Free Trial Ad
Why Subscribe?
  • Player/Prospect News
  • Exclusive Insider Info
  • Members-Only Forums
  • Exclusive Videos
  • Subscribe Now!
Inbox
Reply to TopicPost New Topic
  Page of 7  Next >

Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit

Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 9:27 AM

Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Jon Heyman Jon HeymanVerified @ JonHeymanCBS 28m

# mets talked to AZ about upton/kubel. prospect/player price 2 high on @ JUS10UP10, kubel not perfect fit.

---------------------

Hard to judge without knowing what Arizona's demands were, but if true, I do like that Alderson and Co. are looking into starting outfielders rather than more platoon types like Cowgill.  Hopefully the search didn't end with just those two, and that they're looking at others.


Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 9:40 AM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Not interested in Kubel (can't really field), but Upton would've been nice. Hopefully this puts to rest the perception that the Met FO is just sitting on it's hands...they're clearly trying to upgrade this team with the right fits. And it's encouraging to know they inquired on a player who is making more than pennies and has a multi-year contract.


17 & 14 = Best Duo In NY Sports
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 9:50 AM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Happy to hear that they are looking for actual MLB players.... but probably leaves me a little more unclear regarding the direction of the team and the strategy....

What year is the focus on? What is the multi-year payroll budget forecast? Will the Mets be able to spend like a big market team within the next 5 years?
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 11:42 AM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


any discussion of deals for real players would mean the Mets would have to give up some arm prospects so if talk of any discussions is real then it might indicate a willingness to do so... I'll have to remain skeptical until something comes to pass.  I'm sure there are deals that could be made.
"Maybe it's time to make some moves."  - Sandy Alderson

Last edited 1/7/2013 12:12 PM by DuffyDyer

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 12:09 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


I think there's a snowball's chance in hell that the Mets would dig deep enough in terms of a prospect package to get Upton.  That said, I would hope they explore a deal nonetheless.  I see this as a buy low opportunity on a guy who is still very young who could be a long term piece for this team.  Even if we're punting on 2013, it makes sense to kick the tires on what it would cost to acquire Upton.  I'm 99% sure the cost will be too high but you have to at least consider it...
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 12:28 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


I would guess the Mets would give up a good package of players for Upton that did not include Harvey or Wheeler....although I bet Arizona, at the moment, is asking for at least one of those two.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 1:38 PM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


I've been slightly turned off to Upton ever since Harvey made him look like Brad Emaus that night, but he would still be a great fit for us. Hopefully SA keeps interest and the Mets end up as a fallback option.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 1:45 PM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 



spiritOF86 wrote: I've been slightly turned off to Upton ever since Harvey made him look like Brad Emaus that night, but he would still be a great fit for us. Hopefully SA keeps interest and the Mets end up as a fallback option.

Upton is a bit of a head scratcher I must admit.  That said, Harvey has the stuff to make even good hitters look bad from time to time.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 2:04 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


"I've been slightly turned off to Upton ever since Harvey made him look like Brad Emaus that night,"

A bit of a small sample size there?? He struck out twice and walked once vs Harvey is pretty meaningless compared to what he's done in 1000s of PAs otherwise.

Is it alarming that Yonder Alonso went 2-3 with a double and home run off of Harvey on August 5th?
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 5:55 PM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Well.....it's good that they tried to get a discussion going......it's reported that Arizona is looking for young pitching.....which the mets  are not exactly in a hurry to give up.    So doesn't seem like much of a match.  

I'd agree that Kubel is really not worth bringing in here......unless they traded him straight up for Josh Edgin.   

It really doesn't seem like the Mets are in a great position to do much to upgrade the OF in 2013 outside of low $  hope-for-the-best types.   


I would agree that the picture would be a little muddled if the Mets suddenly added some medium priced veterans to the squad out of nowhere.....
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 6:23 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 



erosen wrote: "I've been slightly turned off to Upton ever since Harvey made him look like Brad Emaus that night,"

A bit of a small sample size there?? He struck out twice and walked once vs Harvey is pretty meaningless compared to what he's done in 1000s of PAs otherwise.

