I found a treasure the other day in TKC's basement. A media guide from that season as well as a program from the Temple game played on Jan 6, 1971. I was 6 then and turned 7 about the time Joyce out jumped Dedmon and won the ACC.
That was probably the happiest I have been as a sports fan, certainly as a child until Sid Bream slid into home plate when the Braves beat the Pirates to the win the 92 pennant. I felt similarly when David Greene threw a late 4th down TD pass to beat Auburn and win UGA the SEC East in 2002.

This was the first season that I remember fully as a fan. I remember the win at Austin Carr and Notre Dame. I remember listening to the Holiday Festival on the radio when the Cocks won the tournament beating future NBAer, center Jim McDaniel and a highly ranked Western Kentucky team. I can even recall that Roche and at least Joyce made the all tournament team. I remember the fight when Ribock slugged Lefty. I watched it on tv, just like I did the Davidson game. I remember Roche on the cover of Sports Illustrated. As a new reading 1st grader, I read every word of it aloud for whomever TKC put in front of me.

For Christmas I got a T and T Sports basketball with a Gamecock emblazoned on it as well as a John Roche T shirt. I think I still have the cassette tape of Fulton calling the last 7 minutes.

With all of the fond memories I have of that season, there are still some things that cause me to pause and wonder why this team lost any games, much less 6! Carolina was coming off a 25-3 season and returned everybody but Cremins. Of course they replaced Cremins with none other than Kevin Joyce, a future Olympian who as you all know has to be considered the 2nd or 3rd best player ever at Carolina. This team started 4 NBA players!

What caused me to pause was something that stood out to me in that Temple program. Through 9 games, USC was 9-0 and ranked 2nd in the nation. (There was an asterisk on the season stats that indicated that the game at UNC a few nights before was not included.). The Gamecocks had 4 starters through 9 games averaging over 15 ppg. Roche was at 23 ppg, Riker at 20 and Owens at 18. Joyce, the 4th leading scorer was at 15.2 ppg and here is what I found astounding. Joyce , a guard, was shooting 58% from the field! He had taken 100 shots, 67 less than Roche and had made 58. Roche had made only 13 more shots than Joyce with again, 67 more attempts.

Roche leading the team in scoring in assists is I suppose a good thing, but he was down this season from about 48% in his previous 2 yrs. Was he trying to do too much? I am looking for the full season stats, but recall distinctly that KJ finished the yr at 12 ppg which means he may have gotten the Rock less as the season progressed.

The link  will not work for me, but you can find it here to see the results of every game at lostlettermendotcom



The Cocks lost 3 of their 4 reg season losses in the span of 8 days getting blown out at Chapel Hill on Jan 4 and losing 2 slow down games to Maryland on Jan 9 and at UVA on Jan 11. Then they took 19 days off for Winter Break! What the hayull? The next game wasn't until Jan 30, a rematch, 19 days after the loss to Virginia, the Cavs were steam rolled in the Frank where we used to stay well after the games were over in our seats and listen to Gene Mckay recite the stats.

I also remember the next game a loss to Duke with Randy Denton and Dick Devenzio. What is wrong Gamecocks?

The next game was the first game I would ever attend. Roche scored 56, a school record, against Furman and the Gamecocks were again on a roll winning the rest of the regular season and winning the rest of the reg season games and the ACC tournament.

But then they lost by 15 to Penn in the NCAA's? By 10 to Fordham in a consolation game?
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1971_NCA...rnament#Bracket


USC got a bye into the sweet 16 and would have played Villanova had they beaten Penn. Nova beat Penn 90-47 to advance to the final 4. Penn wasn't that good. Certainly not good enough to beat a team with 4 NBA players.

Could McGuire not get them ready after winning the ACC?

I am not normally a conspiracy theorist (except when it comes to Obama), but you have to wonder 42 years later whether Roche was jealous of Joyce. Joyce, the 58% shooting 6'3 guard who was THE HERO of the ACC tournament outjumping the 6'11 Dedmon.

Think about that game. I can remember nothing but the final score, 52-51 and that Joyce tipped the ball to Owens who made the buzzer beating shot. Joyce was the hero. Not Roche and not Owens who made the shot.

Am I being silly? This was THE TEAM, even more than the one before. There was no Alcindor at UCLA. He was playing for the Bucks. Bill Walton was a freshman and not eligible for the Varsity. This was the team that could have been the exception to the UCLA string of Championships.

