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The Big 12 is going to fold.

Posted: 07/29/2014 10:48 AM

The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Well I didn't want to believe it (I really enjoyed the old Big 12) but the rhetoric is pretty obvious. A coach from every single major conference has brought up that the Big 12 doesn't play a conference championship game. Imo this is going to present a huge problem going forward, and I wouldn't be surprised to see 4 of the big 5 push for some sort of agreement that keeps conferences that lack a CC out of the college football playoff. Which would lead to the big 12 dissolving.

What happens next is anyone's guess, I would (if I had my choice) love for Texas to end up in the Pac. I've heard rumors of the BIG being interested but I would prefer visiting LA, Palo Alto, Seattle, PHX over the Midwest. Not to mention baseball, basketball, and other Olympic sports would be second to none. How would yall think alignment would go? Pods (my preference) Personally it'd be amazing for me I have family in SLC, PHX, and LA. It'd be nice to play new teams and interact with new fan bases.

Pac-16

West:
Washington
Washington St
Oregon
Oregon St
Stanford
Cal
UCLA
USC

East:
Arizona
Arizona St
Utah
Colorado
Texas
Texas Tech
Oklahoma
Oklahoma St

or pods

N. Pacific:
Oregon
Oregon St
Wash
Wash St

S. Pacific:
Stanford
Cal
UCLA
USC

Mountain:
ASU
UA
Utah
Colorado

Plains:
Texas
TTU
OU
Okie lite

4+3+1+1

I.E. 2014 Schedule Plains vs Mountain plus one from the other 2 pods. I don't see LHN being an issue as it'd probably just turn into a combined PAC plains teams network. What do yall think? The writing is on the wall IMO I give the conference less that 3 years of life left.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:00 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.
"I love Elvis and I love the Devils..."

Last edited 07/29/2014 11:01 AM by elvisdevil

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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:01 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


I'd rather see the SEC, ACC, and BIG10 play 9 conference games like the PAC12 and BIG12. But why couldn't the BIG12 just add a CCG?
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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:03 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


there aren't any teams out there that add value to the conference. WVU is already on an island.. The big 12 missed the boat with Pitt and Louisville.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:06 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?

Last edited 07/29/2014 11:10 AM by TXhsfootball21

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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:11 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


The Big 12 is going to fold because other coaches have complained they don't play a conference title game? Huh?

How about the Big 12 adds 2 schools, and a conference championship game...that makes A LOT more sense. The question is, which 2 schools? Heck, they could easily add 4 schools, which may make the most sense.

Bring Houston and SMU back into the fold. Then lure in Boise St and BYU and you've got a real nice conference. They could also look at Cincinnati (would make a somewhat logical pair w/ WVU) if they can't get one of those schools. 

South:

Texas
Texas Tech
Baylor

TCU
Houston

SMU
Oklahoma (would have protected rivalry w/ OSU)


North:

Oklahoma St (would have protected rivalry w/ OU)

West Virginia
Boise St
BYU

Kansas
K-State

Iowa St

Then let the 5 Power Conferences (Big12, B1G, P12, SEC, ACC) Champions all get auto bids to a future 8 team playoff, have 3 wild cards determined by the polls. Boom, all problems solved, good night. 

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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:21 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Sigh.........Geeze about once a month this comes up and its usually roaringfork.   Wake me up when you actually break apart because I don't see it.   You guys will just add to schools to get to 12.  South Florida and Cincy are perfect for you because both are in large markets and both are large schools and open up the Ohio and Florida recruiting markets.


Bear Down on this!!!  41-34 and 58-21 'nuff said

Last edited 07/29/2014 11:22 AM by spayNnueterallCATS

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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:22 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


The Big12 should add San Diego St and either BYU or Fresno St.  Doing so would not only let them add their CCG, but would open them up to west coast TV markets and give all their schools a better foothold in CA for recruiting.  I still can't believe they reached east for WVU, they bring nothing to the table.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:29 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



TXhsfootball21 wrote: 
or pods

N. Pacific:
Oregon
Oregon St
Wash
Wash St

S. Pacific:
Stanford
Cal
UCLA
USC

Mountain:
ASU
UA
Utah
Colorado

Plains:
Texas
TTU
OU
Okie lite

4+3+1+1

The last time this was looked at the POD system seemed to be the only one where the powers didn't have a major issue, as opposed to the Easty/West, North/South or Zipper split ideas.

It would be a 3+2+2+2 and then 3 OOC games.

This way every team will play 1 game in CA every year, which seemed to be the most important issue and why none of the other splits would get the votes necessary to make them happen.

sparky.gif

 

"Stats are for losers, they relish in them. The stat is the score." - Jerry Jones
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Posted: 07/29/2014 11:41 AM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Nothing against Texas but why would the this be good for PAC 12, especially if their wasn't an even revenue split? We had this discussion a few years ago when there was expansion talk  and nobody wanted expansion into Texas and Oklahoma.  Maybe that has changed but I don't think so.  What has changed now from a few years ago is that the PAC 12 has a much better hand to play with.