Is it alarming that Yonder Alonso went 2-3 with a double and home run off of Harvey on August 5th?
What exactly has he done? He's been a K machine since he came into the league. He's never hit more then 31 HR's (more then 17 just twice), not a big base stealer, has historically been an error machine in the outfield, seems to have attitude and/or work ethic issues. Sure he's been a pretty good player with age and upside certainly on his side, but lets not hype his resume up too much here.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 9:28 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Well your wording made it sound like three PAs against a good young pitcher is a big factor.... my primary point that *no* three particular PAs have any significant meaning relative to thousands of others.


"He's been a K machine since he came into the league." Strikeouts have just about the same negative value as an average out [gives up nearly all possibility of advancing a runner, but that is countered by rare double/triple plays].

Of the 103 players since 2008 with 2500+ PAs, he's at #31 in terms of OBP, so while a large number of his outs may be strikeouts [12th highest rate], he is far better than average at not creating other kinds of outs.


"He's never hit more then 31 HR's (more then 17 just twice),"
And he's 39th [of 103, again] in ISO [and 31st in SLG] so he has shown his share of power.


"Not a big base stealer"
In this sample of players, he's 26th in SB, so again, well above average. His BSR is 20th, so he's also been a well above average base runner as far as advancing on hits, outs and errors.


"has historically been an error machine in the outfield"
He has a poor fielding percent. Sure. But his range factor is a bit above average, and UZR has him above average as well.

The UZR components have him with an arm well below average [ARM: amount of runs an outfielder saves by throwing out the expected amount of runners] and his negative error runs as worst in the league [ErrR: amount of runs he saves by his ability to prevent errors compared to an average fielder at the same position]. But the Range component has him in the top 15% and that is the biggest component [RngR: amount of runs above or below average a fielder is by determining the ability of a fielder to get to the expected batted balls in his zones].


"seems to have attitude and/or work ethic issues."
Maybe- not really my department. But I'll take 25 bad attitude players who have a lot of talent over a squad of 'team-players' without talent.

Last edited 1/7/2013 9:29 PM by erosen

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 9:55 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 



erosen wrote: Well your wording made it sound like three PAs against a good young pitcher is a big factor.... my primary point that *no* three particular PAs have any significant meaning relative to thousands of others.


"He's been a K machine since he came into the league." Strikeouts have just about the same negative value as an average out [gives up nearly all possibility of advancing a runner, but that is countered by rare double/triple plays].

Of the 103 players since 2008 with 2500+ PAs, he's at #31 in terms of OBP, so while a large number of his outs may be strikeouts [12th highest rate], he is far better than average at not creating other kinds of outs.


"He's never hit more then 31 HR's (more then 17 just twice),"
And he's 39th [of 103, again] in ISO [and 31st in SLG] so he has shown his share of power.


"Not a big base stealer"
In this sample of players, he's 26th in SB, so again, well above average. His BSR is 20th, so he's also been a well above average base runner as far as advancing on hits, outs and errors.


"has historically been an error machine in the outfield"
He has a poor fielding percent. Sure. But his range factor is a bit above average, and UZR has him above average as well.

The UZR components have him with an arm well below average [ARM: amount of runs an outfielder saves by throwing out the expected amount of runners] and his negative error runs as worst in the league [ErrR: amount of runs he saves by his ability to prevent errors compared to an average fielder at the same position]. But the Range component has him in the top 15% and that is the biggest component [RngR: amount of runs above or below average a fielder is by determining the ability of a fielder to get to the expected batted balls in his zones].


