packwad97 wrote: I keep hearing “this is over” and “nothing is going to happen to the Cheats”. To the folks that have this belief, what more do you think could/should have happened by now? I am talking in realistic terms, not “burn the place to the ground” type stuff.

I agree that this is a slow and frustrating process to watch unfold, I would love to see them get the Death Penalty too, but the Cheats have a team of lawyers, PR machine, and are some obfuscating SOB’s. They have threaded the needle for 3 years now and continue to do so. They refuse to do an independent investigation and come clean like Penn State did.

At a bare minimum, the NCAA should have rented out a building so they could temporarily relocate here to continue investigating how athletes received fraudulent grades and remained eligible.

StateGrad1979 wrote:

JohnBaker wrote: 'UNC sexual assault victim faces possible expulsion for speaking out'  yahoo.com

A University of North Carolina sexual assault victim has been charged with violating the school's honor code and creating a hostile environment for her attacker by speaking out about her ordeal.

So, the Honor Court that apparently was too stupid to discover McAdoo's plagiarism has nothing better to do with its time than to threaten an alleged sexual assault victim with expulsion? It makes no difference if the alleged perpetrator feels harassed, if the alleged victim's statements are true, they are absolutely protected by the First Amendment. It's amazing how a place can be just 24 miles away but on a different planet.

It is truly unbelievable.  They are basically saying she could be expelled because she is making life hard on the poor guy that..... RAPED..... her.

The NCAA said they would look after all the investigations are through.  The SBI still has not reported on their findings.  

Now in their defense(the NCAA) it would behoove them to wait then come back because they don't have the staff or man power to have a serious investigation.  Now will they come back?  Hard to know right now, but if SACS and the Drake group raise enough ruckus and if the N & O still has some very damning information, then eventually they will be forced to come back.  

I know it's maddening and they should already have come back, but if they do decide to come back, then I would think UNC is going to be hit hard.  We will just have to wait and I know in this age of instant information and gratification that many people want it right now, but that is not how it works.  Remember it took the NCAA 4 years to sanction USC for the Reggie Bush incident.

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

DrummerboyWolf wrote: Oh some of the bullets have hit the target.  Their reputation is damaged.  They have an accrediting agency that is looking for some right answers or they are going to be on probation.  They have lost a head football coach, associate head coach, a chancellor, a major fundraiser, along with many others.  They may skate from the NCAA but to say they have not been harmed by the scandal is being naive.  And the thing about it we're still talking about it and if the Drake group gets involved, then they are not going easy into the night either.

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

52Fan wrote: Well, you all DO know that the Orange County DA, Jim Woodall is an Alumnus of.....you guessed it....UNC-CH.

I keep thinking that SOMEONE along the way will actually care enough about doing the right thing that they won't let their allegiance to the Hole prevent them from doing it.  I know, it's pie in the sky, but someone has to have some integrity, don't they?  Someone?  ANYONE?

I didn't say they had not been harmed.  I'm talking about everything that has come out since the NCAA "sanctioned" them.  So many bullets just screaming for the NCAA to return, and still nothing.  They have lost some personnel (some of them MAJOR), and their reputation has certainly taken a hit.  But they are rolling right along almost like nothing happened.  And if nothing else happens, they're receiving a very strong message that nothing really has to change going forward.  So all this is almost for nothing.  Most other schools would have had to close their doors with a scandal of this magnitude.  But not the Holes.  They are above the law, because (IMO) they ARE the law.  They have too much power and influence over just about every governing body imaginable. So they get to do as they please.  And there's no way that happened by chance.  This is purely and 100% by design.  They are geniuses.  Evil geniuses, maybe.  But geniuses.

I saw this on Yahoo a few minutes ago.  HORRIBLE.  Just another indication of the mentality of the idiots over in Chapel Hill.  Instead of standing by the victim, they are making her the bad guy.  Wonder if the "poor guy" is an athlete???

I hope she nails them to the wall on this!

