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RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78

Posted: 1/14/2013 2:42 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


I can't see any way DY lets Kellie stay another year.  Things have got to get turned around quickly if they are going to get back to the top half of the conference.  WBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football.  Whether you like it or not it is the premiere Women's sport at most Universities and they do represent NCSU.  DY has got to put more money into WBB and that starts with a new Head Coach.
The person I feel the most sorry for--even more than Rexpack--is Kastanek.  The two Coaches that recruited her--Yow and Glance are gone, the Coach she played for for four years will be gone and she also doesn't have any fellow seniors in her class.  She has given a lot to NCSU and didn't get much back in return--besides a degree hopefully.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 2:47 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Random. Doesn't RW and CJL have younger sisters that are prospects?
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:08 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



abcfan2005 wrote: Random. Doesn't RW and CJL have younger sisters that are prospects?
Brief scouting report on CJL's sister.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:11 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Women's basketball is televised?

Who knew.
__________________________________
Come toward the light....
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:11 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Report says...

Explosive guard with lots of speed and quickness. Young with an impressive build. Should become something special as her skills evolve. (Lewis)

Sounds good to me. We could use some speed and quickness.

---------------------------------------------
--- seniorwolf60 wrote:


abcfan2005 wrote: Random. Doesn't RW and CJL have younger sisters that are prospects?
Brief scouting report on CJL's sister.

---------------------------------------------
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:13 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



ibmotu wrote: I can't see any way DY lets Kellie stay another year.  Things have got to get turned around quickly if they are going to get back to the top half of the conference.  WBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football.  Whether you like it or not it is the premiere Women's sport at most Universities and they do represent NCSU.  DY has got to put more money into WBB and that starts with a new Head Coach.
The person I feel the most sorry for--even more than Rexpack--is Kastanek.  The two Coaches that recruited her--Yow and Glance are gone, the Coach she played for for four years will be gone and she also doesn't have any fellow seniors in her class.  She has given a lot to NCSU and didn't get much back in return--besides a degree hopefully.
Have any idea what that would cost? Some earlier posters made a good point that maybe 7-8 programs take the top talent in the country & all the other programs fight for whatever is left.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:13 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


According to this, she is averaging 16 points and 9 boards a game, and is now 6'0.

www.maxpreps.com/athletes/qi5_...iara-leslie.htm
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:18 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



abcfan2005 wrote: According to this, she is averaging 16 points and 9 boards a game, and is now 6'0.

www.maxpreps.com/athletes/qi5_...iara-leslie.htm

BTW, Anna Wilson is class of 2015. She is supposed to be a good three point shooter.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:19 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Women's hoops does not show up on my give a damn radar.  But, I want any program with NC State attached to it to do well.  I had no idea we had fallen this far.  Unless Harper starts coaching games in a bikini, she needs to go.  I just do not want the other sports to be penalized financially for any type of buyout.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:20 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.

FB prediction (2010) 3-9, 1-7 (2011) 5-7, 2-6 (2012) 7-5, 4-4, (2013) 7-5, 4-4
MBB prediction: (2010-11) 21-9,10-6 (2011-12) 19-12, 7-9 (2012-13) 24-7,12-6


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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:22 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



Denverpacker wrote: Women's hoops does not show up on my give a damn radar.  But, I want any program with NC State attached to it to do well.  I had no idea we had fallen this far.  Unless Harper starts coaching games in a bikini, she needs to go.  I just do not want the other sports to be penalized financially for any type of buyout.
this
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:24 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



Denverpacker wrote: Women's hoops does not show up on my give a damn radar.  But, I want any program with NC State attached to it to do well.  I had no idea we had fallen this far.  Unless Harper starts coaching games in a bikini, she needs to go.  I just do not want the other sports to be penalized financially for any type of buyout.
The buyout probably isn't more than the incentives she failed to achieve in her current contract.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:24 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Have to agree.

We are in so much debt. Probably best to just let the contract run out. Glad it's not my decision though.

Ideally, she would hire a new staff and we'd be back in the tournament next year. Seems unlikely though.