I would love to hear anybody's thoughts on this. I have never thought of this season in terms of jealosy and promise unfulfilled but if you study how the season began, the ebbs and flows, the 19 days off in January and how Joyce's numbers waned after Christmas, you have to wonder.

Thanks for the stroll down memory lane.  I was going to USC and got married later that year.  It has been pretty well documented that so much emphasis was placed upon winning the ACC that there was just no fuel in the tank for Penn.  I always thought if we could have eeked out a win we may have gone on to win the whole enchilada.  It was McGuire's "Navy" IMO.

Yes, I know about the fuel in the tank theory, but I think it was more than that. I want to hear more from those that were there and older than me about the chemistry or lack thereof in January. Joyce inserted as a key cog didn't seem to matter winning at Notre Dame and taking the Holiday Festival.

Maybe I am trying too hard to revise history, but it seems in analyzing stats, box scores and the make up of the team, that ego may have gotten in the way of team and Frank didn't know what to do about it. This was Roche's team and Joyce stole some thunder. This was a problem "between the ears" ; it certainly wasn't physical.

By the way, this "study" of Ameican Basketball History is a direct result of trying to avoid thinking about what happened on that ill-fated Tuesday in November and the back shoulder pass gone bad against Alabama.

This is for my sanity.

It had to be the Chicken Curse...!   Just like Roche having a sprained ankle and losing the ACC the year before in double OT.

I wasn't around then so I can't shed any light on the story but I've always wondered why we can't ever seem to win a game in the first round of the NCAAs.  Sure we haven't been much but whenever we go our teams over the past 40 years never show up.  My "Navy" moment in basketball was when our best team in modern times lost to mighty powerhouse Coppin State in the first round.  We were a #2 or #3 seed and got embarrassed!  The next year we lost again in the first round to the Richmond spiders.  I still feel that it was a total lack of coaching and preparation for the most part.  Hopefully coach Martin will break this horribly long streak of bad basketball.

You were a 2 seed.  UGA lost the same day as a 3 seed to Chattanooga.
Bad day!

teddybulldawg wrote: You were a 2 seed.  UGA lost the same day as a 3 seed to Chattanooga.
Bad day!

And, at least at the time, only the second or third 2 seed to lose.  Ever.

Teddy,  I remember that time period and some of those teams...the game I remember the most was beating # 1 ranked and previously unbeaten  Indiana in the '72-73 (I think) season when Joyce had about 30 points... (My recent young bride was from Indiana)...

Your post reminded me of something similar that happened to me recently...I found (in a box of old "stuff") a 1986 Gamecock football guide...I looked through it just for kicks but was surprised by two things:

Listed among the football graduate assistants was one  Charlie Weis (Notre Dame)

Listed among the basketball assistant coaches was one Tubby Smith

Go figure..

Anthair, I was at that Indiana game.   It was played on Dec 22, 1972.  Bobby Knight's first team and it was loaded with Kent Benson, Quin Buckner, Bobby Wilkerson and Scott May.  They were all either freshmen or soph's.  Actually I think that was the first yr that freshmen were eligible to play Varsity as English, Dunleavy, Mathias and Greiner all played a bunch as freshmen that year.  That collection of IU talent put it all together in I think 1976 to go undefeated and win an National Championship.

  Joyce only had 6 points in the first half and IU had a big lead at intermission.  

Joyce exploded for 35 of his 41 in the 2nd half.  Winters hit 2 ft's with less than 10 seconds left to ice the game with an 88-85 final score.

If I can remember all of those details, I am confident that memory loss is years away.

25 in the 2nd half for Joyce.
See picture of Winters "icing" the game. I got that right.

www.flickr.com/photos/32998163...in/photostream/





http://www.flickr.com/photos/3...in/photostream/

teddybulldawg wrote:

If I can remember all of those details, I am confident that memory loss is years away.

Teddy...amazing memory...I'm closer to your dad's age and mine is starting to go...I thought Indiana was ranked # 1 that year, but I was getting it mixed up with their Natl Championship a few years later... the first Carolina games I remember were at the old fieldhouse that mysteriously burned to the ground right after Frank McGuire got there...that place was a snakepit but I'm sure your dad has told you about that...I think capacity was about 3,000 but they would get around 5,000 inside for the games and always put the "pep band" right behind the visitor's bench....couldn't hear yourself think in that place...

