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Is the pre-season turning into dampner?

Posted: 8/5/2014 4:25 AM

Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I've been thinking in terms of a super bowl contender.

The potential of Wilson stretching a D and Hill solidifying a great secondary were, as it's turned out, "like this insubstantial pageant faded,".
Is Ordell chronic?
My "pageant" was based on Schwartz being superb and JJP being, well being "JJP".
Compromise their contributions - as it is starting to appear likely - and I'm not sure the vision survives.
SP teams have to be very good AND very lucky.

Last edited 8/5/2014 4:32 AM by Grizz299

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Posted: 8/5/2014 7:48 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I'm hoping for just as many surprises (Andre Williams?) as there are disappointments...
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Posted: 8/5/2014 9:47 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Grizz......I feel like the optimism for Wilson was a bit lofty.....to be honest.    It's one thing when a Peyton Manning has a neck procedure.......he's not facing contact every down.    A David Wilson.......even a Jermichael Finley......they need to really have that part of their body not be compromised like that at such a young age.    It's truly sad that Wilson's career had to come to an end......but I thought if anyone believed he'd see more than 5-10 touches per game, it would be a lofty expectation.     


W Hill was a loss.......but the guy couldn't keep his stuff together.    The Giants were not going to invest further in him.     


I really don't envision this current roster as a Super Bowl eligible roster.    However......I absolutely think they are a playoff contending roster.    That absolutely is an expectation for this year's team in my book.    I am also just excited that we are going off on a different direction offensively which I think will ultimately be a positive and just make this season a lot of fun, regardless.      

I really think this is just going to be a fun season grizz.    I wouldn't get too caught up in Super Bowl or bust.    It would be nice to just win the freaking division.   We haven't done that in a little while.    It's the easy way to get into the playoffs.
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Posted: 8/5/2014 1:19 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I dunno Jeff, maybe I want it too darn much this year. All the negativity... A chance to cap this run, this regime. I still think if Schwartz, JJP and Moore achieve their potential that we can play with anyone.
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Posted: 8/5/2014 2:34 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I still think if Schwartz, JJP and Moore achieve their potential that we can
play with anyone.




What a powerful word IF is
There is no 'I' in team

Last edited 8/5/2014 2:35 PM by Jintsfan46

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Posted: 8/5/2014 4:08 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Whether or not we are considered Super Bowl Contenders in December will have little to nothing to do with our outlook in the first week of August.  

So, I'm just going to enjoy watching the games on Sunday and see how things play out.
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Posted: 8/5/2014 5:04 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I agree with JeffH that asking Wilson to survive a season of hits was a dream. To David's credit he realizes that his pro career may have ended. Hope he left VT with a sheepskin, if not he can always go back. Still a young lad, wish him the best. Will miss those back flips for sure. And that is coming from someone who hates TD celebrations. But enjoyed those flips as it most likely lit TC up.

Last edited 8/5/2014 5:09 PM by ErnieFergler

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Posted: 8/5/2014 5:15 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


I remember the year I stopped believing in Santa Claus.  Yeah, the sting of betrayal was a bitter pill, but on Christmas morning, there were still presents under the tree.

Despite the recent karmick kick-in-the-shorts... somebody on this team will surprise us in a positive way.
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Posted: 8/5/2014 9:00 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Putting the pieces together - when David Wilson missed most of last year with a neck problem, followed by the fusion surgery,followed by the Giants acquiring Jennings, followed by drafting Andre Williams, I think we all should have figured out that the Braintrust was not counting on DW for anything this year or probably ever.  I gave up on DW and WH a couple of months ago.  Too many issues to ignore and hope they could help us...   Time to wish them the best and move along...
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Posted: 8/5/2014 9:19 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 



Grizz299 wrote: I dunno Jeff, maybe I want it too darn much this year. All the negativity... A chance to cap this run, this regime. I still think if Schwartz, JJP and Moore achieve their potential that we can play with anyone.

I tend to consider myself amongst the more even keeled fans on the board, grizz.    While I always hope for the best for our squad and will root my heart out for us to go as far as we can go.......I also try and be realistic with regards to our roster.    It sometimes overtakes the raw, rabid fan in me.     So.....I just don't see our squad as quite in that Super Bowl echelon........but in today's NFL......if enough injuries happen to our competitors....it can even up the field.   


