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Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez

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Posted: 01/09/2013 2:27 PM

Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


According to Keith Law, the Pittsburgh Pirates have traded outfielder Quincy Latimore to the Cleveland Indians for right-handed pitcher Jeanmar Gomez.

Gomez has thrown 206.2 innings in the majors, with a career 5.18 ERA. He doesn’t have impressive ratios, with a 4.9 K/9, a 3.1 BB/9 and a 1.2 HR/9. Most of his time in the majors has been as a starter, including the 2012 season when he made 17 starts and had a 5.96 ERA. In his time in Triple-A last year, the 24-year-old had a 4.41 ERA in 69.1 innings, with a 7.0 K/9 and a 2.2 BB/9 ratio.  Matt Bandi profiled Gomez last year in his Exploring the Arsenal series. The right-hander is another sinkerball pitcher with a high ground ball rate, which the Pirates seem to love.

Gomez was recently designated for assignment by Cleveland last week. His addition is puzzling. He’s out of options and hasn’t put up impressive numbers throughout his career. His stuff doesn’t separate him from any of the other similar pitchers on the roster. My guess is that the Pirates saw something they liked, or the current group liked him from when they were in the Cleveland organization.

Latimore had some of the best raw power in the system, but could never support that power. He had trouble hitting for average, which was mostly due to his plate patience issues that led to high strikeouts and low walk rates. The power was intriguing, but he was unlikely to make it to the majors without fixing those other issues.

UPDATE 5:05 PM: Pirates have made the deal official. The 40-man roster is now at 40. The 2013 payroll page is updated with the move.


http://www.piratesprospects.co...y-latimore.html

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Posted: 01/09/2013 3:03 PM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


Jeanmar Gomez

Pirates acquire Jeanmar Gomez from Indians

The Pittsburgh Pirates acquired right-handed pitcher Jeanmar Gomez from the Cleveland Indians in exchange for minor league outfielder Quincy Latimore. Full Story | Discuss

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Posted: 01/09/2013 3:48 PM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I'm imagining Gomez gets taken off the 40 man roster fairly soon and the try and stash him in AAA.

Lattimore wouldn't of gotten much laying time in AAA with Presely and Sands in AAA as well as Pie and likely Andrew Lambo so it's pretty much some of nothing for nothing. Maybe the Pirates work on a few things with Gomez but I can't see him making the team with those peripherals.
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Posted: 01/09/2013 5:54 PM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 



katoy2j wrote: I'm imagining Gomez gets taken off the 40 man roster fairly soon and the try and stash him in AAA.

Lattimore wouldn't of gotten much laying time in AAA with Presely and Sands in AAA as well as Pie and likely Andrew Lambo so it's pretty much some of nothing for nothing. Maybe the Pirates work on a few things with Gomez but I can't see him making the team with those peripherals.

Yep.  I always had a soft spot for Lattimore because he never seemed to be overwhelmingly good in any one phase of his game, and yet somehow always seemed to have solid-average or better numbers in most categories at the end of the season.  I always favor versatile players who can give you at least a little bit in almost every category, especially in the National League.  But yes, he was more or less blocked in the Pirates' system after the acquisition of Sands and Pie, and given that Presley is likely to land back in Triple A if he is not traded.  


As for Gomez, bleecchhh.  If he sees any time in Pittsburgh in 2013, then the Pirates have had a bad year.   We would have to blow through Wilson, McPherson, Locke, Oliver, and probably Irwin before Gomez would get the call, and if that happens, it means that the Pirates' pitching staff will have been blown to smithereens by the worst run of injuries this team has seen in many years.  Gomez is organizational depth at best.
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Posted: 01/09/2013 7:06 PM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


The Loriano effect. This tells me that they are going to need more depth at AAA and they know it or they are buying an insurance policy for it. Calling Mr. Marcum, Mr. Marcum....
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Posted: 01/09/2013 7:21 PM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 



abitoutside wrote: The Loriano effect. This tells me that they are going to need more depth at AAA and they know it or they are buying an insurance policy for it. Calling Mr. Marcum, Mr. Marcum....