I actually googled that game and it is archived on some IU site with an article. I also saw a roster and Benson, May,etc were not on that team. Buckner was on the team and he had the responsibility of guarding Joyce. They did have Steve Downing who later played for the Celtics and another guy you might remember, Jim Crews. Both IU and USC were ranked in the top 10.

I actually saw Steve Downing play when he was in high school ( I was in the military and stationed at Ft Benjamin Harrison in Indianapolis)  ...he was on the same high school team as George McGinnis and that was a sight to behold...I was totally stunned to see two guys like that on the same high school team...McGinnis only played about a year in college and made the leap to the ABA..He was on that Denver team that had Doctor J and David Thompson  I believe.....Downing and McGinnis were both high school All Americans in basketball and football as I recall.....

From Wikipedia...

"George F. McGinnis (born August 12, 1950 in Indianapolis, Indiana) is a retired American professional basketball player, most notably with the Indiana Pacers of the American Basketball Association (ABA) (from 1971 to 1975). He was drafted into the ABA from Indiana University in 1971. In the '70-71 season at Indiana, McGinnis became the first sophomore to lead the Big Ten in scoring and rebounding. He averaged 29.9 points per game in his lone season in Bloomington earning All-American and All-Big Ten Honors in 1971."

I took you to that game, TBD, right? What I remember so well in the second half was the crowd. Joyce could not miss. I've rarely seen a player in that kind of zone. He threw one up from around his knees near half court and it went in! The crowd was insane, and Knight called time-out, but the crowd continued to scream and even got louder which seemed impossible throughout the entire time out! It was so loud Knight was having to literally scream out his instructions to his team, but to no avail. I am sure every fan at that game had laryngitis the next day.

teddybulldawg wrote: Anthair, I was at that Indiana game.   It was played on Dec 22, 1972.  Bobby Knight's first team and it was loaded with Kent Benson, Quin Buckner, Bobby Wilkerson and Scott May.  They were all either freshmen or soph's.  Actually I think that was the first yr that freshmen were eligible to play Varsity as English, Dunleavy, Mathias and Greiner all played a bunch as freshmen that year.  That collection of IU talent put it all together in I think 1976 to go undefeated and win an National Championship.

  Joyce only had 6 points in the first half and IU had a big lead at intermission.  

Joyce exploded for 35 of his 41 in the 2nd half.  Winters hit 2 ft's with less than 10 seconds left to ice the game with an 88-85 final score.

If I can remember all of those details, I am confident that memory loss is years away.

I am confident that you took me to that one. I went to a few that era with Florence.

---------------------------------------------
--- teddykohncock wrote:

I took you to that game, TBD, right? What I remember so well in the second half was the crowd. Joyce could not miss. I've rarely seen a player in that kind of zone. He threw one up from around his knees near half court and it went in! The crowd was insane, and Knight called time-out, but the crowd continued to scream and even got louder which seemed impossible throughout the entire time out! It was so loud Knight was having to literally scream out his instructions to his team, but to no avail. I am sure every fan at that game had laryngitis the next day.

teddybulldawg wrote: Anthair, I was at that Indiana game.   It was played on Dec 22, 1972.  Bobby Knight's first team and it was loaded with Kent Benson, Quin Buckner, Bobby Wilkerson and Scott May.  They were all either freshmen or soph's.  Actually I think that was the first yr that freshmen were eligible to play Varsity as English, Dunleavy, Mathias and Greiner all played a bunch as freshmen that year.  That collection of IU talent put it all together in I think 1976 to go undefeated and win an National Championship.

  Joyce only had 6 points in the first half and IU had a big lead at intermission.  

Joyce exploded for 35 of his 41 in the 2nd half.  Winters hit 2 ft's with less than 10 seconds left to ice the game with an 88-85 final score.

If I can remember all of those details, I am confident that memory loss is years away.

---------------------------------------------

Those are great memories.  I was in school there at the time and basketball was king.  But the year before that was, in my opinion, our best team ever and our best chance of a national championship.  We began the season ranked No. 1 in the nation by Sports Illustrated and basketball fever on campus was off the charts.  We had just won the ACC Championship in football but even that took a backseat to the upcoming basketball season and the hopes for what lay ahead.

