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Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season.

Posted: 8/14/2013 7:22 PM

Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Per DG

#"Cardinals prospect Oscar Taveras will have season-ending surgical procedure on foot next week to address high ankle sprain. #stlcards"

Can rule out a a possible September call up with the Cardinals going with the caution route on the surgical side.

Last edited 8/14/2013 7:23 PM by DTFlush234

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Posted: 8/14/2013 7:43 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


After wasting a couple months hoping for a miraculous healing?
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Posted: 8/14/2013 10:51 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Not a dr..but have had a high ankle sprain and continued to tape it up and play football. Giant mistake. In many cases a clean break would have been better news so ur at least off it for certain.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 5:51 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Well, it was treated properly, and you wouldn't perform surgery immediately for a normal high ankle sprain. He developed and continued to have discomfort that kept setting him back. So the ortho is going to have to scope it and see if there is any cartilage damage and remove it or if the ligament needs repair itself. This really should not be a long term problem, and I suspect he will come out this fine. and that is a my professional opinion. :)
 photo 891f3be8.jpg
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Posted: 8/15/2013 7:34 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


NJGiants, thank you for the explanation.
Brian Walton
The Cardinal Nation and The Cardinal Nation blog
Follow both Brian and TCN on Twitter
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Posted: 8/15/2013 9:15 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



Domeboys wrote: NJGiants, thank you for the explanation.

Agreed. Thanks NJG.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 9:59 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Hopefully he'll be able to rehab successfully and be ready to go for next season.  

I think this helps give sway to the argument to re-sign Beltran in the offseason.  I can't wait until Taveras is up in the majors, but I think he needs to prove his health before he's handed a starting position in the OF.  Beltran has shown a desire to stay in St. Louis so maybe we can get him on a team friendly 2 year deal.  That would allow him a chance to mentor Taveras while Taveras proves himself in the majors and Beltran's bat would give us depth behind our Craig, Adams, Holliday slugging core.

Last edited 8/15/2013 10:00 AM by desmetlax12

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Posted: 8/15/2013 10:08 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



desmetlax12 wrote: Hopefully he'll be able to rehab successfully and be ready to go for next season.  

I think this helps give sway to the argument to re-sign Beltran in the offseason.  I can't wait until Taveras is up in the majors, but I think he needs to prove his health before he's handed a starting position in the OF.  Beltran has shown a desire to stay in St. Louis so maybe we can get him on a team friendly 2 year deal.  That would allow him a chance to mentor Taveras while Taveras proves himself in the majors and Beltran's bat would give us depth behind our Craig, Adams, Holliday slugging core.


I think that ship has sailed. I can't see the Cardinals offering Beltran a multi-year deal and I can't see Beltran taking a 1-year deal. Plus Beltran will be 37 years old next year.

I was thinking that, perhaps, Nelson Cruz would be a smart pick-up.

He is good for a .260 BA and 20-30 HRs. (Tied with Beltran in WAR) He can play average defense in RF. He may sign a one-year deal to get a less PED-tainted contract. He is also 33 (34 in July) so he fits right into our signing aging players to minimal term contracts.

With Cruz, we wouldn't feel inclined to keep him in the lineup if he sucks over Taveras like I think Matheny would do with Beltran, if that makes sense.

Also, we'd get a draft pick out of Beltran, whereas I don't think Texas will offer Cruz arbitration.

Last edited 8/15/2013 10:12 AM by PadsFS

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Posted: 8/15/2013 10:14 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



PadsFS wrote:
desmetlax12 wrote: Hopefully he'll be able to rehab successfully and be ready to go for next season.  

I think this helps give sway to the argument to re-sign Beltran in the offseason.  I can't wait until Taveras is up in the majors, but I think he needs to prove his health before he's handed a starting position in the OF.  Beltran has shown a desire to stay in St. Louis so maybe we can get him on a team friendly 2 year deal.  That would allow him a chance to mentor Taveras while Taveras proves himself in the majors and Beltran's bat would give us depth behind our Craig, Adams, Holliday slugging core.


