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From the combine...fyi
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Posted: 2/22/2013 9:09 AM
From the combine...fyi
Travis Frederick, 6'4", 312 pounds, 33 arm length, projected round 2.
Ricky Wagner, 6'6", 308 pounds, 34 arm length, projected 5-6 round.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 9:20 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
Wait, I thought they were supposed to be college football's best C and LT duo?
Best of luck to them both in the draft and future careers.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 9:26 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
In late August, CFN had wagner as its number one OT and TF as its number one interior OL. Kiper and others had him highly rated as well.
I think wagners alleged poor sr bowl practices and TF's move from OC to OG in the NFL likely dropped them a bit. Still, an OG who goes in high 2nd round is a top 2-3 OG coming in.
hard to figure whey wagner dropped though he had some trouble vs some good DEs. (big ten had arguably the best bookends in the nation in simon and gholston)
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Posted: 2/22/2013 9:27 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
badgerpaw wrote: Travis Frederick, 6'4", 312 pounds, 33 arm length, projected round 2.
Ricky Wagner, 6'6", 308 pounds, 34 arm length, projected 5-6 round. Seems about right to me. Frederick might just slip into the 1st round if someone is focused on a versatile lineman that can play Center. Wagner, 1st round all-everything, nah. He was good but not great. I think he's got the athletic ability though to get significantly better in time. Somebody could get lucky with this pick. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 9:34 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
buckyfever1 wrote: In late August, CFN had wagner as its number one OT and TF as its number one interior OL. Kiper and others had him highly rated as well.
I think wagners alleged poor sr bowl practices and TF's move from OC to OG in the NFL likely dropped them a bit. Still, an OG who goes in high 2nd round is a top 2-3 OG coming in.
hard to figure whey wagner dropped though he had some trouble vs some good DEs. (big ten had arguably the best bookends in the nation in simon and gholston) Wagner's less than stellar senior season didn't help him much either. He never really made much of a jump from his SOPHOMORE season. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 10:20 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
buckyfever1 wrote:
hard to figure whey wagner dropped though he had some trouble vs some good DEs. (big ten had arguably the best bookends in the nation in simon and gholston) phhhhbt. any guesses as to how many SEC DEs get drafted before either of those guys? And that's among draftable players only, Clowney at SC is better than all of them. And to answer my own question, I'm going to guess five.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 10:20 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
UnknownBadger wrote:
badgerpaw wrote: Travis Frederick, 6'4", 312 pounds, 33 arm length, projected round 2.
Ricky Wagner, 6'6", 308 pounds, 34 arm length, projected 5-6 round. Seems about right to me. Frederick might just slip into the 1st round if someone is focused on a versatile lineman that can play Center. Wagner, 1st round all-everything, nah. He was good but not great. I think he's got the athletic ability though to get significantly better in time. Somebody could get lucky with this pick.
A second-round Center is very, very good draft position. A low first-round Guard would also be very good.
Wagner down that low is a little surprising. I don't see him as a 1-2 round OT, but 3-4 is legit. 5-6? That's low.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 10:33 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
buckyfever1 wrote: In late August, CFN had wagner as its number one OT and TF as its number one interior OL. Kiper and others had him highly rated as well.
I think wagners alleged poor sr bowl practices and TF's move from OC to OG in the NFL likely dropped them a bit. Still, an OG who goes in high 2nd round is a top 2-3 OG coming in.
