Our boy BP got screwed over. Darwin Barney winning a gold glove? Get the **** out.

If Phillips's defensive performance in 2012 was not GG worthy, then they should just quit giving out the award .

Voter boredom

My friend is a Cubs fan and said Barney simply deserved it because of that errorless streak he had. It's not all about fielding percentage. Phillips turned countless amount of singles into outs. He's on the damn Sportscenter Top 10 every freakin' day. Fay says he thinks Phillips' attitude didn't help him. I hope that's not the case because it shouldn't factor into the Gold Glove at all. He was a magician this year, like every year, and I agree that they just wanted to give it to someone new.

Dunno Barney was pretty good...almost all metrics pointed to Barney if you believe in those kind of things...

I'm no less certain he deserved the GG because he didn't win than I would be had he won. I'd be willing to bet, neither is he. Barney can have the trophy. I'll take the best 2B in the game.

Barney didn't make errors and his sabermetric bull**** looks good because he doesn't get to half the balls BP does. BP deserved a gold glove more than anyone in the game.

Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

I think you are sort of right.  BP isnt necessarily a hot dog in my book.  He is out there having fun staying loose not the prototypical infielder. get in front of it grab it with two hands style.  He makes plays outside the box because of the style that he plays.  I do think some of the older ( not saying you are old)  crowd would agree with you that he is a hot dog.  He probably did lose votes to that. The thing you cant discount is even if he is a hot dog he makes alot of plays that no one else makes and still ends the years with very few errors.

2001MUgrad wrote: Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

I am both old and old school, however, I really don't consider BP a hotdog by today's standards. Sure he grabs popups with a one hand snatch but the only Reds player that uses two hands is Ludwick and there aren't very many on other teams that use two hands. Yes, he is apt to stand and admire his homeruns a bit longer that I like but so do many other players. 

2001MUgrad wrote: Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

I don't know if I believe that Jim Edmonds added unneeded "flare" to his plays or not but there are a lot if people that do. Given that, as well as the undisputed fact that he was an arrogant asshat...in a world where he can win 6 straight GGs I don't know if I think it was completely political that BP didn't win. Just a boneheaded oversight IMO.

Although I'd rather it be political than metric. That would be very disappointing. Given the time I can find the right mix of saber metrics to make a convincing argument that the world is flat.

If i can ask what does the DC stand for in your screenname?

DCillini wrote: I am both old and old school, however, I really don't consider BP a hotdog by today's standards. Sure he grabs popups with a one hand snatch but the only Reds player that uses two hands is Ludwick and there aren't very many on other teams that use two hands. Yes, he is apt to stand and admire his homeruns a bit longer that I like but so do many other players. 

2001MUgrad wrote: Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

This is an aspect of sports that I will never understand.

These guys are part of the .0000001% of the population that gets to play a kid's game for a living but if you outwardly show you actually enjoy yourself while doing it, you are labeled a "hot dog" or "you don't respect the game" or "you don't take your job serious".

to go one step further. BP practices those plays for hours and hours.  Ive heard that he takes more ground balls than anyone on the team and when he is taking them they are all in the hole.

OhioRaiderNation wrote: This is an aspect of sports that I will never understand.

These guys are part of the .0000001% of the population that gets to play a kid's game for a living but if you outwardly show you actually enjoy yourself while doing it, you are labeled a "hot dog" or "you don't respect the game" or "you don't take your job serious".

mattd149 - no problem, until two years ago I lived and worked in the Washington, DC area for about 10 years. Then, I retired and moved back to Illinois (which I consider home even though I grew up in Cincinnati); fortunately, I live within 4 hours of GABP so I am now able to get to a bunch of games every year.

mattd149 wrote: If i can ask what does the DC stand for in your screenname?

DCillini wrote: I am both old and old school, however, I really don't consider BP a hotdog by today's standards. Sure he grabs popups with a one hand snatch but the only Reds player that uses two hands is Ludwick and there aren't very many on other teams that use two hands. Yes, he is apt to stand and admire his homeruns a bit longer that I like but so do many other players. 

