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The Co-Hitting Coaches

Posted: 06/24/2014 10:02 AM

The Co-Hitting Coaches 


Seem to be getting a free pass. The Pads are horrible at the plate both with results and approach and they still have co-hitting coaches. Why not bring in a new guy with a fresh new approach? Loretta? Sweeney? Heck, why not Mark Grant at this point??
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:29 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 



claykirby1969 wrote: Seem to be getting a free pass. The Pads are horrible at the plate both with results and approach and they still have co-hitting coaches. Why not bring in a new guy with a fresh new approach? Loretta? Sweeney? Heck, why not Mark Grant at this point??
Padres have had 6 hitting coaches in 10 years … think that change the hitting coach thought is stale … does't work and doesn't go to the cause … bad hitters at the core. That is fiddling while Rome is burning.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:43 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


At this point I think it needs to be tried, even though I think the likelihood that BOTH these guys aren't the right fit is highly unlikely.

Basically I see this team and how bad they are and feel there's really no explanation other than they're just awful players. It's possible (and maybe probable) the coaching staff has contributed to the problem, but as Greg Booker once famously said, "you can't win the Kentucky Derby with a stable of donkeys."

Ladies and gentlemen, may I present the San Diego Donkeys!
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:53 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


I got the impression from the Mike Dee media conference that Black and coaching staff have until the end of the season to present some kind of improvement.
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:56 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


So you just fire two guys that all reports seem to think are good guys and are just victim of the players they have been dealt just because a change needs to be tried …. hmmmm … sounds very similar to the logic used to fire Byrnes and that will be used to fire Black.  Not really big on firing the clerk when the executive created the problem.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 11:02 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 



thrownoutatsecond wrote: I got the impression from the Mike Dee media conference that Black and coaching staff have until the end of the season to present some kind of improvement.
To the end of the season yes … the last part may be PR double talk … the new GM and Dee may go their own route no matter what Black does (unless they make the playoffs …eek) At that point we will get the statement that "Black is well respected in all circles of baseball but given the results over the past few years … a change and a fresh look is needed. We thank him for all he has done for the Padres in the past eight years and wish him the best where he goes." At that point the Padres announce the hiring of Norv Turner to improve the offense. biggrin
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Posted: 06/24/2014 11:14 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


With Byrnes gone, the coaches aren't going to magically improve the players.

I'm curious to know what kind of rapport the players truly have with the hitting instructors. We've heard the players are un-coachable. We've heard a lot of things. It's hard to distinguish the gossip from the truth.

Whatever the problem is, it seems unlikely that Byrnes dismissal will resolve it.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 11:28 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


I would rather have 1 voice as far as hitting goes at this point. Even though Plantier and Powell may be on the same page, the players arent buying in....
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Posted: 06/24/2014 11:42 AM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 



claykirby1969 wrote: I would rather have 1 voice as far as hitting goes at this point. Even though Plantier and Powell may be on the same page, the players arent buying in....
If I got their approach right … they talk between themselves on strategy then each one has there own players to work with … only one voice to the player. Some other clubs employee the same idea stating that one coach can't devote enough one one one time to each hitter.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 12:03 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 





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--- FENN68 wrote:

So you just fire two guys that all reports seem to think are good guys and are just victim of the players they have been dealt just because a change needs to be tried …. hmmmm … sounds very similar to the logic used to fire Byrnes and that will be used to fire Black.  Not really big on firing the clerk when the executive created the problem.

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Well,Coaches generally get some credit when things are going well shouldn't they also get some blame when they suck?
We all praise Balsley like he's one of the best pitching coaches in all of baseball but at the same time maybe it's Petco AND the guys he's been given?
Sounds like a double standard?
Balsley gets credit nearly everytime a pitcher improves after coming to SD......where are the improved hitters?
It can't be about Petco every time.
Agon could hit there.......others could/can.

If a batting coach doesn't bet blame for the worst offense of "all time"...... Man,that's some good gig!





Prospect I'm Championing.........Jordan Paroubeck

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Posted: 06/24/2014 2:14 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


I know there are other teams that have co-hitting coaches.  You have to wonder if it ever goes down with Plantier saying forget Powell is saying you need to focus on this.  I heard Merv Rettenmund the other night talking about Tony's hitting.  What a smart hitting coach.  Merv's probably too long in the tooth too be brought back.

