I think Luis Mendoza deserves to be the 5 starter, hoch to the pen, Chen to long relief

Maybe if hoch could just fire away in the pen and ramp up his fastball a la crow, he could be effective

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------

Fine. Don't bring him in w/runners on. He starts an inning or comes in mid-inning based empty.

nick05 wrote: We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

I say do it for the comedic value.

WilliamofOckham wrote:

nick05 wrote: We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

I say do it for the comedic value.

Only if Hoch agrees to use Yakety Sax (Benny Hill theme music) as his intro to increase said comedic value.

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------

Fine. Don't bring him in w/runners on. He starts an inning or comes in mid-inning based empty.

OK, but I just don't see the wisdom in wasting a roster spot (and four or five million bucks) on a reliever who's a "bases-empty specialist".

The whole idea is that if Hoch could just focus on blowing people away in a relief role, he might become a better pitcher like Crow. Obviously it doesn't work if he is still the same pitcher but if he is able to dial up his fastball to 97 or 98 along with his curve, he could be very dominant.

That article is not great by any means. I feel cheated.

'The Royals retained Guthrie with a three-year deal, leaving the No. 5 spot open to competition among Bruce Chen, Luke Hochevar and young Will Smith, with veteran right-hander Guillermo Moscoso a sleeper.'

What is Luis Mendoza? Chopped liver?

wilson123 wrote: The whole idea is that if Hoch could just focus on blowing people away in a relief role, he might become a better pitcher like Crow. Obviously it doesn't work if he is still the same pitcher but if he is able to dial up his fastball to 97 or 98 along with his curve, he could be very dominant.

If you substituted almost any other pitcher's name for Hochevar, I'd agree with you.  I just think that with men on, he'd be dialing up 97-98 mph fastballs right down the middle when men are on base. 

I've never doubted his raw talent, when he decides to look good, he looks great, so long as no one hits a bloop single.   

In fact, whenever people start going on about player's mental states (I know you didn't bring that up, I did), I always get kind of pissed as Hochevar immediately comes to mind.  If you or I are frazzled at work, yeah, that's excuseable, but he gets paid millions of dollars to pitch a baseball.

mpf8888 wrote: That article is not great by any means. I feel cheated.

Agreed. Not very well written, and basically just a summary of who's on our team now.

---------------------------------------------
--- greewe wrote:

mpf8888 wrote: That article is not great by any means. I feel cheated.

Agreed. Not very well written, and basically just a summary of who's on our team now.

---------------------------------------------

Could have been just as effective if they had posted the 40 man roster.
Que WheelingEagle

Wonder if DM regrets offering arbitration to Luke. I do think he will get dealt by end of ST. He will have highest trade value with his "potential " and someone will bite. KC has at least 4 options in Chen, Mendoza, Smith & Moscoso. Can't see Hochevar as a LR or high leverage guy with KC 's current pen. Too expensive and doesn't have the makeup.

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------

Fine. Don't bring him in w/runners on. He starts an inning or comes in mid-inning based empty.

OK, but I just don't see the wisdom in wasting a roster spot (and four or five million bucks) on a reliever who's a "bases-empty specialist".

---------------------------------------------

I don't disagree w/you a bit there. Just think they're gonna keep him regardless. Perhaps in that role we minimize the damage.

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------

Fine. Don't bring him in w/runners on. He starts an inning or comes in mid-inning based empty.

OK, but I just don't see the wisdom in wasting a roster spot (and four or five million bucks) on a reliever who's a "bases-empty specialist".

---------------------------------------------

I don't disagree w/you a bit there. Just think they're gonna keep him regardless. Perhaps in that role we minimize the damage.

I think the only option for that is off the roster.  I realize you're assuming the Royals keep him until they've explored every use of him (a good assumption that I agree with).  The Royals could try him as a reliever, and I don't doubt that they will if they owe him $4 million.  But, his woes with runners on base and pitching from the stretch are not qualities you want in a reliever.  His mechanics change when pitching from the stretch, so throwing harder probably isn't going to help much. 

I really hope they just cut him lose if he doesn't cut it as a starter.  Even if he does become a decent reliever, there's no way you pay him $6-7 million or whatever he'd make in arbitration the following year (i.e., more money than probably all of our young relievers make combined).  Nonetheless, none of us thought it was a good idea to pay him $4 million, so I should probably not give them any ideas

It is time consuming to dally with a Cinderella theme with Hoch. He's had his shot.  Give him a real tight leash.  He is expendable. Mendoza and Chen are good alternatives. Morosco doesn't have a solid track record in the AL and appears to be a bit more heart than talent. I'd stay with Mendoza.

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

COroyal wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- nick05 wrote:

We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

---------------------------------------------

Fine. Don't bring him in w/runners on. He starts an inning or comes in mid-inning based empty.

OK, but I just don't see the wisdom in wasting a roster spot (and four or five million bucks) on a reliever who's a "bases-empty specialist".

---------------------------------------------

I don't disagree w/you a bit there. Just think they're gonna keep him regardless. Perhaps in that role we minimize the damage.

OK, we're cool. I understand that, one of DM's most non-redeeming qualities.

---------------------------------------------
--- ElChupanibre wrote:

WilliamofOckham wrote:

nick05 wrote: We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

I say do it for the comedic value.

Only if Hoch agrees to use Yakety Sax (Benny Hill theme music) as his intro to increase said comedic value.

---------------------------------------------

They could also play it when they show the replay of his 4 run inning while they speed up the tape. Damn I wish they'd do that. It'd make keeping Hoch less painful.

steadyd wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- ElChupanibre wrote:

WilliamofOckham wrote:

nick05 wrote: We've been over this in another thread. Look up Hoch's numbers with runners on, especially in scoring position. The guy flat sucks pitching from the stretch.

I say do it for the comedic value.

Only if Hoch agrees to use Yakety Sax (Benny Hill theme music) as his intro to increase said comedic value.

---------------------------------------------

They could also play it when they show the replay of his 4 run inning while they speed up the tape. Damn I wish they'd do that. It'd make keeping Hoch less painful.

To be fair, that music makes everything pretty awesome.