I have a hard time seeing myself not enjoying this season Grizz.    I really like the new offense.......and I'm pretty happy with our defensive additions......even though I'm slightly worried about our pass rush in the long run.    I think our division is absolutely winnable.    I just don't know if we can overcome some of the top squads.    I think a lot of our games will be fun to watch.........and have their typically excruciating moments.  

I just don't have my expectations bar set at Super Bowl or Bust.    :-)
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Posted: 8/6/2014 9:14 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 



Grizz299 wrote: I've been thinking in terms of a super bowl contender.

The potential of Wilson stretching a D and Hill solidifying a great secondary were, as it's turned out, "like this insubstantial pageant faded,".
Is Ordell chronic?
My "pageant" was based on Schwartz being superb and JJP being, well being "JJP".
Compromise their contributions - as it is starting to appear likely - and I'm not sure the vision survives.
SP teams have to be very good AND very lucky.
I have never really understtod thinking pre-season can be a dampner unless there was something like a death of a player or maybe the starting QB going out.  Other than that, pre-seasons are all filled with ups and downs. 

NFL seasons are not won and lost in week one.  Teams progress throughout a season.  Some teams gel quickly, others do not.  some teams improve others regress.  This team has the talent to compete to win this division.  That is all I ever care about. I hate starting a season feeling like we can not win the East.  Winning the East is the goal for a season to me.  I feel like if we can win the division, then we can compete for playoff wins and maybe another title.  I know we can;t win the division every year, just as I know superbowls are hard to come by.  But all I want is a comeptive team to cheer for. I want every game to count until the last week, where I hope we are resting starters going into a buy week during the wild card weekend.  To me, that is still very possible. 

Hopefully we will be very good and get lucky, but either way, I am enjoying this team already.  I am going to lose my voice cheering a lot this season.
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Posted: 8/7/2014 12:54 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Regards "if".

I think if 's are allright "if" it's more likely than not. And I think all our "if 's" fell into that category.
This team will compete Mike and I think that's gonna happen regardless. Ahhh but for a season when we gk out and dominate like the BPS ( before Plax shooting) was doing.
In all the years I've never completely identified with a staff like TC and JR, to see them completely validated before the end of a grand era closes - that's my hope. Moreover, it's here, it might be crumbling a little with Hill Wilson gone, but I can still hope. Now wishing is one thing, but watching Prince shut down a brilliant draft choice who has been tearing up Buffalos practices like baking soda snuffing a frying pan fire and understanding that they're going to Prince's side because the other side is even stronger makes you start to believe. Now I think it's about JJP, Moore and Schwartz they are my question marks. "more likely than not" , unfortunately doesn't mean that it will happen. And as noted, camp produces positive surprises too. We may actually have a strong corp of linebackers this year. I even think the now four years from cancer Herzy might be in full remission.
In the end, it's about the strange lure of pro football where every gridiron, practice field and yard marker stands as a personal field of dreams.
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Posted: 8/7/2014 7:10 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


This conversation reminds me of one I had with a Redskins fan recently that said, "If RG3 is back to his rookie year form and our O and D line can dominate, we'll be a playoff contender." Really? No $hi! How about if they don't?

So yes, if Eli throws under 15 picks, our O line improves a lot, ODB becomes a star and our running attack looks like it did a week ago, I think we'll be competitive [sarcasm off].
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Posted: 8/8/2014 1:28 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Well other than a personal drive to negativity, there's no comparison between the two statements.

RG is unproven at this point in his career -'esp. If he's going th have to change his game. Ditto off. And defensive lines. It could happen, it is not "more likely than not".

Here's a few hard facts: the nyg offensive line is better. Period. Bass, Snee, Brewer, Boothe, Cordell have been replaced by Schwartz, Walton, Richenberg, Jerry. That's a thousand percent upgrade. moreover the tackle positions logically figure to be much better.
The TE position should be upgraded.
Your assertion that OB has to be productive is also wrong. Randle and Jerigan figure logically to mature and improve. Harris and Washington along with Halliday will upgrade. OB can be the one icing.
The RB position has objectively been upgraded.
. Eli is a SB QB and with an improved o line he will be better.
so every position on the offense has objectively been upgraded.
I'm not going to detail it but the secondary has been significantly upgraded, linebakers upgraded. Hankins set to replace Joseph, Ayers replaced Tuck figures to be even, JPP 'S return from injury upgrades significantly the entire front.
Sorry that a commit to negativity fogs the "anticipated" difference between the two statements.

