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The Final Piece of 201---- DH

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Posted: 1/26/2013 12:14 PM

The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


My choice is Jim Thome!!!  He a crowd draw and I feel he still has a year or two left in his torrid bat. What's your take??
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Posted: 1/26/2013 1:25 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



bayside123 wrote: My choice is Jim Thome!!!  He a crowd draw and I feel he still has a year or two left in his torrid bat. What's your take??
I've given my say on this and I agree with you.  I feel Thome and provide a spark as our DH.  As you said he would help some with attendance and he would also bring in more veteran leadership to a relatively young team.  That's not a knock against Hafner, just that I believe Thome would be a better choice.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 1:48 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


+1 to both of you 

If the organization decides to go this route I vote Thome although latest indications are they may just decide to do a rotational thing with several position players to feel  this need.

Couple more 2-3 then playball spring spring training games.
BrianBell wrote:
bayside123 wrote: My choice is Jim Thome!!!  He a crowd draw and I feel he still has a year or two left in his torrid bat. What's your take??
I've given my say on this and I agree with you.  I feel Thome and provide a spark as our DH.  As you said he would help some with attendance and he would also bring in more veteran leadership to a relatively young team.  That's not a knock against Hafner, just that I believe Thome would be a better choice.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 2:00 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


Sigh! It's sad that we can't part from our broken down washed up old heroes and move on.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 2:01 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


I'm on board with this move.  As mentioned by BB, I like the veteran leadership he brings to the club as well.  Let's sign him and move on to other needs.  I'm looking forward to heading out to AZ in late March.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 2:06 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



ChiefWahoo1948 wrote: I'm on board with this move.  As mentioned by BB, I like the veteran leadership he brings to the club as well.  Let's sign him and move on to other needs.  I'm looking forward to heading out to AZ in late March.

Veteran leadership? What the hell is Swisher? Reynolds? What are you looking for - a team of veteran leaders? How many do you need on one team?
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Posted: 1/26/2013 2:10 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



TitoFrancona wrote:
ChiefWahoo1948 wrote: I'm on board with this move.  As mentioned by BB, I like the veteran leadership he brings to the club as well.  Let's sign him and move on to other needs.  I'm looking forward to heading out to AZ in late March.

Veteran leadership? What the hell is Swisher? Reynolds? What are you looking for - a team of veteran leaders? How many do you need on one team?
Swisher and Reynolds have years under their belts but are they really leaders?  I like to thinks that Swisher is but I do not know about Reynolds.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 2:14 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



ChiefWahoo1948 wrote:
Swisher and Reynolds have years under their belts but are they really leaders?  I like to thinks that Swisher is but I do not know about Reynolds.

Do you really think a guy who will spend half the season on the DL is going to provide any leadership? I think you're just trying to find any reason at all to bring back a one time hero.

He was here 2 years ago and didn't make a damn bit of difference. Why would you think he will now at 42? I don't want Hafner back either but at least he's 7 years younger.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 3:22 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



TitoFrancona wrote:
ChiefWahoo1948 wrote:
Swisher and Reynolds have years under their belts but are they really leaders?  I like to thinks that Swisher is but I do not know about Reynolds.

Do you really think a guy who will spend half the season on the DL is going to provide any leadership? I think you're just trying to find any reason at all to bring back a one time hero.

He was here 2 years ago and didn't make a bit of difference. Why would you think he will now at 42? I don't want Hafner back either but at least he's 7 years younger.
He did in my book. The Jake hasn't jumped like it did when Thome returned since 07. The fan in me is all in, 100% with bringing Jimmy back. Might as well squeeze out every ounce of the 90s magic we can.


The GM in me is torn. Obviously he's a DL risk but he did post a .786 OPS last year, including .854 in Philly.

The way I see it, if we're going to go DH by committee anyway, what does it hurt to rotate Jim in and out? If he hits the DL, so what? We were gonna rotate guys anyway noidea


So yeah, I say bring him back.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 5:15 PM

RE: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


With regret losing the last man on the 40 man roster is worth more than Thome or Hafner at this point in time.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 5:17 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



TitoFrancona wrote:

Do you really think a guy who will spend half the season on the DL is going to provide any leadership? I think you're just trying to find any reason at all to bring back a one time hero.

