NCSUfan81 wrote:

JamesHenderson wrote: IMO the only way he's worth that is if he eventually leads us to a title or two.

Take for instance the NYG and SD trade for Eli and PR. I'm sure NYG is fine with giving up Rivers, a third (Nate Kaeding), a first (Shawn Merriman), and a fifth for Eli, given he's led them to two Super Bowls. Of course, it can be debated, would Rivers have been able to do the same with that defense?

I personally don't agree.  You are basically saying that if we keep those draft picks you expect us to win a title or two with them as well. I don't think we were on track to win a Super Bowl anytime soon and even if you keep those picks you still have to draft a QB at some point and hope that he pans out. The NFL is a QB driven league and RG3 was one of the safest QB picks ever (talent wise).  He may never win a Super Bowl, but heck at least he makes the skins fun to watch again.

I don't think that's what he's saying.  Giving up so much for one player is a bigger risk than just staying where you are.

If Griffin III isn't what the Redskins saw him to be (regardless of whether it is because of injury, failure to adjust to the NFL, or any other reason), then Washington is in a deeper hole because they went two years without a first round pick.

New England is generally considered on of the top 2 or 3 franchises in football, and they always tend to trade down to stockpile picks rather than give up a lot of picks to move up.

Daniel33 wrote:

NCSUfan81 wrote:

JamesHenderson wrote: IMO the only way he's worth that is if he eventually leads us to a title or two.

Take for instance the NYG and SD trade for Eli and PR. I'm sure NYG is fine with giving up Rivers, a third (Nate Kaeding), a first (Shawn Merriman), and a fifth for Eli, given he's led them to two Super Bowls. Of course, it can be debated, would Rivers have been able to do the same with that defense?

I personally don't agree.  You are basically saying that if we keep those draft picks you expect us to win a title or two with them as well. I don't think we were on track to win a Super Bowl anytime soon and even if you keep those picks you still have to draft a QB at some point and hope that he pans out. The NFL is a QB driven league and RG3 was one of the safest QB picks ever (talent wise).  He may never win a Super Bowl, but heck at least he makes the skins fun to watch again.

I don't think that's what he's saying.  Giving up so much for one player is a bigger risk than just staying where you are.

If Griffin III isn't what the Redskins saw him to be (regardless of whether it is because of injury, failure to adjust to the NFL, or any other reason), then Washington is in a deeper hole because they went two years without a first round pick.

New England is generally considered on of the top 2 or 3 franchises in football, and they always tend to trade down to stockpile picks rather than give up a lot of picks to move up.

Easier to do when you've got Brady planted in the backfield for 10 years or so straight.

302ASullivan wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

NCSUfan81 wrote:

JamesHenderson wrote: IMO the only way he's worth that is if he eventually leads us to a title or two.

Take for instance the NYG and SD trade for Eli and PR. I'm sure NYG is fine with giving up Rivers, a third (Nate Kaeding), a first (Shawn Merriman), and a fifth for Eli, given he's led them to two Super Bowls. Of course, it can be debated, would Rivers have been able to do the same with that defense?

I personally don't agree.  You are basically saying that if we keep those draft picks you expect us to win a title or two with them as well. I don't think we were on track to win a Super Bowl anytime soon and even if you keep those picks you still have to draft a QB at some point and hope that he pans out. The NFL is a QB driven league and RG3 was one of the safest QB picks ever (talent wise).  He may never win a Super Bowl, but heck at least he makes the skins fun to watch again.

I don't think that's what he's saying.  Giving up so much for one player is a bigger risk than just staying where you are.

If Griffin III isn't what the Redskins saw him to be (regardless of whether it is because of injury, failure to adjust to the NFL, or any other reason), then Washington is in a deeper hole because they went two years without a first round pick.

New England is generally considered on of the top 2 or 3 franchises in football, and they always tend to trade down to stockpile picks rather than give up a lot of picks to move up.

Easier to do when you've got Brady planted in the backfield for 10 years or so straight.

Of course.  It all goes together.  Scouting, coaching, performance, luck with injuries.....no single part of an NFL franchise is going to overcome ineptitude in other areas.

If the Patriots weren't really skilled at getting value for their draft picks, stockpiling those picks wouldn't help them at all.

