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2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3

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Posted: 6/29/2014 7:37 AM

2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


Carlos Martinez (1-3, 4.13) vs. Madison Bumgarner (9-4, 2.63). 2:45 PM CT. FOX Sports Midwest and KMOX.
Brian Walton
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Posted: 7/3/2014 7:52 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


Reminder that this is a day game and it will be televised on MLB Network outside the Cardinals broadcast area.
Brian Walton
The Cardinal Nation and The Cardinal Nation blog
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Last edited 7/3/2014 7:54 AM by Domeboys

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Posted: 7/3/2014 10:36 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


Oddly, despite almost no offense for the past several games, we could win the series in SF today and finish a tough road trip at 5-5. That's relatively good considering the circumstances.

Tough game today, though, as Bumgarner has been really good this year and CMart is basically a 5 inning guy at the moment. Our bullpen should be rested thanks to Waino last night, though, so if we can score a few runs, we have a good chance at a happy flight today.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 10:45 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


For being a ground ball specialist (55% of balls hit are GBs), Martinez isn't very efficient. I would love to see that changed. Also, I would love to see Taveras back in CF today. His FIP is 3.48 also, so I'd love to see HIS ERA drop some today to line up better with the FIP. Fangraphs shows his ZIPS projection for the rest of the year improving pretty much across the board.
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  • MAP315
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Posted: 7/3/2014 10:51 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 10:55 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



bigns11 wrote: Oddly, despite almost no offense for the past several games, we could win the series in SF today and finish a tough road trip at 5-5. That's relatively good considering the circumstances.

Tough game today, though, as Bumgarner has been really good this year and CMart is basically a 5 inning guy at the moment. Our bullpen should be rested thanks to Waino last night, though, so if we can score a few runs, we have a good chance at a happy flight today.

The bullpen basically consists of Rosenthal, Neshek, and a bunch of question marks at the moment. I think Maness has drastically improved since this time last month and Freeman is obviously doing well too. Motte and Choate have also been better of late.

I can't remember who the 7th member of the pen is. Greenwood, I guess. It would be wonderful to get some news on Wacha or Garcia so we can shift some better talents to the bullpen.

I think Gonzales would be an excellent option for the bullpen come August, September. Last year, he threw 130 innings, while this year he is at 85, which projects to around 160 for the year. If he goes down to AAA for Kelly, he could wind up with a 2013 mixture of a Carlos Martinez-like workload (121 innings over 3 levels) or a Michael Wacha-like workload (180 innings incl. playoff starts which won't be the case for Gonzales)
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Posted: 7/3/2014 11:02 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.

I would prefer to let Taveras prove to me that he can't play CF and display that all-important range that you covet out there. Taveras can provide offense that Bourjos can't come close to. Plus everyone that has seen him play seems sort of split on the issue of his ability to handle CF. Considering all his physical ailments, Taveras's best may be yet to come.

BTW, Jay has produced a positive UZR in CF this year at 5.3 UZR/150 (12th among CFers), while Bourjos is at 17.5 UZR/150 (7th among CFers) Kemp, Crisp, and Fowler are the worst this year.

Last edited 7/3/2014 11:03 AM by PadsFS

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Posted: 7/3/2014 11:15 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



PadsFS wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.

I would prefer to let Taveras prove to me that he can't play CF and display that all-important range that you covet out there. Taveras can provide offense that Bourjos can't come close to. Plus everyone that has seen him play seems sort of split on the issue of his ability to handle CF. Considering all his physical ailments, Taveras's best may be yet to come.

BTW, Jay has produced a positive UZR in CF this year at 5.3 UZR/150 (12th among CFers), while Bourjos is at 17.5 UZR/150 (7th among CFers) Kemp, Crisp, and Fowler are the worst this year.

Well I still prefer defense over offense in CF. I still like Bourjos the best there. His defensive WAR is 3rd on the team with only Peralta (who has been outstanding defensively) and Yadi above him. Give me a strong up the middle defense. BTW Ellis is number 5 on that list.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 11:17 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



Domeboys wrote: Reminder that this is a day game and it will be televised on MLB Network outside the Cardinals broadcast area.

Not in Las Vegas - MLB considers us to be part of the viewing area for the Dodgers, Angels, Giants, A's, Padres and D'backs.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 11:35 AM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


I concur with the poster who notes we could still go 5-5 on this meatgrinder road trip and I'd call that terrific.  I also agree with the poster who said I want to keep Taveras in center until he proves he can't play it.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 1:01 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



PadsFS wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.

I would prefer to let Taveras prove to me that he can't play CF and display that all-important range that you covet out there. Taveras can provide offense that Bourjos can't come close to. Plus everyone that has seen him play seems sort of split on the issue of his ability to handle CF. Considering all his physical ailments, Taveras's best may be yet to come.

BTW, Jay has produced a positive UZR in CF this year at 5.3 UZR/150 (12th among CFers), while Bourjos is at 17.5 UZR/150 (7th among CFers) Kemp, Crisp, and Fowler are the worst this year.
At this point I agree to leave Taveras in center with Bourjos covering the late innings when we are ahead. However, I would have stuck with Bourjos most every day from the start of the season and given him the opportunity to get into a routine, so had that happened who knows.

