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RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012

Posted: 12/29/2011 2:31 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
jackattack030 wrote: Whats the plan with K Mac? I thought since we kept him and didn't non tender him meant we'd trade him.
Lynn
Boggs
Romero
Scrabble
Sanchez
Salas
Motte
McClellan
8 pitchers out of bullpen.
Keep McClellan and trade Boggs
God, please no.
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
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Posted: 12/29/2011 5:33 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



nathanleopoldjr wrote:
easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
jackattack030 wrote: Whats the plan with K Mac? I thought since we kept him and didn't non tender him meant we'd trade him.
Lynn
Boggs
Romero
Scrabble
Sanchez
Salas
Motte
McClellan
8 pitchers out of bullpen.
Keep McClellan and trade Boggs
God, please no.
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
Yes, because giving up a home run on a 96 mph fastball up and in means you have no value to the team.  (Insert sarcasm icon here)
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Posted: 12/29/2011 7:34 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



nathanleopoldjr wrote:
easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Keep McClellan and trade Boggs
God, please no.
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.

Thank goodness you aren't running this team.  We'd be bankrupt and terrible.  I don't want to be the Mets.




This message was approved by the Easton Eye Test™.

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Posted: 12/29/2011 11:15 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
...did you watch the WS? He actually pitched well, if you said the DS or CS I'd say you had a point, but this statement just makes me think you didn't even watch.

Posted: 12/29/2011 4:23 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



stlcards5129 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
...did you watch the WS? He actually pitched well, if you said the DS or CS I'd say you had a point, but this statement just makes me think you didn't even watch.
I watched that 3 run home run that took away any chance of winning that game.  He's a head case who cracks when the pressure is on.

Posted: 12/29/2011 4:24 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



jrtimbli wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
jackattack030 wrote: Whats the plan with K Mac? I thought since we kept him and didn't non tender him meant we'd trade him.
Lynn
Boggs
Romero
Scrabble
Sanchez
Salas
Motte
McClellan
8 pitchers out of bullpen.
Keep McClellan and trade Boggs
God, please no.
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
Yes, because giving up a home run on a 96 mph fastball up and in means you have no value to the team.  (Insert sarcasm icon here)
If you out that 96 mile an hour fastball in the wrong place then you have no value to the team.  You become a Kyle Farnsworth or Manny Aybar.

Posted: 12/29/2011 4:26 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
easton714 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Keep McClellan and trade Boggs
God, please no.
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.

Thank goodness you aren't running this team.  We'd be bankrupt and terrible.  I don't want to be the Mets.
Well we wouldn't have re-signed Lohse.  We'd spend but wisely and we would know when to cut bate on a guy like Boggs.  He has to go-now.
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Posted: 12/29/2011 4:47 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



nathanleopoldjr wrote:
stlcards5129 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
...did you watch the WS? He actually pitched well, if you said the DS or CS I'd say you had a point, but this statement just makes me think you didn't even watch.
I watched that 3 run home run that took away any chance of winning that game.  He's a head case who cracks when the pressure is on.
Oh you mean that 3 run Home run where he inherited 2 runners and came in and had to face the Rangers hottest hitter. Oh yeah, that was completely his fault. He also went on to retire the next 5 batters. But yeah, lets evaluate the guy on 2.2 innings of postseason work against the American League's best team. That's an obvious indicator of how he'll perform in his career.

Posted: 12/30/2011 9:33 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


The problem with this scenario is that we don't have the money to spend that much.  This is very basic and I'm sure someone else could provide the actual details, but we were going to really be stretching the payroll if Pujols took the short deal which was about $26m per year.  Since he moved on, the Cards have added Furcal for $7m and Beltran for $13m.  If we signed Oswalt for $7m (not sure if that's even realistic) then we are at $1m more than the already stretched payroll.  That would leave the team very vulnerable during the season if a need pops up (bullpen, second base, etc.).  I don't know for sure what Westbrooks salary is for 2012, but last year it was $8m.  If you can get someone to take $5m of his salary, then signing Oswalt seems a lot more possible because we'd still have a little wiggle room during the season if needed.  Just my opinion though and that's without working with the actual 2012 salary numbers for the full team.
scadder21 wrote: Was wanting to throw this idea around here. Not many people it on the other site I'm on. Lets say Oswalt really wants to pitch for us this year. If he signs for say 7-8 mil sigh him and let Lohse and Westbrook compete for the 5th starter spot. The loser of that competition can be the swingman. If they choose to stay we have 6 guys ready to start in case the injury bug hits. I'm also sure that they would wave there NTC if they aren't starting. I'm worried about the rotation. We hope Wainwright is back how he was but it's not guaranteed. Carpenter pitched so much last year I hope he stays healthy but if he isn't we need someone who can be a strogn number 2 to step in. I think Oswalt is that guy.