I'm no doctor, and I realize Andrews is a world-renown surgeon, but every other opinion I've read besides his is saying 6-8 months is pretty optimistic, and that 8-12 months is more realistic. Also, (and I realize this is in the realm of he said/he said) the local sports radio guys here in DC were saying they'd heard Andrews tells all of his patients the most optimistic news because he believes the patient's expectations affect outcomes. For what that's worth. Probably nothing.

Daniel33 wrote:

302ASullivan wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

NCSUfan81 wrote:

JamesHenderson wrote: IMO the only way he's worth that is if he eventually leads us to a title or two.

Take for instance the NYG and SD trade for Eli and PR. I'm sure NYG is fine with giving up Rivers, a third (Nate Kaeding), a first (Shawn Merriman), and a fifth for Eli, given he's led them to two Super Bowls. Of course, it can be debated, would Rivers have been able to do the same with that defense?

I personally don't agree.  You are basically saying that if we keep those draft picks you expect us to win a title or two with them as well. I don't think we were on track to win a Super Bowl anytime soon and even if you keep those picks you still have to draft a QB at some point and hope that he pans out. The NFL is a QB driven league and RG3 was one of the safest QB picks ever (talent wise).  He may never win a Super Bowl, but heck at least he makes the skins fun to watch again.

I don't think that's what he's saying.  Giving up so much for one player is a bigger risk than just staying where you are.

If Griffin III isn't what the Redskins saw him to be (regardless of whether it is because of injury, failure to adjust to the NFL, or any other reason), then Washington is in a deeper hole because they went two years without a first round pick.

New England is generally considered on of the top 2 or 3 franchises in football, and they always tend to trade down to stockpile picks rather than give up a lot of picks to move up.

Easier to do when you've got Brady planted in the backfield for 10 years or so straight.

Of course.  It all goes together.  Scouting, coaching, performance, luck with injuries.....no single part of an NFL franchise is going to overcome ineptitude in other areas.

If the Patriots weren't really skilled at getting value for their draft picks, stockpiling those picks wouldn't help them at all.

Wasn't Brady a 4th round pick?  Brett Farve was also a 4th rounder IIRC.

Any way you slice it Washington gave up far too much for Griffin.  First rounds picks frequently turn into busts and you can find value in later rounds.   Russell Wilson, taken in the third round, could easily wind up with a better pro career than Griffin.

Daniel33 wrote: 
I don't think that's what he's saying.  Giving up so much for one player is a bigger risk than just staying where you are.

If Griffin III isn't what the Redskins saw him to be (regardless of whether it is because of injury, failure to adjust to the NFL, or any other reason), then Washington is in a deeper hole because they went two years without a first round pick.

New England is generally considered on of the top 2 or 3 franchises in football, and they always tend to trade down to stockpile picks rather than give up a lot of picks to move up.

My point is if you define success by winning a title (which I take to mean Super Bowl, but please correct me if I'm wrong) it must go both ways.  By that definition there is a good chance that both the options lead to failure. A statement like the one James made does nothing but put unrealistic expectations on one single player.  We've had 12 first round draft picks since the year 2000 and what good has it done us? We've made the playoffs 2 times and we wouldn't have made it this year without RG3 on the team. 

New England was lucky in that they found a hall of fame QB sitting on their bench.  You take him off that team and that franchise would be mediocre at best over the last 10 years.  Having Brady as your QB vs. Ramsey, Brunell, Campbell, McNabb, Grossman, Beck... makes it a whole lot easier to trade down and stockpile players.  If RG3 doesn't pan out we go from not winning titles to not winning titles so what have we really lost?  Who knows maybe RG3 gets hurt again and we find the next Brady sitting on our bench.

Why does it not surprise me in the least that someone with the mentality to willingly give himself the nickname of "Sids Souljah Boy" would post something like that?

psupack wrote: Why does everyone think Cousins will be the bees knees? He played pretty good in FOUR games this year, only starting one in which he played great, against the BROWNS. He looked scared against Seattle and played poorly, although he was attempting a comeback in a playoff game.

Kevin Kolb looked pretty good in Philly FYI. Matt Cassel in NE too.