Seriously though,  Why do they did two hitting coaches?
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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Posted: 06/24/2014 2:19 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


I have been a drummer a long time and have thought no band needs two trap set drummers.  Either it's a gimmick or neither one is very good.  Powell/Plantier???  Any of you guys remember Phil Plantier's swing when he was playing for the Padres?  Awful.
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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Posted: 06/24/2014 3:58 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 



thrownoutatsecond wrote: Seriously though,  Why do they did two hitting coaches?
Seems like there's two possible reasons for that.

Either you don't trust your players' ability to hit. Or you don't trust your own ability to hire.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 3:58 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 





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--- thrownoutatsecond wrote:

I have been a drummer a long time and have thought no band needs two trap set drummers.  Either it's a gimmick or neither one is very good.  Powell/Plantier???  Any of you guys remember Phil Plantier's swing when he was playing for the Padres?  Awful.

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Some people can teach better than they can do.
Not saying Plantier can as he hasn't proven it but his swing may not have anything to do with his coaching ability.





Prospect I'm Championing.........Jordan Paroubeck

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Posted: 06/24/2014 4:06 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


Lets not get too caught up in the potential negative reasons for having two separate hitting coaches. If one wasn't good enough at his job to be a major league hitting coach, he wouldn't be one.

The way I see it, you can have 5 different hitting coaches, all excellent at their job, but not all of them will be a fit for a given club. It depends on their style, how they communicate, even what languages they speak for them to be effective. Honestly, I'm not sure why more teams don't use the 2 coach approach. So long as they come up with a game plan together, it makes sense to have a couple different voices for hitting instruction. That way you can mix and match players and coaches, giving each one more 1 on 1 time with a coach they click with.

Last edited 06/24/2014 4:07 PM by sportwarrior

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Posted: 06/24/2014 4:33 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


Well I guess most all of agree Balsley is a miracle worker and he never pitched in the majors but Plantier had  one season 34 home runs at 100 rbis and basically sucked the rest of his career.  MR. P you said there is something going on in dugout.  How does Plantier get a free pass for the worst hitting team in our lifetimes?
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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Posted: 06/24/2014 4:34 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


And just because previous regimes fired five or six hitting coaches we can't fire Plantier?
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:36 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 



thrownoutatsecond wrote: Well I guess most all of agree Balsley is a miracle worker and he never pitched in the majors but Plantier had  one season 34 home runs at 100 rbis and basically sucked the rest of his career.  MR. P you said there is something going on in dugout.  How does Plantier get a free pass for the worst hitting team in our lifetimes?
Honestly, one of the biggest misconceptions about hitting coaches is that they need to have performed well at the big league level to be good instructors. That is absolutely not the case. There are many students of the game with a ton of knowledge on proper swing techniques, approaches, etc that did way WORSE than Plantier and are serving as fine hitting coaches at the big league level.

Another misconception is that all bad offenses can be traced to bad hitting coaches. For me, I see a hitting coach as sort of like a ship's mechanic/engineer. If you send a mechanic out on a sound, seaworthy vessel in good working order, he should be able to fix and tweak a lot of problems that come his way. If you send an engineer out on a boat with a leak and a lemon of an engine, however, you're looking at a perfectly capable professional that is entirely unable to fix the problem. Why? Because the problem is just too big. It's gonna take an entirely new engine to get that ship going again and there's nothing he can do about it.

That's where we're at with this offense. It's not a tweak or two away from hitting on all cylinders. We aren't even a couple spare parts away from limping back to dock. It's impossible to tell what the mechanic would have done with a working engine because it's turned out that the engine driving our offense is completely shot.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:37 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 





---------------------------------------------
--- thrownoutatsecond wrote:

Well I guess most all of agree Balsley is a miracle worker and he never pitched in the majors but Plantier had  one season 34 home runs at 100 rbis and basically sucked the rest of his career.  MR. P you said there is something going on in dugout.  How does Plantier get a free pass for the worst hitting team in our lifetimes?

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When did I give him a free pass?
I was the first one to question why he's still around!
All I said is you can't judge his coaching on his swing as a player.





Prospect I'm Championing.........Jordan Paroubeck

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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:58 PM

Re: The Co-Hitting Coaches 


I never it was all Plantier fault either.  Maybe it is what Randy Jones and Kurt B. said, some of these guys are un-coachable,
The current unis are a hound.... Bring Back The Brown
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