I think that ship has sailed. I can't see the Cardinals offering Beltran a multi-year deal and I can't see Beltran taking a 1-year deal. Plus Beltran will be 37 years old next year.

I was thinking that, perhaps, Nelson Cruz would be a smart pick-up.

He is good for a .260 BA and 20-30 HRs. (Tied with Beltran in WAR) He can play average defense in RF. He may sign a one-year deal to get a less PED-tainted contract. He is also 33 (34 in July) so he fits right into our signing aging players to minimal term contracts.

With Cruz, we wouldn't feel inclined to keep him in the lineup if he sucks over Taveras like I think Matheny would do with Beltran, if that makes sense.

Also, we'd get a draft pick out of Beltran, whereas I don't think Texas will offer Cruz arbitration.
I don't think that is a good idea.  Cruz chokes in the playoffs.  biggrin
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Posted: 8/15/2013 10:45 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



crdswmn wrote:
PadsFS wrote:
desmetlax12 wrote: Hopefully he'll be able to rehab successfully and be ready to go for next season.  

I think this helps give sway to the argument to re-sign Beltran in the offseason.  I can't wait until Taveras is up in the majors, but I think he needs to prove his health before he's handed a starting position in the OF.  Beltran has shown a desire to stay in St. Louis so maybe we can get him on a team friendly 2 year deal.  That would allow him a chance to mentor Taveras while Taveras proves himself in the majors and Beltran's bat would give us depth behind our Craig, Adams, Holliday slugging core.


I think that ship has sailed. I can't see the Cardinals offering Beltran a multi-year deal and I can't see Beltran taking a 1-year deal. Plus Beltran will be 37 years old next year.

I was thinking that, perhaps, Nelson Cruz would be a smart pick-up.

He is good for a .260 BA and 20-30 HRs. (Tied with Beltran in WAR) He can play average defense in RF. He may sign a one-year deal to get a less PED-tainted contract. He is also 33 (34 in July) so he fits right into our signing aging players to minimal term contracts.

With Cruz, we wouldn't feel inclined to keep him in the lineup if he sucks over Taveras like I think Matheny would do with Beltran, if that makes sense.

Also, we'd get a draft pick out of Beltran, whereas I don't think Texas will offer Cruz arbitration.
I don't think that is a good idea.  Cruz chokes in the playoffs.  biggrin

By that time, we'd have Taveras ready!

Cruz did look like Matt Holliday out there so 'average defense' may be pushing it slightly. More likely, below-average.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 11:12 AM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Beltran is making a push for the HOF. He will not sign anywhere without a strong assurance he will not spend more time on the bench than he wants to. In fact, I predict he signs with an AL team that doesn't have an everyday DH.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 12:16 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



blingboy wrote: Beltran is making a push for the HOF. He will not sign anywhere without a strong assurance he will not spend more time on the bench than he wants to. In fact, I predict he signs with an AL team that doesn't have an everyday DH.

Texas would be a very attractive spot I would think with Cruz and Murphy leaving via FA and Berkman likely not to be re-signed.

They would then have Martin/Gentry, Wells, and Beltran in the OF with an open DH spot too.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 1:45 PM

Re: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


I know that Taveras is considered a RF rather than a CF, but the fact that him playing CF was considered a possibility and the fact that Jay's defense has taken a significant step back, makes me feel like we should consider Taveras in CF, Craig in RF and Adams at 1B.  I know that will make for a below-average defensive OF, but we already have one of those in my opinion.  If not, what is the plan with Matt Adams?  Is he just gonna keep being this awesome hitter that we can't find ABs for?  This offense has severely lacked power this year and Adams could be a huge shot in the arm in that department going into next season if we finally give him some regular ABs.