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

packwad97 wrote: I keep hearing “this is over” and “nothing is going to happen to the Cheats”. To the folks that have this belief, what more do you think could/should have happened by now? I am talking in realistic terms, not “burn the place to the ground” type stuff.

I agree that this is a slow and frustrating process to watch unfold, I would love to see them get the Death Penalty too, but the Cheats have a team of lawyers, PR machine, and are some obfuscating SOB’s. They have threaded the needle for 3 years now and continue to do so. They refuse to do an independent investigation and come clean like Penn State did.

At a bare minimum, the NCAA should have rented out a building so they could temporarily relocate here to continue investigating how athletes received fraudulent grades and remained eligible.

prior to this scandal, if a poster made a crack about the NCAA being corrupt, someone would post a black helicopter pic - who's really willing to defend what the NCAA does or doesn't do now? It's not just fans saying the NCAA is full of it, people in sports media openly mock them now (Lupica, Bilas, Rome, Feinstein, Doyel, Forde). So an organization that claimed they're about fair play & integrity have done nothing to prove that, in fact their actions indicate just the opposite.

BlackRazor wrote:

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

packwad97 wrote: I keep hearing “this is over” and “nothing is going to happen to the Cheats”. To the folks that have this belief, what more do you think could/should have happened by now? I am talking in realistic terms, not “burn the place to the ground” type stuff.

I agree that this is a slow and frustrating process to watch unfold, I would love to see them get the Death Penalty too, but the Cheats have a team of lawyers, PR machine, and are some obfuscating SOB’s. They have threaded the needle for 3 years now and continue to do so. They refuse to do an independent investigation and come clean like Penn State did.

At a bare minimum, the NCAA should have rented out a building so they could temporarily relocate here to continue investigating how athletes received fraudulent grades and remained eligible.

prior to this scandal, if a poster made a crack about the NCAA being corrupt, someone would post a black helicopter pic - who's really willing to defend what the NCAA does or doesn't do now? It's not just fans saying the NCAA is full of it, people in sports media openly mock them now (Lupica, Bilas, Rome, Feinstein, Doyel, Forde). So an organization that claimed they're about fair play & integrity have done nothing to prove that, in fact their actions indicate just the opposite.

This is true.  It is also true for UNC and their corruption.  As Pack fans we were always called the lunatic fringe, paranoid, and jealous by their success when we questioned the "Carolina Way".  But not anymore...

They will indict Nyang’oro because they know he is out of the country and will not fight it...
They will leave Crowder alone because that is what the power brokers want...
The only way the cheats get further NCAA action is for Kayne to stay on their ***...
Even then, Emmert will not do anything because he wants Thrope's old job...
The most corrupt institution in the history of the NCAA is the NCAA...

DrummerboyWolf wrote: The NCAA said they would look after all the investigations are through.  The SBI still has not reported on their findings.  

Now in their defense(the NCAA) it would behoove them to wait then come back because they don't have the staff or man power to have a serious investigation.  Now will they come back?  Hard to know right now, but if SACS and the Drake group raise enough ruckus and if the N & O still has some very damning information, then eventually they will be forced to come back.  

I know it's maddening and they should already have come back, but if they do decide to come back, then I would think UNC is going to be hit hard.  We will just have to wait and I know in this age of instant information and gratification that many people want it right now, but that is not how it works.  Remember it took the NCAA 4 years to sanction USC for the Reggie Bush incident.

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

DrummerboyWolf wrote: Oh some of the bullets have hit the target.  Their reputation is damaged.  They have an accrediting agency that is looking for some right answers or they are going to be on probation.  They have lost a head football coach, associate head coach, a chancellor, a major fundraiser, along with many others.  They may skate from the NCAA but to say they have not been harmed by the scandal is being naive.  And the thing about it we're still talking about it and if the Drake group gets involved, then they are not going easy into the night either.

TruthBKnownReturns wrote:

52Fan wrote: Well, you all DO know that the Orange County DA, Jim Woodall is an Alumnus of.....you guessed it....UNC-CH.

