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Not so fast Ryan Braun...

Posted: 02/05/2013 5:38 PM

Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


This could get interesting!
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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Posted: 02/05/2013 8:45 PM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Selig needs to go.  Same stories for 15 years now.  This is getting old and needs corrected, starting from the top.  Sadly it stops at the top.
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Posted: 02/06/2013 4:30 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Braun is already spin doctoring.  Still, with all of his nonsense about tampering and such...he has yet to offer a motive.  Why the hell would an independent collector make  sure he failed his test?  If this was also the case, why wasn't it a part of his actual defense instead of his public whining?  Braun is dirty, he knows it, we know it...

Yes...the entire culture needs changed.  I read an article about how everybody turned their head.  The money made it okay, until folks like Canseco--a moron, yes, but still--started crying they were blacklisted.

http://www.grantland.com/story...sk-ped-question

JFC 2013 Bluegrass Jam
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Posted: 02/06/2013 4:36 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Braun is a PED user and him getting off was a total joke.

In saying that, I believe most pro athletes probably are using some sort of PED that currently are being caught on the current drug screenings.
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Posted: 02/06/2013 5:23 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 



panthers2533 wrote: Braun is a PED user and him getting off was a total joke.

In saying that, I believe most pro athletes probably are using some sort of PED that currently are being caught on the current drug screenings.


The one bone that I think can be tossed to the PED users is the fact that the line between---shall we say---"pharmacologically enhanced athletic performance" and "legitimate medicine" is a little blurred in places.  For example: some of the more radical treatments for healing injuries and surgical wounds could be considered "an unfair advantage", quote - unquote.  I've mentioned before that Randy Johnson's career would almost certainly have ended several years before it did because of his serious knee injury.  Instead, he had radical surgery followed by injections of some kind of lubricant gel that, as far as I know, is now a permanent part of his knee.  Similarly, is it really "fair" that A-Rod goes to Europe to get platelet treatments to speed healing in his knee? 



For that matter, even the more so-called "natural supplements" are, ahem, artificially / mechanically produced in "un-naturally" concentrated doses.  I used to take creatine when I was weightlifting, and creatine is a substance that occurs naturally---in much smaller amounts---in some types of meat.  But you'd have to consume many hundreds of pounds of steak to get the same amount of creatine you get from the substance in its concentrated, powder form.  Is taking creatine, then, "cheating"?  One could argue that it is. 


Having said all that, there is obviously a clear distinction between taking supplements that are merely more highly concentrated natural substances on one hand, and taking injections of specifically formulated artifical substances on the other hand.  The natural substances basically help you achieve the maximum performance of which you are capable within the limits of your God-given genetics.  The artificial substances enable you to achieve greater performance than you would ever be able to achieve naturally; they enable you to go beyond the limits of your God-given genetics.  So I am not saying that I am in favor of PEDs.  Just thinking out loud about the issue from all sides. 

Last edited 02/06/2013 5:24 AM by williamjpellas

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Posted: 02/06/2013 6:04 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Baseball has done a much better job at eliminating drugs than football - where I believe PEDs is much an accepted part of the culture.

I've never been convinced of Braun's PED use as his weight and strength (based on workout routine notes) have never changed.
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Posted: 02/06/2013 5:38 PM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Until baseball, football and the other big sports utilize an organization like USADA to govern the PEDs, this will continue to proliferate.  HGH is pretty much undetected.  Braun and many others are cheaters.  Plain and simple.
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Posted: 02/07/2013 7:54 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


What's funny is that Braun said his name is on the list at the lab because he was using this Bosh guy for consultation. How stupid does he think we are? Braun's a joke. You'd think he would have learned his lesson after he got off on a technicality last year.




I spent most of my money on beer and football. The rest I just wasted.

Last edited 02/07/2013 8:01 AM by burghsports3

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Posted: 02/07/2013 8:43 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


He is still juicing. The best guys get the best stuff. He and Arod are both frauds. MLB didn't like that Braun got off on a technicality last year so I would expect they will go at this investigation with vigor. I doubt though that it will come to anything in the short term. This may be another Lance Armstrong situation and I agree with Bucaddict that unless an organization like the WDA gets involved this stuff will continue to happen. Too much money is on the table for guys with less than stellar character to pass up.

---------------------------------------------
--- burghsports3 wrote:

What's funny is that Braun said his name is on the list at the lab because he was using this Bosh guy for consultation. How stupid does he think we are? Braun's a joke. You'd think he would have learned his lesson after he got off on a technicality last year.

---------------------------------------------
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Posted: 02/07/2013 9:06 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Braun's performance has been pretty steady since he entered the league.  He hit 34 home runs with a 1.004 OPS as a rookie and 41 home runs with a .987 OPS last year.  There is not the dramatic Barry Bonds/Melky Cabrera spike in performance .

I'd imagine he'd hit 60+ home runs on steroids.  I guess you could try to argue he has been on steroids since his first day in the majors.  In which case he should have failed multiple tests by now.

Its unfortunate that Braun's statement is true.  When it comes to PED accusations, you are 100% guilty until proven innocent.

Braun is one of the best players I've ever seen.  Its a short list of players who dominate the majors since day one: Pujols, Braun, maybe Mike Trout - if he continues to dominate.
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Posted: 02/07/2013 10:29 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


I understand your point, Sangue, but I still have yet to hear an adequate explanation for the T ratio and the fact that the T was proven to be synthetic.  In public, Braun said his sample was tampered with, but his actual defense only speaks of the chain of custody.  He can say he it was tampered with all he wants, but it begs the question:  why would some random tester make his piss dirty?

