgies" later.

all kidding aside, he was a starter and the only reason he is not and came to us is because of the nonsense "adult" man on man bullying crap in miami.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:39 AM

Re: A problem at center? 


Do we know that Jerry isn't going to be suspended?
“No matter how much you've won, no matter how many games, no matter how many championships, no matter how many Super Bowls, you're not winning now, so you stink.” -Bill Parcells
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Posted: 8/26/2014 2:50 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


Schwartz will be in a boot for about a week and then evaluated on a week by week basis.  So, it sounds like he will be OK -- probably miss a few games but not a long term injury.

I agree: when Schwartz returns the Giants have to seriously consider moving Richburg to starting center if Walton doesn't begin playing better.  He has been awful in the preseason.

I know Jerry has been awful too, but he has a decent track record.  Due to injury, Jerry has been a little slow out of the gate.  He should improve with more playing time.  Jerry will give you a clean pocket and so has some value.

                Remember Joe Delaney
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Last edited 8/26/2014 2:56 PM by callmeSage

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Posted: 8/26/2014 5:17 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


Seems to me Walton and Schwartz are in different systems and dont seem to display the same skills that they had in other offenses.A lot of the players we resigned also dont fit this type offense very well. There has been a few instances where the teams lineman have simply been overpowered by the opposition,a few more times that newer players like Richburg  and Mosley have helped team mates and not completed their own assignments.Schwartz has a much higher comfort level at right guard and suffers when he is moved.Cant go without mentioning that all the rbs have been sub par as well with their blitz pickups.

Big Blue View had a good summation to this discussion and the gist of it is there isnt a total lack of talent it is more that they need to gel more as a unit to know each others strengths and weaknesses.Why a transformation hasnt come to pass as of yet might also be in the communication between position coaches and the new o.c. as well.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 9:31 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


Well Walton has only played in 3 preseason games after being injured for 2 years, so he's going to have to get back into the speed and understanding of the game again. He might be only a 1 year option as well just to get Richburg up to speed to the NFL game.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 9:46 PM

Re: A problem at center? 


Hope was springing for with me in the offseason for the lack of Kildrive and a few fairly good OL additions.  But after seeing the OL play BEFORE any injuries I fear we're doomed. 

Washington cut an experienced center, but relying on waiver wire stuff reminds me of the late 70's early 80's.

Hope I'm wrong.
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Posted: 8/27/2014 8:13 AM

Re: A problem at center? 


Part of me can't help but feel a little bit satisfied with all of this going on. Back at the draft I was clammoring for offensive linemen to be drafted (note more than one) at the top of the draft, and I was being yelled at that the Giants had sufficiently upgraded the line and no more bodies were needed. Well, I feel validation now.

The bad part is that this is going to cost the Giants their entire season. No matter how good the defense plays, or how good the running backs are or how good and deep the receivers are, the atrocious offensive line is going to cause the offense to be stuck in the mud. That really stinks because its going to set back the entire new offense for a year. Maybe next Spring Reese will bring in some more "quality" linemen, but probably not. He'll probably keep Schwartz around and then draft DE with their first round choice and add an OL in the 3rd round.

Good teams rely on their stars,
Great teams rely on each other.

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Posted: 8/27/2014 10:03 AM

Re: A problem at center? 



leagued wrote: Part of me can't help but feel a little bit satisfied with all of this going on. Back at the draft I was clammoring for offensive linemen to be drafted (note more than one) at the top of the draft, and I was being yelled at that the Giants had sufficiently upgraded the line and no more bodies were needed. Well, I feel validation now.

The bad part is that this is going to cost the Giants their entire season. No matter how good the defense plays, or how good the running backs are or how good and deep the receivers are, the atrocious offensive line is going to cause the offense to be stuck in the mud. That really stinks because its going to set back the entire new offense for a year. Maybe next Spring Reese will bring in some more "quality" linemen, but probably not. He'll probably keep Schwartz around and then draft DE with their first round choice and add an OL in the 3rd round.
They could have drafted OL in the first three rounds this year and it wouldn't have been too much. At this point, ODB and Bromley are luxuries compared to what is going on with the OL.

In the first round, if Zach Martin was the pick, he could have been a quality starter anywhere on the line.

In the third round, all of the OTs and OGs taken after Bromley are playing well and many of then are already starting (Spencer Long, Gabe Jackson, Chris Watt,  Trai Turner, Brandon Linder, Michael Schofield).

We would be in better shape right now had we drafted Martin, Richburg, and Jackson. All three would be starters in week 1. It's not ideal to start so many young players, but at least it would be a more promising future.
“No matter how much you've won, no matter how many games, no matter how many championships, no matter how many Super Bowls, you're not winning now, so you stink.” -Bill Parcells
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Posted: 8/27/2014 11:53 AM

Re: A problem at center? 


Absolutely Doc, and that is what is so maddening about this. This year is not going to be successful but a lot of us veteran fans would have accepted it as a rebuilding year had they actually gone and drafted a bunch of linemen to build the offense around. Instead they did almost nothing to fix the line, other than sign some bad and/or injury prone players, and now this season will be lost and they will be in the exact same position next year.

Someone else pointed out a disconnect between the front office and the head coach and that is pointed out again here. Coughlin believes heavily in building your lines and winning at the line of scrimmage. However, the front office went cheap on fixing a major problem on the offensive line and instead added a WR and a DT that is fighting to make the team when it could have drafted quality offensive linemen with all of those picks and really built up that line for the future. There are always quality receivers in every draft and they could have found another receiver next year if they needed to.

I'm very disappointed and confused about what this team is trying to do.

Good teams rely on their stars,
Great teams rely on each other.

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