hard to figure whey wagner dropped though he had some trouble vs some good DEs. (big ten had arguably the best bookends in the nation in simon and gholston) it just goes to show people don't really watch OL play as closely as they tihnk they do and make blanket statements based on one series they watched or one bad play. When Montee BAll is continuoulsy running for 7-8-20 yards at a pop, nobody is watching the O'lineman but when a play is stopped for no gain, 'It's did you see Mtthias get pushed back there? DId you see HAvenstein knocked back? Frankly, it's often a popularity contest and Badger fans just love a whipping boy, especially on the O'line.. Wagner wasn't great all season, fortunately, CAirmi played agianst all the good DE"s in the league and they all left for the NFL 2 years ago. LOL |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 11:53 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
Clowney is a league of his own but as a tandem, Simon and Gholston were RIDICULOUS. one could argue simon kept osu from losses to UW in both 2011/12(And then there were the zebras in 12,  ) I dont know how simon projects but imo, he was the best player we saw last year in terms of a one man wrecking crew. people can take shots at RH all they want for his 2012 vs this duo but Simon destroyed josh oglesby and JO was first team COACHES all big ten in 2011 |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 11:54 AM
RE: From the combine...fyi
Still #58 would be a value pick in the 5th.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 12:42 PM
RE: From the combine...fyi
buckyfever1 wrote: Clowney is a league of his own but as a tandem, Simon and Gholston were RIDICULOUS. They aren't on the same team, so I don't know what you mean by tandem. In 2011 Gholston did nothing and then he beat Havenstein like a rented mule this year. Not that impressive.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 12:46 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Travis Frederick will be a much better guard than a center at the next level.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 12:49 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Wispak wrote: Travis Frederick will be a much better guard than a center at the next level. I think so too, wispak, but it will not surprise me if he sees time at both during his time as a pro. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 2:44 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Wagner has some tools but I never saw it translate to the level of play justifying how highly some had him rated. I always wondered what I was missing. "It's a great day to be great!" Greg Jennings 2/6/11
SNC - D3 Men's Hockey National Champs
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Posted: 2/22/2013 3:19 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
mwingb wrote:Wagner has some tools but I never saw it translate to the level of play justifying how highly some had him rated. I always wondered what I was missing. Nothing, he did a decent job at RT, and a couple people here combined that performance with his agility and determined that he was now the next great Wisconsin LT. Since then they have refused to admit that they just may have gotten carried away with their pie-in-the sky prediction. Not surprisingly the same one's do it over and over and then come up with all sorts of excuses and "if only's" why things went wrong. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 4:13 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
When 3 top draft analysts have RW as the #1-2 LT in fall 2012, I guess a few badger fans who.................. 1. Watch no film 2. never played the game 3. Snipe vs ADD ANY PROACTIVE ANALYSIS yea, they knew better than 3 guys who do this 24/7 and talk to scouts/GM"S all week  RW was at worst a top 15-20 pick in August and then, had an averge sr year/sr bowl he will play alot longer in the league than GC will imo |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 4:18 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Agree with this and 5cent. Don't see wags lasting until round 5. Bacchus1 wrote:
UnknownBadger wrote:
badgerpaw wrote: Travis Frederick, 6'4", 312 pounds, 33 arm length, projected round 2.
Ricky Wagner, 6'6", 308 pounds, 34 arm length, projected 5-6 round. Seems about right to me. Frederick might just slip into the 1st round if someone is focused on a versatile lineman that can play Center. Wagner, 1st round all-everything, nah. He was good but not great. I think he's got the athletic ability though to get significantly better in time. Somebody could get lucky with this pick.
A second-round Center is very, very good draft position. A low first-round Guard would also be very good.
Wagner down that low is a little surprising. I don't see him as a 1-2 round OT, but 3-4 is legit. 5-6? That's low.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 4:56 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Bench reps
Frederick 21
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/travis-frederi ck?id=2540161
Wagner 20
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/ricky-wagner?i d=2539340
Last edited 2/22/2013 4:57 PM by NewerBreed
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Posted: 2/22/2013 5:56 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
NewerBreed wrote: Bench reps
Frederick 21
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/travis-frederi ck?id=2540161
Wagner 20
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/ricky-wagner?i d=2539340 Not great but acceptable. They both lost weight since the season ended, i always see worse bench results by kids who train to be quicker and lighter for the combine. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 6:18 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Barely acceptable-need to show some quicks.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 6:43 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
ajmadison wrote:
NewerBreed wrote: Bench reps
Frederick 21
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/travis-frederi ck?id=2540161
Wagner 20
http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/ricky-wagner?i d=2539340 Not great but acceptable.
They both lost weight since the season ended, i always see worse bench results by kids who train to be quicker and lighter for the combine. Re: Weight loss. How do you know they both lost weight. You can't believe the numbers posted on the official roster. |
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Posted: 2/22/2013 7:06 PM
Re: From the combine...fyi
They look slimmer too.
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Posted: 2/23/2013 8:41 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Frederick's numbers surprise me. I expected much more - maybe around 30 reps.
I expected more from Wagner as well, but not as many more reps as I did from Frederick.
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Posted: 2/23/2013 8:52 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Frederick 40 Yard dash 5.50
Armstead from Arkansas Pine Bluff is really putting up freaky metrics.
