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Burnett signs with...

Posted: 02/12/2014 9:01 AM

Burnett signs with... 



the Phillies, 1 year 16 million.

I'll gladly eat crow on this one.  Burnett was truly about the money and not about winning.  I took him at his word and didn't look deeper, I was obviously wrong in doing that. 

Although, on the bright side, I look forward to watching Burnett struggle with the Phillies brutal defense behind him and mediocre team around him, and I can't wait for the Pirates to face him.  Revenge will be sweet.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:07 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


He's clearly about the money and not about winning, assuming that the Pirates are better than the Phillies at this point in time, as seems to be the case.  Surely either the Nationals or the Pirates would have offered better shots at the postseason, maybe even the Orioles.  The Phillies?  I guess there's still a small chance that they might make a run if all of their veterans stay healthy for a year, but their window is all but closed and they are on the edge of a rebuild. 


I would not have paid a 37 year old Burnett $16 million for one season of baseball.  No way.  He did some good work in Pittsburgh, and he should get all due credit for that, but he's clearly a mercenary first.  While to some degree we are all "mercenaries" when it comes to plying our trades in a capitalist system, Burnett's dishonesty is disappointing, particularly when he's already banked tens of millions of dollars over the course of his career.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:15 AM

RE: Burnett signs with... 


i'll just say i told you so. I said he'd get more than the QO. I said the Phillies were still interested even when reports said they weren't.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:16 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


I appreciate his 2 years with the Pirates. He helped turn this franchise around and was a big part of changing the clubhouse culture in regards to the attitude.

In saying that, 16 million? Pass... good luck in Philly AJ.... your big talk was nothing more than big talk. It clearly was more about money and not more about winning as you indicated.

He had every right to make it about money, but he should have kept his comments to himself.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:19 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



williamjpellas wrote: He's clearly about the money and not about winning, assuming that the Pirates are better than the Phillies at this point in time, as seems to be the case.  Surely either the Nationals or the Pirates would have offered better shots at the postseason, maybe even the Orioles.  The Phillies?  I guess there's still a small chance that they might make a run if all of their veterans stay healthy for a year, but their window is all but closed and they are on the edge of a rebuild. 


I would not have paid a 37 year old Burnett $16 million for one season of baseball.  No way.  He did some good work in Pittsburgh, and he should get all due credit for that, but he's clearly a mercenary first.  While to some degree we are all "mercenaries" when it comes to plying our trades in a capitalist system, Burnett's dishonesty is disappointing, particularly when he's already banked tens of millions of dollars over the course of his career.
I think this is miscast blame. The team gave all sorts of indications they didn't value him. For all we know The Pirates never made an offer even close to fair. If AJ passed up say $12M to go to the Phillies, then maybe you could make this argument. But if all the Bucs did was make low ball offers then I don't blame him for doing this.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:19 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



williamjpellas wrote: He's clearly about the money and not about winning, assuming that the Pirates are better than the Phillies at this point in time, as seems to be the case.  Surely either the Nationals or the Pirates would have offered better shots at the postseason, maybe even the Orioles.  The Phillies?  I guess there's still a small chance that they might make a run if all of their veterans stay healthy for a year, but their window is all but closed and they are on the edge of a rebuild. 


I would not have paid a 37 year old Burnett $16 million for one season of baseball.  No way.  He did some good work in Pittsburgh, and he should get all due credit for that, but he's clearly a mercenary first.  While to some degree we are all "mercenaries" when it comes to plying our trades in a capitalist system, Burnett's dishonesty is disappointing, particularly when he's already banked tens of millions of dollars over the course of his career.

Yeah the Phillies are built with players well into their 30's.  Ruiz, Howard, Rollins, Utley, Byrd, Lee, Burnett.  That is an old group of players that they are counting on to be the ones that carry the team.

Burnett was worth nothing near $16 million, especially for a team that is just about to be in rebuild mode.  But, that is Amaro for you, consistently one of the worst GM's in baseball lol.  They only way he won was because Ed Wade left him a ridiculously talented roster and minor league system.  Burnett absolutely deserves credit for his performance, but the Pirates deserve some credit as well for improving his performance, especially with the shifts this past season.  We'll see how it plays out.  Disappointing that a guy with well over $100 million in career earnings would feel the need to go for the money.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:21 AM

RE: Burnett signs with... 



mjdouble wrote: i'll just say i told you so. I said he'd get more than the QO. I said the Phillies were still interested even when reports said they weren't.