I keep thinking that SOMEONE along the way will actually care enough about doing the right thing that they won't let their allegiance to the Hole prevent them from doing it.  I know, it's pie in the sky, but someone has to have some integrity, don't they?  Someone?  ANYONE?

I didn't say they had not been harmed.  I'm talking about everything that has come out since the NCAA "sanctioned" them.  So many bullets just screaming for the NCAA to return, and still nothing.  They have lost some personnel (some of them MAJOR), and their reputation has certainly taken a hit.  But they are rolling right along almost like nothing happened.  And if nothing else happens, they're receiving a very strong message that nothing really has to change going forward.  So all this is almost for nothing.  Most other schools would have had to close their doors with a scandal of this magnitude.  But not the Holes.  They are above the law, because (IMO) they ARE the law.  They have too much power and influence over just about every governing body imaginable. So they get to do as they please.  And there's no way that happened by chance.  This is purely and 100% by design.  They are geniuses.  Evil geniuses, maybe.  But geniuses.

When did the NCAA ever say they were planning to return? I thought they kinda left the door open to that possibility, but basically said they were not coming back unless something new came out.  And new stuff has come out, but the NCAA has agreed that it was an academic issue (even though it is CLEARLY an athletic issue) and they are not in the academics game.  They leave that up to the schools.

I don't need immediate gratification.  It took the NCAA a long time to get USC, yes.  But they didn't stop investigating, only to return 2-3 years later, did they?  They actually DID an investigation of USC.  Not so much with UN*C.  I feel pretty certain the NCAA is done with the Holes.  I don't think we're going to get ANY gratification, much less immediate gratification.

The one thing about them that could do them in is their arrogance.
I could see them expecting this to be over and a new exposure could nail them if it is significant enough that the PR firm cannot spin it.

55blue wrote: The one thing about them that could do them in is their arrogance.
I could see them expecting this to be over and a new exposure could nail them if it is significant enough that the PR firm cannot spin it.

When they can't spin something, that's when they try to convince people that everybody does it.  They have an answer for everything.

The one thing that stills strikes fear in the hearts of UNC VIPs is they still do not know what Kane knows and has not yet revealed.

They must be constantly worrying "did we get away with it? Do we remain quiet and hope it fades away, or will Kane then pop up and show we knew about it but chose to remain silent?"

Point the finger at a convenient scapegoat or remain silent?  Tough choice ....

turbyjr1959 wrote: They will indict Nyang’oro because they know he is out of the country and will not fight it...
They will leave Crowder alone because that is what the power brokers want...
The only way the cheats get further NCAA action is for Kayne to stay on their ***...
Even then, Emmert will not do anything because he wants Thrope's old job...
The most corrupt institution in the history of the NCAA is the NCAA...

If those 2 things happen, I'd love to hear the spin on why indict him but not her?

Rspnc wrote: The one thing that stills strikes fear in the hearts of UNC VIPs is they still do not know what Kane knows and has not yet revealed.

They must be constantly worrying "did we get away with it? Do we remain quiet and hope it fades away, or will Kane then pop up and show we knew about it but chose to remain silent?"

Point the finger at a convenient scapegoat or remain silent?  Tough choice ....

Even if Kane doesn't know anything else now, can UNC really be sure all the leaks are plugged & will remain so? What sane person honestly believes only 2 people @ UNC knew about this?

From the NCAA's website:

"A commitment to academics and student-athlete success in the classroom is a
vital part of the NCAA’s mission...NCAA member schools create rules to ensure
that the Association’s student-athletes compete on equal footing... the
Association’s belief in student-athletes as students first is paramount."  
 
So what do you do when you find out that one of your schools has been operating hundreds of fake classes for over a thousand athletes, giving them free credit hours and grades with forged signatures to assure they remain eligible to play, and that they have done this for the past 17 years?! What is appropriate other than the death penalty in all sports?

There may be only one school in the country who could get out of this one.

UNC knows better than anyone else how to keep regulators off of their backs. Also, they have really dug in their (tar) heels to defend their cheating. They seem to be most willing to wage a war of resources, although their current spin war is having a few problems. I still expect the new chancellor selection to be made based primarily on who can provide the best appearance of academic integrity rather than who can provide the best actual academic integrity. That golden idol over there is not going anywhere.

