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Carolyn Peck

Posted: 10/21/2007 6:41 PM

Carolyn Peck 

One of the most attractive and personable women in WBB is Caroline Peck, currently an announcer for the Fox Sports and ESPN. She is the best color announcer in the business in my opinion , but she also is a very good coach with a NT on her belt.

 As many probably know, she started out as an assistant at Purdue , then moved on to the main job. In her 2nd year she won a NT. She was offered a Pro job and took it, with only fair results. It appeared the Pros were not for her. (Why I don't know)
She then moved to Florida and had some good teams although her last team was decimated with injuries and finished  poorly. She was then terminated a month before the end of the season but finished out the year, as I recall 

When the many jobs opened up this year she had plenty of time to apply since she was available a month before the end of the season but there were no offers or if there were she did not consider them. What is the story with this gal?

Why didn't Michigan State jump at the chance, or Michigan? I would love to see her back inthe Big Ten!

Sharon , if you can help please do.

Last edited 10/23/2007 8:50 AM by gateling65

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Posted: 10/21/2007 9:02 PM

Re: Caroline Peck 

Carolyn Peck won the national title with other people's players, and never came close to replicating that success anywhere else. She is charming, articulate and intelligent, but has not been able to translate that into successful coaching. She had every opportunity to succeed at Florida (great support, etc.) and failed miserably.

I think she's a very good TV analyst, and I think she may stick with that.
Clay Kallam
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Posted: 10/23/2007 9:52 AM

Re: Caroline Peck 

Clay   I know you are pressed for time but that was a 5 cent answer to a $20 question. (If you do not have time maybe someone else can give me the answers) I have done a little bit of research and come up with the fact that she helped recruit most of Nell Fortners players on the team that won the NC and went
34-1. The two years previously Purdue went 17-11 under Fortner and 23-10 in Carolyns first year. To win a title after two good but not great years is why the pros jumped at her . They must have thought very highly of her abilities since she was both coach and GM. (I have no knowledge about her pro career but I assume it wasn't very good. However, the Orlando team was an expansion team) the main point up to now is the woman could coach. She had a swagger about her that translated over to the players at Purdue.

At Florida she had the best turnaround in the history of the school taking a 9-22 team and going 19-11Ok, she had other peoples players but they weren't very good. In the middle of the season 2006 she was 14-3 and her team was in the top Ten and a darkhourse for the NT. Last year she had three players transfer in the middle of the season and they lost 13 in row until winnning the last 4 of 6 including a couple in the post season tournement. Her record last year was 9 and 22. She finished up was 72-76 at florida , never a WBBall power in my memory. Taking away last seaons disaster her record was 61 - 54, not bad in the always tough SEC.Why wasn't she allowed to finish out the season. Why did the players transfer?

One poster stated long ago that her downfall was recruting. If so, why would this woman not be able to recruit. She is a motivational speaker , charging 10-20k per appearance. Pat Summitt highly priased her when she was an assiatant. Nell Fortner only spent on year at Purdue and the year before she arrived thei were 11-17, so she must have done a lot of recruiting at Purdue.

How could it be possible she could not recruit.She seems to have everything you want in a recruiter:great looks , great smile.  great voice, very intelligent (she was a Vandy grad) was a great player (averaged 34 pts a game in HS). I do know that she made a lot of money selling pharmaceuticles for two years , a tough job in itself.

I don't know , maybe someone should write a book about the situation, but something doesn't add up. Would appreciate answers.

PS when she won the NT she was the youngest coach in America, 31 . Also the team knew she would be going to the pros after the season, and they still went 34-1, the one loss being by one point.

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Posted: 10/23/2007 2:01 PM

Re: Caroline Peck 

Just to clear up the history, when Carol Ross stepped down (or was pushed down, whatever) after the 2001-2002 season, Florida had been to the post-season for ten straight years, including nine NCAA appearances and a WNIT appearance in 1999-2000. That peaked in 1997 when Florida was in the Elite 8. After that, there was a string of 1st and 2nd round exits and the WNIT year. In 2002, Florida had an overall record of 18-11, made the NCAA tournament, but lost in the first round to BYU. Ross resigned soon afterwards.

At that time, the program had been a perennial NCAA team for a decade, but wasn't getting to the "next level". When they hired Peck, who was a national championship coach, it looked like that was the idea . . not salvaging a bad program, but rather taking a good program to a higher level.