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Posted: 2/23/2013 8:54 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
UnknownBadger wrote:
mwingb wrote:Wagner has some tools but I never saw it translate to the level of play justifying how highly some had him rated. I always wondered what I was missing. Nothing, he did a decent job at RT, and a couple people here combined that performance with his agility and determined that he was now the next great Wisconsin LT. Since then they have refused to admit that they just may have gotten carried away with their pie-in-the sky prediction.
Not surprisingly the same one's do it over and over and then come up with all sorts of excuses and "if only's" why things went wrong. What a bunch of unadulterated BS. If a "couple of posters here" determined he was the next great Wisconsin LT it's only because Bret Bielema was leading that bandwagon. When asked about Wagner being discussed as a potential first round draft pick Bret told the media that he expected Ricky to make a huge jump his second year removed from moving from RT to LT. Posters didn't pull that out of thin air. That was the conventional wisdom coming out of the football offices at the time. http://host.madison.com/sports/college/video/biele ma-discusses-wagner-and-borland/vmix_53545c36-d77e -11e1-9627-001a4bcf887a.html Bret telling the media during the 2012 season that Wagner falls somewhere between Joe Thomas and Gabe Carimi talent wise. http://host.madison.com/sports/college/video/biele ma-rick-wagner-s-best-football-is-ahead-of-him/vmi x_60133f20-2867-11e2-b765-0019bb2963f4.html
Last edited 2/23/2013 9:00 AM by madbadger
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Posted: 2/23/2013 8:56 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Frederick's testing so far is similar to Moffitt's in 2011.
http://www.nfl.com/draft/2011/profiles/john-moffit t?id=2495204
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Posted: 2/23/2013 9:06 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Of the B1G O-linemen, the guy that stands out so far appears to be Fragel from tOSU. He put up 33 reps in the BP and has an unofficial 5.09 40yd at 6-8 308.
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Posted: 2/23/2013 9:07 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
badgerman27 wrote: Frederick's numbers surprise me. I expected much more - maybe around 30 reps.
I expected more from Wagner as well, but not as many more reps as I did from Frederick. It doesn't surprise me. Herbert didn't focus on guys throwing weights around during his time in Madison. His focus was building functional strength through non traditional exercises. During his time in Madison our O-linemen never put up gaudy BP numbers at the combine. |
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Posted: 2/23/2013 9:12 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
Zeitler and Watt (D-line) did.
Last edited 2/23/2013 9:13 AM by NewerBreed
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Posted: 2/23/2013 9:30 AM
Re: From the combine...fyi
madbadger wrote:
UnknownBadger wrote:
mwingb wrote:Wagner has some tools but I never saw it translate to the level of play justifying how highly some had him rated. I always wondered what I was missing. Nothing, he did a decent job at RT, and a couple people here combined that performance with his agility and determined that he was now the next great Wisconsin LT. Since then they have refused to admit that they just may have gotten carried away with their pie-in-the sky prediction.
Not surprisingly the same one's do it over and over and then come up with all sorts of excuses and "if only's" why things went wrong. What a bunch of unadulterated BS. If a "couple of posters here" determined he was the next great Wisconsin LT it's only because Bret Bielema was leading that bandwagon.
When asked about Wagner being discussed as a potential first round draft pick Bret told the media that he expected Ricky to make a huge jump his second year removed from moving from RT to LT. Posters didn't pull that out of thin air. That was the conventional wisdom coming out of the football offices at the time.
http://host.madison.com/sports/college/video/biele ma-discusses-wagner-and-borland/vmix_53545c36-d77e -11e1-9627-001a4bcf887a.html
Bret telling the media during the 2012 season that Wagner falls somewhere between Joe Thomas and Gabe Carimi talent wise.
http://host.madison.com/sports/college/video/biele ma-rick-wagner-s-best-football-is-ahead-of-him/vmi x_60133f20-2867-11e2-b765-0019bb2963f4.html I agree 100%! You never could trust what Bielema was telling the media. He was kinda like a few here in that those he praised were going to be all everything. Wagner was and has a lot of potential but it's not realized yet. Unfortunately it seems you and others didn't learn that until way too late. Gilreath, Doe, Garner, are others. There are more. BTW, I actually do think that Gilreath's productivity was hampered by injury AND Special Teams that were poorly coached for much of his career. BB didn't do him justice.
Last edited 2/23/2013 9:41 AM by UnknownBadger
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