I'm quoting myself bc nobody answered.
Maybe I made valid points. In that case carry on.

psupack wrote:

psupack wrote: Why does everyone think Cousins will be the bees knees? He played pretty good in FOUR games this year, only starting one in which he played great, against the BROWNS. He looked scared against Seattle and played poorly, although he was attempting a comeback in a playoff game.

Kevin Kolb looked pretty good in Philly FYI. Matt Cassel in NE too.

I'm quoting myself bc nobody answered.
Maybe I made valid points. In that case carry on.

I personally didn't respond because I don't think he'll be the bees knees.  He looks like he has the potential to develop into a starting QB.  But there are tons of guys that have been through the NFL that "look like they have the potential to develop into" starting QBs.  In this draft you have Luck, Griffin and Wilson that we KNOW should be starters at this point.  Luck and Griffin were considered the sure things, Tannehill and Wilson (and others?) were question marks.

There are guys that CAN win the game for you - Cousins looks more like - dare I say it - a game manager.  He looked good in one game and has looked decent in the rest of his play.  You build a team around a guy that can WIN the game for you - you're SuperBowl caliber.  You build a GREAT team around a Trent Dilfer - and you can win "a" SuperBowl. 

Cousins could be the next Brady, P. Manning, etc. - but we won't know until later.

psupack wrote:

psupack wrote: Why does everyone think Cousins will be the bees knees? He played pretty good in FOUR games this year, only starting one in which he played great, against the BROWNS. He looked scared against Seattle and played poorly, although he was attempting a comeback in a playoff game.

Kevin Kolb looked pretty good in Philly FYI. Matt Cassel in NE too.

I'm quoting myself bc nobody answered.
Maybe I made valid points. In that case carry on.

I didn't respond because I didn't think anyone said that Cousins would be all that special.  If you have a strong team, you QB doesn't have to be a superstar.  There are plenty of QBs that are "stars" because their teams win, but they aren't necessarily the main reason for those victories.  Brad Johnson won a Super Bowl.  Trent Dilfer won a Super Bowl. 

Roethlisberger and Eli Manning have two each, IIRC, and neither of them is a game-changing human highlight film. 

For example, since we're talking about the Redskins.....this season Washington was 30th in the NFL against the pass and 5th against the run, despite the fact that they had injury issues in their front 7.  If the trade for RGIII doesn't happen, and everyone is drafted where they were drafted, Washington would have added Morris Claiborne in the 1st round and Janoris Jenkins in the 2nd.  Their pass defense improves, and all of a sudden the QB isn't asked to be quite as dynamic because the team doesn't need as many points to win.

I'm not saying that RGIII isn't a great talent.  He is.  But, he's still just one guy, and he is far from a sure thing....that's a risky player upon which to wager so much of your franchise's future.

Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

psupack wrote:

psupack wrote: Why does everyone think Cousins will be the bees knees? He played pretty good in FOUR games this year, only starting one in which he played great, against the BROWNS. He looked scared against Seattle and played poorly, although he was attempting a comeback in a playoff game.

Kevin Kolb looked pretty good in Philly FYI. Matt Cassel in NE too.

I'm quoting myself bc nobody answered.
Maybe I made valid points. In that case carry on.

He's not changing teams/schemes like Kolb and Cassell for one.  It's not  like those guys looked good in Philly and NE and then looked bad.  Their situations changed.

Cousins looked very good for us this year.  In our seven game winning streak he won two of those games, including a road game against Cleveland who, at the time, were playing good football.

I trust him throwing the ball right now more than I do RG3.

NCSUfan81 wrote:

JamesHenderson wrote: IMO the only way he's worth that is if he eventually leads us to a title or two.

Take for instance the NYG and SD trade for Eli and PR. I'm sure NYG is fine with giving up Rivers, a third (Nate Kaeding), a first (Shawn Merriman), and a fifth for Eli, given he's led them to two Super Bowls. Of course, it can be debated, would Rivers have been able to do the same with that defense?

I personally don't agree.  You are basically saying that if we keep those draft picks you expect us to win a title or two with them as well. I don't think we were on track to win a Super Bowl anytime soon and even if you keep those picks you still have to draft a QB at some point and hope that he pans out. The NFL is a QB driven league and RG3 was one of the safest QB picks ever (talent wise).  He may never win a Super Bowl, but heck at least he makes the skins fun to watch again.