Peck's first year was Florida's worst season ever at that time, at 9-19. The turnaround the following year to 19-11 with a trip to the NCAAs. Then a poor to mediocre year (14-15 WNIT) followed by another good year (21-9 NCAA, 1st round loss). That year, she had four senior starters, Carol Ross' last recruiting class at Florida. They all played 30+ minutes per game.

In her last year, anybody who paid attention would have expected a down year since the team had such a big loss to graduation. But by that time, she'd had time to bring in and develop her own recruits. But deep into the SEC season, her team was 0-11 in the SEC, losing 13 straight games, and that's when Fla decided to pull the trigger.

I think that many, probably most, athletic directors would have given a coach in her situation more time. After all, she had had two good years out of the four preceding years, which would keep many ADs happy enough.

But that wasn't what Florida had in mind when they brought her in. They'd had plenty of good seasons with Carol Ross, without the horrible seasons. There's no possible argument that Florida improved over Peck's tenure, and it's hard to argue that they even held their ground.

So she was fired. I don't think there's anything more mysterious to it than that.

I agree with you that with her personal charm, it seems like she should have been a successful recruiter, but when it was time for her own recruits to become the face of the program, they had the worst season in the history of Florida basketball. If you're an AD at a school that just won a football national championship and was the defending men's basketball national championship, that just ain't gonna cut it. I really think it's as simple as that.
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Posted: 10/23/2007 3:53 PM

Re: Caroline Peck 

If Peck had helped Fortner recruit so well, then why did Fortner take a worse program at Auburn and move it past Peck's at Florida? Because Fortner recruited and Peck didn't.

Peck had issues with players who could have helped her in the WNBA, cutting Sheri Sam when she could have at least traded her for a draft pick. Sam was pretty good back then, but Peck cut just before the season started, if I recall correctly.

None of her teams, except the national championship one, really played at or above expectations, which tells me she's not a particularly good coach when it comes to getting the most out of the talent at hand.

When you combine mediocre recruiting with mediocre talent development, you get mediocre teams -- which is what Peck has done except for her one annus mirabilis.

In my limited contact with her, she's been professional, and she's very charming. But it takes more than that to succeed in a BCS conference.
Clay Kallam
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Posted: 10/23/2007 4:43 PM

Re: Caroline Peck 

Vandywhit   thanx for your input . It solves much of the mystery, very much in fact. However there are some loose ends.First involves the transfering of the players in midyear. Wasn't that when the slide began to occur. And three players transferring. Were they freshman, disgruntled upperclassmen, why? That is a BIG story. If we had three playeres transfer  out of our football team (Univ of Mich) in midseason, it would be headline news on the sports page! Even if they were third string. To lose 3 out of 11 or 12 is shocking. Why would they do that to her? Is she a Jeckle and Hyde character?.

I just saw her voted the 2nd best hair style in the nation from some shampoo company. Maybe she makes so much money in endorsments she lost her edge. Is she maried to a millionare? I have never seen her live but she looks drop dead georgeous on TV. Always did.

Lastly , the recruits. Were they big time recruits or just ordinary. I was not impressed looks of the players. I know this sems a bit strange but many of the best coaches are good looking people , Gail G, Geno, P.J.McCallie, Sherri Coale. Maybe her players looked upon her as a stuck up movie star type than a coach. I must say the new coach Amanda Butler looks like a movie star herself in the pics I saw.

I think the people at Florida are maybe a little bit spoiled. Both Donovan and Urban Meyer had unbelievable years but they also had some lousy years. A couple of years ago when Roberson (Saginaw recruit who may have cost Mchigan State a NT) was running the show I thought Billy D might be gone. Remember when they were #1 and Kentucky beat them by 30. David Lee was also on the team.

Since you are probably from Vandy I will tell you that a lot of people in Michigan were convinced that there was hanky-panky going on with the recruiting of Roberson. He was in Izzo's pocket for 3 1/2 years then a week before signing he switches to the Gators. Lots of money was evidently passed around . And yes it does happen. But thats a story for another time. (If you want to hear some I have some beauts.)

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Posted: 10/23/2007 9:41 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

The three transfers were all from the Memphis area. Two of them were freshmen, one a sophomore. Two of them transferred to the University of Memphis. The other one transferred to Ole Miss, which is only about 60 miles from Memphis. They weren't big name recruits, but how good were they? I dunno. Given where they came from and where they ended up, "wanting to play closer to home" seems like a pretty plausible explanation. It's a long haul from Memphis to Gainesville.