---------------------------------------------
--- BlackRazor wrote:


Denverpacker wrote: Women's hoops does not show up on my give a damn radar.  But, I want any program with NC State attached to it to do well.  I had no idea we had fallen this far.  Unless Harper starts coaching games in a bikini, she needs to go.  I just do not want the other sports to be penalized financially for any type of buyout.
this

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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:28 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



BlackRazor wrote:
ibmotu wrote: I can't see any way DY lets Kellie stay another year.  Things have got to get turned around quickly if they are going to get back to the top half of the conference.  WBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football.  Whether you like it or not it is the premiere Women's sport at most Universities and they do represent NCSU.  DY has got to put more money into WBB and that starts with a new Head Coach.
The person I feel the most sorry for--even more than Rexpack--is Kastanek.  The two Coaches that recruited her--Yow and Glance are gone, the Coach she played for for four years will be gone and she also doesn't have any fellow seniors in her class.  She has given a lot to NCSU and didn't get much back in return--besides a degree hopefully.
Have any idea what that would cost? Some earlier posters made a good point that maybe 7-8 programs take the top talent in the country & all the other programs fight for whatever is left.
2011 story

2011 salary comparison


2012- For Division I basketball, the median salary for coaches of a men’s team in 2010 was $329,300, nearly twice that of coaches for women’s teams, who had a median of $171,600.



FB prediction (2010) 3-9, 1-7 (2011) 5-7, 2-6 (2012) 7-5, 4-4, (2013) 7-5, 4-4
MBB prediction: (2010-11) 21-9,10-6 (2011-12) 19-12, 7-9 (2012-13) 24-7,12-6


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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:30 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:31 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Thanks wolfer!

Wow, for those who want a top notch WBB program again, you want DY to invest that much in a new coach?
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:40 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


According to last season's data, WBB outdraws gymnastics on average, but it's close:
WBB 2011-12 season: ~2,306 (from NCAA)
Gymnastics: 2012 season: ~2,059 (from Gym Info; seven home meets last season)

If you take away the Hoops for Hope game, the edge might go to gymnastics. But I also think if WBB performed better, it's attendance would jump pretty remarkably. Perhaps that's wishful thinking. 
ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.

Last edited 1/14/2013 3:48 PM by loneycafe

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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:47 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-8, 0-4) 1/13 @ Virginia 



seniorwolf60 wrote:
Planet Boulder wrote:
BlackRazor wrote:
redmoonrising wrote: With Duke rolling, Maryland re-loading after an injury filled season, UNC streaming in top 100 recruits next year, and every other conference team improving except Virginia Tech....Notre Dame and Louisville about to enter the league, you are about to be obsolete in ACC WBB if you don't make a change soon. I argue against waiting.... Of course, it's not my money. :-)

---------------------------------------------
--- Planet Boulder wrote:


BlackRazor wrote:
Planet Boulder wrote: Let her contract run out after next season and find a new coach.
I agree, why waste any buyout $ or spend much on a new coach now? The program's in terrible shape so the next coach will have to rebuild any way.
Yep. I don't want to see dime 1 spent on a buyout of a non-revenue sports coach, at least not at this point in time.

---------------------------------------------
Based on all the posts I've read here this season, what's to say NCSU isn't already obsolete in WBB anyway & does 1 year make that big a difference? This isn't a program most State students or even grads just can't wait to be good again.
That's my thinking, BR. If she had another 2 or more years on her contract after this season, I'd say to make the move, but one more year will not set this program any farther back.

I like coach Harper as a person and I appreciate her dedication, however, it is clear that this simply isn't working out and I'd rather absorb one more year of fail than to have to dole out more bread than is necessary for a non-revenue sport.

THAT SAID, I can see the argument that some might make that, well, a buyout of a non-revenue coach with only one year remaining on her contract won't break the bank and it's quite clear (pretty much beyond a shadow of a doubt) that the program has become a complete and total train wreck, so why waste any more time with it?