2001MUgrad wrote: Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

While I didn't sit and watch Barney play all year, I know he can't make the plays BP makes consistently. Politics? Metrics? How about market size? Terrible, jus ter...

Cool. I live just outside of champaign andhave visited cincinnati yearly since i was born. Figures it meant washington but thought i would just ask. Go Illini

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--- DCillini wrote:

mattd149 - no problem, until two years ago I lived and worked in the Washington, DC area for about 10 years. Then, I retired and moved back to Illinois (which I consider home even though I grew up in Cincinnati); fortunately, I live within 4 hours of GABP so I am now able to get to a bunch of games every year.

mattd149 wrote: If i can ask what does the DC stand for in your screenname?

DCillini wrote: I am both old and old school, however, I really don't consider BP a hotdog by today's standards. Sure he grabs popups with a one hand snatch but the only Reds player that uses two hands is Ludwick and there aren't very many on other teams that use two hands. Yes, he is apt to stand and admire his homeruns a bit longer that I like but so do many other players. 

2001MUgrad wrote: Politics.  Too many people that matter on awards like this do not like his antics and he was punished.  I don't like his antics either.

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I'm not necessarily saying the Hot Dogging it.  But the crap with the Cardinals a couple years back.  Then his crap with Hughes this year.  Just anything to single himself out and make something about him.  Its really annoying.  He is a good ballplayer, no doubt about it.  But he is hardly Joe Morgan.  If he was half as good as he thought he was.

Amen.  Joe Morgan was, in a word, awesome.  In every aspect of the game, a gentleman, gold gloves, batting ave. rbi, homers, stolen bases, OBP, MVP, clutch player.  IMHO, the best second baseman since 1958, which is when I started watching.  I doubt there was anyone better than him before that, but I cannot say.

BP gets all tied up in BP. Runs well when he wants to. Steals bases when the mood hits him.  Stands off the base and starts rapping with his buddies, and gets tagged out. He was accused of ordering room service to deliver alcohol to Josh Hamilton's room bc he was jealous of all the attention Hamilton was getting. Obviously, IDK if that is true, but I heard that on MLB radio, and that is serious stuff. I believe you can enjoy playing the game, and still keep your head in it. 

Before I get the firing squad from board members, let me say, I am glad we have him.  He is very good. I just feel that he needs a firm handed manager.  For all we know, Dusty takes it behind closed doors, which is the right way to do it. Still, he is the best glove man at second base today, bar none.

2001MUgrad wrote: I'm not necessarily saying the Hot Dogging it.  But the crap with the Cardinals a couple years back.  Then his crap with Hughes this year.  Just anything to single himself out and make something about him.  Its really annoying.  He is a good ballplayer, no doubt about it.  But he is hardly Joe Morgan.  If he was half as good as he thought he was.

Theshadowman wrote:
BP gets all tied up in BP. Runs well when he wants to. Steals bases when the mood hits him.  Stands off the base and starts rapping with his buddies, and gets tagged out. He was accused of ordering room service to deliver alcohol to Josh Hamilton's room bc he was jealous of all the attention Hamilton was getting. Obviously, IDK if that is true, but I heard that on MLB radio, and that is serious stuff. I believe you can enjoy playing the game, and still keep your head in it. 

I know you don't like the guy but I don't think you are being fair at all in this post.

He has dealt with leg injuries the last couple years including a hamstring issue early this season, a calf issue toward the middle and a groin issue at the end of the season.  For a guy who is now in his 30s with good, not great, speed.  Even a minor leg injury would prevent him from stealing bases.

Yes, he got picked off talking to Jimmy Rollins once.  Rapping with his buddies?  Yikes.  BP has made countless heads up plays but those are forgotten because he's a "hot dog".

And shame on MLB radio for putting that Josh Hamilton story out there.  How does one prove definitively that something DID NOT happen?