It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW has won 10 straight and that Bo has their number.
For me, IU vs UW and UW vs MSU in bball are the equal of UW vs osu or Iowa/minny in football. Losing is not an option. This rivalry has grown over the years to the point where IU needs to win one to let us know that their number isn't in Bo's pocket anymore.
I expect a great game, and am hoping that UW's defense and rebounding propels them to yet another W and sole possession of first place in the B1G.
My prediction is 68-64 good guys :)
Onwisconsin

Wisconsinfan77 wrote: It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW has won 10 straight and that Bo has their number.
For me, IU vs UW and UW vs MSU in bball are the equal of UW vs osu or Iowa/minny in football. Losing is not an option. This rivalry has grown over the years to the point where IU needs to win one to let us know that their number isn't in Bo's pocket anymore.
I expect a great game, and am hoping that UW's defense and rebounding propels them to yet another W and sole possession of first place in the B1G.
My prediction is 68-64 good guys :)
Onwisconsin

IU has never been a big basketball rival of UW. MSU and OSU have been rivals over this decade. Illinois right there. Iowa and Minnesota traditional rivals in all sports. Michigan and Northwestern have probably been bigger rivals. Bo has dominated the series with IU over the last decade. What would make IU a rival?

Most UW fans don't care for the current IU coach and what he stands for. That does not make the two programs a top rivalry. This would be a big upset for UW.

I suppose, from the strictest of definitions, that there is a rivalry between IU and UW, but I don't see it as a RIVALRY, especially from IU's perspective.  I think their RIVALRIES are with Purdue, Ohio State and Kentucky (who they should again be playing home and away, which Crean is afraid of).  And I see our "rivalries" as being with Mich State, Marquette and perhaps Illinois and/or Minnesota.  Having said that, I reckon Crean may see himself as having a rivalry with Bo.

Ummm get your facts straight. IU offered a home and away game. Kentucky wanted off campus so IU offered home and away and then two off campus game. Kentucky and Cal are the ones that are afraid.

RacineRed wrote: Kentucky (who they should again be playing home and away, which Crean is afraid of). 

You got that one wrong. IU wanted to keep the series home and away. Kentucky and Cal wanted to go neutral which is why the series ended. The series has done a bit of both over the years. If you want to spin it, it could be said that Crean thought there was no way for IU to win any if it was always neutral.

Lot's of things to rip on Crean for, but this is not one of them.

I should add PU as another school that has had something of a rivalry for the UW over the last decade. Probably similar to Illinois.

The Locker room door has had more of a rivalry with Crean than UW lately- took a big blow but got the last shot in.

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--- IUBadger wrote:

RacineRed wrote: Kentucky (who they should again be playing home and away, which Crean is afraid of). 

You got that one wrong. IU wanted to keep the series home and away. Kentucky and Cal wanted to go neutral which is why the series ended. The series has done a bit of both over the years. If you want to spin it, it could be said that Crean thought there was no way for IU to win any if it was always neutral.

Lot's of things to rip on Crean for, but this is not one of them.

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Really? I'll have to speak with my KY friend. It really doesn't matter, though - Crean/Calipari or Calipari/ Crean

RacineRed wrote:

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--- IUBadger wrote:

You got that one wrong. IU wanted to keep the series home and away. Kentucky and Cal wanted to go neutral which is why the series ended. The series has done a bit of both over the years. If you want to spin it, it could be said that Crean thought there was no way for IU to win any if it was always neutral.

Lot's of things to rip on Crean for, but this is not one of them.

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Really? I'll have to speak with my KY friend. It really doesn't matter, though - Crean/Calipari or Calipari/ Crean

It's a fact, Jack.  Kentucky was the one that ended the series.  After they stopped the series, IU made one last attempt to re-negotiate the series one more time. On May 10,  2011, Kentucky rejected IU's request to keep the series alive.\

The Bloomington Indiana newspaper published a story in which the newspaper talked about getting a copy of the letter that Fred Glass (IU's AD) sent to Kentucky, trying to keep the series alive.

Once again Wisconsin fans spin in attempts to attack IU in reality, brings me to this site with the facts.

Don't believe me ?  Then read this link from a Kentucky tv station.....http://www.lex18.com/news/indiana-trie d-to-re-negotiate-with-uk-to-keep-series-alive

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--- milehiiu wrote:

RacineRed wrote:

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--- IUBadger wrote:

You got that one wrong. IU wanted to keep the series home and away. Kentucky and Cal wanted to go neutral which is why the series ended. The series has done a bit of both over the years. If you want to spin it, it could be said that Crean thought there was no way for IU to win any if it was always neutral.

Lot's of things to rip on Crean for, but this is not one of them.

