Joe Strauss believes the Cardinals have "real" interest in Cleveland's Asdrubal Cabrera, thought it is not clear that the shortstop is on the market.

This is a good time for a quick reminder for the new readers about how we handle rumor threads on this board. We generally start a new individual thread when a major media source connects the Cardinals with a particular player, such as in this case.

If you have an idea of your own for a trade or acquisition target for the Cardinals, we have created the "Trade Ideas...." thread pinned to the top of the board for that purpose. Same if you want to talk about a player in another organization or a free agent not connected to the Cardinals. Please do not start new threads for these kinds of ideas.

At times, the moderators will merge threads into the "Trade Ideas" thread if they are deemed to best fit there based on the preceding criteria.

Cabrera has been an all-star shortstop and I have seen a note (maybe on Baseball America) that indicates that he could be available. If we didn't have to give up more than one good prospect I would be in favor. He could also play second base if Furcal is sound. Or maybe Furcal would be better served at 2b with his shoulder problem.

Strauss is a major media source, then.

I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

blingboy wrote: Strauss is a major media source, then.

I think he would tell you he is THE major media source.  ;-)

I put up three polls on the matter. Stop by the blog and vote if you are so inclined.

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

Curious if that is a rant or if the metrics would back that up...

SoonerinNC wrote: Cabrera has been an all-star shortstop and I have seen a note (maybe on Baseball America) that indicates that he could be available. If we didn't have to give up more than one good prospect I would be in favor. He could also play second base if Furcal is sound. Or maybe Furcal would be better served at 2b with his shoulder problem.

Minor point, but Furcal's current issue is with his elbow, not shoulder. The main point is very important in that he can't be counted upon to play a full slate of games next year.

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

I agree 100% with this statement. I'd be very upset if they gave up anything substantial to get such a poor fielding SS. He's a solid offensive 2nd baseman who happens to play SS for the Indians.

Domeboys wrote:

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

Curious if that is a rant or if the metrics would back that up...

Ryan Theriot:  2009  UZR 3.7  DRS 0
                     2010  UZR -3.3  DRS -3
                     2011  UZR   -8.5  DRS -8

Asdrubal Cabrera:  2010  UZR  -7.7  DRS -1
                           2011  UZR  -11.3  DRS 3
                           2012  UZR  -9.0  DRS  -5

Domeboys wrote:  Minor point, but Furcal's current issue is with his elbow, not shoulder. The main point is very important in that he can't be counted upon to play a full slate of games next year.

An unrepaired anything with the throwing arm makes a SS unreliable.  Which means we do need somebody.  Its early, and it wouldn't be impossible to imagine the major media source overstating the level of 'interest'.  I wouldn't be all that surprised to see Mo sign or trade for a second tier/creaky vereran as insurance, and see what Kozma and Jackson look like as a backup next spring.

blingboy wrote:

Domeboys wrote:  Minor point, but Furcal's current issue is with his elbow, not shoulder. The main point is very important in that he can't be counted upon to play a full slate of games next year.

An unrepaired anything with the throwing arm makes a SS unreliable.  Which means we do need somebody.  Its early, and it wouldn't be impossible to imagine the major media source overstating the level of 'interest'.  I wouldn't be all that surprised to see Mo sign or trade for a second tier/creaky vereran as insurance, and see what Kozma and Jackson look like as a backup next spring.

Scoots?

Could we have another Cesar Izturis sighting in STL?

stlcards5129 wrote:

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

I agree 100% with this statement. I'd be very upset if they gave up anything substantial to get such a poor fielding SS. He's a solid offensive 2nd baseman who happens to play SS for the Indians.

They have made the offense for defense trade off a lot in the last few years. Holliday, Berkman, Beltran are all poor fielders and Craig is no Keith Hernandez either. I doubt poor fielding scares them much. This is a burgeoning player that could benefit from leaving a dead baseball town like Cleveland. He would easily be the most talented player at SS for St.Louis since Renteria. The only worry i have is if he has the mentality to play here. Furcal and Drew can't carry this kids jock.

From Terry Pluto of the Cleveland Plain-Dealer:

"Cabrera has two years left on his deal at $6.5 million and $10 million.

