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Gameday Thread: May 2013

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Posted: 05/01/2013 11:43 AM

Gameday Thread: May 2013 


In order to try and keep the Gameday thread from getting too uncontrollable during the year, let's try breaking it down by months.  Should still be accessible that way, and if you miss a few games (like me) then it's not a total hassle trying to get caught up with the discussion.

Feel free to keep posting in the other one through the end of the Cubs series if you want to though...
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Posted: 05/01/2013 11:31 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Andrew Cashner's performance was incredible tonight...in the worst possible way...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....
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Posted: 05/02/2013 4:21 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Had to watch the game on gameday since I was at work and could only check every 10 minutes or so... despite that I didnt feel like I missed anything. 

From Gameday (and tweets) it made it sound like there were no hard hit balls by the Padres until Hundleys double...  Can anyone comment?
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Posted: 05/03/2013 10:18 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


I don't get to watch to many Padre games here in Arizona but from what I saw tonight, I was pretty happy with how the team played.  Other than than a couple of hiccups from Marquis and the lack of pitching from Brach, I thought it was a solid effort all around.  Some nice defensive plays and some timely hits got it done. 

The homerun from Alonso would have been off the wall last year.  From what the Diamondbacks announcers said, the Padres have had six balls go over the new fence already!




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Posted: 05/03/2013 11:10 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



TheMendozaLine wrote: I don't get to watch to many Padre games here in Arizona but from what I saw tonight, I was pretty happy with how the team played.  Other than than a couple of hiccups from Marquis and the lack of pitching from Brach, I thought it was a solid effort all around.  Some nice defensive plays and some timely hits got it done. 

The homerun from Alonso would have been off the wall last year.  From what the Diamondbacks announcers said, the Padres have had six balls go over the new fence already!
Really?That might be an exaggeration as Lil Ninja was the first Padre to clear it only a few home games ago. 

Black got crazy defensive when it came to Brach.  Finally admitted that maybe he should stop putting Brach in pressure situations
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Posted: 05/04/2013 10:59 AM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Well, they are Diamondbacks announcers...   lol! 

Actually, the new duo of Brenly and Berthiaume aren't to bad.

Speaking of announcers, how has Enberg been of late?  When I was able to get Padres games a couple of years ago he was kinda spotty.




Last edited 05/04/2013 11:00 AM by TheMendozaLine

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Posted: 05/04/2013 11:03 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


there has to be something going on physically with Clayton Richard...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....
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Posted: 05/05/2013 8:18 AM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



stevin wrote: there has to be something going on physically with Clayton Richard...
or emotionally.  When you look back at his performance over the past four years.....a model of consistency with an ERA of around 4.00 and chewing up innings.  This year he is regressed in almost all aspects of pitching....walks / strikeouts / innings / HRs....basically a complete breakdown.  Given his reputed "work ethic" and attention to detail...at 29 with over 4 years of ML consistency .... hard to fathom.  Looks like he lost about a MPH off his pitches but the key is he lost total command / control...that would seem to be mechanics...with his experience (baring injury) that is something that has a chance be corrected.
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  • brianmcon
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Posted: 05/05/2013 10:22 AM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



FENN68 wrote:
stevin wrote: there has to be something going on physically with Clayton Richard...
or emotionally.  When you look back at his performance over the past four years.....a model of consistency with an ERA of around 4.00 and chewing up innings.  This year he is regressed in almost all aspects of pitching....walks / strikeouts / innings / HRs....basically a complete breakdown.  Given his reputed "work ethic" and attention to detail...at 29 with over 4 years of ML consistency .... hard to fathom.  Looks like he lost about a MPH off his pitches but the key is he lost total command / control...that would seem to be mechanics...with his experience (baring injury) that is something that has a chance be corrected.
No one on the Pads works harder than Clay Richard.  He's a model for approaching the game the right way.  I believe Pads have seriously considered extending him.... Thank God they didn't.  The problem with guys like him is that he is out-working everyone on the team to maximize his limited ability; and has absolutely zero margin for losing anything.  Very much like a below average speed cornerback making up for it with savvy; literally can't afford to lose a step.  However, in hindsight, he definitely shouldn't have pitched so soon after flu; have to write 1 or 2 of last 3 starts off to that.  I believe he deserves 1 more start, but another bad outing and you have to replace him in rotation.