JFC 2013 Bluegrass Jam
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Posted: 02/07/2013 10:30 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 



Sangue wrote: Braun's performance has been pretty steady since he entered the league.  He hit 34 home runs with a 1.004 OPS as a rookie and 41 home runs with a .987 OPS last year.  There is not the dramatic Barry Bonds/Melky Cabrera spike in performance .

I'd imagine he'd hit 60+ home runs on steroids.  I guess you could try to argue he has been on steroids since his first day in the majors.  In which case he should have failed multiple tests by now.

Its unfortunate that Braun's statement is true.  When it comes to PED accusations, you are 100% guilty until proven innocent.

Braun is one of the best players I've ever seen.  Its a short list of players who dominate the majors since day one: Pujols, Braun, maybe Mike Trout - if he continues to dominate.
Possibly, but that's not the case with Braun... he did test positive and didn't contest the results, he contested the process.  In essence, he admited that he was in fact guilty.
#fringeprospect
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Posted: 02/07/2013 10:37 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 



TBayXXXVII wrote:
Sangue wrote: Braun's performance has been pretty steady since he entered the league.  He hit 34 home runs with a 1.004 OPS as a rookie and 41 home runs with a .987 OPS last year.  There is not the dramatic Barry Bonds/Melky Cabrera spike in performance .

I'd imagine he'd hit 60+ home runs on steroids.  I guess you could try to argue he has been on steroids since his first day in the majors.  In which case he should have failed multiple tests by now.

Its unfortunate that Braun's statement is true.  When it comes to PED accusations, you are 100% guilty until proven innocent.

Braun is one of the best players I've ever seen.  Its a short list of players who dominate the majors since day one: Pujols, Braun, maybe Mike Trout - if he continues to dominate.
Possibly, but that's not the case with Braun... he did test positive and didn't contest the results, he contested the process.  In essence, he admited that he was in fact guilty.


Agree.  And his case isn't being discussed now just to harrass him -- it is being discussed because new evidence of his juicing has come to light (his name in the wrong book).  And he didn't help matters with his lame explanation as to how it got there.

___________

 

  

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Posted: 02/08/2013 5:37 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Not sure if anybody has heard the latest, but it now appears some are claiming the University of Miami was the HGH capital of the universe and they have been uncovering pipelines from the lab in question, straight to the Hurricanes clubhouse.

Where did Braun attend college again?  Oh yeah...."The U"

It would certainly explain why he has been dominant since his rookie year and we didn't see a dramatic jump in his performance.
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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Posted: 02/08/2013 5:51 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Grandal went to "the U" as well, another guy who is on the list.




I spent most of my money on beer and football. The rest I just wasted.
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Posted: 02/08/2013 6:04 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


I was reading an article earlier this morning about a former Miami player years ago who was caught selling some pot.  After raiding his apartment, cops found 19 vials of HGH.

Let me see if I can find it....
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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Posted: 02/08/2013 6:06 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


Here it is 

It also discusses how Miami doesn't test for HGH.  Not saying I blame them, just saying they wouldn't have caught anybody even if they were using it there.
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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Posted: 02/08/2013 6:07 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 


"Another report in Thursday's editions of The New York Times said MLB investigators suspect that Miami's baseball program "is a nexus of performance-enhancing drug use." In 2010, a now-former Miami player was arrested and charged with trying to sell marijuana to undercover officers on university grounds, and police later found 19 vials of HGH at his apartment."

Anybody still defending Braun?
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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Posted: 02/08/2013 7:11 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 



GhostOfPBG wrote: "Another report in Thursday's editions of The New York Times said MLB investigators suspect that Miami's baseball program "is a nexus of performance-enhancing drug use." In 2010, a now-former Miami player was arrested and charged with trying to sell marijuana to undercover officers on university grounds, and police later found 19 vials of HGH at his apartment."

Anybody still defending Braun?
Yes.  I still need more evidence.  Right now its guilt by association.  You don't go to jail when your neighbor commits a crime just because you know your neighbor.  While its clear this agency was selling HGH, it does not mean Braun was buying it from them.  I'm sure Braun knew they were selling HGH, but its possible he said I want your consultation, I want to procure legal substances from you, but I dont want to use any illegal PED's.

I sure hope none of you guys get selected for jury duty.
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Posted: 02/08/2013 7:25 AM

Re: Not so fast Ryan Braun... 



Sangue wrote:
GhostOfPBG wrote: "Another report in Thursday's editions of The New York Times said MLB investigators suspect that Miami's baseball program "is a nexus of performance-enhancing drug use." In 2010, a now-former Miami player was arrested and charged with trying to sell marijuana to undercover officers on university grounds, and police later found 19 vials of HGH at his apartment."

Anybody still defending Braun?
Yes.  I still need more evidence.  Right now its guilt by association.  You don't go to jail when your neighbor commits a crime just because you know your neighbor.  While its clear this agency was selling HGH, it does not mean Braun was buying it from them.  I'm sure Braun knew they were selling HGH, but its possible he said I want your consultation, I want to procure legal substances from you, but I dont want to use any illegal PED's.

I sure hope none of you guys get selected for jury duty.
You were a juror in the OJ trial, weren't you?  biggrin
"I originally said he would get fired in mid-May after a poor start, but honestly, he might not make it to May at this rate." A 'professional' opinion of Manager of the Year Clint Hurdle 4/8/13
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