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Really? I'll have to speak with my KY friend. It really doesn't matter, though - Crean/Calipari or Calipari/ Crean

It's a fact, Jack.  Kentucky was the one that ended the series.  After they stopped the series, IU made one last attempt to re-negotiate the series one more time. On May 10,  2011, Kentucky rejected IU's request to keep the series alive.\

The Bloomington Indiana newspaper published a story in which the newspaper talked about getting a copy of the letter that Fred Glass (IU's AD) sent to Kentucky, trying to keep the series alive.

Once again Wisconsin fans spin in attempts to attack IU in reality, brings me to this site with the facts.

Don't believe me ?  Then read this link from a Kentucky tv station.....www.lex18.com/news/indiana-trie d-to-re-negotiate-with-uk-to-keep-series-alive

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Whoa, big fella (or gal)! I believe you. Just saying Ky fans have their own spin. I really don't care as both are coached my moral cripples. As for the subject, i. e. rivalries, it's too bad. KY-IN is one of the top couple

The Clap hasn't beaten Wisconsin since he's been there.

You guys take so much pride from Bo's record against IU during Crean's tenure as if Crean underachieved by failing to beat UW with a team of walk ons.  Good lord.  Crean's first 3 years at IU were IU's worst teams in decades.  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson.  He inherited Kyle Taber.  If you see Bo's wins in that time over Crean as indicative of anything you're setting the bar way too low.

What's odd to me is that you don't even have to rely on the last few years where the talent was so ridiculously uneven (exclusing a year ago).  Bo had a winning record against Crean when he was at Marquette.  At least there you can point to two competitive programs and comparable talent levels.

Seeing as how Wisconsin has been my home for going on 20 years, and I have two kids that say they are going to be Badgers when they go to college I've grown to look at UW as my 2nd favorite Big Ten Team.  I always root for UW except when they play Indiana.

I don't think the two fan bases as a whole hate each other any more than the fan bases of any other Big Ten University.  Looking at things on the internet, though, is a bit different.  Those of us on these sites, are a little more "fanatical" than the average fan.  

I am hoping for a great game, and for no body to get hurt.  Well.... also for IU to win. :)

You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

breadtree wrote: You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

I don't care what they were ranked when Bo's predecessor recruited them, they were terrific college players and Bo absolutely benefited from starting his program with them as freshmen (in MW's case, a rs freshman).  Do you seriously want to argue otherwise, or that the team Crean trotted out his first year in Bloomington was comparable?

The rivalries seem to shift year to year depending on the teams fighting it out at the top of the league. Since UW has been in the top 4 every year in the last 10+ years, they have had to deal with shifting "rivalries". OSU & Michigan were down for a while and not on the UW radar but since those coaches came along and started to win they have become rivals. MSU has pretty much been a constant. IU and Minny are just now coming up with competitive teams so now they are rivals. Hopefully UW can keep up their end of the bargain.

I just love the argument from fans that goes, 'oh, yeah, well, we were terrible for those 4 years.'  Congrats on being terrible then, I guess.

You can hype up Wilkinson and Harris in retrospect all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that they weren't any more heavily recruited than Dumes, Jones III, or Nick Williams.  Ryan has to get some credit for developing them.  Wisconsin was widely predicted to finish last in the Big Ten in Bo's first year.  The PG, Travon Davis, had FG %ages of 17, 38, and 33 in his 3 years prior to that year to go along with turnover percentages in the 20s.  

What Bo did in his first year in Madison was remarkable.

Here's an awesome summary of what UW was facing that first year:

Wisconsin began the season with just one starter returning from last year’s squad (Kirk Penney) and only two other players that had played more than five minutes a game last year (Charlie Wills and Travon Davis). After the departure of five seniors (with 558 career games played between them) and the transfer of guard Ricky Bower (14.0 mpg. last year) the Badgers were left with a young roster.  Then before the season started, sophomore Julian Swartz left the team (later transferred to UW-Green Bay), freshman guard Latrell Fleming was diagnosed with a career-ending heart ailment and freshman  forward Andreas Helmigk suffered a season-ending knee injury. That left the UW with just eight healthy scholarship players, five of whom had never played more than 13 minutes in a collegiate game, on its 2001-02 roster

http://www.uwbadgers.com/pdfs/2385.pdf

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--- MDBucky wrote:

The rivalries seem to shift year to year depending on the teams fighting it out at the top of the league. Since UW has been in the top 4 every year in the last 10+ years, they have had to deal with shifting "rivalries". OSU & Michigan were down for a while and not on the UW radar but since those coaches came along and started to win they have become rivals. MSU has pretty much been a constant. IU and Minny are just now coming up with competitive teams so now they are rivals. Hopefully UW can keep up their end of the bargain.

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Extremely broad definition of a rivalry.