He was here 2 years ago and didn't make a damn bit of difference. Why would you think he will now at 42? I don't want Hafner back either but at least he's 7 years younger.
The Indians were too far out for Thome to make a huge difference in the won/lose column, but he definitely made a difference in the clubhouse with the younger players and also provided a nice boost to the attendance numbers.  Keep in mind that the when the Indians added Thome, they were 6 games out with 22 games to go.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 5:32 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



BrianBell wrote:
TitoFrancona wrote:

Do you really think a guy who will spend half the season on the DL is going to provide any leadership? I think you're just trying to find any reason at all to bring back a one time hero.

He was here 2 years ago and didn't make a damn bit of difference. Why would you think he will now at 42? I don't want Hafner back either but at least he's 7 years younger.
The Indians were too far out for Thome to make a huge difference in the won/lose column, but he definitely made a difference in the clubhouse with the younger players and also provided a nice boost to the attendance numbers.  Keep in mind that the when the Indians added Thome, they were 6 games out with 22 games to go.
Thome was acquired with 35 games to go.  He might have boosted attendance when they had the Jim Thome appreciation night and the first game after he was acquired, but other than that attendance was average.  I like how he "made a huge difference in the clubhouse", but they Indians were 17-18 with him and were awful last year.  He must have made a lasting impression.  Of course Thome missed 14 of those 35 games because he can't play many games and a row and is constantly hurt...

Last edited 1/26/2013 5:33 PM by indiansfan1234

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Posted: 1/26/2013 5:50 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



indiansfan1234 wrote:
Thome was acquired with 35 games to go.  He might have boosted attendance when they had the Jim Thome appreciation night and the first game after he was acquired, but other than that attendance was average.  I like how he "made a huge difference in the clubhouse", but they Indians were 17-18 with him and were awful last year.  He must have made a lasting impression.  Of course Thome missed 14 of those 35 games because he can't play many games and a row and is constantly hurt...

Exactly. I'm perplexed where anybody can claim they have seen positive proof that Thome provided veteran leadership in his short stint in Cleveland and as you said, other than that one night, he didn't help sell ticket sales.

And any peak in attendance they might have if they sign Thome, will be very short lived.

Some of us just can't seem to move on.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 5:56 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



indiansfan1234 wrote:
BrianBell wrote:
TitoFrancona wrote:

Do you really think a guy who will spend half the season on the DL is going to provide any leadership? I think you're just trying to find any reason at all to bring back a one time hero.

He was here 2 years ago and didn't make a damn bit of difference. Why would you think he will now at 42? I don't want Hafner back either but at least he's 7 years younger.
The Indians were too far out for Thome to make a huge difference in the won/lose column, but he definitely made a difference in the clubhouse with the younger players and also provided a nice boost to the attendance numbers.  Keep in mind that the when the Indians added Thome, they were 6 games out with 22 games to go.
Thome was acquired with 35 games to go.  He might have boosted attendance when they had the Jim Thome appreciation night and the first game after he was acquired, but other than that attendance was average.  I like how he "made a huge difference in the clubhouse", but they Indians were 17-18 with him and were awful last year.  He must have made a lasting impression.  Of course Thome missed 14 of those 35 games because he can't play many games and a row and is constantly hurt...
You're right on when they acquired him, he played in 22 games.  And if you want to get technical about it, the 17-18 record was an improvement over the 35 games prior to Thome's addition as the Indians only had a 14-21 mark in the 35 games prior to the trade.

As for him helping the clubhouse, I'm just going off of what he was in the media.  He was helping the younger hitters on the team according to most of the media close to the Indians.  And let's keep in mind the disaster that was the 2012 season falls a lot more on the pitching than the hitting.  What type of advice is Thome going to give a pitcher exactly?