Still, I think we should wait until the 2013-2014 season has mercifully breathed its last, fateful breath before kicking the plug out of the socket.
From a pure business perspective, I agree completely with you. Before any move is made, maybe it needs to be decided just how important this program is to N C State athletics. As you know, Title IX forces us into a certain level of participation in women's sports. How far we go beyond the minimum is up to the school. But of all the women's sports the basketball program has the most media attention. So if we elect to have a program that sucks on a year-in-year-out basis, that is going to be on display in these media events. I believe our AD will be taking that into consideration.

Considering the sister of the current AD built this program into a national contender, I'm guessing DY puts a great deal of emphasis on women's basketball.  That program was the face of NC State's women's athletic program for many years.  I'm doubting DY is going to let it sit dormant for too long.  Besides, this is the last of the Fowler hires.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:51 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
More than baseball?  I find that extremely hard to believe.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:57 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Baseball averaged 1,464 last season, which was ranked No. 43 in the nation. PDF of attendance rankings from SEC here

But according to last season's data, WBB outdrew gymnastics. Re-posted info from above:

WBB 2011-12 season: ~2,306 (from NCAA)
Gymnastics: 2012 season: ~2,059 (from Gym Info; seven home meets last season)


Denverpacker wrote:
ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
More than baseball?  I find that extremely hard to believe.

Last edited 1/14/2013 3:59 PM by loneycafe

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Posted: 1/14/2013 3:59 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



loneycafe wrote: According to last season's data, WBB outdraws gymnastics on average, but it's close:
WBB 2011-12 season: ~2,306 (from NCAA)
Gymnastics: 2012 season: ~2,059 (from Gym Info; seven home meets last season)

If you take away the Hoops for Hope game, the edge might go to gymnastics. But I also think if WBB performed better, it's attendance would jump pretty remarkably. Perhaps that's wishful thinking. 
ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
thank you
I just did not care enough to look it up
It would be interesting to subtract Hoops4Hope and see what average attendance is then, but it is a game so it counts.

FB prediction (2010) 3-9, 1-7 (2011) 5-7, 2-6 (2012) 7-5, 4-4, (2013) 7-5, 4-4
MBB prediction: (2010-11) 21-9,10-6 (2011-12) 19-12, 7-9 (2012-13) 24-7,12-6


Last edited 1/14/2013 4:01 PM by wolfer79

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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:00 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Doak Field at Dail Park only holds 2,300 and there are a lot of midweek games, particularly in February, with less than 500 people.
loneycafe wrote: Baseball averaged 1,464 last season, which was ranked No. 43 in the nation. PDF of attendance rankings from SEC here

But according to last season's data, WBB outdrew gymnastics. Re-posted info from above:

WBB 2011-12 season: ~2,306 (from NCAA)
Gymnastics: 2012 season: ~2,059 (from Gym Info; seven home meets last season)


Denverpacker wrote:
ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
More than baseball?  I find that extremely hard to believe.

FB prediction (2010) 3-9, 1-7 (2011) 5-7, 2-6 (2012) 7-5, 4-4, (2013) 7-5, 4-4
MBB prediction: (2010-11) 21-9,10-6 (2011-12) 19-12, 7-9 (2012-13) 24-7,12-6


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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:04 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



ibmotu wrote: I can't see any way DY lets Kellie stay another year.  Things have got to get turned around quickly if they are going to get back to the top half of the conference.  WBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football.  Whether you like it or not it is the premiere Women's sport at most Universities and they do represent NCSU.  DY has got to put more money into WBB and that starts with a new Head Coach.
The person I feel the most sorry for--even more than Rexpack--is Kastanek.  The two Coaches that recruited her--Yow and Glance are gone, the Coach she played for for four years will be gone and she also doesn't have any fellow seniors in her class.  She has given a lot to NCSU and didn't get much back in return--besides a degree hopefully.
No need to feel sorry for me. I thought for sure Harper would do well here. I was wrong. I also have a lot of sympathy for Marissa. She deserved more. It is difficult to see Kellie go through this (do think she is a good person) but I am sure she will land on her feet somewhere and have another opportunity to prove herself.

The program comes first. This can not be allowed to go on.