Before next year, I think the Padres need to do 2 things:  1)  Sign Headley to an extension, and 2) Allocate the 11 MM going to Richard & Volquez (+more as needed) towards a top of the rotation starter by FA or trade.  THAT IS IT.  All other improvement can come from within.  Can't have your choice of "#1" starter be between the MLB leaders in walks & HR's given up!  I think it's imperative next year to have a TRUE # 1 type to take the pressure off of what will be an extremely young but talented rotation next year... not fair to ask Luebke or whoever else to be the #1.   Headley's raise would be dramatic, but others on roster are mostly modest/manageable.  I have "rolling" payroll right now at 71 Million.  Could field an extremely competitive team next year with very little turnover for 85 MM.  Realistic?

Finally, I have noticed for the last 6 months that with our extremely "tight" roster that we are well positioned to do a reverse of the Latos trade; we acquire a good starter, but give up 3 or 4 players on or soon to be on the 40-man roster.  Of course, who do you give up.  The value of some guys still to be determined, and would probably have to sacrifice a top 10 system SP prospect in this type of deal.
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Posted: 05/05/2013 12:23 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Richard to the DL with "intestinal virus" or something like that...being sent to a "specialist"...that will give him a couple of weeks to work out the mechanics.

Ross up....but probably as a RP...still don't want him trying to hit.

Speculation Richard's replacement in the starting role is either Bass OR Stauffer / O'Sullivan who both have opt out clauses if not added to the roster by June 1. (could send someone like Boxberger back down and will need a 40 man roster move).

Last edited 05/05/2013 12:25 PM by FENN68

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Posted: 05/05/2013 12:56 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



brianmcon wrote:
FENN68 wrote:
stevin wrote: there has to be something going on physically with Clayton Richard...
or emotionally.  When you look back at his performance over the past four years.....a model of consistency with an ERA of around 4.00 and chewing up innings.  This year he is regressed in almost all aspects of pitching....walks / strikeouts / innings / HRs....basically a complete breakdown.  Given his reputed "work ethic" and attention to detail...at 29 with over 4 years of ML consistency .... hard to fathom.  Looks like he lost about a MPH off his pitches but the key is he lost total command / control...that would seem to be mechanics...with his experience (baring injury) that is something that has a chance be corrected.
No one on the Pads works harder than Clay Richard.  He's a model for approaching the game the right way.  I believe Pads have seriously considered extending him.... Thank God they didn't.  The problem with guys like him is that he is out-working everyone on the team to maximize his limited ability; and has absolutely zero margin for losing anything.  Very much like a below average speed cornerback making up for it with savvy; literally can't afford to lose a step.  However, in hindsight, he definitely shouldn't have pitched so soon after flu; have to write 1 or 2 of last 3 starts off to that.  I believe he deserves 1 more start, but another bad outing and you have to replace him in rotation.

Before next year, I think the Padres need to do 2 things:  1)  Sign Headley to an extension, and 2) Allocate the 11 MM going to Richard & Volquez (+more as needed) towards a top of the rotation starter by FA or trade.  THAT IS IT.  All other improvement can come from within.  Can't have your choice of "#1" starter be between the MLB leaders in walks & HR's given up!  I think it's imperative next year to have a TRUE # 1 type to take the pressure off of what will be an extremely young but talented rotation next year... not fair to ask Luebke or whoever else to be the #1.   Headley's raise would be dramatic, but others on roster are mostly modest/manageable.  I have "rolling" payroll right now at 71 Million.  Could field an extremely competitive team next year with very little turnover for 85 MM.  Realistic?

Finally, I have noticed for the last 6 months that with our extremely "tight" roster that we are well positioned to do a reverse of the Latos trade; we acquire a good starter, but give up 3 or 4 players on or soon to be on the 40-man roster.  Of course, who do you give up.  The value of some guys still to be determined, and would probably have to sacrifice a top 10 system SP prospect in this type of deal.
Don't see much on next years' FA market that would qualify as a #1 going forward...maybe not even a #2....whoever is the best will be way over priced.  The trade approach seems the better option IF the Padres had a bundle of blue chip prospects to deal that were anywhere near ML ready. Keep in mind that for Latos the Padres got Volquez already a "successful" MLer, Alonso and Grandal both blue chippers and ML ready, and Boxberger.  Problem is that the Padres don't have top 100 types who are healthy in AA/AAA...and clearly short on bats. The could move some of the prospects for pitching...but would most likely get a mid-rotation type.  So the best option to get a top of the rotation type (even just a "potential" top of the rotation type) is trading off the 25 man roster....other than Headley not sure who could get that type of return.  Getting a true top of the rotation type is a great objective.....just don't see that working out for 2014.  Padres will probably will have to wait to see if Fried, Wisler, J.Ross, or one of the other prospects develop into that role in a few years....until then hope the other prospects (Smith, Roach, Erlin, et. al.) can give them a solid base of five mid-rotation starters.

