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Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13?

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Posted: 1/5/2013 8:38 AM

Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


http://metsblog.com/metsblog/2...-with-the-mets/

There is no one in the Mets organization who is talking about retaining Johan Santana beyond 2013, after which his contract expires, Bob Klapisch reports in the Bergen Record.

According to Klapisch, the Mets hope Santana can show that he’s healthy and productive so he can be traded this summer.

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Posted: 1/5/2013 9:19 AM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


Well, yeah. Hopefully during '13. Now that it's the final year of his contract, a hot start may lead to a trade. Mets will have to eat cash to get a good return, but hopefully they'll be willing to buy a top prospect that way.

I don't think it would be a horrible idea to resign Santana for '14+ at a reasonable price. I might extend a qualifying offer after a healthy season. I imagine there will be other teams willing to pay more and that the Mets will not be his first choice of destination.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 10:56 AM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


I hope he's gone. Don't think his body can pitch a full season anymore.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 11:01 AM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



danfran wrote: I hope he's gone. Don't think his body can pitch a full season anymore.

I wouldn't be so sure about that.  Santana has always been a great athlete.  He clearly dealt with some arm/shoulder fatigue late last season, but that doesn't mean he can't build his endurance back up.

I'm not saying I want to bring him back in 2014.  The only circumstance by which we'd want to bring him back is if he pitches really well next season, and if that happens he'll probably command more on the open market than we're willing to give.  Our best hope could be him having a great year and then signing for enough money to yield draft compensation.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 11:12 AM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


As right they should.. Right now in the state of the franchise thye obviously haven't even entertained the idea of anything that goes beyond the trade deadline of 2013... They signed Wright, because he fits the bill as the face of the franchise but everything and everyone else making more tha the league minimum is negotiable.

We have been so domesticated that we no longer think in terms of next season but rather 3 or 4 years down the line... Hopefully the promised land will be found before the prospects on which our expectations lie become arbitration eligible because if not we will be looking at a permanent fixture of developing players to trade for new prospects to generate the ilusion that we are going somewhere...

I shudder to think that the "what can we get" for Ike, or Niese posts will be replaced by "what can we get" for Harvey or Wheeler or Familia or anybody else for that matter.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 11:17 AM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



metdelsur wrote: As right they should.. Right now in the state of the franchise thye obviously haven't even entertained the idea of anything that goes beyond the trade deadline of 2013... They signed Wright, because he fits the bill as the face of the franchise but everything and everyone else making more tha the league minimum is negotiable.

We have been so domesticated that we no longer think in terms of next season but rather 3 or 4 years down the line... Hopefully the promised land will be found before the prospects on which our expectations lie become arbitration eligible because if not we will be looking at a permanent fixture of developing players to trade for new prospects to generate the ilusion that we are going somewhere...

I shudder to think that the "what can we get" for Ike, or Niese posts will be replaced by "what can we get" for Harvey or Wheeler or Familia or anybody else for that matter.

The "what can we get" for Ike and Niese posts had more to do with adding depth, short-term and long, than pushing back the goal posts.  Given the current state of the farm, there should be no need to trade Harvey or Wheeler at any point in our future because depth shouldn't be a major issue for long.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 12:43 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


The Sturm und Drang posts concerning the rebuilding effort are really blowing my mind more and more, because I'm genuinely starting to think that there are Mets fans who are convinced that the team is actively planning to be like the Pittsburgh Pirates for the next decade, and actively planning on keeping payroll at $60 million over that entire span.

John Adams: At a stage in life when other men prosper, I'm reduced to living in Philadelphia!
Mike "Doc" Emrick: THEY SCORE! HENRIQUE!! IT'S OVER!!!

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Posted: 1/5/2013 12:50 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



StelOgStem wrote: The Sturm und Drang posts concerning the rebuilding effort are really blowing my mind more and more, because I'm genuinely starting to think that there are Mets fans who are convinced that the team is actively planning to be like the Pittsburgh Pirates for the next decade, and actively planning on keeping payroll at $60 million over that entire span.

The constant longing for the status quo is truly baffling.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 12:57 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


Concerning Johan, I'd really hate to see him go, but what other option is there? Even if he has a great 2013 (which I think is entirely possible), even with all the money the Mets will have coming off the books, more than likely we'll still be entering the offseason needing to address multiple positions across the roster, spots that won't be filled right if Johan is given another huge contract.

I mean, we could get lucky: one of the young OF'ers might come into his own and at least provide a decent, cheap option going forward, the farm system might finally revitalize the bullpen, Wheeler and other young guns might stock up the rotation, and maybe all of the sudden there aren't quite so many holes to fill, making Johan more of an option to keep...but that's a lot of "mights".

John Adams: At a stage in life when other men prosper, I'm reduced to living in Philadelphia!
Mike "Doc" Emrick: THEY SCORE! HENRIQUE!! IT'S OVER!!!

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Posted: 1/5/2013 1:29 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


Due to time away from the surgery, like Beltran in '11 compared to '10... I think there's a good chance Santana is able to be a very productive and reasonably durable 180-190 IP SP this year.

We need our top projected producers to perform as such... if so, I think we'll have a decent chance at being a .500 team. As usual, in terms of W-L going into the season, I'm not as pessimistic as most seem to be. Last year's team wasn't a 74 W talent team... Just like the '11 squad wasn't a 77 W talent team.

"Seen It All"

loyal_Jues (IG)

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Posted: 1/5/2013 4:18 PM

RE: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


I think this paragraph from a recent Jeff Pasan column in Yahoo more or less sums up my feelings:

"The deeper the Mets sink, the more blame shifts to commissioner Bud Selig for allowing his good ol' boy network to supersede the health of a jewel franchise. The Dodgers' and Mets' financial troubles seemed to parallel one another, a big city team's cash flow going kaput before it spiraled into this sad shell of itself.