"Awwww boilerdown #suck" - Colin Hartman after Purdon't got smacked around by VCU
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Posted: 12/30/2011 2:17 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



Hoosiers1111 wrote: The problem with this scenario is that we don't have the money to spend that much.  This is very basic and I'm sure someone else could provide the actual details, but we were going to really be stretching the payroll if Pujols took the short deal which was about $26m per year.  Since he moved on, the Cards have added Furcal for $7m and Beltran for $13m.  If we signed Oswalt for $7m (not sure if that's even realistic) then we are at $1m more than the already stretched payroll.  That would leave the team very vulnerable during the season if a need pops up (bullpen, second base, etc.).  I don't know for sure what Westbrooks salary is for 2012, but last year it was $8m.  If you can get someone to take $5m of his salary, then signing Oswalt seems a lot more possible because we'd still have a little wiggle room during the season if needed.  Just my opinion though and that's without working with the actual 2012 salary numbers for the full team.
scadder21 wrote: Was wanting to throw this idea around here. Not many people it on the other site I'm on. Lets say Oswalt really wants to pitch for us this year. If he signs for say 7-8 mil sigh him and let Lohse and Westbrook compete for the 5th starter spot. The loser of that competition can be the swingman. If they choose to stay we have 6 guys ready to start in case the injury bug hits. I'm also sure that they would wave there NTC if they aren't starting. I'm worried about the rotation. We hope Wainwright is back how he was but it's not guaranteed. Carpenter pitched so much last year I hope he stays healthy but if he isn't we need someone who can be a strogn number 2 to step in. I think Oswalt is that guy.
Why giving up Westbrook/K Mac would free up salary. Thought I don't think it'll happen.
Great Grand Father is Eddie Dyer
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World Series Champions 1946
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Jack_Attack030
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Posted: 12/30/2011 2:46 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


Andruw Jones is returning to the Yankees for $2 million plus incentives, per Jon Heyman.
Brian Walton
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Posted: 1/1/2012 2:37 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



stlcards5129 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
stlcards5129 wrote:
nathanleopoldjr wrote:
Please, please get rid of Boggs-The world series was the last straw.  McClellan knows how to pitch out of the pen-Boggs doesn't have a clue.
...did you watch the WS? He actually pitched well, if you said the DS or CS I'd say you had a point, but this statement just makes me think you didn't even watch.
I watched that 3 run home run that took away any chance of winning that game.  He's a head case who cracks when the pressure is on.
Oh you mean that 3 run Home run where he inherited 2 runners and came in and had to face the Rangers hottest hitter. Oh yeah, that was completely his fault. He also went on to retire the next 5 batters. But yeah, lets evaluate the guy on 2.2 innings of postseason work against the American League's best team. That's an obvious indicator of how he'll perform in his career.
You either get the job done or you don't.  He doesn't.  The fac that he retired five batters after the game was over illustrates what he is good for.   If the Cardinals are five runs behind or five ahead he can be used but he can't be used if the game is on the line.  Tony and Duncan saw he was failing and sent him to Memphis last year.  I don't think he went there because they were oozing confidence in him.  Face it, some guys who throw hard jut never make it in the majors and i think Boggs is one of those.  Keep him to mop up if its 8-0 but as a key ingredient in the bullpen forget it.
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Posted: 1/1/2012 2:58 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



nathanleopoldjr wrote:
You either get the job done or you don't.  He doesn't.  The fac that he retired five batters after the game was over illustrates what he is good for.   If the Cardinals are five runs behind or five ahead he can be used but he can't be used if the game is on the line.  Tony and Duncan saw he was failing and sent him to Memphis last year.  I don't think he went there because they were oozing confidence in him.  Face it, some guys who throw hard jut never make it in the majors and i think Boggs is one of those.  Keep him to mop up if its 8-0 but as a key ingredient in the bullpen forget it.
I'm not advocating Boggs as some elite bullpen stopper type. I'm just saying he's better than McClellan and if you don't see that, I gotta believe you're crazy. McClellan is nothing more than a replacement level player with no upside. Boggs has stuff and upside and the very least he'll be at least as good as McClellan with the potential of him being much better. Oh yeah, he's cheaper too.

Posted: 1/1/2012 6:42 PM

Re: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


I wish you guys would lighten up.

McClellan was excellent coming out of the bullpen in middle relief in 2009 - 2010. If he stays in middle relief, I can see no reason why he wouldn't be very good again. If we trade him, there's a strong possibility that another team could develop him as a reliable middle of the rotation starter. Boggs has pretty good stuff, alright, but he hasn't been able to be consistent. I think that's because he was rushed and put on the active roster before he was really ready.  Hopefully, practice, practice, practice and maturity will get him where he wants to be.