When you say, "I think the people at Florida are maybe a little bit spoiled," I think you hit the nail on the head. Or maybe they're just really smart and hoping that Amanda Butler will turn out to be another Billy Donnovan. Only time will tell.
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Posted: 10/24/2007 9:41 AM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

"Sharon , if you can help please do."

Sorry, but I'm not interested in a dialogue with you.

First I think you're nohoops who got bounced for attacking me, among others.

Second, even if you're not, I find your constant judging of these women based on their looks to be sexist, demeaning and insulting.

Ask someone else.
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Posted: 10/24/2007 12:57 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Sharon   First I am not Nohoops . However, He is related  to me and he asked me if I wanted to take over his situation on the website. He paid the $40 and then was unable to use any of the forums.I took over. My only posts concerning womens good looks also included Geno Auriemma. You will find me much kinder and gentler than my brother. who like to argue for the point of arguing.

However if you think judging women like Carolyn Peck as being very attractive is sexist and insulting I will leave it at that. I think that a very small % of the population feel about it like you do . Do you think Maria Sharapova with her 20 story high picture in NYC demeaning or sexist? Are her ads for Canon insulting to you? In any case , I did not ask you for your opinon on her (Pecks) looks but why she apparently could not recruit top players.

In any case I will wait for your report on the Big 10 Season. I have gone back and read most of your articles. I found it interesting that after you blasted my brother because he stood up for the fired Penn State coach , Rene Porland, your own article said practically the same thing about her . "I didn't know whether to like her or hate her". "She was a powerful women that I admired". And "She donated hundreds of thousands to the university"I have to feel that you have an agenda that is none of my business so  will let it  drop.

By the way, You say insulting: to who ,Carolyn. I doubt that she will be insulted being called geogeous. Did she mind when the shampoo maker rated her hair in the top ten in the nation. Demeanig ?What's exactly does that mean? How has the fair maden been demeaned in any way I stated she was a great coach and could n't figure out why she couldn't get a job. I also stated she was very intelligent and articulate. You find that demeaning. You should be demeaned in such a manner. Sexist: I happen to be a male and can appreciate a good looking woman . I made no references to her sexual parts, legs or any of that. A man calling a women beauftiful. That is not sexist , just an opinion that many share with me.

I will say this . If you are a true professional you can't go around dealing with just the people you like .It's your job to find a way to deal with all the people , like them or not. As I said I read many of your articles and many of them were very good . Since the Big 10 is where I live I am dissapointed that I have lost the best reference for the area .

PS I will make no more references to the players looks.My problem is that at times I forget that the board is open and I am not dealing one to one. This is a bad habit that I must eliminate. Please forgive that.

Last edited 10/24/2007 3:13 PM by gateling65

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Posted: 10/24/2007 5:53 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

"I found it interesting that after you blasted my brother because he stood up for the fired Penn State coach , Rene Porland, your own article said practically the same thing about her . "I didn't know whether to like her or hate her". "She was a powerful women that I admired". And "She donated hundreds of thousands to the university"  I have to feel that you have an agenda that is none of my business so  will let it  drop."

I do not believe that I ever said that I admired her.  The other comments are taken totally out of context.  Anyone who has read my comments on Portland know that I thought she should have been fired years ago and that her negative behavior far outweighed her positives. 

There is a huge difference between commenting on how a person looks and making it the most important factor in judging them.

"I will say this . If you are a true professional you can't go around dealing with just the people you like .It's your job to find a way to deal with all the people , like them or not"

This forum is not a part of my job for FCP.  I deal quite will with all the coaches in the league, including those that I dislike and those that dislike me.

Last edited 10/24/2007 5:56 PM by jpthatcher

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Posted: 10/24/2007 7:09 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Sharon    I am sorry if I upset you in any way. If so it was unintended . The statements were read months ago when I first came on the site. My brother was not fond of you so they were among the first that I read. The first one was the Portland article since we both liked the team with Kelly Mazzantte, the one where Helen Darling player point.