I would love to get an honest answer from any SBI investigator & the DA as to the motive of this criminal activity they have been investigating for almost a year now. Anything other than an ELIGIBILITY SHAM FOR ATHLETES & I call BS!

packwad97 wrote: I keep hearing “this is over” and “nothing is going to happen to the Cheats”. To the folks that have this belief, what more do you think could/should have happened by now? I am talking in realistic terms, not “burn the place to the ground” type stuff.

I agree that this is a slow and frustrating process to watch unfold, I would love to see them get the Death Penalty too, but the Cheats have a team of lawyers, PR machine, and are some obfuscating SOB’s. They have threaded the needle for 3 years now and continue to do so. They refuse to do an independent investigation and come clean like Penn State did.

When Martin presented his report, the media had an opportunity to ask them why they weren't interested in getting to the bottom of this scandal.  Everyone in that room could see how ridiculous that whole show was.  The sigh of relief after Martin's first statement announcing this was not an athletic scandal should have really brought out the wolves, but it didn't.  They just sat there and asked a few polite questions.  Kane was the only one that took the opportunity to have them explain their illogical logic and even he let them dance around his questions.  Maybe justice will come some day.

Correct me if I am wrong but, only Prof Kangaroo can be indicted for taking money and not teaching. Crowder just forged signatures, she wont be indicted at all. She is free and clear.
Indict Prof Kangaroo and he stays in Africa....no one squeels like a pig in this SBI probe.

All we have is SACS, and I dont hold out any hope for that one. Drake, I have no clue.

Do we know for a fact that Nyang'oro is out of country, or even out of Durham?

55blue wrote: The one thing about them that could do them in is their arrogance.
I could see them expecting this to be over and a new exposure could nail them if it is significant enough that the PR firm cannot spin it.

It would be just like them to violate their probation by doing something arrogant like putting up a billboard claiming a championship they weren't eligible to win.

JKReading wrote:

55blue wrote: The one thing about them that could do them in is their arrogance.
I could see them expecting this to be over and a new exposure could nail them if it is significant enough that the PR firm cannot spin it.

It would be just like them to violate their probation by doing something arrogant like putting up a billboard claiming a championship they weren't eligible to win.

Except this probation means zilch, nada. Just wait and see.

Let us not forget how the state senator challenged woodalls "salt" in this piece.

carolinacolumns.com/thom-gools...riminal-probe-2

unclewolf wrote: Do we know for a fact that Nyang'oro is out of country, or even out of Durham?

it's still amazing to hear that of all the profs @ UNC his players had, Bunting says that was the one he claims he never met.

Put aside the FB scandal, just WTF was that clown doing there wasting state tax $'s?

CowboyPack wrote: Let us not forget how the state senator challenged woodalls "salt" in this piece.

carolinacolumns.com/thom-gools...riminal-probe-2

He's on record.  Now we'll never hear from him again--just like brother Burley.  It's important for political leaders to talk tough on occasion.  Watching what they actually do is the key that unlocks understanding.

Yeah, I guess I have just about given up. Maybe I am just getting tired of all the UNC homers laughing at us for thinking they were going to get hammered, and as of now just a slap on the wrist. Guess also when the Martin report was outed for the sham it was, I expected for someone to call for an independent investigation. Guess I also expected the football team to go like 1-7 in the ACC, and not 5-3, & 8-4 Overall. That is about what they had been doing anyway. Guess, I also expected them to be last in recruiting in the ACC, not 5th. Just frustrated this has not had a profound effect on them, while at the same time there is nothing really strongly pointing that there will be.
BlackRazor wrote:

apackfan69 wrote: Give it up guys. It's over. Nobody more than me wanted them to go down in a big way. It's not going to happen, period! They got away with it. Kane has shot all his bullets, and the NCAA is through with them. They have spent millions of dollars buying off people to be able to get away with it. The local newspaper tried, and failed, some of the National newspapers tried and failed. The local, and national TV networks won't touch it. The NCAA gave them a slap om the wrist in football, and they still came out okay. All the people(except Roy)who were involved in this scandal are gone, and I am betting are financially set for life. Since they got away with it, you can be sure they will go right back to cheating again. This time though, they will learn from the mistakes they made and the cover up will be even deeper. Get ready boys, things are going to get much worse for all the State fans who love to see UNC fail. Look for 2 or 3 big time basketball recruit, and a couple of 5 star football players to commit within the next year.