If this isn't a possibility I just don't understand what we keep Adams around for.  He's a pure hitter and, though he's a very good pinch hitter/spot starter, which is valuable to a team of course, he is just still way too valuable for us to let him sit on the bench and rot on a regular basis.  Is it just wishful thinking on my part that we could employ a Craig-RF, Taveras-CF, and Adams-1B trio and not have to sign anyone (except a couple solid bench bats), or do you think it will actually be considered?
"You wait for a strike, then you knock the **** out of it." -Stan Musial
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Posted: 8/15/2013 4:15 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



NJGiants11 wrote: Well, it was treated properly,
That's one way to see it.  Here is the other, from Bernie's column.

"It's obvious that the Cardinals botched their handling of Taveras' original ankle injury. You don't need me to tell you this; GM John Mozeliak has admitted that the Cardinals rushed Taveras back too soon. I don't understand how an otherwise superb organization can get it wrong so often in such a crucial area. Because of the injury this was largely a wasted year for Taveras, and it could have been avoided.

. . . this is the loss of  MLB's No. 1 hitting prospect who had the potential to impact the NL Central race. Or look at it this way: a healthy and thriving Taveras would have been as good, if not better, than any realistic trade-deadline addition to the 25-man roster."

http://www.stltoday.com/sports...76ac3f4110.html
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Posted: 8/15/2013 4:17 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



blingboy wrote: Beltran is making a push for the HOF. He will not sign anywhere without a strong assurance he will not spend more time on the bench than he wants to. In fact, I predict he signs with an AL team that doesn't have an everyday DH.

Yankees or Texas

 Suggested U. of Illinois mascots

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Posted: 8/15/2013 4:19 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


How do we know the implications of rushing him back too soon? I don't have enough info to know "it could have been avoided" as is asserted in the quote above. For all we know, he may have needed surgery in either case.
Brian Walton
The Cardinal Nation and The Cardinal Nation blog
Follow both Brian and TCN on Twitter

Last edited 8/15/2013 4:20 PM by Domeboys

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Posted: 8/15/2013 4:47 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 




---------------------------------------------
--- PadsFS wrote:


crdswmn wrote:
PadsFS wrote:
desmetlax12 wrote: Hopefully he'll be able to rehab successfully and be ready to go for next season.  

I think this helps give sway to the argument to re-sign Beltran in the offseason.  I can't wait until Taveras is up in the majors, but I think he needs to prove his health before he's handed a starting position in the OF.  Beltran has shown a desire to stay in St. Louis so maybe we can get him on a team friendly 2 year deal.  That would allow him a chance to mentor Taveras while Taveras proves himself in the majors and Beltran's bat would give us depth behind our Craig, Adams, Holliday slugging core.


I think that ship has sailed. I can't see the Cardinals offering Beltran a multi-year deal and I can't see Beltran taking a 1-year deal. Plus Beltran will be 37 years old next year.

I was thinking that, perhaps, Nelson Cruz would be a smart pick-up.

He is good for a .260 BA and 20-30 HRs. (Tied with Beltran in WAR) He can play average defense in RF. He may sign a one-year deal to get a less PED-tainted contract. He is also 33 (34 in July) so he fits right into our signing aging players to minimal term contracts.

With Cruz, we wouldn't feel inclined to keep him in the lineup if he sucks over Taveras like I think Matheny would do with Beltran, if that makes sense.

Also, we'd get a draft pick out of Beltran, whereas I don't think Texas will offer Cruz arbitration.
I don't think that is a good idea.  Cruz chokes in the playoffs.  biggrin

By that time, we'd have Taveras ready!

Cruz did look like Matt Holliday out there so 'average defense' may be pushing it slightly. More likely, below-average.

---------------------------------------------

Arm strength doesn't even come close in the evaluation of both defensively. Cruz has a cannon.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 8:49 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 



Domeboys wrote: How do we know the implications of rushing him back too soon? I don't have enough info to know "it could have been avoided" as is asserted in the quote above. For all we know, he may have needed surgery in either case.