"seems to have attitude and/or work ethic issues."
Maybe- not really my department. But I'll take 25 bad attitude players who have a lot of talent over a squad of 'team-players' without talent.
Everything you say in this post makes sense except this, to me at least.  I would never be able to root for a team full of bad attitude players regardless of the win-loss outcome because basically i couldnt root for a team full of douches who dog it just bc they can at times.  To each his own i suppose.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/7/2013 10:10 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Do you watch baseball because you like to see players show off their amazing talents at the sport or because of the people they are outside of the sport?

If sports didn't exist, we wouldn't likely have any idea who David Wright is. He'd just be some guy you brushed by in a crowd [OK, he'd probably be an underwear model, so you probably still noticed him].

There has to be some give-and-take. Is Daniel Murphy a nice guy? I don't know- but lets say he is really, really nice. If the D'Backs offered Upton straight up for Murphy would you do it? If so, then I guess you'd trade some amount of personal attributes for talent as well...
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/7/2013 11:34 PM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 



erosen wrote: Do you watch baseball because you like to see players show off their amazing talents at the sport or because of the people they are outside of the sport?

If sports didn't exist, we wouldn't likely have any idea who David Wright is. He'd just be some guy you brushed by in a crowd [OK, he'd probably be an underwear model, so you probably still noticed him].

There has to be some give-and-take. Is Daniel Murphy a nice guy? I don't know- but lets say he is really, really nice. If the D'Backs offered Upton straight up for Murphy would you do it? If so, then I guess you'd trade some amount of personal attributes for talent as well...
I watch sports for a mixture of both.  I personally cant stand the athlete who thinks hes above the law or thinks he (or she) is "to cool for school".  Cant stand it as a matter of fact.

Not saying Upton is even close to this or anything like this, just sayin in general
Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/8/2013 9:09 AM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


I didn't mean to say that if Charles Manson could hit a curve ball that I'd want him on the Mets :) I also didn't mean the guy who tells the manager to go f--- himself when questioned why he didn't come to practice [even if he is so good that he doesn't need any].

I was thinking the kind of guy who might come off as a malcontent to the media when he refuses to answer some of their idiotic questions...

IDK-- to what degree are JUs attitude/social/mental problems?

Last edited 1/8/2013 9:10 AM by erosen

Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/8/2013 10:25 AM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


Kubel is a mouth breathing mammal who plays the outfield and hit 30 home runs last year.
The Mets don't have too many of those, do they?
Let's face it. If he were a right handed batter, you all would be screaming for the Mets to try to get him.

Later
"You spend a good part of your life gripping the baseball, and in the end it turns out it was the other way around all the time." Jim Bouton
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/8/2013 10:32 AM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 



NewMFS62 wrote: Kubel is a mouth breathing mammal who plays the outfield and hit 30 home runs last year.
The Mets don't have too many of those, do they?
Let's face it. If he were a right handed batter, you all would be screaming for the Mets to try to get him.

Later
no, bc the Mets aren't supposed to be a competitive team until some point in the future.  wink
"Maybe it's time to make some moves."  - Sandy Alderson

Last edited 1/8/2013 10:48 AM by DuffyDyer

Reply | Quote

Posted: 1/8/2013 10:43 AM

Re: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


DuffyDyer wrote:
no, bc the Mets aren't supposed to be a competitive team until some point in the future.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Maybe both.
thumbsup.gif


Later
"You spend a good part of your life gripping the baseball, and in the end it turns out it was the other way around all the time." Jim Bouton
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 1/8/2013 11:09 AM

RE: Heyman: Mets, Dbacks discussed Upton, Kubel; no fit 


I'm not a Kubel guy, whether he were RH or LH.

From 2010-2012 (last 383 games), he had a 2.6 fWAR.

Non-athlete, bad fielder, which is only likely to get worse now that he is on the wrong side of 30. I think we already have Kubel in Duda, except he'll be $8M cheaper. I would hate to trade an asset for Kubel. Better fantasy baseball option than real, IMO.


17 & 14 = Best Duo In NY Sports
Reply | Quote
Reply to TopicPost New Topic
  Page of 7  Next >