But where we are now, I can see the benefit in seeing of Oscar can adequately handle center field.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 1:32 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



Jmodene1 wrote:
Domeboys wrote: Reminder that this is a day game and it will be televised on MLB Network outside the Cardinals broadcast area.

Not in Las Vegas - MLB considers us to be part of the viewing area for the Dodgers, Angels, Giants, A's, Padres and D'backs.
Sorry, I should have said "the Cardinals AND GIANTS broadcast area." It is sad that MLB refuses to address this problem.
Brian Walton
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Posted: 7/3/2014 1:35 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 


Lineup: Carpenter, Holliday, Adams, Peralta, Molina, Taveras 9, Ellis, Jay 8, Martinez.
Brian Walton
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Posted: 7/3/2014 1:48 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



Domeboys wrote: Lineup: Carpenter, Holliday, Adams, Peralta, Molina, Taveras 9, Ellis, Jay 8, Martinez.

Yes Taveras back to right...good. Jay in CF especially against a lefty...not good. Bourjos has not been give a fair shot and that's unfortunate.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 1:59 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..
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Posted: 7/3/2014 2:11 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



TCRedbird wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..

Is offense more important than defense? and if so much more important? They don't have a problem putting crap as defense in CF. You would think when you have trouble scoring you would like to have excellent defense and pitching.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 2:14 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



MAP315 wrote:
TCRedbird wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..

Is offense more important than defense? and if so much more important? They don't have a problem putting crap as defense in CF. You would think when you have trouble scoring you would like to have excellent defense and pitching.
It is when the offense is as BAD as the Cards is this year.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 2:15 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



TCRedbird wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..
I agree. Bourjos has been awful with the bat. It is not just his numbers either, he has put up too many AB's where he fouls off strikes and then dives out three feet off the plate for a slider. He has been over matched and is unable to bunt or hit to the right side when they need him too also. He has been a complete disaster and they do not have the line up to hide him in or the luxury of riding it out with him. To me the games get more and more important as you go and they just cannot afford to wait on guys like Bourjos and Ellis IMO. I been saying for weeks now that there comes a time when you have to cut bait and start over.

GO CARDS!
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Posted: 7/3/2014 2:22 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



cardinalnationhouston wrote:
TCRedbird wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..
I agree. Bourjos has been awful with the bat. It is not just his numbers either, he has put up too many AB's where he fouls off strikes and then dives out three feet off the plate for a slider. He has been over matched and is unable to bunt or hit to the right side when they need him too also. He has been a complete disaster and they do not have the line up to hide him in or the luxury of riding it out with him. To me the games get more and more important as you go and they just cannot afford to wait on guys like Bourjos and Ellis IMO. I been saying for weeks now that there comes a time when you have to cut bait and start over.

yes Ellis and Bourjos two of our top five defensive players not playing because they cannot hit but the same rule does not apply to those who can't field. Catching the ball and pitching well is more important than playing bad defensive players with marginal offensive skills.
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Posted: 7/3/2014 2:41 PM

Re: 2014 MLB game #87: Cards at Giants: Thu 7/3 



MAP315 wrote:
cardinalnationhouston wrote:
TCRedbird wrote:
MAP315 wrote: Why? Keep Taveras in RF. Let Bourjos play CF.
Because they don't want crap in CF as offense?  They have trouble scoring as it is..
I agree. Bourjos has been awful with the bat. It is not just his numbers either, he has put up too many AB's where he fouls off strikes and then dives out three feet off the plate for a slider. He has been over matched and is unable to bunt or hit to the right side when they need him too also. He has been a complete disaster and they do not have the line up to hide him in or the luxury of riding it out with him. To me the games get more and more important as you go and they just cannot afford to wait on guys like Bourjos and Ellis IMO. I been saying for weeks now that there comes a time when you have to cut bait and start over.

yes Ellis and Bourjos two of our top five defensive players not playing because they cannot hit but the same rule does not apply to those who can't field. Catching the ball and pitching well is more important than playing bad defensive players with marginal offensive skills.
Yet some say we are the top defensive club in the NL? We seem to have a bit of a mystery team on defense this year. The metrics tell us we are top flight but i think (judging by comments made) most of us know they are not really top flight on defense. I think it says a lot about catching the ones you can get to and not kicking the ball around. I have to give them credit. One reason i think so many fans find this club hard to watch is they don't make the spectacular plays but they do make the routine ones. They throw to the safe base and don't challenge runners. They play the game safe. I was a big fan of the Bourjos deal and still am but he is a AAA bat in the big leagues and so is about four other guys. That is the problem. I like PB for late defensive help and as a pinch runner but the Cards don't run. If the offense was clicking i think you could give him a lot more rope, the reality is that it is not though. It is not just him MAP it is the entire bench and all these guys AB's need to be phased out down the back stretch.

GO CARDS!
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