I don't know Oscar Taveras (the kid) at all, but I have seen him play in Johnson City, Quad Cities, Springfield and Memphis.  He has a great stroke and a MLB body.  In following Oscar's career, the only thing I questioned about him was his willingness to play when slightly injured.  Perhaps the Cardinals pushed him back into action too soon.... just to see if he could play thru a little pain.  Full-season teams like Memphis play their season with very few off-days. An occasional rain-out can be a blessing!  I'm sure the 2013 Memphis roster has several players that played a good portion of the season at less than 100%.

If someone knows Taveras very well, please tell me how willing he is to play at less than 100%.  I'm disappointed that I won't be seeing Taveras in STL in September,  but will settle for seeing Wong hopefully making an impact.
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Posted: 8/15/2013 8:53 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 




---------------------------------------------
--- skszyszowski wrote:


Domeboys wrote: How do we know the implications of rushing him back too soon? I don't have enough info to know "it could have been avoided" as is asserted in the quote above. For all we know, he may have needed surgery in either case.

I don't know Oscar Taveras (the kid) at all, but I have seen him play in Johnson City, Quad Cities, Springfield and Memphis.  He has a great stroke and a MLB body.  In following Oscar's career, the only thing I questioned about him was his willingness to play when slightly injured.  Perhaps the Cardinals pushed him back into action too soon.... just to see if he could play thru a little pain.  Full-season teams like Memphis play their season with very few off-days. An occasional rain-out can be a blessing!  I'm sure the 2013 Memphis roster has several players that played a good portion of the season at less than 100%.

If someone knows Taveras very well, please tell me how willing he is to play at less than 100%.  I'm disappointed that I won't be seeing Taveras in STL in September,  but will settle for seeing Wong hopefully making an impact.

---------------------------------------------

Wong from reports was called up. Will join team in Chicago,
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Posted: 8/15/2013 9:13 PM

RE: Oscar Taveras out for the rest of the season. 


Your initial assertion was he needed surgery right away and they should have known it. Rushing him back too soon can really only have an affect on the cartilage or ligaments if he suffered a tweak or recurring sprain because it was too weak to sustain a good ankle position. High ankle sprains can be tricky and maybe a little more time would have been better but if he didn't reinjure the tibiofibular ligament/ syndesmotic ligament by rolling the ankle a 2nd time, then the surgery was more than likely going to be necessary anyway. High ankle sprains are classified as stable or unstable. But it isn't always clear cut. Unstable sprains are treated surgically with a syndesmotic screw that basically holds the tibia and fibula together and allows the ligament a non stressed environment and it heals within 3 months. The screw is later removed. He might not have been back for end of the season anyway. Not sure if John Mozeliak is just trying to take the blame or he has some advanced orthopaedic knowledge of his particular case. I think anytime these things go anywhere but the expected outcome, you are going to 2nd guess yourself. One can always be more conservative, and I would bet a large part was Taveras telling them initially he felt great. But to blame the otherwise superb organization is really not understanding how unique some medical cases can become and how hard it is to predict complications in advance.
---------------------------------------------
--- blingboy wrote:


NJGiants11 wrote: Well, it was treated properly,
That's one way to see it.  Here is the other, from Bernie's column.

"It's obvious that the Cardinals botched their handling of Taveras' original ankle injury. You don't need me to tell you this; GM John Mozeliak has admitted that the Cardinals rushed Taveras back too soon. I don't understand how an otherwise superb organization can get it wrong so often in such a crucial area. Because of the injury this was largely a wasted year for Taveras, and it could have been avoided.

. . . this is the loss of  MLB's No. 1 hitting prospect who had the potential to impact the NL Central race. Or look at it this way: a healthy and thriving Taveras would have been as good, if not better, than any realistic trade-deadline addition to the 25-man roster."

www.stltoday.com/sports...76ac3f4110.html

---------------------------------------------
 photo 891f3be8.jpg

Last edited 8/15/2013 9:19 PM by NJGiants11

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