On another subject..... there's some internet talk that the Rays would be willing to listen offers for David Price. They have so much quality pitching that they could afford to trade him. In addition to having an off year,  David Price got a lot of Rays fans mad at him last year for going off on them for not showing up at games. Our package could start with Cox and Lynn, but then assuming that Adams, Wong, and Taveras are untouchable, I don't know who else the Rays might be interested in........?

You've got to dream it first. There's no chance of it happening, if you don't dream it first.
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Posted: 1/1/2012 8:51 PM

Re: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



lemurian wrote: Our package could start with Cox and Lynn,

If you are starting with those two, the conversation is over. A trade for Price starts with Miller and Taveras, and it would take more than that.

I'm not interested in gutting our farm for one guy.



This user banned by Cardinal Nation Moderators. Rest in peace.
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Posted: 1/1/2012 8:58 PM

Re: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 



lemurian wrote: I wish you guys would lighten up.

Ignore me if it offends you. This is a message board. People discuss things.

McClellan was excellent coming out of the bullpen in middle relief in 2009 - 2010. If he stays in middle relief, I can see no reason why he wouldn't be very good again. If we trade him, there's a strong possibility that another team could develop him as a reliable middle of the rotation starter. Boggs has pretty good stuff, alright, but he hasn't been able to be consistent. I think that's because he was rushed and put on the active roster before he was really ready.  Hopefully, practice, practice, practice and maturity will get him where he wants to be.

Not really. He's had lowish ERAs with high xFIP and FIP numbers and pretty mediocre peripherals. The regression to the mean you saw as a starter and after Jackson was acquired is the pitcher McClellan really is. He's little more than a replacement level pitcher.

On another subject..... there's some internet talk that the Rays would be willing to listen offers for David Price. They have so much quality pitching that they could afford to trade him. In addition to having an off year,  David Price got a lot of Rays fans mad at him last year for going off on them for not showing up at games. Our package could start with Cox and Lynn, but then assuming that Adams, Wong, and Taveras are untouchable, I don't know who else the Rays might be interested in........?

I wasn't aware Adams and Taveras were untouchable. Wong isn't eligible to be traded yet, so I guess in a way he is untouchable. And any package for Price would start with Miller. The odds of the Rays trading price right now are pretty much nonexistent. And the Cardinals need for Price isn't pressing enough for them to give up the crazy package it would require.

You've got to dream it first. There's no chance of it happening, if you don't dream it first.

What the hell are you talking about?

Posted: 1/1/2012 10:20 PM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


Tampa fans need to be called out. It's sorry such a consistently good and exciting team can't draw fans.

Posted: 1/2/2012 8:52 AM

Re: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


These young men are people trying to make a future for themselves. You can criticize when you're not satisfied, but you don't have to to rip them the way you do. When McClellan came up from Springfield in 2009, he did a great job in middle relief, and, in my opinion, he could do it again. I like stats, too, but stats aren't everything.

I don't see a replacement for Adams if we trade him. Taveras' looks like the only other true power hitting
prospect we have in the system. Wong looks like the second baseman we've been trying to find for a decade. (I think he could be traded as that 'player to be named later' if we had to include him in a package.) You're right in suggesting that none of them are untouchable. With the kind of pitching the Rays have already, I'm not sure about how much Miller would interest them.

I suspect that every team that has looked at David Price assumes that the possibility of trading him is nearly nonexistent. However, if you look a little deeper at it, there are reasons why the Rays might let him go such as (1) he insulted the Rays fans (and he might be something of a head case) (2) the Rays have plenty of pitching and they need help in other areas such as first base, second base, and their bullpen, (3) Price will be arbitration eligible and the Rays are on a tight budget, (4) he had an off year.  It wouldn't hurt Mozeliak to inquire about him, if he hasn't already. Cox could probably play first for them and Lynn could help them with middle relief and possibly closer. Green might interest them for second base.  I realize that this might not be enough, but its a start. Like I said, you've got to dream it first. Everything starts with an idea and that's what this thread is supposed to be about.

I respect your interest in wanting to defend the integrity of the Forum by quashing whims and ridiculous suggestions. I would not want this Forum to be a source of silly rumors either. On the other hand, sometimes it can be just plain fun to be creative.;

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Posted: 1/2/2012 9:03 AM

Re: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


With our luck, Price will be traded to Cincinnati.
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Posted: 1/2/2012 9:04 AM

RE: Trade Ideas/Acquisition Ideas/Non-Cards Rumors - 2012 


Maybe they will trade him to us for Lohse and Westbrook. I'd be willing to throw in Schumaker if the Rayz are driving a hard bargain. I might be willing to part with McClellan, but right handed middle relief does not grow on trees.



This user banned by Cardinal Nation Moderators. Rest in peace.
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