Glad you felt the need to pat yourself on the back.  Let me virtually pat you on the back as well.  Kudos.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:25 AM

RE: Burnett signs with... 



cferrel3 wrote:
mjdouble wrote: i'll just say i told you so. I said he'd get more than the QO. I said the Phillies were still interested even when reports said they weren't.

Glad you felt the need to pat yourself on the back.  Let me virtually pat you on the back as well.  Kudos.
This is weird. What are you doing? I'm not arguing with you. 

Let me virtually tell you to STFD.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:27 AM

RE: Burnett signs with... 



mjdouble wrote:
cferrel3 wrote:
mjdouble wrote: i'll just say i told you so. I said he'd get more than the QO. I said the Phillies were still interested even when reports said they weren't.

Glad you felt the need to pat yourself on the back.  Let me virtually pat you on the back as well.  Kudos.
This is weird. What are you doing? I'm not arguing with you. 

Let me virtually tell you to STFD.

Wow, take a joke, it is called a sense of humor.  Amazing lol.  I was giving you props and you got mad, I give up.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:31 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


Ken Rosenthal is talking on MLB network right now saying that the Pirates are definitely in a better position to win next season, and GM's around the league think this as well.  He is really anxious to see what Burnett's reasoning was.  Harold Reynolds also seemed shocked at the money, but stated that the Phillies don't have a choice at this point, they have to go all-in with their current roster.

I'm really anxious to see how Burnett does on a team where 5 of the 8 defenders on the field are average at best, and one of the above average ones is 35 (Chase Utley).
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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:50 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


Interesting statistic.  The Pirates were the 3rd best defensive team in baseball, while the Phillies were 30th.  If you adjust Burnett's ERA to runs he would have given up with the Phillies it is well over 4.  And that isn't even factoring in that Philly plays in a launching pad.  This is definitely an interesting side story I will be following this season.

"Burnett doesn’t allow a lot of fly balls or line drives, but the ones he does allow are hit harder than the league average. His relative fly ball run value allowed spikes up from 90 to 109 once you take the Pirates’ ballpark and outfield defense out of the equation. Ditto his line drive run value, up from 99 to 107."

Last edited 02/12/2014 9:53 AM by cferrel3

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Posted: 02/12/2014 9:58 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


Lets see, the Pirates low ball him with a 8 million offer, that recently was said to be up to 10 mil. And he gets offered 16 million by a team that is still close to home. I don't care who you are or how much money you have. Thats almost double the salary that was offered by the Pirates. I would take it too. I can't fault AJ, I fault the normal cheap front office. 2 million dollars is not a huge amount of money in MLB terms. And that most likely is all it would of taken from the start. A 12 million offer months ago, and we would not be having this conversation. My other post about this Burnett situation is completely proven by this.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 10:02 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



Blitz36 wrote: Lets see, the Pirates low ball him with a 8 million offer, that recently was said to be up to 10 mil. And he gets offered 16 million by a team that is still close to home. I don't care who you are or how much money you have. Thats almost double the salary that was offered by the Pirates. I would take it too. I can't fault AJ, I fault the normal cheap front office. 2 million dollars is not a huge amount of money in MLB terms. And that most likely is all it would of taken from the start. A 12 million offer months ago, and we would not be having this conversation. My other post about this Burnett situation is completely proven by this.

Completely misinformed.  I have no idea where you got your numbers.  My guess is that the Pirates offered $10ish million, maybe more, I doubt they would go above $12 million because he isn't worth more than that for the Pirates.  You have no idea "what it would have taken", he was obviously in it just for the money.

Last edited 02/12/2014 10:03 AM by cferrel3

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Posted: 02/12/2014 10:14 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


I am disappointed in the decision, especially since he's made over $100 million during his career. It is his right to seek out the highest payday. I will miss his fire in the mound and in the dugout. I thought he gave our team an edge it was lacking before he arrived. He expected the team to kick axx every day. Not so much before his arrival.

I wish him well, except when he faces our Buccos.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 10:22 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


The loss of AJ considerably weakens the rotation and team. Aside from his pitching performance, he brought the fire.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 10:46 AM

RE: Burnett signs with... 


I don't really have a big problem with what AJ did. I don't see a need to call him out on anything. He's entitled to do what he likes and sign where he wants and for what he is able to sign for. There shouldn't be any sour grapes about Burnett leaving.

All that being said this was a really bad decision by Burnett in terms of his ability to play on a competing team. The Phillies scored 610 runs last season. Tied for 4th worst in all of baseball. They also allowed 749 runs last season. Only Colorado allowed more in the NL. The pitching will be improved with the addition of Burnett but that is going to do nothing for the offense that is old and likely to continue to trend downward from an individual performance standpoint.