I would want them to really extend their comfort zone to re-sign Headley but basically start the mega switch from aging veteran SP (Volquez, Richard, Marquis, Stults) to prospects...take the short run ups and downs with prospects for the future.  Luebke, Erlin, Smith, Roach, Wieland, Andriese, Bass, Ross, Cashner are all at that stage where ML time seems reasonable.  Wisler and Portillo are not far behind.
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Posted: 05/05/2013 1:41 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



brianmcon wrote:
Before next year, I think the Padres need to do 2 things:  1)  Sign Headley to an extension, and 2) Allocate the 11 MM going to Richard & Volquez (+more as needed) towards a top of the rotation starter by FA or trade.  THAT IS IT.  All other improvement can come from within.  Can't have your choice of "#1" starter be between the MLB leaders in walks & HR's given up!  I think it's imperative next year to have a TRUE # 1 type to take the pressure off of what will be an extremely young but talented rotation next year... not fair to ask Luebke or whoever else to be the #1.   Headley's raise would be dramatic, but others on roster are mostly modest/manageable.  I have "rolling" payroll right now at 71 Million.  Could field an extremely competitive team next year with very little turnover for 85 MM.  Realistic?


I will go on record as saying neither one of these things are going to happen...and as I've said before, I base this on the way the current ownership group / FO have operated up to present...big contracts [over $10M] and big FA signs haven't happened, and they're not going to with the status quo...plus, and Byrnes has said this publically, they aren't going to make wholesale trades of prospects...this makes sense, because their philosophy is develop kids, ride them until they become too expensive, then trade them / let them walk...this is what this ownership / FO has done to this day, and until they do / prove otherwise, there is no reason to believe they will do business any other way...
it's baseball economics...if the team spends to revenue...we're going to see an $80M payroll top of the mark...a figure that simply does not support a contract to one player in the $15-20M a season [much less two, if you count the FA pitcher mentioned]...
to support just one player [Headley] with that sort of contract, a payroll number of
$95-100M or more has to be in play... is there anyone here who really thinks the current ownership group is going to bring the payroll number to that level within the next two years?...
this is why I've gone on record as saying Chase Headley is a goner...there are so many reasons...the situation described above...and even if they gave CH his contract, it would force the team into a inflexible roster situation for the duration of the contract...essentially putting the team into the situation of surrounding a rose with crap, and that for as many years they are tied to that contract, and let's not even go into an injury / lack of performance situation...why would a guy sign up for that when he could move to a organization with the resources to realistically support his contract with the team, and one that has a chance to win?...
it's time for Padres fans here and elsewhere to wake up and face reality...as far as the new ownership is concerned...meet the new boss, same as the old boss...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....

Last edited 05/05/2013 2:00 PM by stevin

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Posted: 05/05/2013 2:06 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



FENN68 wrote: Richard to the DL with "intestinal virus" or something like that...being sent to a "specialist"...that will give him a couple of weeks to work out the mechanics.

Ross up....but probably as a RP...still don't want him trying to hit.


thought something was going on...a guy like Richard doesn't just go off the rails just like that...
as for having to add Ross...you know things are bad when you have to bring back a guy who will probably hurt himself the next time he swings a bat in a game...not to mention the fact the guy belongs in the minors so he can learn how to pitch...look for Bass to take Richard's spot...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....

Last edited 05/05/2013 2:08 PM by stevin

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Posted: 05/05/2013 3:22 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Gyorko and Venable back to back jacks...
Gyorko's was a bomb...like this kid more and more...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....
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Posted: 05/05/2013 4:16 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


nice win...
Crazy Eddie throws another good game...bully, who has done great work so far this season, finishes up smartly...
offense supplies enough...Headley, Gyorko, and Venable leading the way...
it's nice to see a player develop before your eyes like Yonder Alonso is...not only at the plate, but defensively and as a leader...you can see it coming together..
Padres 8-3 after that 5-15 start....

Miami coming in...a chance to get some wins against a team that's not very good...
disclaimer: what I write here is my opinion...and is not meant to anger, disturb, harass, annoy, upset, provoke, or otherwise harsh your mellow....

