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With Walker back today who is getting cut?

Posted: 06/24/2014 4:37 AM

With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


Will someone get a mysterious injury and go on the DL?
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Posted: 06/24/2014 4:42 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


I have a feeling Snider will be gone.

JFC 2013 Bluegrass Jam
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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:15 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


Should be Snider, but maybe a pitcher??
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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:47 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.

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Posted: 06/24/2014 5:49 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



panthers2533 wrote:

I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.




I agree that Snider is more valuable to the team, as a left handed pinch hitter and a 4th outfielder.

But Tabata has a contract that would have to be eaten.

If NH trusts Harrison to play shortstop on occasion to give Mercer a blow, Barmes could be the odd man out.

___________

 

  

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Posted: 06/24/2014 6:00 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


The problem with your theory is that Tabata has actually hit RH pitchers better than Snider.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 7:02 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



gr1111 wrote:
panthers2533 wrote:

I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.




I agree that Snider is more valuable to the team, as a left handed pinch hitter and a 4th outfielder.

But Tabata has a contract that would have to be eaten.

If NH trusts Harrison to play shortstop on occasion to give Mercer a blow, Barmes could be the odd man out.
Personally, I'd rather take the SS approach but I wouldn't make Barmes be the odd man out.  I'd come up with a mysterious injury for Mercer.

One option I'd entertain is ask Pedro if he would be willing to take a 1-month trip to Indy to play 1B.  If he accepts, then great.  If not, come up with an injury to Mercer and trade Alvarez next month.  Maybe they can get Hunter Dozier for him.
#fringeprospect

Last edited 06/24/2014 7:06 AM by TBayXXXVII

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Posted: 06/24/2014 7:17 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


I suspect they send Cumpton down. Cole is ready to return. He'll take Cumpton's next turn in the rotation. Buys them a few more days until they have to make the ultimate decision.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 7:42 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



mjdouble wrote: I suspect they send Cumpton down. Cole is ready to return. He'll take Cumpton's next turn in the rotation. Buys them a few more days until they have to make the ultimate decision.
Yep - this is what will happen.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:15 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



TBayXXXVII wrote:
gr1111 wrote:
panthers2533 wrote:

I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.




I agree that Snider is more valuable to the team, as a left handed pinch hitter and a 4th outfielder.

But Tabata has a contract that would have to be eaten.

If NH trusts Harrison to play shortstop on occasion to give Mercer a blow, Barmes could be the odd man out.
Personally, I'd rather take the SS approach but I wouldn't make Barmes be the odd man out.  I'd come up with a mysterious injury for Mercer.

One option I'd entertain is ask Pedro if he would be willing to take a 1-month trip to Indy to play 1B.  If he accepts, then great.  If not, come up with an injury to Mercer and trade Alvarez next month.  Maybe they can get Hunter Dozier for him.


Pedro will never agree to go back to AAA, and he will never agree to play first base.  He has more value on the open market as a third baseman, and Boras isn't going to let him get moved away from there.  The Pirates could demand that Pedro move, but they aren't going to ruin the team's chemistry in taking a stand on this one, nor should they.

The mysterious injury would be to Snider, Tabata, or Barmes, not to Mercer.  Why would you want to put a starter on the DL to protect your bench guys -- if it comes to that you're better off just fishing or cutting bait on one of the three.

___________

 

  

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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:24 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


I don't know what more Cumpton has to do in order to stay in the Pirates' rotation.   Ask yourself this question, yinz guys: do the Pirates, right now and as currently constructed, have five (5) starting pitchers who are objectively, unquestionably better than Brandon Cumpton?  You know the answer to that question as well as I do.


Of course I get the fact that there are other considerations when it comes to how you build your roster and so on.  And it could be argued that Snider is a better fit for the roster than Tabata because of the preponderance of RH hitters in the outfield and so on, even though Tabata is clearly the better player vis a vis Snider. 