Last edited 8/8/2014 1:53 AM by Grizz299

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Posted: 8/8/2014 10:41 PM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Last times we went to the SB the DL & OL were stronger than the current lines.
RB's were stronger.
TE's were stronger

DB's stronger today.
The rest about equal.

The Giants need another year for the SB. I think they'll have their work cut out
to get into the playoffs. They first have to beat Eagles & Skins which won't be easy.
I don't think they are as good as Seattle, SF, Arizona & St Louis.
And they have to prove that they are better than, NO, NC, Chicago and GB.
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Posted: 8/9/2014 2:42 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Awww Johnie, "as of this writing".
re: comparisons
O lines.....beatty Pugh vs. Diehl and an old Mackenzie...potentially?? I like Beatty / Pugh
. Walton / Richenburg vs O Hara.... Go 2014,
Snee vs. Schwartz ..,, Snee ( for comparison I switched guard positions)
. Suey vs. jerry/mosley ...draw slight edge Suey
I think a TE will emerge that's the equal or better than Boss/Ballard.

wide receivers....give me the current crew. Plax/ Toomer remember are gone. Cruz, nicks, Mario vs. Cruz, Odell, Randolph, Jernigan, Harris ,washington
RB...awww Brandon brought so much, still could be close.

. Defense...lines could be very close, provided Moore and JP are productive. Hell Blackburn, Rivers, JW as a rook, Torbor, Wilson, madison, Ross don't make this team.
special teams.....weatherford, Halliday, Quentin make this crew better. Maybe this new field goal kicker is an upgrade too.
Johnie the secondary and line backers are so much stronger that this team has to be given a chance.
Now the operative word of course is potential and achieving full measure, but how did we look in the pre season in the year of those amazing runs.? We were talking "potential" and I think that's fair.

. Finally I don't think Seattle is as tough and complete as those NE teams we beat. You stay close and Eli is a big upgrade over Wilson who has never had to win a game. New Orleans at home scares me,more than Seattle. QB is still an important position.
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Posted: 8/9/2014 2:49 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Awww Johnie, "as of this writing".
re: comparisons
O lines.....beatty Pugh vs. Diehl and an old Mackenzie...potentially?? I like Beatty / Pugh
. Walton / Richenburg vs O Hara.... Go 2014,
Snee vs. Schwartz ..,, Snee ( for comparison I switched guard positions)
. Suey vs. jerry/mosley ...draw slight edge Suey
I think a TE will emerge that's the equal or better than Boss/Ballard.

wide receivers....give me the current crew. Plax/ Toomer remember are gone. Cruz, nicks, Mario vs. Cruz, Odell, Randolph, Jernigan, Harris ,washington
RB...awww Brandon brought so much, still could be close.

. Defense...lines could be very close, provided Moore and JP are productive. Hell Blackburn, Rivers, JW as a rook, Torbor, Wilson, madison, Ross don't make this team.
special teams.....weatherford, Halliday, Quentin make this crew better. Maybe this new field goal kicker is an upgrade too.
Johnie the secondary and line backers are so much stronger that this team has to be given a chance.
Now the operative word of course is potential and achieving full measure, but how did we look in the pre season in the year of those amazing runs.? We were talking "potential" and I think that's fair.

. Finally I don't think Seattle is as tough and complete as those NE teams we beat. You stay close and Eli is a big upgrade over Wilson who has never had to win a game. New Orleans at home scares me,more than Seattle. QB is still an important position.
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Posted: 8/9/2014 3:28 AM

Re: Is the pre-season turning into dampner? 


Grizz, I like you style.
You definitely are an optimist. And optimist alway make the world a better place. I'd rather 'partner' with you
than most realist. Because, well maybe I tell this later.

I'm going to watch the games this season and hope for the best, thanks to you!

BUT, I think the SB is a year away!
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