I'm just going to savior this statement for a sec.  An Indiana fan stating as a cold hard fact that they simply did not match up in any way to the talent level at Wisconsin.  INDIANA just doesn't have the horses to keep up with WISCONSIN in basketball.  Priceless.

BTB wrote:

breadtree wrote: You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

I don't care what they were ranked when Bo's predecessor recruited them, they were terrific college players and Bo absolutely benefited from starting his program with them as freshmen (in MW's case, a rs freshman).  Do you seriously want to argue otherwise, or that the team Crean trotted out his first year in Bloomington was comparable?

bigdsrip wrote: I'm just going to savior this statement for a sec.  An Indiana fan stating as a cold hard fact that they simply did not match up in any way to the talent level at Wisconsin.  INDIANA just doesn't have the horses to keep up with WISCONSIN in basketball.  Priceless.

BTB wrote:

breadtree wrote: You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

I don't care what they were ranked when Bo's predecessor recruited them, they were terrific college players and Bo absolutely benefited from starting his program with them as freshmen (in MW's case, a rs freshman).  Do you seriously want to argue otherwise, or that the team Crean trotted out his first year in Bloomington was comparable?

Be prepared to hear it again in a few years when the cycle repeats itself as Clappy is shown the door (unintentionally this time) for stepping over the line he is constantly tiptoeing.

breadtree wrote: I just love the argument from fans that goes, 'oh, yeah, well, we were terrible for those 4 years.'  Congrats on being terrible then, I guess.

You can hype up Wilkinson and Harris in retrospect all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that they weren't any more heavily recruited than Dumes, Jones III, or Nick Williams.  Ryan has to get some credit for developing them.  Wisconsin was widely predicted to finish last in the Big Ten in Bo's first year.  The PG, Travon Davis, had FG %ages of 17, 38, and 33 in his 3 years prior to that year to go along with turnover percentages in the 20s.  

What Bo did in his first year in Madison was remarkable.

This and your following post hit the nail on the head.  The other thing about that team was that they won their share of the title by beating every single team in the league.  It wasn't a product of schedule in that regard.  

It's also easy to look back at the Bennett/early Bo UW teams through the lens of the past 10+ years and underestimate what happened at UW starting with a little success under Stu Jackson and moving forward.  Nothing that that team did was preordained, nor were they working off a platform of decades of tradition and success.  There are lots and lots of programs that have nice runs of a handful of years and then fall back into the pack.  That could easily have happenned at UW, but it didn't.  If it was going to, that would have been the year that the slip started.    Instead, things got better.

Wisconsinfan77 wrote: It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW ...Onwisconsin

I believe I understand the nature of your post, but i do object to rash generalizations that include me. 

I am a UW fan and I don't hate Crean.  I don't respect him either.  So, going forward, if you want to speak on my behalf, please susbstitute the words "not respect" when you want to say "hate."  Hate implies that one is being irrational due to being consumed by an emotion.  IU fans will pull the "if you didn't hate him so much you would see ..." line, when they are blind to his shortcomings as well.  Who knows, he might gain my respect someday?

Enough of the soap box ... carry on.

turomon wrote:

Wisconsinfan77 wrote: It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW ...Onwisconsin

I believe I understand the nature of your post, but i do object to rash generalizations that include me. 

I am a UW fan and I don't hate Crean.  I don't respect him either.  So, going forward, if you want to speak on my behalf, please susbstitute the words "not respect" when you want to say "hate."  Hate implies that one is being irrational due to being consumed by an emotion.  IU fans will pull the "if you didn't hate him so much you would see ..." line, when they are blind to his shortcomings as well.  Who knows, he might gain my respect someday?

Enough of the soap box ... carry on.

Absolutely excellent reply. Thanks

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--- turomon wrote:

Wisconsinfan77 wrote: It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW ...Onwisconsin

I believe I understand the nature of your post, but i do object to rash generalizations that include me. 

I am a UW fan and I don't hate Crean.  I don't respect him either.  So, going forward, if you want to speak on my behalf, please susbstitute the words "not respect" when you want to say "hate."  Hate implies that one is being irrational due to being consumed by an emotion.  IU fans will pull the "if you didn't hate him so much you would see ..." line, when they are blind to his shortcomings as well.  Who knows, he might gain my respect someday?

Enough of the soap box ... carry on.

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Agreed. I liked IU under Knight and Davis. Much of that had to do with the way the program was run. I assumed that is how IU fans wanted their program to be viewed. The turned out to be a complete misconception on my part as we learned with the Sampson hire and defense of his actions by IU fans. It is clear IU fans have a win at all costs mentality.

breadtree wrote: I just love the argument from fans that goes, 'oh, yeah, well, we were terrible for those 4 years.'  Congrats on being terrible then, I guess.