Last edited 05/05/2013 5:56 PM by stevin

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Posted: 05/06/2013 5:59 AM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Some speculation that with a couple of scheduled off days in the next two weeks the Padres may be able to avoid using a 5th SP until just before Richard is due off the DL.
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  • brianmcon
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Posted: 05/06/2013 8:03 AM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



stevin wrote:
FENN68 wrote: Richard to the DL with "intestinal virus" or something like that...being sent to a "specialist"...that will give him a couple of weeks to work out the mechanics.

Ross up....but probably as a RP...still don't want him trying to hit.


thought something was going on...a guy like Richard doesn't just go off the rails just like that...
as for having to add Ross...you know things are bad when you have to bring back a guy who will probably hurt himself the next time he swings a bat in a game...not to mention the fact the guy belongs in the minors so he can learn how to pitch...look for Bass to take Richard's spot...
+1!  How much more obvious can it be that he should be starting at AAA (with DH or when able to hit).  Hopefully he's down in 2 weeks with a healthy Richard back.  Illness gives hope he recovers past form.
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  • brianmcon
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Posted: 05/06/2013 12:13 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 



FENN68 wrote:
brianmcon wrote:
FENN68 wrote:
stevin wrote: there has to be something going on physically with Clayton Richard...
or emotionally.  When you look back at his performance over the past four years.....a model of consistency with an ERA of around 4.00 and chewing up innings.  This year he is regressed in almost all aspects of pitching....walks / strikeouts / innings / HRs....basically a complete breakdown.  Given his reputed "work ethic" and attention to detail...at 29 with over 4 years of ML consistency .... hard to fathom.  Looks like he lost about a MPH off his pitches but the key is he lost total command / control...that would seem to be mechanics...with his experience (baring injury) that is something that has a chance be corrected.
No one on the Pads works harder than Clay Richard.  He's a model for approaching the game the right way.  I believe Pads have seriously considered extending him.... Thank God they didn't.  The problem with guys like him is that he is out-working everyone on the team to maximize his limited ability; and has absolutely zero margin for losing anything.  Very much like a below average speed cornerback making up for it with savvy; literally can't afford to lose a step.  However, in hindsight, he definitely shouldn't have pitched so soon after flu; have to write 1 or 2 of last 3 starts off to that.  I believe he deserves 1 more start, but another bad outing and you have to replace him in rotation.

Before next year, I think the Padres need to do 2 things:  1)  Sign Headley to an extension, and 2) Allocate the 11 MM going to Richard & Volquez (+more as needed) towards a top of the rotation starter by FA or trade.  THAT IS IT.  All other improvement can come from within.  Can't have your choice of "#1" starter be between the MLB leaders in walks & HR's given up!  I think it's imperative next year to have a TRUE # 1 type to take the pressure off of what will be an extremely young but talented rotation next year... not fair to ask Luebke or whoever else to be the #1.   Headley's raise would be dramatic, but others on roster are mostly modest/manageable.  I have "rolling" payroll right now at 71 Million.  Could field an extremely competitive team next year with very little turnover for 85 MM.  Realistic?

Finally, I have noticed for the last 6 months that with our extremely "tight" roster that we are well positioned to do a reverse of the Latos trade; we acquire a good starter, but give up 3 or 4 players on or soon to be on the 40-man roster.  Of course, who do you give up.  The value of some guys still to be determined, and would probably have to sacrifice a top 10 system SP prospect in this type of deal.
1)  Don't see much on next years' FA market that would qualify as a #1 going forward...maybe not even a #2....whoever is the best will be way over priced.  The trade approach seems the better option IF the Padres had a bundle of blue chip prospects to deal that were anywhere near ML ready. 2)  Keep in mind that for Latos the Padres got Volquez already a "successful" MLer, Alonso and Grandal both blue chippers and ML ready, and Boxberger.  Problem is that the Padres don't have top 100 types who are healthy in AA/AAA...and clearly short on bats. The could move some of the prospects for pitching...but would most likely get a mid-rotation type.  So the best option to get a top of the rotation type (even just a "potential" top of the rotation type) is trading off the 25 man roster....other than Headley not sure who could get that type of return.  Getting a true top of the rotation type is a great objective.....just don't see that working out for 2014.  Padres will probably will have to wait to see if Fried, Wisler, J.Ross, 3) or one of the other prospects develop into that role in a few years....until then hope the other prospects (Smith, Roach, Erlin, et. al.) can give them a solid base of five mid-rotation starters.