But I would still poop can Snider or, if not him, Barmes or a reliever.  I guess farming out a reliever would be the best route to go, since you could always recall him, where if you DFA Snider or Barmes, it's a permanent thing and neither of them are going to accept a demotion to Triple A.  To me, Hughes is CLEARLY the guy to send down.  That buys you a few days until Cole comes back, and then I guess you have to go through this dance of death once again, but I would send him down before I even thought about Tabata or Snider or even Barmes.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:45 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



williamjpellas wrote: I don't know what more Cumpton has to do in order to stay in the Pirates' rotation.   Ask yourself this question, yinz guys: do the Pirates, right now and as currently constructed, have five (5) starting pitchers who are objectively, unquestionably better than Brandon Cumpton?  You know the answer to that question as well as I do.


Of course I get the fact that there are other considerations when it comes to how you build your roster and so on.  And it could be argued that Snider is a better fit for the roster than Tabata because of the preponderance of RH hitters in the outfield and so on, even though Tabata is clearly the better player vis a vis Snider. 


But I would still poop can Snider or, if not him, Barmes or a reliever.  I guess farming out a reliever would be the best route to go, since you could always recall him, where if you DFA Snider or Barmes, it's a permanent thing and neither of them are going to accept a demotion to Triple A.  To me, Hughes is CLEARLY the guy to send down.  That buys you a few days until Cole comes back, and then I guess you have to go through this dance of death once again, but I would send him down before I even thought about Tabata or Snider or even Barmes.


But Hughes has pitched very well -- 1.93 ERA in 28 innings.

I don't think you play games that potentially hurt the team on the field right now -- like sending down a useful reliever just to hold on to an extra bench guy.  Fish or cut bait -- somebody's got to go.

I think Cumpton goes down for Cole, just because he has options and Worley and Locke don't.

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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:49 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


Yep, it will probably be Cumpton because of the options.   I guess you can't argue, in principle, with him being swapped out for Cole (even though technically he's being replaced in the immediate sense by Walker) but I still like our rotation a lot better with Cumpton in it than not.  Then again, presumably you'd have to deal with this when Liriano comes back, anyway, since you can't very well send him packing in favor of Cumpton (can you?!?). 


Anyway, the Pirates will have to make two moves, one when Walker comes back and another when Cole returns.  If Cumpton goes down first, who will be sent out when Cole comes back?  At that point it would either be Hughes or one from among Snider, Tabata, or Barmes.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:51 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



williamjpellas wrote: Yep, it will probably be Cumpton because of the options.   I guess you can't argue, in principle, with him being swapped out for Cole (even though technically he's being replaced in the immediate sense by Walker) but I still like our rotation a lot better with Cumpton in it than not.  Then again, presumably you'd have to deal with this when Liriano comes back, anyway, since you can't very well send him packing in favor of Cumpton (can you?!?). 


Anyway, the Pirates will have to make two moves, one when Walker comes back and another when Cole returns.  If Cumpton goes down first, who will be sent out when Cole comes back?  At that point it would either be Hughes or one from among Snider, Tabata, or Barmes.


I just think we need a full bullpen rather than an extra bench guy.

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Posted: 06/24/2014 8:53 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



gr1111 wrote:
TBayXXXVII wrote:
gr1111 wrote:
panthers2533 wrote:

I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.




I agree that Snider is more valuable to the team, as a left handed pinch hitter and a 4th outfielder.

But Tabata has a contract that would have to be eaten.

If NH trusts Harrison to play shortstop on occasion to give Mercer a blow, Barmes could be the odd man out.
Personally, I'd rather take the SS approach but I wouldn't make Barmes be the odd man out.  I'd come up with a mysterious injury for Mercer.

One option I'd entertain is ask Pedro if he would be willing to take a 1-month trip to Indy to play 1B.  If he accepts, then great.  If not, come up with an injury to Mercer and trade Alvarez next month.  Maybe they can get Hunter Dozier for him.


Pedro will never agree to go back to AAA, and he will never agree to play first base.  He has more value on the open market as a third baseman, and Boras isn't going to let him get moved away from there.  The Pirates could demand that Pedro move, but they aren't going to ruin the team's chemistry in taking a stand on this one, nor should they.

The mysterious injury would be to Snider, Tabata, or Barmes, not to Mercer.  Why would you want to put a starter on the DL to protect your bench guys -- if it comes to that you're better off just fishing or cutting bait on one of the three.
Oh, I agree that Pedro won't take the offer, but I'd still take the shot in the dark.  I wouldn't force it either.  I'd simply ask.  Like I said, if he says 'yes', then great.  If he says 'no', I'd trade him next month.  It's not something he needs to know, just something that I'd do.