The PAC 12 is a very good conference with a lot of stability over the last 30 years.  You have a new TV contract , improved play and scheduling and historical rivalries.  The Pac 12 is very healthy conference.  College football has always been regional sport and traveling across two time zones for games I don't think is good.   This isn't pro sports.   I don't like all these new conference affiliations, the Big 10x I don't think was smart taking Rutgers and Maryland.  It takes away from the tradition of college football.  Sometimes staying small is good.  

Ok the comment about the Southwestern Conference was a low blow (agreed) but has some validity  Their were reasons why Missouri and Nebraska ran from the Big 12 as fast as  they could. Some of it was a bad culture fit.   Some of  it had to do with revenue sharing and a perceived  lack of  clot , precipitated by a weak commissioner in Dan Beebe,  in  a Texas run conference and the Longhorn Network that didn't want to share it's money.  (Similar to the Southwestern Conference) .  As I see it Texas sees a sinking ship in Big 12 and wants out, understandable but not a good fit for the Pac 12.
TXhsfootball21 wrote:
elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?
"I love Elvis and I love the Devils..."

Last edited 07/29/2014 11:45 AM by elvisdevil

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Posted: 07/29/2014 12:40 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



DenverDevil wrote:

The last time this was looked at the POD system seemed to be the only one where the powers didn't have a major issue.


Are you kidding? Everybody hated the idea of a POD system. It would have been too complicated for the casual fan to figure out.

If there was no issue with the POD system, don't you think the conference would have went ahead with it?

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Posted: 07/29/2014 2:05 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Notre Dame didn't have a conference championship game 2 years ago, but were able to back door into the national title game just fine.

Relax people.  Big 12 will not collapse unless a couple of its members join another conference.
Expand CFB playoffs to 8 teams!
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  • barmy12
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Posted: 07/29/2014 2:06 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



TXhsfootball21 wrote:
elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?
A Texas pipeline will never replace a SoCal pipeline for ASU. Sorry we like being in the Pac 12. We have no interest in being basically in a divison with Big 12 schools. CTG will make some inroads in Texas but he knows it will never replace SoCal as the main recruiting base for ASU. UofA tried that you see how well Stoops did with that.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 2:20 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



TheDevilSpawn wrote:
DenverDevil wrote:

The last time this was looked at the POD system seemed to be the only one where the powers didn't have a major issue.


Are you kidding? Everybody hated the idea of a POD system. It would have been too complicated for the casual fan to figure out.

If there was no issue with the POD system, don't you think the conference would have went ahead with it?

If you thought of it as the old way sure it'd be confusing. However if you just thought of it as the 2 teams with the best conference record played in the Conference Championship then there you have it.

Mock up ASU schedule

NAU
@BYU
NMSU
USC - Potential top 25 match up sell out
@Ore St - meh
@Cal - meh (Cali recruits)
Texas - Easily an SDS sell out
@Washington - Seattle New stadium upgrades
Colorado - meh
Utah - meh
@Texas Tech - Yall would enjoy LBK
Arizona - Sell out

7 home games
3 games against your own pod teams of (Utah, Colorado, and Arizona)
2 Home games against Blue bloods
1 New opponent stadium

Easily a very strong SOS not to mention 4 games against 2 power states. Then in two years switch to the other two opponents left in the pod


Pre-season opponent
"   "
"   "
@UCLA
Oregon
@Colorado
@Utah
Stanford
Okie lite
@Washinton St
Oklahoma
@Arizona

The tv contracts would be huge and the football would be fantastic. I agree College football should be regional and I also think this set up still keeps a regional feel. You get 2 guaranteed games in 2 of the nations most fertile recruiting areas while also hosting major programs every season (might make those valley kids look at ASU more carefully)

I know this has been beaten to death more than a few times, I was just watching espn college media days and literally every conference has spoke out about the Big 12 not having a CC. I think it'll grow to be a major issue.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 2:23 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



barmy12 wrote:
TXhsfootball21 wrote:
elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?
A Texas pipeline will never replace a SoCal pipeline for ASU. Sorry we like being in the Pac 12. We have no interest in being basically in a divison with Big 12 schools. CTG will make some inroads in Texas but he knows it will never replace SoCal as the main recruiting base for ASU. UofA tried that you see how well Stoops did with that.

why would you replace it? Shoot pull from both and get your role pieces from AZ sounds like a win win to me.
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  • barmy12
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Posted: 07/29/2014 2:52 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



TXhsfootball21 wrote:
barmy12 wrote:
TXhsfootball21 wrote:
elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?
A Texas pipeline will never replace a SoCal pipeline for ASU. Sorry we like being in the Pac 12. We have no interest in being basically in a divison with Big 12 schools. CTG will make some inroads in Texas but he knows it will never replace SoCal as the main recruiting base for ASU. UofA tried that you see how well Stoops did with that.

