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Polanco Sent to AAA

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Posted: 08/25/2014 6:39 AM

Polanco Sent to AAA 


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Posted: 08/25/2014 6:44 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


Pretty much what you stated last week.  Completely agreed.
#fringeprospect
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Posted: 08/25/2014 6:50 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


The Pittsburgh Pirates have reportedly optioned Gregory Polanco back to Triple-A Indianapolis.

According to Ken Rosenthal of Fox Sports, it does not appear to be a long-term move with rosters expanding Sept. 1.

Polanco is hitting .241 with six home runs and 30 RBIs in 64 games with the Pirates.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 7:39 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


In other words...." We admit fully that we have made a huge mistake this offseason in dealing with our 1B and RF situation. However, since we are still in playoff contention for the last wild card spot and fans are still spending money we don't care."

It was never fair to expect Polanco to come in and be a huge piece of this team mid season. It was also a huge failure to PLAN on him to be that piece.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 8:44 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


I don't think that Polanco was counted on to be a huge piece by the FO. To some on here and the media perhaps.   I think the front office felt that with Snider, Tabata, Polanco, Lambo, Gabby and even guys like Decker and Dickerson they would find a way to get production out of 1B and RF.  In hindsight you turned out to be right about those players not cutting the mustard.  That said, I don't think signing James Loney or Mark Reynolds would have been the right thing to do even in hindsight either. 

The pitching is where this team has faltered.  Morton and Liriano have both performed well below what was expected.  Without guys like Volquez, Locke and Worley this team would be with the Reds or even worse.  Grilli was horrific when he was here and what was brought in to bridge that gap has been worse. The organization's mishandling of the bullpen from not having depth to having guys in the wrong roles has been the team's biggest failure IMO.  Losing leads is why this team is not in first place.  It's not for a lack of offense.  
vinnybravo wrote: In other words...." We admit fully that we have made a huge mistake this offseason in dealing with our 1B and RF situation. However, since we are still in playoff contention for the last wild card spot and fans are still spending money we don't care."

It was never fair to expect Polanco to come in and be a huge piece of this team mid season. It was also a huge failure to PLAN on him to be that piece.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 8:52 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


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Posted: 08/25/2014 8:57 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 



abitoutside wrote: I don't think that Polanco was counted on to be a huge piece by the FO. .
Blocking Polanco was the #2 reason not to re-sign Byrd - with money being the #1 reason.  If Polanco was not in the system, I think the Pirates would have re-signed Byrd.  If Byrd was a Pirate for the full season, I'd imagine the Pirates would have won 3-5 games more.  Byrd has a 3.2 WAR this year.  Polanco's is 0.2, Tabata's is 0.0.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 9:22 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


Do you think Byrd would have signed for 1 year?  Do you want Polanco blocked for the next 2 years?  Would you trade for Byrd right now?  What would you give up to get him?
Sangue wrote:
abitoutside wrote: I don't think that Polanco was counted on to be a huge piece by the FO. .
Blocking Polanco was the #2 reason not to re-sign Byrd - with money being the #1 reason.  If Polanco was not in the system, I think the Pirates would have re-signed Byrd.  If Byrd was a Pirate for the full season, I'd imagine the Pirates would have won 3-5 games more.  Byrd has a 3.2 WAR this year.  Polanco's is 0.2, Tabata's is 0.0.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 9:31 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 





---------------------------------------------
--- abitoutside wrote:


I don't think that Polanco was counted on to be a huge piece by the FO. To some on here and the media perhaps.   I think the front office felt that with Snider, Tabata, Polanco, Lambo, Gabby and even guys like Decker and Dickerson they would find a way to get production out of 1B and RF.  In hindsight you turned out to be right about those players not cutting the mustard.  That said, I don't think signing James Loney or Mark Reynolds would have been the right thing to do even in hindsight either. 

The pitching is where this team has faltered.  Morton and Liriano have both performed well below what was expected.  Without guys like Volquez, Locke and Worley this team would be with the Reds or even worse.  Grilli was horrific when he was here and what was brought in to bridge that gap has been worse. The organization's mishandling of the bullpen from not having depth to having guys in the wrong roles has been the team's biggest failure IMO.  Losing leads is why this team is not in first place.  It's not for a lack of offense.  
vinnybravo wrote: In other words...." We admit fully that we have made a huge mistake this offseason in dealing with our 1B and RF situation. However, since we are still in playoff contention for the last wild card spot and fans are still spending money we don't care."

It was never fair to expect Polanco to come in and be a huge piece of this team mid season. It was also a huge failure to PLAN on him to be that piece.