I'm not saying that.  I'm saying if you give all that up you have to achieve the highest levels of success to make it worth it.  We gave up essentially the 6th pick, a second rounder, and two future 1sts to move up to the 2nd pick.  That's a ton man.  Future picks are like gold in the NFL.  Hell, Brandon Marshall was traded from Miami to Chicago for two 3rd-round picks... he's a top five WR in the league, Pro Bowler, and he commanded two thirds. 

I disagree on RG3 being one of the safest ever.  His injury history, lack of experience in a pro style offense, and frame had me pretty scared about the pick.

My hope was he'd be good enough to run what Shanahan normally runs (see Schaub in Houston).  I'm surprised they didn't run that... makes me worried he didn't look good/ready for the pro-style/under-center offense in OTAs.

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

Daniel33 wrote:

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

IMO they were a championship contender this year.  If he was healthy they would be playing in Atlanta this weekend with an excellent shot at moving on.

---------------------------------------------
--- NCSUfan81 wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

IMO they were a championship contender this year.  If he was healthy they would be playing in Atlanta this weekend with an excellent shot at moving on.

---------------------------------------------
.....and if he hadn't missed all or parts of some games when Cousins filled in, they might not have made the playoffs at all.

You don't get to have RG3 healthy and everything else stay the same. You can't pretend that Seattle didn't leave a bunch of points on the field. You also should understand that even if Washington had beaten Seattle, they would still be less likely to win against Atlanta. Washington was horrible against the pass this year.

NCSUfan81 wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

IMO they were a championship contender this year.  If he was healthy they would be playing in Atlanta this weekend with an excellent shot at moving on.

I disagree with that. 

The defense wasn't strong enough to make a run in the playoffs.  We feasted down the stretch on weak competition.  I think in that winning streak the best win we had was against Baltimore at home and that was with Cousins finishing it out.

JamesHenderson wrote:

NCSUfan81 wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

IMO they were a championship contender this year.  If he was healthy they would be playing in Atlanta this weekend with an excellent shot at moving on.

I disagree with that. 

The defense wasn't strong enough to make a run in the playoffs.  We feasted down the stretch on weak competition.  I think in that winning streak the best win we had was against Baltimore at home and that was with Cousins finishing it out.

i think they beat atlanta with rgIII.  after that, i think our a** would have been grass!

Hogettes Retiring


More crap news for Redskins fans.  These guys have been a staple for 30 years.  Saw them when I went back in September.

For someone who admittedly didn't watch the Redskins much this season, Daniel knows a lot about them.  Maybe more than Mike Shanahan or Bruce Allen.

Not Redskins related, but Monte Kiffin was just hired as DC for Dallas.

Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

dsd27205 wrote: For someone who admittedly didn't watch the Redskins much this season, Daniel knows a lot about them.  Maybe more than Mike Shanahan or Bruce Allen.

I know where they finished last year, where they finished this year, and what they gave up to get their Heisman Trophy winner. 

In my opinion, the only difference between drafting RGIII and signing the overpriced, aging free agents that Snyder is famous for is that he gave up too many draft picks to get RGIII instead of giving up too much money.

found this at Si.com extra mustard

www.washingtonian.com/blogs/ca...ted-for-dui.php

Former Washington Redskins defensive back Fred Smoot was arrested on December 30 and charged with driving under the influence of alcohol or a drug and operating while impaired, according to documents filed with DC Superior Court

Smoot was subsequently arrested and taken to the Capitol Police headquarters at 119 D Street, Northeast, for processing, where he twice refused to take a breathalyzer test.

“During processing, in the service area, while handcuffed, the [defendant] peed his pants creating a puddle on the floor,” Carll said in the affidavit. “[A police officer] witnessed the urine running down his pant leg and onto the floor. [Smoot] did not express that he had to use the restroom.”

si.com
Washington Redskins 2013 Offseason Preview
sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nfl/...11_a2&eref=sihp

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

Perhaps.  But they'll still finish with a better record than the Charlotte Kittycats no matter what.