I like Marcum well enough in a vacuum, but didn't he miss time with a sore elbow last season?  He had Tommy John surgery in 2009 and missed the entire season.  He has a very respectable career resume and so you'll have to pay him some significant money, and I don't know that he is a good risk at this point.  I'd rather go with the kids than throw truckloads of cash at the likes of Marcum and Liriano, the more so because Cole will be here at some point in 2013, CHAЯLY is also due back, and meanwhile there is at least some depth (if unproven depth) with Wilson, McPherson, Locke, and Oliver.  

Last edited 01/09/2013 7:22 PM by williamjpellas

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Posted: 01/10/2013 7:02 AM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 



Marcum would provide veteran depth which I am all of a sudden concerned about. Between Burnett, Wandy and Loriano I felt that we would have at least 2 guys that we could count on to carry a solid 200 inning load. We have been burned too many times in the past where we count on guys like Benson, Cordova, Schmidt, etc.... repeating what they did the year before. Would it surprise you at all if Wandy or Burnett had a bad year or went on the DL a couple times?

SP is THE unquestionable key to the season IMO. I felt very comfortable having Wilson, Locke, McP, etc. fill the 4-5 holes and maybe one of them moves up in responsibility if one of the big 3 had issues. If they are now being counted on to fill 3 spots then that is a recipe for some bad stew. Getting Marcum would be a risk, but at least he is proven. It doesn't have to be him either. Revisiting Porcello or even Capuano would be another option provided we don't give up part of the future.
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--- williamjpellas wrote:


abitoutside wrote: The Loriano effect. This tells me that they are going to need more depth at AAA and they know it or they are buying an insurance policy for it. Calling Mr. Marcum, Mr. Marcum....


I like Marcum well enough in a vacuum, but didn't he miss time with a sore elbow last season?  He had Tommy John surgery in 2009 and missed the entire season.  He has a very respectable career resume and so you'll have to pay him some significant money, and I don't know that he is a good risk at this point.  I'd rather go with the kids than throw truckloads of cash at the likes of Marcum and Liriano, the more so because Cole will be here at some point in 2013, CHAЯLY is also due back, and meanwhile there is at least some depth (if unproven depth) with Wilson, McPherson, Locke, and Oliver.  

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Posted: 01/10/2013 8:05 AM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


Aren't you forgetting James McDonald?  Right now the top three in the rotation would be, in order, Burnett, Rodriguez, and McDonald.  I get what you are saying, though, don't get me wrong.  It would be better to work the young guys in one at a time over the next 2 to 3 seasons, with the idea being that they learn on the job at the back end of the rotation, then move up as the current veterans move on or retire.  Thus, by 2016, your rotation might be: Cole, Taillon, Wilson/McPherson/Locke, and one or two veterans acquired between now and then. 


Yes, I quite agree, it would be greatly preferred if only one, rather than two, young pitchers / rookies were being counted on for 2013 right out of the gate.  On the other hand, counting on rookie pitchers rarely seems to harm Oakland or Tampa Bay.  At some point you either trust your kids or you don't.  If the Pirates really believe in the young guns, then now is the time to play them.  If not, then package them with the likes of Tabata / Presley and some other kids in the lower minors, and go get another veteran arm.  One or the other.  Just make a decision and do it.
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Posted: 01/10/2013 8:13 AM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I doubt Huntington will go with both Locke and McPherson in the rotation right from the get go in a year in which he stands a good chance to be relieved of his duties should the team struggle. I'd imagine he brings in some kind of proven pitcher before the season starts.
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Posted: 01/10/2013 1:21 PM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


If Liriano does not end up on the team then I think its a lock that Gomez or Oliver is the 4th starter. I know it makes no sense but I fully believe that Oliver will start the year in the starting rotation. Now I believe we may see both Gomez and Oliver.

I also believe that the 7 million they were going to pay Liriano will not be used on another player.
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Posted: 01/10/2013 1:40 PM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 



vinnybravo wrote: If Liriano does not end up on the team then I think its a lock that Gomez or Oliver is the 4th starter. I know it makes no sense but I fully believe that Oliver will start the year in the starting rotation. Now I believe we may see both Gomez and Oliver.

I also believe that the 7 million they were going to pay Liriano will not be used on another player.