--------------------------------------------

I could care less if I am right or wrong. It's just sad when an idiot like me can see these things and professionals cannot. To me that just shows they don't care or just want to try and save money instead of making the additions needed to win.

The offense has been ok, but offense cost this team very early on and set this team on a bad note. As far as pitching, the same argument is applicable. The Pirates failed to address it's needs. The fact the Pirates went into the season having to rely on Volquez, Worley and Locke is a failure. There was a 95% chance Wandy was done and everyone outside of the Pirates FO knew this. Also, based on past performance and MLB history we knew one of Morton, Liriano or Cole wild struggle. That ended up being Liriano. None of that should have been a surprise.

The Pen did struggle with closing games, but even with the blown saves, the Pirates actually ended up winning most of those games. At the end of the day the Pirates had a chance to continue to build, and they chose to plug holes instead of fixing the holes and it has cost the team. It will be ingesting to see what they do this offseason. Do they make the same mistakes or actually make an effort to IMPROVE the team.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 10:58 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 



abitoutside wrote: Do you think Byrd would have signed for 1 year?  Do you want Polanco blocked for the next 2 years?  Would you trade for Byrd right now?  What would you give up to get him?
Sangue wrote:
abitoutside wrote: I don't think that Polanco was counted on to be a huge piece by the FO. .
Blocking Polanco was the #2 reason not to re-sign Byrd - with money being the #1 reason.  If Polanco was not in the system, I think the Pirates would have re-signed Byrd.  If Byrd was a Pirate for the full season, I'd imagine the Pirates would have won 3-5 games more.  Byrd has a 3.2 WAR this year.  Polanco's is 0.2, Tabata's is 0.0.
Byrd would not have signed for a year.  The scenario I gave was one without Polanco in the system.  I would not have blocked Polanco for 2 years.  I would trade for Byrd right now under the conditions the Phillies take him back before next year starts.  For the one month rental I'd give them Tony Sanchez or Jose Tabata (with Pirates eating some of contract).  I'd throw in Bobby LaFromboise if that's what it took.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 11:19 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


Can't agree with you here, Sangue, because the time to make a move for Byrd would have been around the trade deadline, not now.  While I share your frustration and am generally with you in your "go for it NOW" mentality, at this point I think it is unlikely that Byrd or, really, any similar player would make enough of a difference to get us back to the playoffs. 


ABO is right, too, to point out that the Pirates DID, in fact, bring in a small truckload of guys in an attempt to get production going in RF and at 1B.  Unfortunately most of those players were basically four-A types, but hey, occasionally one of those types of players works out quite well---see Jones, Garrett.  I think, however, that the time to bring in a U-Haul full of the Dickersons and Ishikawas and Joneses of the world is when you are in rebuild mode, NOT when you are coming off a playoff appearance and supposedly loading up for a sustained, several year run of winning baseball and playoff appearances. 


We should also, in fairness, give Huntington credit for signing Worley and acquiring a couple other guys (such as Stewart) who have worked out quite well this season.  Unfortunately most of what has gone right this year, other than Volquez, have been fringe-of-the-roster types and not the kind of solid, everyday producers that were really needed.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 12:06 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 



williamjpellas wrote: Can't agree with you here, Sangue, because the time to make a move for Byrd would have been around the trade deadline, not now.  While I share your frustration and am generally with you in your "go for it NOW" mentality, at this point I think it is unlikely that Byrd or, really, any similar player would make enough of a difference to get us back to the playoffs. 

The Pirates are still only 1.5 games back in the Wild Card with 32 games to play.

Byrd could be the difference maker.  If the Pirates don't make a substantial move their playoff hopes are living on a prayer...
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Posted: 08/25/2014 12:28 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


they don't need to make a substantial move,its going to come down to if the starters can pitch good enough and if the offense can keep doing what their doing,pirates will have their shot to take a wild card spot if they do the above,cause we have like 6 games against the cards and atlanta still has to play in washington i believe and the giants have to play in LA
Sangue wrote:
williamjpellas wrote: Can't agree with you here, Sangue, because the time to make a move for Byrd would have been around the trade deadline, not now.  While I share your frustration and am generally with you in your "go for it NOW" mentality, at this point I think it is unlikely that Byrd or, really, any similar player would make enough of a difference to get us back to the playoffs. 

The Pirates are still only 1.5 games back in the Wild Card with 32 games to play.