We had an inexplicable early season loss at Tennessee but rolled after that and remained in the top five.  I think we got as high as two or three by Feb. and only a late season loss at home to a very good top five  Davidson team was the only blemish on our record for the remainder of the regular season and we finished 14-0 in the ACC.  We rolled through the first two games of the ACC tourney until Roche suffered a severe ankle injury late in the semi-final against Wake Forest when the game as all but over.  The next night he was severely hobbled in the championship game against NC State.  He tried to play but was not able to be as effective as usual.  State held the ball, kept the score down and got the game to overtime where they pulled out major upset that I will always believe cost us the national championship.

Because in that year only 16 teams made the NCAA tournament. There were four four-team regionals and the Eastern regional was in Columbia.  All we would have had to do is win two games there and be in the final four.  The team that I thought all year would be our toughest challenge in the final four was Kentucky and they were beaten in the Midwest regional by Jacksonville.  This was UCLA's first year of life after Alcindor, they were in a period of transition and not the team they had been in previous years.   But we had to watch a St. Bonaventure team, without their star player Bob Lanier), come in to Columbia and win the trip to the final four that we had been destined for.  

After that, excitement for the 1970-71 season was off the charts.  Football season was almost an after thought, just something to get us through until basketball began again.  And we got off to a great start and looked like we were ready to challenge for the NCAA title again.  I still have the Jan. 4, 1971 Sports Illustrated with John Roche on the cover that said, "Challenge From The South: Hard driving John Roche."  But as magical a season as that was with us finally winning the ACC Championship, I was never as confident about our chances of a possible national championship as I had been in 1969-70.  The 71 team had a little more depth, but the regionals at home should have been our ticket to the Final Four in 1970.

But that loss in the 1970 ACC tournament was, and to this day is still by far the greatest disappointment of my sport's life.  And I say that as a guy who likes football much more than basketball.  But during those years we were a serious national power and all Carolina fans were into basketball more than football.  Its funny how the times a-change.

But those are great memories.  Thanks for bringing this us.  Its fun to reflect back on those days even though that 1970 ACC tournament loss still hurts like hell.  BTW, the 69-70 freshman team with Joyce, Danny Traylor, etc. could have beaten most varsity teams in the country that year, which really helped fuel the enthusiasm for 70-71.


.

Thanks Jackie.
Questions:
Were there issues with Roche and Joyce?

Carolina lost 3 slow down games between the championship game in 1970 and the back to backs against MD and VA in Jan 71. What did McGuire do or not do well to combat those type of games?

looking back too, why was the "unfairness of tobacco rd" such a big deal? I can remember hearing about Roche hung in effigy, etc. It was like they were bigger than the Beatles and Mcguire seemed to relish that which in retrospect may have not been a good thing.

Was McGuire a great strategist or just a fantastic recruiter?

Teddybulldawg, I think with the introduction of Joyce into the lineup, that disturbd the chemistry of the team. He had incredible talent, of course, but with Roche being use to controlling rhe ball all game long, the need to get Joyce into the flow was not easy on either of them as Joyce knew Roche was the star almost like in 1961 with the NY Yankees when Roger Maris and Mickey Mantle were both chasing Ruth's home run record. Mantle was the ideal and some Yankee fans were rooting against Maris as they wanted Mantle to be the one to top Ruth's 60 homers in a season. Maris got 61, while Mantle ended up with 54, but sat out the last two weeks of the season with a medical issue. Without that, he might have made it, too.

That is not to say that the fans were against Joyce, but Roche was still the man. It is possible that Joyce may have felt like a third wheel kind of thing, though.

As to the Tobacco Road thing, I know the general consensus is we left the ACC over the SAT level the ACC used being higher than the SEC and other plces hurt our recruiting being the major reason we left, but on that I disagree.

I think the level of hate directed toward our players, coaches and fans around the league that it was no longer safe to go on the road. Some schools said that unless we fired McGuire, they would no longer play us. The day we did leave, I remember it felt like a huge weight had been lifted from our shoulders and there was such joy and jubilation all over the state almost as if a war was over.

Of course on the SAT thing as it related to basketball. Most of those guys were/are very bright. You live for those kind of rivalries. That is what makes the SEC great. Of course the SEC pulls for each other in most cases.