I'm with you re: Oliver, who was very highly thought of in the Tigers organization at one time.  He has problems with his control, but get that even somewhat straightened out and he's an absolute steal.
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Posted: 01/10/2013 2:54 PM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I am not forgetting that James McDonald was removed from the rotation at the end of the season. He goes into the 4-5 group in my estimation. The Tampa model typically brings guys up mid year, lets them get their feet wet and then does not really start counting on them until half way through their first full year a la Moore. This if effective and would have made a lot of sense had we done it last year or the year before. Instead we pitched Kevin Correia, Jeff Karstens and Eric Bedard even though we knew they were not part of the future.

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--- williamjpellas wrote:

Aren't you forgetting James McDonald?  Right now the top three in the rotation would be, in order, Burnett, Rodriguez, and McDonald.  I get what you are saying, though, don't get me wrong.  It would be better to work the young guys in one at a time over the next 2 to 3 seasons, with the idea being that they learn on the job at the back end of the rotation, then move up as the current veterans move on or retire.  Thus, by 2016, your rotation might be: Cole, Taillon, Wilson/McPherson/Locke, and one or two veterans acquired between now and then. 


Yes, I quite agree, it would be greatly preferred if only one, rather than two, young pitchers / rookies were being counted on for 2013 right out of the gate.  On the other hand, counting on rookie pitchers rarely seems to harm Oakland or Tampa Bay.  At some point you either trust your kids or you don't.  If the Pirates really believe in the young guns, then now is the time to play them.  If not, then package them with the likes of Tabata / Presley and some other kids in the lower minors, and go get another veteran arm.  One or the other.  Just make a decision and do it.

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Posted: 01/10/2013 6:45 PM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I am not forgetting that James McDonald was removed from the rotation at the end of the season. He goes into the 4-5 group in my estimation. The Tampa model typically brings guys up mid year, lets them get their feet wet and then does not really start counting on them until half way through their first full year a la Moore. This if effective and would have made a lot of sense had we done it last year or the year before. Instead we pitched Kevin Correia, Jeff Karstens and Eric Bedard even though we knew they were not part of the future.


Yeah, I'm not sure what to make of McDonald.  Everybody, including him, swears up and down that he wasn't hurt.  If not, he was a real head case last season.  As for Correia and Karstens, I had no problem with those two.  Bedard, not so much; he was more of a reach, though not a bad gamble on paper.  I think the biggest problem with him was not signing him in the first place, but rather how long they stuck with him, and after they cut him, how they basically refused to start McPherson or Wilson for the remainder of the season.  I'll say again that roster mismanagement by both Hurdle and Huntington was one of the biggest reasons for the Pirates' collapse in 2012. 
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Posted: 01/10/2013 10:10 PM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I think the problem with McDonald was the high pitch counts. Fangraphs did an article on him saying that his meltdown started to occur after he threw a career high 122 pitches. At that point his ERA was 2.19 on June 21st.

In all of 2011, McDonald threw 100 pitches 7 times. The June 21st game was the 8th time in 2012 that he crossed the 100 pitch mark. He ended up going over 100 pitches 14 times last year.

McDonald isn't really the workhorse type in my opinion. His pitches require a lot more effort because he relies so heavily on his slider. McDonald threw his slider 17.2% of the time last year and because that pitch is so tough on an arm a 122 pitch night is probably the equivalent of 145 pitches because of how hard that pitch is on your arm.
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Posted: 01/11/2013 7:02 AM

RE: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


I would not be surprised if McDonald has another great first half.  I would be surprised if he has even a good second half.
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Posted: 01/11/2013 7:12 AM

Re: Pirates trade Quincy Latimore for Jeanmar Gomez 


It is hard to know what to expect from JMac.  I don't think his problems were fatigue related, at least in the sense that his velocity went down significantly.  Fatigue may have played a role in pitch placement, as it is certainly the case that he did not spot the ball as well in the second half.
 
Part of the explanation could be that the league "caught up" with him to some extent.  In the second half, batters seemed to be looking for certain pitches in certain locations, and thus weren't fooled by them like they were in the first half.  To the extent that this is part of the explanation, JMac will need to make his own adjustments to get hitters off-stride again.

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