We see what's happening to the Dodgers. An owner with money bought them, and they're going to spend more on players this year than any team in sports history. The Mets, meanwhile, are trading for Collin Cowgill and calling that an offseason.

Which is to say nothing of Cowgill, a perfectly acceptable fourth or fifth outfielder. It's more to remind people how much owners matter, how a good one can make a franchise overnight, and how a bad one can break it down, piece by piece, until it is this, T substituted for S, a big, honking mess."

The key here is that a NL franchise in the city of New York is an amazing asset, and unless the Wilpon's find a "legal" way of generating returns similar to those amassed with their Madoff investments, IMO we will not see a major shift in the resourses dedicated to improve the on field performance. I know these types of comments are like beating a dead horse, things aren't going to change because of them so we´ll just have "stay calm and carry on" until something we have something concrete to base our opinions on.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 5:17 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


does Johan's contract have a no trade clause?




****************************************************************************************************

The best pitch is one that looks like a strike....................but it isn't.           Warren Spahn
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Posted: 1/5/2013 5:18 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



nickel7168 wrote: does Johan's contract have a no trade clause?
Excellent, and incredibly relavent question.
Mets trade away reigning CY Young award winner.
Still have the best pitcher in Baseball.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 5:23 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



DocK16 wrote:
StelOgStem wrote: The Sturm und Drang posts concerning the rebuilding effort are really blowing my mind more and more, because I'm genuinely starting to think that there are Mets fans who are convinced that the team is actively planning to be like the Pittsburgh Pirates for the next decade, and actively planning on keeping payroll at $60 million over that entire span.

The constant longing for the status quo is truly baffling.

On top of that, we will at some point next season be graduating D'Arnaud and Wheeler.  Trading Santana presents an opportunity to restock the system somewhat.
Mets trade away reigning CY Young award winner.
Still have the best pitcher in Baseball.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 6:01 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


Santana does have a full no-trade.  I guess, considering the money he is owed, a Santana deal becomes a possibility between the trade deadline and waiver trade deadline in August...if he is actually still healthy and pitching well.  I don't think the the no-trade would be a huge problem with only one month to go on his contract if he had an opportunity to go to the playoffs.  As for what he is owed, remember there is the $5.5 buyout on top of his $25M.  So, if he is traded on August 31, he is still owed $10M or so for a month + playoffs of service.

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Posted: 1/5/2013 6:03 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



MetsBeast wrote:

Santana does have a full no-trade.  I guess, considering the money he is owed, a Santana deal becomes a possibility between the trade deadline and waiver trade deadline in August...if he is actually still healthy and pitching well.  I don't think the the no-trade would be a huge problem with only one month to go on his contract if he had an opportunity to go to the playoffs.  As for what he is owed, remember there is the $5.5 buyout on top of his $25M.  So, if he is traded on August 31, he is still owed $10M or so for a month + playoffs of service.

Yeah, I'm glad that deal is just about over for us.
Mets trade away reigning CY Young award winner.
Still have the best pitcher in Baseball.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 6:10 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



MetsBeast wrote:

Santana does have a full no-trade.  I guess, considering the money he is owed, a Santana deal becomes a possibility between the trade deadline and waiver trade deadline in August...if he is actually still healthy and pitching well.  I don't think the the no-trade would be a huge problem with only one month to go on his contract if he had an opportunity to go to the playoffs.  As for what he is owed, remember there is the $5.5 buyout on top of his $25M.  So, if he is traded on August 31, he is still owed $10M or so for a month + playoffs of service.


What's the new criteria for draft compensation?  I assume if Santana has a strong 2013, some team will sign him for a year or two at $12-14M per.  Would that net us a compensatory pick?  If so, that's probably better than any prospect we'd get for him.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 6:25 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 


If the team extends a qualifying offer but the player signs with another team, then the team losing the player gets a sandwich pick. This year the qualifying offer was about $13.3M. Next year it will probably be closer to $14M.

So the Mets have to offer Santana $14M to pitch in 2014, then he has to sign with someone else for the Mets to get a draft pick.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 6:36 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



nickel7168 wrote: does Johan's contract have a no trade clause?
It doesn't matter. He's a 10 and 5 player, so he has no-trade rights now. I can't imagine a guy like him would possibly object to being traded to a contender down the stretch.
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Posted: 1/5/2013 7:12 PM

Re: Johan Santana: Done with Mets after '13? 



DocK16 wrote:
MetsBeast wrote:

Santana does have a full no-trade.  I guess, considering the money he is owed, a Santana deal becomes a possibility between the trade deadline and waiver trade deadline in August...if he is actually still healthy and pitching well.  I don't think the the no-trade would be a huge problem with only one month to go on his contract if he had an opportunity to go to the playoffs.  As for what he is owed, remember there is the $5.5 buyout on top of his $25M.  So, if he is traded on August 31, he is still owed $10M or so for a month + playoffs of service.


What's the new criteria for draft compensation?  I assume if Santana has a strong 2013, some team will sign him for a year or two at $12-14M per.  Would that net us a compensatory pick?  If so, that's probably better than any prospect we'd get for him.
See TTW's post above...there is no chance the Mets offer a QO.  The only way the Mets get a "good" player for Santana is if they trade him around early to mid June and eat about $20M.  I don't see how they could do that.  Maybe I can see them trading him August 31st for a C prospect if they offer to pay the $5.5M buyout, essentially costing the team acquiring him a C prospect and $4.5M for a month + playoffs of Santana.
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