I would want them to really extend their comfort zone to re-sign Headley but basically start the mega switch from aging veteran SP (Volquez, Richard, Marquis, Stults) to prospects...take the short run ups and downs with prospects for the future.  Luebke, Erlin, Smith, Roach, Wieland, Andriese, Bass, Ross, Cashner are all at that stage where ML time seems reasonable.  Wisler and Portillo are not far behind.
  Preface)  Padres new front office made a fundamental "compete now" shift by re-upping Quentin, Street, Maybin, Hundley, & Luebke.   They believed in young players potential end of 2011, and the veterans' contributions to the 2nd 1/2 team last year.   Since only Hundley has any trade value at the moment, you really can't undo these collective moves... i.e. "youth movement".   In light of these moves having already been done, a Headley extension really makes sense; it will overlap all of these contracts.

  1)  I agree completely!  If Volquez is up/down but healthy all year, he is going to cost over 10 MM/yr for 2-3 yrs.  If Richard rights the ship to some extent which is likely, he will get 7-8 MM in 3rd yr Arb.  Kuroda got 15 MM for 1 yr, look how awful Edwin Jackson, Joe Saunders have been, etc etc...  A trade is the way to go.  I was pointing out that Padres can replace 11 MM in 2012 SP salary plus 3.5 MM buyouts (Hudson & Bartlett) or almost 15 MM in 2013 by getting ONE guy somehow we would all by consensus consider superior to either Volquez or Richard, while a young minimum salary pitcher takes the other spot.  Another way of looking at it is that you're going to spend at least half of the $ next year anyway just to keep Volquez or Richard.

2)  Latos wasn't even Arb eligible yet, which is why he "cost" so much in prospects.  As per above & with our overloaded 40-man roster + potential roster additions, I believe we are in a position now to make a "quantity for quality" type trade for an established SP that is now or will get too expensive to current non-contender with 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 years of control remaining.  This scenario is simply not going to command what Latos did in return, especially if trading team is clearing significant salary.  The idea is to have an established Quality veteran at top of rotation to take pressure off very young staff in 2013.
We could get this for:  Marquis, Portillo, Boxberger, Darnell   etc, etc, etc...
I don't follow the whole league in deep detail.  But what about David Price?  Others who fit?

3)  I agree we have eventual candidates; Luebke first & foremost.  But the injuries have delayed the timetable 1 yr+ for him & many other guys.  I believe the value of top end starters is massively undervalued; it's like # 3 or # 4 hitters; they allow the others in the rotation to really pitch where they belong, save bullpens long term by consistently going deep, basically can't win in the playoffs without them, etc.

In 2013 we desparately need(ed) Volquez & Richard to simply get through the year.
In 2014 we could have:  Cashner, Ross, Luebke, Wieland, Erlin, Kelly, Roach, B. Smith, Andriese, De Paula, Oramas  ALL competing for starting spots!  Seems counter-intuitive, but I believe we need a quality vet because of how inexperienced they are; all < 2 full yrs in majors.  I don't see how next year for example it makes sense for Jason Marquis to be that veteran.  But new guy + bold above + returning position players?!  = Competitive!!
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Posted: 05/06/2013 1:54 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


Maybe a better comparison is what KC had to trade to get James Shields (all-star SP, 1 yr plus option) and Wade Davis (good prospect but not a track record as a SP, 2 yrs plus three options).  They had to deal Will Myers, a top 5 prospect and MiL player of the year in AAA; Jake Odorizzi, top 50 pitching prospect in AA/AAA); plus two other prospects.

Padres have nothing in AA/AAA that comes even close to that quality of prospects....so if nothing else...quite a few teams could easily out bid the Padres for any top of the rotation starter hitting the market.

As for Price...he will have two more years of control...is a Cy Young winner...and is already making $10.11MM so it would not be unreasonable to expect him $15-20MM in 2014 and around $20MM in 2015.  TB will make Price available but he will go to a "big money team" who can (and will) sign him long-term to justify trading the cream of their MiL system....LAD? LAA? Tex?......not S.D.

The idea of getting that veteran top of the rotation is good....just the Padres don't have the trading chips even if Byrnes was willing to deal the top prospects (which he is not).
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Posted: 05/06/2013 2:20 PM

Re: Gameday Thread: May 2013 


I'm afraid the only way we are able to sign Headley long term is if we rely on our young SP's coming up and if we "don't" replace Volquez and/or Richard with a high priced Starter.
If we sign Chase,our rotation next season will more than likely include 5 pitchers already on the roster........or possibly one guy who comes cheaply like Marquis did this year.
I suspect a rotation something like:
Luebke
Cashner
Stultz
Bass
Erlin/Wieland/Kelly

Now,that could all change if we trade Chase....as there will probably be a starter included in any return for him.





Prospect I'm Championing.........Jordan Paroubeck

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