And of course Thome missed 13 of the 35 games he played in (roughly 40%).  Play that out over a full season and that comes out to about 100 games played, right in line with our former DH.  I don't think anyone here supporting adding Thome expects him to play much more than 300-350 plate appearances.  Anything more than that would be considered a bonus.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 6:02 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



BrianBell wrote:
You're right on when they acquired him, he played in 22 games.  And if you want to get technical about it, the 17-18 record was an improvement over the 35 games prior to Thome's addition as the Indians only had a 14-21 mark in the 35 games prior to the trade.

As for him helping the clubhouse, I'm just going off of what he was in the media.  He was helping the younger hitters on the team according to most of the media close to the Indians.  And let's keep in mind the disaster that was the 2012 season falls a lot more on the pitching than the hitting.  What type of advice is Thome going to give a pitcher exactly?

And of course Thome missed 13 of the 35 games he played in (roughly 40%).  Play that out over a full season and that comes out to about 100 games played, right in line with our former DH.  I don't think anyone here supporting adding Thome expects him to play much more than 300-350 plate appearances.  Anything more than that would be considered a bonus.
He won't come close. And again, how many veteran leaders do you want on 1 team? Of course, I no longer live in Cleveland, but I never read oanywhere,  where he was a factor in helping any of our young players.

And if he were such a major factor in helping our young players, I would think the Indians would be trying to convince him to be a player-coach.

Last edited 1/26/2013 6:04 PM by TitoFrancona

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Posted: 1/26/2013 6:21 PM

RE: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


Whether or not you're for or against Thome, there is no validity in the argument that we have or will have too much veteran leadership.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 6:42 PM

RE: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



mooseahoy wrote: Whether or not you're for or against Thome, there is no validity in the argument that we have or will have too much veteran leadership.
And conversely, there's no validity to state we don't have enough.

The point I'm making is there's no reason to sign Thome or Hafner or any other veteran for their supposed leadership qualities.

Last edited 1/26/2013 6:43 PM by TitoFrancona

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Posted: 1/26/2013 7:19 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



TitoFrancona wrote:
BrianBell wrote:
You're right on when they acquired him, he played in 22 games.  And if you want to get technical about it, the 17-18 record was an improvement over the 35 games prior to Thome's addition as the Indians only had a 14-21 mark in the 35 games prior to the trade.

As for him helping the clubhouse, I'm just going off of what he was in the media.  He was helping the younger hitters on the team according to most of the media close to the Indians.  And let's keep in mind the disaster that was the 2012 season falls a lot more on the pitching than the hitting.  What type of advice is Thome going to give a pitcher exactly?

And of course Thome missed 13 of the 35 games he played in (roughly 40%).  Play that out over a full season and that comes out to about 100 games played, right in line with our former DH.  I don't think anyone here supporting adding Thome expects him to play much more than 300-350 plate appearances.  Anything more than that would be considered a bonus.
He won't come close. And again, how many veteran leaders do you want on 1 team? Of course, I no longer live in Cleveland, but I never read oanywhere,  where he was a factor in helping any of our young players.

And if he were such a major factor in helping our young players, I would think the Indians would be trying to convince him to be a player-coach.
And AGAIN you can never have enough veteran leadership.  It's clear by the moves made this off-season, the Indians are trying to compete for the immediate future.  You can never have enough players on your roster that have been to the postseason. 

And I heard mention made on several Indians radio broadcasts in the weeks after he was acquired in 2011 how he was more than willing to help the younger hitters on this team passing on his knowledge.  There was never any mention of any specific players.

As for the player-coach thing, who knows if they haven't?  Do you know?  Because I sure don't.
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Posted: 1/26/2013 8:07 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 


And AGAIN you can never have enough veteran leadership

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sure you can. when broken down vets start pushing out promising youngsters, then you have too much "veteran leadership."
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Posted: 1/26/2013 8:31 PM

Re: The Final Piece of 201---- DH 



buddy34 wrote: And AGAIN you can never have enough veteran leadership

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sure you can. when broken down vets start pushing out promising youngsters, then you have too much "veteran leadership."

I agree.

My hope is they give McGuinnis and whomever a fair shot at winning the job. If they don't, they can always rotate the DH role. They also will very likely be able to sign someone like Hafner or Thome during or even after spring training. There just isn't much of a market for either player so far as I can tell.
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