why would you replace it? Shoot pull from both and get your role pieces from AZ sounds like a win win to me.
Arizona will always be behind the Texas schools, SEC schools, and many Midwest schools when it comes to recruiting Texas. We are better focused on recruiting the wealth of talent next door in California and keeping our kids at home then fishing for talent half the country away. BTW Lubbock is a cowtown. Nothing special there. And we say you guys here. Not y'all.  I remember when there was expansion talk 3-4 years ago for some reason all the Texas Tech fans thought that there was this big similarity between them and ASU and Lubbock and Tempe. The areas couldn't be more different. Very different culturally and I'm sorry but we are not in the same part of the country. Arizona faces west. We are more linked to the west coast and mountain west. We have no connection to Texas.
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Posted: 07/29/2014 3:07 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


I actually like the pod system if the PAC were to expand for reasons already mentioned, but I don't know if Texas would be a part of this. First off, I think if the Big12 were to fold, UT would find a way to go Independent. With their athletic dept funds, who better to survive independent status than Texas? In which case , who would we inherent from the conference other than OU and OSU?
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Posted: 07/29/2014 3:12 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 



barmy12 wrote:
TXhsfootball21 wrote:
barmy12 wrote:
TXhsfootball21 wrote:
elvisdevil wrote: Problem is nobody wants to be in the same league with Texas unless they share the Longhorn Network money and that is not going to happen.  Even if it did not sure it is a good idea.    Pac 12 is great league with a great TV deal.   Texas can go revive the the old Southwestern Conference where they can use their political power to run roughshot over everyone else.

why don't you actually add something to the conversation instead of this mindless drivel. If you really believe Texas would just be left out in the cold you are seriously mistaken.

Not sure why you wouldn't be excited at the possibility of having 2 power recruiting states in the conference, considering you know your head coach is from guess where????????? TEXAS! It's pretty obvious that he is wanting to make a pipeline there, no?
A Texas pipeline will never replace a SoCal pipeline for ASU. Sorry we like being in the Pac 12. We have no interest in being basically in a divison with Big 12 schools. CTG will make some inroads in Texas but he knows it will never replace SoCal as the main recruiting base for ASU. UofA tried that you see how well Stoops did with that.

why would you replace it? Shoot pull from both and get your role pieces from AZ sounds like a win win to me.
Arizona will always be behind the Texas schools, SEC schools, and many Midwest schools when it comes to recruiting Texas. We are better focused on recruiting the wealth of talent next door in California and keeping our kids at home then fishing for talent half the country away. BTW Lubbock is a cowtown. Nothing special there. And we say you guys here. Not y'all.  I remember when there was expansion talk 3-4 years ago for some reason all the Texas Tech fans thought that there was this big similarity between them and ASU and Lubbock and Tempe. The areas couldn't be more different. Very different culturally and I'm sorry but we are not in the same part of the country. Arizona faces west. We are more linked to the west coast and mountain west. We have no connection to Texas.

Please do forgive my ignorance for trying to engage in conversation with the Arizona State University Sun Devil fan base. I think you do shed light on things you're really not aware of. When the subject of ASU and TTU come up as being similar it isn't about Tempe and Lubbock bud but more along the lines of the types of the two fan bases and students that attend the two universities. Both schools love to partake in copious amounts of Alcohol (as do most college students) Both schools have a rabid fan base. After that the parallels start to blur, take it for what it is. I know you probably think Tempe is amazing, but the gravel yards and cactus instead of trees isn't for everybody. It's funny you mention cows, I remember waking up for school while attending Highland Jr High briefly in Gilbert and I do recall waking up to the smell of cow sh*t quite often........ Just sayin. Just spent a couple of weeks in Newport Beach, CA and other than the desert landscape in some places there really isn't very much in common with PHX geographically or culturally but that's just my opinion I guess.

Anyways the point of this thread was my preference on where my school ended up (Univ. of Texas) match ups would be fun and view on academics are similar. Other than that I guess we're all done here, I won't disrupt the normal "is ASU a sleeping giant?"    "f#ck the rats"     "so and so is visiting this weekend"
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Posted: 07/29/2014 3:18 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


Our conference commissioner, Larry Scott, is totally against a POD system. Again, it is far too complicated for the casual fan.

I believe that Scott still has his main goal of bringing Texas and Oklahoma to the Pac-12. It would bring millions of dollars in revenue to the conference. He very much wants it to happen.

But this stuff is so hard to predict right now. Everything is currently in flux because a lot of it is tied up in the courts. I would keep my eye on the O'Bannon case next month and on the court appeal allowing players to unionize.  Those two court outcomes will determine the future for college sports. That's because sports agents and union organizers are ready to pounce.

As for the future of the Big 12, Texas will follow the money. And Oklahoma will follow Texas.

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Posted: 07/29/2014 3:29 PM

Re: The Big 12 is going to fold. 


TXhsfootball21 wrote: Well I didn't want to believe it (I really enjoyed the old Big 12) but the rhetoric is pretty obvious.
Big 12 Coach: The lack of a CCG is an issue.

Your interpretation: The Big 12 is going to fold.

Why in the world would the Pac-12 East region or Mountain pod teams ever agree to a system where they get much less exposure in the lucrative California recruiting region and instead play teams two times zones away?   Why would Oklahoma want to travel two times zones west to play in Tucson?

Additionally, there's little likelihood that Texas ever gives up the Longhorn Network and that's a deal-breaker for the Pac-12.

It's much more realistic to think the Big 12 will just add two more teams.
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