I just don't see them sending Barmes or Snider packing.  They won't dump Tabata.  Mercer just seems to me to be the odd man out.  Mercer is better than Harrison on defense, but I don't think it's significant.  I think Harrison's offense makes up for the small difference in defense.  Plus, Barmes is still really good defensively.  You could always use him in a defensive switch late in games.
#fringeprospect
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Posted: 06/24/2014 9:38 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



TBayXXXVII wrote:
gr1111 wrote:
TBayXXXVII wrote:
gr1111 wrote:
panthers2533 wrote:

I don't know. Snider seems to have picked it up lately and has become a good pinch hitter. Plus you have Marte, Cutch and Harrison if needed as RH outfielders. Only Polanco is LH in the OF if you cut Snider.

I would try like hell to unload Tabata even if you get nothing in return. I am sure they might even have to pay some of his salary but Snider is a better fit on this team I thnk due to him be LH hitter.




I agree that Snider is more valuable to the team, as a left handed pinch hitter and a 4th outfielder.

But Tabata has a contract that would have to be eaten.

If NH trusts Harrison to play shortstop on occasion to give Mercer a blow, Barmes could be the odd man out.
Personally, I'd rather take the SS approach but I wouldn't make Barmes be the odd man out.  I'd come up with a mysterious injury for Mercer.

One option I'd entertain is ask Pedro if he would be willing to take a 1-month trip to Indy to play 1B.  If he accepts, then great.  If not, come up with an injury to Mercer and trade Alvarez next month.  Maybe they can get Hunter Dozier for him.


Pedro will never agree to go back to AAA, and he will never agree to play first base.  He has more value on the open market as a third baseman, and Boras isn't going to let him get moved away from there.  The Pirates could demand that Pedro move, but they aren't going to ruin the team's chemistry in taking a stand on this one, nor should they.

The mysterious injury would be to Snider, Tabata, or Barmes, not to Mercer.  Why would you want to put a starter on the DL to protect your bench guys -- if it comes to that you're better off just fishing or cutting bait on one of the three.
Oh, I agree that Pedro won't take the offer, but I'd still take the shot in the dark.  I wouldn't force it either.  I'd simply ask.  Like I said, if he says 'yes', then great.  If he says 'no', I'd trade him next month.  It's not something he needs to know, just something that I'd do.

I just don't see them sending Barmes or Snider packing.  They won't dump Tabata.  Mercer just seems to me to be the odd man out.  Mercer is better than Harrison on defense, but I don't think it's significant.  I think Harrison's offense makes up for the small difference in defense.  Plus, Barmes is still really good defensively.  You could always use him in a defensive switch late in games.


Mercer is not going anywhere., imo.  He's the starting shortstop.

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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:41 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


Mercer is literally about the 15th or 16th player down on the list to even be considered when Walker gets activited.

In other words, there are about 14 players that are more likely to be released or sent down before Mercer is considered.

Mercer's defense is much better than Harrisons also. Harrison is better offensively though but defense is not close.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:49 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


Agreed, Mercer's the starting SS. When you have to make a decision on who to cut, it is illogical to think starter, especially a young starter. As for now, it's obviously going to be Cumpton, but that only puts off the real decision for a few days unless they find a guy for the DL or short the bullpen a guy for awhile. I'm a little surprised we haven't heard any trade rumors involving Snider or Tabata. I know you'd get next to nothing, but still? In the end, one of those two has to go.
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Posted: 06/24/2014 10:59 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 



BBG65 wrote: Agreed, Mercer's the starting SS. When you have to make a decision on who to cut, it is illogical to think starter, especially a young starter. As for now, it's obviously going to be Cumpton, but that only puts off the real decision for a few days unless they find a guy for the DL or short the bullpen a guy for awhile. I'm a little surprised we haven't heard any trade rumors involving Snider or Tabata. I know you'd get next to nothing, but still? In the end, one of those two has to go.


I don't think any other team would trade anything for either of them, since they know that one of them will be available for free soon enough.

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Posted: 06/24/2014 11:06 AM

Re: With Walker back today who is getting cut? 


According to Rob Biertempfel's (the trib) twitter: "#pirates have outrighted OF Jose Tabata to Triple-A @indyindians"
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