Cabrera averaged 20 homers and 80 RBI while batting .271 during the past two seasons, making the All-Star team. But his declining defense is alarming for a 27-year-old as he battles weight problems. His numbers have fallen down in the second half of the past two seasons. In 2011-12, he batted .290 (.834 OPS) before the All-Star break and .248 (.698) after.

Physical conditioning was an issue."

I don't know anything about Mr. Pluto, but I don't like the sound of that. It reminds me of Carlos Baerga.

SoonerinNC wrote: Cabrera has been an all-star shortstop and I have seen a note (maybe on Baseball America) that indicates that he could be available. If we didn't have to give up more than one good prospect I would be in favor. He could also play second base if Furcal is sound. Or maybe Furcal would be better served at 2b with his shoulder problem.

Furcal was an all star as recently as 2012...

crdswmn wrote:

Domeboys wrote:

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

Curious if that is a rant or if the metrics would back that up...

Ryan Theriot:  2009  UZR 3.7  DRS 0
                     2010  UZR -3.3  DRS -3
                     2011  UZR   -8.5  DRS -8

Asdrubal Cabrera:  2010  UZR  -7.7  DRS -1
                           2011  UZR  -11.3  DRS 3
                           2012  UZR  -9.0  DRS  -5

First, Cabrera's FRAA is positive for 2012 and generally hovers around zero:

http://www.baseballprospectus....rd.php?id=45398

Second, he has been on the other's recieving votes for several years on the fielding bible voting:

http://www.fieldingbible.com/c...tetally2011.asp

That said, maybe he is bad, but I don't think he could possibly be any worse that Theriot or Furcal this past year.

Also, Cabrera is going to be 27 next year. Right at the beginning of his prime AND he has already proven he can he 20+ HRs a year. Certainly something Theriot COULD NOT do.

Oh, and he'll be cheap for a SS.

PadsFS wrote:

crdswmn wrote:

Domeboys wrote:

crdswmn wrote: I will go on record as opposed to trading for Cabrera.  His defense at ss is no better than Ryan Theriot's.  I have been and always will be opposed to sacrificing defense to get a little more offense.  Especially when the Cardinals have a stacked offense already.

Having said that, I wouldn't be surprised if the Cardinals do it.  As good as the Cardinals organization is, they have a major problem with never learning from their mistakes.  Which is why they will also sign another crappy left handed reliever from the trash heap.  J.C Romero 2.0.

Curious if that is a rant or if the metrics would back that up...

Ryan Theriot:  2009  UZR 3.7  DRS 0
                     2010  UZR -3.3  DRS -3
                     2011  UZR   -8.5  DRS -8

Asdrubal Cabrera:  2010  UZR  -7.7  DRS -1
                           2011  UZR  -11.3  DRS 3
                           2012  UZR  -9.0  DRS  -5

First, Cabrera's FRAA is positive for 2012 and generally hovers around zero:

http://www.baseballprospectus....rd.php?id=45398

Second, he has been on the other's recieving votes for several years on the fielding bible voting:

http://www.fieldingbible.com/c...tetally2011.asp

That said, maybe he is bad, but I don't think he could possibly be any worse that Theriot or Furcal this past year.

Also, Cabrera is going to be 27 next year. Right at the beginning of his prime AND he has already proven he can he 20+ HRs a year. Certainly something Theriot COULD NOT do.

Oh, and he'll be cheap for a SS.

So when are we going to stop worshipping the HR to the exclusion of everything else in baseball?  Until we have the worst defensive team in baseball? 

At some point, reason and logic says there has to be a balance.  The Cardinals have one of the best offensive lineups in baseball.  To keep focusing on offense to the exclusion of defense will trigger the law of diminishing returns.  Why not try to add some defense with a little less offense?  I'm not saying going full Brendan Ryan here, but look for someone with a solid glove who maybe doesn't have power but hits for acceptable average. And Asdrubal Cabrera is not that guy.

Cabrera's defense has been declining.  His offense has become a little shaky of late as well.  The team knows this, that is why they want to trade him.  Let's not bite.

why no love for stephen drew?

grayssportsalmanac wrote: why no love for stephen drew?

2012

.223/.309/.348   28 RBIs

-5.2 UZR  DRS -7  WAR  0.0

And a bad ankle.


That's why.

well he was hurt and he wouldnt cost a prospect...