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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:07 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



rexpack71 wrote: No need to feel sorry for me. I thought for sure Harper would do well here. I was wrong. I also have a lot of sympathy for Marissa. She deserved more. It is difficult to see Kellie go through this (do think she is a good person) but I am sure she will land on her feet somewhere and have another opportunity to prove herself.

The program comes first. This can not be allowed to go on.
you're not alone there, she looked like a sure thing @ the time.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:12 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-8, 0-4) 1/13 @ Virginia 



Yeehaa wrote:
Considering the sister of the current AD built this program into a national contender, I'm guessing DY puts a great deal of emphasis on women's basketball.  That program was the face of NC State's women's athletic program for many years.  I'm doubting DY is going to let it sit dormant for too long.  Besides, this is the last of the Fowler hires.
Bryan Bunn says hello.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:12 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


I'm procrastinating on some work, so here you go.

If you take away the Hoops 4 Hope game (attendance of the box score was listed at 8,560, thanks to Scotty McCreery), then you're at an average attendance of 2,000. 

And I put James Madison's figure in my original for WBB. Including Hoops 4 Hope, average is 2,365. 
wolfer79 wrote:
loneycafe wrote: According to last season's data, WBB outdraws gymnastics on average, but it's close:
WBB 2011-12 season: ~2,306 (from NCAA)
Gymnastics: 2012 season: ~2,059 (from Gym Info; seven home meets last season)

If you take away the Hoops for Hope game, the edge might go to gymnastics. But I also think if WBB performed better, it's attendance would jump pretty remarkably. Perhaps that's wishful thinking. 
ibmotu wrote:
wolfer79 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: IWBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football. 
I have heard at NC State that gymnastics has higher attendance than any sport other than football and men's basketball.
That would be unusual if true, but aren't there only 3 or 4 home meets?  Kind of different in that regard.
thank you
I just did not care enough to look it up
It would be interesting to subtract Hoops4Hope and see what average attendance is then, but it is a game so it counts.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:17 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 



rexpack71 wrote:
ibmotu wrote: I can't see any way DY lets Kellie stay another year.  Things have got to get turned around quickly if they are going to get back to the top half of the conference.  WBB is the third most attended sport at a university and is on TV more than any other sport besides MBB and Football.  Whether you like it or not it is the premiere Women's sport at most Universities and they do represent NCSU.  DY has got to put more money into WBB and that starts with a new Head Coach.
The person I feel the most sorry for--even more than Rexpack--is Kastanek.  The two Coaches that recruited her--Yow and Glance are gone, the Coach she played for for four years will be gone and she also doesn't have any fellow seniors in her class.  She has given a lot to NCSU and didn't get much back in return--besides a degree hopefully.
No need to feel sorry for me. I thought for sure Harper would do well here. I was wrong. I also have a lot of sympathy for Marissa. She deserved more. It is difficult to see Kellie go through this (do think she is a good person) but I am sure she will land on her feet somewhere and have another opportunity to prove herself.

The program comes first. This can not be allowed to go on.
I just meant that you are a good fan and deserve a better program than this to follow--as does Marissa.
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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:20 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Oh ok. Thanks. I am sure all of us NCSU WBB fans will get one with Yow in charge.

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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:25 PM

RE: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Without winning the ACCT which would get us in the NCAA,Harper is gone....she has known it since before the season started.....

fv
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Posted: 1/14/2013 4:26 PM

Re: WBB 2012-13: (8-9, 0-5) L to Virginia 59-78 


Looking back, here are statements from the press conference when Harper was hired:

"This team and staff has got to work hard to get where we want to go," Harper said. "But we are accepting that challenge. We want to consistently compete for and win championships. We want to beat our neighbors who wear various shades of blue. The bottom line: we want to win and make you proud."

I don't see how you can come close to meeting those challenges without having the level of talent to accomplish it. Outside of Kody Burke and maybe one or two others, the talent she has brought in is not ACC quality. Does she think the job can get done without talent? If she found the recruiting to be so difficult, did she pull out all of the stops to attack the recruiting issue? The head coach can not take any deficiency lightly. Now she seems to be stuck in bewilderment. She needs to get back into a climate where she has a better reference of success. Unfortunately, it isn't here.
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