AJ is going to blow a gasket midseason. This is a bad team to join. The addition of Burnett won't help as much as some will likely think because the big issue with the Phillies is in the bullpen and not really the starting rotation. All their starters had a lower xFIP than ERA last season. Which shows that the defense was really the problem and that hasn't been addressed. The Pirates were almost the reverse in that their ERA actually outperformed their xFIP. Which tells you the defense makes a huge difference. AJ was hurt by a lot of bad luck so he was the one exception where he pitched worse than he should have. I think the defense in Philly is really going to let Burnett down next season. Heavy groundball pitchers don't do well without strong defenses. Also he's likely to allow a lot more homers in that park. I would be surprised if he ends up with an ERA below 4.

To me it's not worth it to chase the cash when he's made so much. In what will probably be your last season in baseball it probably won't be a lot of fun to spend it on a 75 win team. I have a feeling though that before the season is over Burnett will be back with the Pirates.

I really can't believe that Ruben Amaro Jr still has a job though.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 10:47 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



cferrel3 wrote:
Blitz36 wrote: Lets see, the Pirates low ball him with a 8 million offer, that recently was said to be up to 10 mil. And he gets offered 16 million by a team that is still close to home. I don't care who you are or how much money you have. Thats almost double the salary that was offered by the Pirates. I would take it too. I can't fault AJ, I fault the normal cheap front office. 2 million dollars is not a huge amount of money in MLB terms. And that most likely is all it would of taken from the start. A 12 million offer months ago, and we would not be having this conversation. My other post about this Burnett situation is completely proven by this.

Completely misinformed.  I have no idea where you got your numbers.  My guess is that the Pirates offered $10ish million, maybe more, I doubt they would go above $12 million because he isn't worth more than that for the Pirates.  You have no idea "what it would have taken", he was obviously in it just for the money.
I am not saying I know what AJ would of taken. But you are saying the same thing I am. Around 10 millionish. And you doubt they would of gone over 12. The problem is which was reported, the low ball offers given in the beginning. No way would I want them to pay 16 mil. But I truely believe, and this is not misinformed information. My opinion is if a respectable offer was made from the start, it would of never gotten to this situation where 16 was even brought up. I don't blame AJ at all. You can only be insulted so many times before you say the hell with you, I'll play elsewhere.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 11:04 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 


katoy -- nobody in their right mind would leave $6-$8 million on the table just to play for one team over another. 

Even for baseball players, that is real money.

___________

 

  

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Posted: 02/12/2014 11:11 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



Blitz36 wrote:
cferrel3 wrote:
Blitz36 wrote: Lets see, the Pirates low ball him with a 8 million offer, that recently was said to be up to 10 mil. And he gets offered 16 million by a team that is still close to home. I don't care who you are or how much money you have. Thats almost double the salary that was offered by the Pirates. I would take it too. I can't fault AJ, I fault the normal cheap front office. 2 million dollars is not a huge amount of money in MLB terms. And that most likely is all it would of taken from the start. A 12 million offer months ago, and we would not be having this conversation. My other post about this Burnett situation is completely proven by this.

Completely misinformed.  I have no idea where you got your numbers.  My guess is that the Pirates offered $10ish million, maybe more, I doubt they would go above $12 million because he isn't worth more than that for the Pirates.  You have no idea "what it would have taken", he was obviously in it just for the money.
I am not saying I know what AJ would of taken. But you are saying the same thing I am. Around 10 millionish. And you doubt they would of gone over 12. The problem is which was reported, the low ball offers given in the beginning. No way would I want them to pay 16 mil. But I truely believe, and this is not misinformed information. My opinion is if a respectable offer was made from the start, it would of never gotten to this situation where 16 was even brought up. I don't blame AJ at all. You can only be insulted so many times before you say the hell with you, I'll play elsewhere.

That is all I needed, you saying it was your opinion, you just didn't the first time.  We don't know what the first offer was, it could have been very respectable.  I'll wait to hear specifics before I judge anything of the situation.  I don't blame Burnett either, he can do whatever he wants, but I don't have to like his decision or think that it is the right one.  I think he will greatly regret the decision a couple months into the season.
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Posted: 02/12/2014 11:11 AM

Re: Burnett signs with... 



gr1111 wrote: katoy -- nobody in their right mind would leave $6-$8 million on the table just to play for one team over another. 

Even for baseball players, that is real money.

Link?
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