  In your article you state (and I quote) "she is a strong intelligent woman who fights for what she believes in. I like women like that
 "During a lunch "I kept thinking that I was supposed to dislike this woman and I couldn't. "

"She and her husband have given hundreds of thousands of dollars to academics at Penn State"

"Jane Albright Wichita coach says Portland had a heart of gold that she does not allow many people to see."

You also describe the weekly trips to California at her expense to care for a player with alcoholism. Then you describe the rules that she was supposed to follow and didn't. The Detroit Free Press said that the player (who stated was not gay) was reprimanded for not conforming with  the dress code and when she refused she was kicked off the team.  Then she sued and lost. This and your commenting on the "rules" are the sum of my knowledge on the subject. You never go into any detail about what rules were broken. However you do slam her for her locker room behavior and the loss in the 1st round of the NCAA. I saw that game and they played lazy and without emotion against a lousy team  they should have beaten by 30.

Then you finish"so why did I want to like this woman. Rene Portland is like all of us, a flawed human being (I hope you put yourself in this catagory, Sharon). I see her strength, her passion, her willingness to fight for her beliefs, her intelligence the good things she's done and what she could have been..........I see a women who fought for the sport that she and I love".

The comment about a huge difference between how a person looks and making it the most important factor in judging them is a platitude, true at times, untrue in others. Shakespear said "he who loves at first sight" would disprove your idea, right? In my case my job required me to make an instant judgement based on how they looked. You know the body language etc.

I was under the impression that you read all the posts as part of your job. Couldn't you throw in one more if it is kept well within your bounds, now that I  know how you feel about things?

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Posted: 10/24/2007 7:57 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

You're right, I said each of those things.  But then each comment was followed by reasons why I could not respect or like her.  That's what I meant by taking statements out of context.

What I have said and what I feel is that Rene Portland was the type of woman who had the potential to be a force for good in the sport and a woman who had the ability to do much good, but she never reached the potential she had for good.  Instead she let herself be mired in her homophobia.  Her out of control ego would not allow her to take any responsibility or look honestly at her own actions. 

I think it's sad that a woman with the potential to be strong voice for the sport failed to reach it because of her own personal shortcomings.

I've written several times about her inability to retain her players, her homophobia, her publicly bashing her players and her refusal to take any responsibility for any of her actions.  The details of the Harris situation are all over the internet.

"However you do slam her for her locker room behavior and the loss in the 1st round of the NCAA. I saw that game and they played lazy and without emotion against a lousy team  they should have beaten by 30."

And do you think an appropriate for a coach in that situation is to go into the locker room and tell the team that three of them are being thrown off the team?

I agree with you about the PSU play against Liberty.  Portland's teams had a history of being upset early in the NCAA's.  At what point does the coach have to take responsibility for not having her team ready to play?  At what point is it absurd for her to simply continue to lash out and blame her players?

I wasn't aware that Shakespeare was the ultimate authority on truth.  These are people in a profession that is totally performance based.  Their appearance is irrelevant to their performance. 

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Posted: 10/25/2007 8:34 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Read the articles.  Any person with a marginally functional brain will understand why I said what I said.

Penn State is not a christian University.  It is a public institution with a written policy of non-discrimination against gays and lesbians.  As a university employee, Portland had an ethical obligation to follow the rules of her employer or find a place to work that would allow her to follow the dictates of her conscience.  She chose to violate her employer's work rules and she was fired for it.  That's how it works in every workplace in the country.

You know absolutely nothing about me and your misguided attempts to characterize me are as ridiculous as the rest of your silly post.
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Posted: 10/26/2007 3:38 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

" Why didn't you say that she did a few good things but her faults were much greater than her pluses?"

Because my writing simplistic.

"If Ms Harris was not gay (as she says she wasn't) what rules were broken, the dress code?"

Penn State investigated and found that Rene Portland broke the rules in her treatment of Harris because she perceived Harris to be lesbian.

"Ms. Smarty, there are fewer and fewer parents who are sending their kids to public schools because of stupid rules like this."

Then how come Penn State, and almost every other public university has a waiting list and routinely refuses to admit large number of it's applicants?

"and they are closing and consolidating public schools all over the -place because they are losing so many students."

Would you like to tell that to all the students trying to survie in the overcrowded public schools?

"I am a advanced math teacher in a public school"

Oh.  Have I mentioned that I won a Nobel Prize for a little project I threw together in the garage.

"His comments were a tiny part of his posts, like .5%, and they were in no way the real content of the posts."