JamesHenderson wrote:

NCSUfan81 wrote:

Daniel33 wrote:

GoState44 wrote: Dude we won the East it was well worth it.  It has been since 1999!  To win the East in year 1 is special!  I totally disagree about Eli and Ben they are great QB's.

If you think winning one of the weakest divisions in the NFL was worth giving up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick, then it was worth it.

My personal opinion is that if you give up that much to get a guy, he should be the last piece of a championship contender.

IMO they were a championship contender this year.  If he was healthy they would be playing in Atlanta this weekend with an excellent shot at moving on.

I disagree with that. 

The defense wasn't strong enough to make a run in the playoffs.  We feasted down the stretch on weak competition.  I think in that winning streak the best win we had was against Baltimore at home and that was with Cousins finishing it out.

I think the skins will make the playoffs again and considering all the injuries we had on D they played pretty good down the stretch when the replacement players became more comfortable at their positions. Plus I think the only team they lost by more than 8 points to in the 3-6 start was Pittsburgh, so they did play well against the good teams. They were getting used to not having their starting nose tackle, best LB and I don't know how many DBs. Also, Garcon was hurt during the majority of the 3-6 start, they had several new receivers, a rookie QB and RB and then the lost Fred Davis.

So, I think you can't look at the start of the season as indicative of how good they can be. They do need to get creative on the salary cap since the NFL nailed them on that. (Not too creative as they did during the no cap season).

Of course RGIII has to heal and I think he is a very accurate passer. I think going with the pistol offense was the Shanahans' way of getting RGIII starting and comfortable as quickly as possible.

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

And the Boys will assume their rightful position of most hyped team to never do anything.

Here is a video that RG tweeted today.

@RGIII: Here is the video for those who can't find it lol Narrated by @BMeriweather31 t.co/BDZDQU3cwG

Looks like he is training with Brandon Meriweather. Can you imagine if we would've had him and Orakpo the entire season? Wow.

packskins wrote:

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

And the Boys will assume their rightful position of most hyped team to never do anything.

Yeah, Monte Kiffin did a great job with USC's D.

packskins wrote:

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

And the Boys will assume their rightful position of most hyped team to never do anything.

The Cowgirls will, however, continue to lead the league in cocaine arrests and drunk driving wrecks.

JaegerWolf wrote:

packskins wrote:

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

And the Boys will assume their rightful position of most hyped team to never do anything.

The Cowgirls will, however, continue to lead the league in cocaine arrests and drunk driving wrecks.

They probably will but you might have missed wolfer's link to Fred Smoot's not so great night out. Course he's not a current player.

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

Of course the same kind of things were said about Rob Ryan a few years ago.  He did a good job of running his mouth at times.  That was about it.

Are they having to shoot embalming fluid into Kiffin now?  I know he was a State coach, but he was a boob.

dsd27205 wrote:

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

Of course the same kind of things were said about Rob Ryan a few years ago.  He did a good job of running his mouth at times.  That was about it.

Are they having to shoot embalming fluid into Kiffin now?  I know he was a State coach, but he was a boob.

Nobody is worried about his old decrepid ***

NCSUredskin wrote:

dsd27205 wrote:

LiveWolvesinUnitards wrote: Monte will have their defense eating babies. Redskins will reassume their rightful position at the bottom of the NFC East.

Of course the same kind of things were said about Rob Ryan a few years ago.  He did a good job of running his mouth at times.  That was about it.

Are they having to shoot embalming fluid into Kiffin now?  I know he was a State coach, but he was a boob.

Nobody is worried about his old decrepid ***

I have nothing against Kiffin (of course I despise the Cowboys), but after seeing what he did at his last job, I have a hard time seeing him doing well in Dallas and especially connecting with his players at 72 years of age.

Why in the hell would the Redskins want anything to do with AJ Smith much less hire him?

The Chargers drafted pretty well under Smith. The problem was that he had an owner unwilling to spend. He won't have that problem with Danny Boy.

TimPack10 wrote: Why in the hell would the Redskins want anything to do with AJ Smith much less hire him?

My thoughts also. Eeek!

AJS, ugh. He will have to prove to me he knows what he is doing.