Byrd could be the difference maker.  If the Pirates don't make a substantial move their playoff hopes are living on a prayer...
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Posted: 08/25/2014 12:32 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


The only move the Pirates should make, in my opinion, is to try and trade for Hamels.  They have the talent to spend (from a prospect standpoint - I'd even see if the Phillies would want Alvarez too), and they'll have the financial flexibility.  If Hamels helps them make the playoffs, great.  If not, we'll still have him for 4 more years.  I think with the caliber of prospects the Pirates could give, they could probably get the Phillies to pick up at least a third if not a half, of Hamels' salary.  Outside of that, I don't think they should make any moves.
#fringeprospect
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Posted: 08/25/2014 12:35 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


if they wanted a player like hammels they could of gotten a starter like him from another team,phillies have stated if they trade him the other team has to take his full salary,its not worth it
TBayXXXVII wrote: The only move the Pirates should make, in my opinion, is to try and trade for Hamels.  They have the talent to spend (from a prospect standpoint - I'd even see if the Phillies would want Alvarez too), and they'll have the financial flexibility.  If Hamels helps them make the playoffs, great.  If not, we'll still have him for 4 more years.  I think with the caliber of prospects the Pirates could give, they could probably get the Phillies to pick up at least a third if not a half, of Hamels' salary.  Outside of that, I don't think they should make any moves.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 12:38 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 



TBayXXXVII wrote: The only move the Pirates should make, in my opinion, is to try and trade for Hamels.  They have the talent to spend (from a prospect standpoint - I'd even see if the Phillies would want Alvarez too), and they'll have the financial flexibility.  If Hamels helps them make the playoffs, great.  If not, we'll still have him for 4 more years.  I think with the caliber of prospects the Pirates could give, they could probably get the Phillies to pick up at least a third if not a half, of Hamels' salary.  Outside of that, I don't think they should make any moves.
Would love Hamels but Nutting would never pick up that check...
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Posted: 08/25/2014 1:38 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


Polanco has had 249 At Bats with the Pirates and 248 At Bats with the Indianapolis Indians this year.

http://pittsburgh.pirates.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?player_id=570256#gameType='R'&sectionType=career&statType=1&season=2014&level='ALL'
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Posted: 08/25/2014 3:19 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


I really like TB's idea that the Pirates could use prospects and some salary relief to acquire an ace, or near-ace, starting pitcher like Hamels.   Our GM has made deals like that in the past, notably for A J Burnett, and a healthy Hamels would be a difference - maker.  Although at some point I think we are getting close to trading too many prospects, nevertheless this kind of trade makes sense for the Pirates.
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Posted: 08/25/2014 5:47 PM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 



williamjpellas wrote: Can't agree with you here, Sangue, because the time to make a move for Byrd would have been around the trade deadline, not now.  While I share your frustration and am generally with you in your "go for it NOW" mentality, at this point I think it is unlikely that Byrd or, really, any similar player would make enough of a difference to get us back to the playoffs. 


ABO is right, too, to point out that the Pirates DID, in fact, bring in a small truckload of guys in an attempt to get production going in RF and at 1B.  Unfortunately most of those players were basically four-A types, but hey, occasionally one of those types of players works out quite well---see Jones, Garrett.  I think, however, that the time to bring in a U-Haul full of the Dickersons and Ishikawas and Joneses of the world is when you are in rebuild mode, NOT when you are coming off a playoff appearance and supposedly loading up for a sustained, several year run of winning baseball and playoff appearances. 


We should also, in fairness, give Huntington credit for signing Worley and acquiring a couple other guys (such as Stewart) who have worked out quite well this season.  Unfortunately most of what has gone right this year, other than Volquez, have been fringe-of-the-roster types and not the kind of solid, everyday producers that were really needed.
Hunting does a good job of finding productive players off the scrap heap. He has shown a good job for doing this. What he has not shown the ability to do is sign or trade for a proven player other than ones team pay the Pirates to take off their hands.

Last edited 08/26/2014 5:19 AM by vinnybravo

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Posted: 08/26/2014 4:43 AM

Re: Polanco Sent to AAA 


You guys can stop wasting your time. Hamels and Byrd did not clear waivers. They were claimed by other teams and Philly pulled them back. They can't be traded until after the season.
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--- TBayXXXVII wrote:

The only move the Pirates should make, in my opinion, is to try and trade for Hamels.  They have the talent to spend (from a prospect standpoint - I'd even see if the Phillies would want Alvarez too), and they'll have the financial flexibility.  If Hamels helps them make the playoffs, great.  If not, we'll still have him for 4 more years.  I think with the caliber of prospects the Pirates could give, they could probably get the Phillies to pick up at least a third if not a half, of Hamels' salary.  Outside of that, I don't think they should make any moves.

---------------------------------------------
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