He (you?? nohoops??) has made it clear in his posts that the appearance of the athletes is how he judges them.

"And you can tell"Clay" that she was 72-74 at Florida, not exactly "failing miserably" considering the league they play in."

Aww, comeon, suck it up and tell him yourself.

"You are wrong. I do know something about you. First you are rude and inconsiderate and weird"

Golly gee, a person with an ever changing nickname says I'm rude.  I'll go cry now.

"Second you say that you do your job with coaches who both like and dislike you. It is pretty obvious why they dislike you."

Well, I've met all seven returning coaches and six of the seven like me just fine.  I can live with that.  I'm sure you wonder what it would be like to have that percentage of people like you.

"Please do not reply."

Please tell me that you're not delusional enough to think that I'm going to do something or not do it because you tell me to. 

BTW, it's very noticable that you failed to address the simple fact that Rene Portland violated the work rules of her employer.  Do you think that everyone should be able to do that or just the people that are bigots?
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Posted: 10/26/2007 8:09 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

" The content was the fact that she was a very good coach. And you can tell"Clay" that she was 72-74 at Florida, not exactly "failing miserably" considering the league they play in."
* * * *
Getting more or less back to the subject, in her five years there, she notched the two worst seasons in Florida history at 9-19 and 9-22. The first one was forgiveable because it was her first season. But the second one was in her FIFTH year, the year when she was playing with only her own recruits. By that time, you'd expect to be seeing some positive signsn for the future, and instead her team starts the season 0-11 in the SEC. I think that's pretty darned close to failing miserably, even if you play in the SEC.
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Posted: 10/26/2007 9:17 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Do you have any more relatives that are going to create user names and say exactly the same thing in the same writing style using the same logic?  Maybe you wouldn't have so many log-in problems if you weren't posting under so many different names.  Just a thought.

"I assume that you are a young woman."

Lol, not for many years.  That's just as wrong as all of your other assumptions about me.

The fallacy of using views to support your position has been pointed out to you before.  Except I think you were your brother then, or maybe your second cousin three times removed.
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Posted: 10/27/2007 1:11 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Sharon    We appear to have lost three posts . Where are they? Two of mine and one of yours.  Too hot to handle?

By the way my brother would love to have a go at you again. He made you out to be a fool the first time, with your inability to understand simple subtraction. This time he would like to go through your report on Rene Portland, line by line , to demonstrate what he calles your lesbionic twisted mind. Then you will see the difference between me and him. Are you  up for it??  Lesbionic see I can't come up with that stuff! He always was the smart one on his feet. Thats why he was so good in court!

How about a real challenge on the private message post.? It will be enlightening ,if nothing else.

Last edited 10/27/2007 4:28 PM by kittycat33

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Posted: 10/27/2007 2:41 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

Vandywhit    WhaT if this years team goes 22-9. Who will get the credit? What if they go 23-6 the next year. Will that be Carolyns team too?I guess it serves her right for being greedy and wanting to leave Purdue after one year. Seriously. She went 24-10 and was going to leave. The players talked her into staying another yer.

=Remember i was the one looking for answers and simply asking the questions. Therefore I will ask this she was a head coach in college for 6 years she was 24-10 at Purdue, 34-1 at Purdue, and 72 -74 at Florida. I don't thing that is being a miserable failure:sorry.  It does seem that there was either something very luckey or something very wrong with her and the answers are not going to be found here.
Vandy,,you have been helpful as you could be . Clay , you admit that with you on the west coast you didn't have to opportunity to get to know her at all.

I have a feeling the truth will come out eventually
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Posted: 10/27/2007 3:16 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

I don't have to know people to understand that a coach who posts the two worst records in the school's history is pretty likely to get fired.
Clay Kallam
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Posted: 10/27/2007 4:20 PM

Re: Carolyn Peck 

"I don't have to know people to understand that a coach who posts the two worst records in the school's history is pretty likely to get fired."
* * * * *
I think that at a lot of colleges, the wbb coach with a similar record would have gotten at least another year to right the ship. But remember, Florida at the time was defending national champion in both football and men's basketball. In that kind of an environment, when they'd brought in a wbb coach who'd won a national championship in the past, 0-11 in the SEC in her 5th season was probably very hard to swallow. I really seems pretty straight-forward to me. If it turns out that here's some underlying untold "real" story, I'll be very surprised.
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