You can hype up Wilkinson and Harris in retrospect all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that they weren't any more heavily recruited than Dumes, Jones III, or Nick Williams.  Ryan has to get some credit for developing them.  Wisconsin was widely predicted to finish last in the Big Ten in Bo's first year.  The PG, Travon Davis, had FG %ages of 17, 38, and 33 in his 3 years prior to that year to go along with turnover percentages in the 20s.  

What Bo did in his first year in Madison was remarkable.

I too think that Bo did a great job in his first year but you can't deny that he had an NBA lottery pick on that team and that Harris was really good as a freshman.  For you to compare him to Jones, Dumes or Nick Williams as if Bo would have turned them into lottery picks tels me all I need to know about your hoops knowledge.

breadtree wrote: Here's an awesome summary of what UW was facing that first year:

Wisconsin began the season with just one starter returning from last year’s squad (Kirk Penney) and only two other players that had played more than five minutes a game last year (Charlie Wills and Travon Davis). After the departure of five seniors (with 558 career games played between them) and the transfer of guard Ricky Bower (14.0 mpg. last year) the Badgers were left with a young roster.  Then before the season started, sophomore Julian Swartz left the team (later transferred to UW-Green Bay), freshman guard Latrell Fleming was diagnosed with a career-ending heart ailment and freshman  forward Andreas Helmigk suffered a season-ending knee injury. That left the UW with just eight healthy scholarship players, five of whom had never played more than 13 minutes in a collegiate game, on its 2001-02 roster

http://www.uwbadgers.com/pdfs/2385.pdf

Thanks for that.  I forgot that he also inherited Kirk Penney.  That kid was also miles better than anyone Crean inherited.  Harris, Penney and Wilkinson.  Pretty solid core to begin with, even if inexperienced.  Having said all that, Bo did a masterful job with that team.

bigdsrip wrote: I'm just going to savior this statement for a sec.  An Indiana fan stating as a cold hard fact that they simply did not match up in any way to the talent level at Wisconsin.  INDIANA just doesn't have the horses to keep up with WISCONSIN in basketball.  Priceless.

BTB wrote:

breadtree wrote: You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

I don't care what they were ranked when Bo's predecessor recruited them, they were terrific college players and Bo absolutely benefited from starting his program with them as freshmen (in MW's case, a rs freshman).  Do you seriously want to argue otherwise, or that the team Crean trotted out his first year in Bloomington was comparable?

How is this newsworthy?  IU's program fell apart under Sampson and was left to start from scratch.  IU's talent level didn't match up to any team in the conference or to any other team in any BCS conference for that matter.  Have you guys seriously forgotten how bad it was after Sampson? IU fans haven't.

GratephulRed wrote:

bigdsrip wrote: I'm just going to savior this statement for a sec.  An Indiana fan stating as a cold hard fact that they simply did not match up in any way to the talent level at Wisconsin.  INDIANA just doesn't have the horses to keep up with WISCONSIN in basketball.  Priceless.

BTB wrote:

breadtree wrote: You mean consensus 3* recruits?  Great point.

BTB wrote:  Crean didn't inherit Devin Harris and Mike Wilkinson. 

I don't care what they were ranked when Bo's predecessor recruited them, they were terrific college players and Bo absolutely benefited from starting his program with them as freshmen (in MW's case, a rs freshman).  Do you seriously want to argue otherwise, or that the team Crean trotted out his first year in Bloomington was comparable?

Be prepared to hear it again in a few years when the cycle repeats itself as Clappy is shown the door (unintentionally this time) for stepping over the line he is constantly tiptoeing.

Wishful thinking?  Don't blame you.  Crean's got things rolling.

redforeman62 wrote:

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--- turomon wrote:

Wisconsinfan77 wrote: It seems as though both of our fanbases just can't stand each other, UW fans hate crean And IU fans hate that UW ...Onwisconsin

I believe I understand the nature of your post, but i do object to rash generalizations that include me. 

I am a UW fan and I don't hate Crean.  I don't respect him either.  So, going forward, if you want to speak on my behalf, please susbstitute the words "not respect" when you want to say "hate."  Hate implies that one is being irrational due to being consumed by an emotion.  IU fans will pull the "if you didn't hate him so much you would see ..." line, when they are blind to his shortcomings as well.  Who knows, he might gain my respect someday?

Enough of the soap box ... carry on.

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Agreed. I liked IU under Knight and Davis. Much of that had to do with the way the program was run. I assumed that is how IU fans wanted their program to be viewed. The turned out to be a complete misconception on my part as we learned with the Sampson hire and defense of his actions by IU fans. It is clear IU fans have a win at all costs mentality.

I love the sweeping generalizations about fan bases.  So well thought out.  Thanks so much Red.