Honestly from your post, it appears you gave up.

So next year UNC FB recruiting takes off? We heard it was going to be this year & they finished 6th in the weak *** ACC.

Treyvon wrote: Correct me if I am wrong but, only Prof Kangaroo can be indicted for taking money and not teaching. Crowder just forged signatures, she wont be indicted at all. She is free and clear.
Indict Prof Kangaroo and he stays in Africa....no one squeels like a pig in this SBI probe.

All we have is SACS, and I dont hold out any hope for that one. Drake, I have no clue.

As strange as it seems, I think the only classes in question for Dr J regarding financial remuneration are the summer school courses. It is hard to explain... basically, he was a state employee nine months of the year and then a contract employee the months he was teaching summer school. I think the question asked was did he fulfill the conditions of his summer contract. The other nine months, there really is no contract in place. Basically we (faculty) get paid to get the job done recognizing the definition of what that job is changes (sometimes frequently). The number of courses you teach and which courses you teach can change each semester (although, that makes long-term planning a nightmare for the department and faculty member).

Sometime ago, it was recognized that something similar to a contract needed to be in place. The question kept coming up in the promotion and tenure process, what does the university expect of me and what do I expect in return. We refer to those as Statement of Mutual Expectations (NCSU's SME policy: http://policies.ncsu.edu/regulation/reg-05-20-27).

Some departments use the SMEs quite effectively. Others, it is just another piece of paper. As part of promotion and tenure discussions, you technically can only evaluate the faculty member against what is in the SME. If that document says you will teach 6 courses, you better be teaching 6 courses. If you are teaching only 3, you are considered under performing in the view of some administrators. From the faculty perspective, I've seen SMEs where the faculty said the university will provide a safe & healthy work environment that includes an office, X sq. ft of lab space, 2 graduates student stipends, a phone, email, computer and laptop. Once both the university and the faculty sign the document, the university is expected to provide those resources. If not, the faculty can not be held accountable for not meeting the university's expectations of the faculty member... that is why it is called a Statement of Mutual Expectations. I know of two cases where people have included the "healthy work environment" clause in their SME. Once signed, they used that mutually agreed expectation to force the university to address the mold issues in their damp offices. The university had no choice but to address the problem or relocate the faculty member. One person I know ended up in rented space at Centennial Campus because the university couldn't practically solve the mold problem. Their office is in some of our top-dollar real estate (i.e., price per sq ft).

Since 2002, Statements of Mutual Expectations have been policy at all campuses of the UNC system. Wonder what is included in Dr J's SME? Statements of Mutual Expectations are part of our personnel files... not sure if they are subject to FOIA or not.

ProfessorWolf wrote:

Treyvon wrote: Correct me if I am wrong but, only Prof Kangaroo can be indicted for taking money and not teaching. Crowder just forged signatures, she wont be indicted at all. She is free and clear.
Indict Prof Kangaroo and he stays in Africa....no one squeels like a pig in this SBI probe.

All we have is SACS, and I dont hold out any hope for that one. Drake, I have no clue.

As strange as it seems, I think the only classes in question for Dr J regarding financial remuneration are the summer school courses. It is hard to explain... basically, he was a state employee nine months of the year and then a contract employee the months he was teaching summer school. I think the question asked was did he fulfill the conditions of his summer contract. The other nine months, there really is no contract in place. Basically we (faculty) get paid to get the job done recognizing the definition of what that job is changes (sometimes frequently). The number of courses you teach and which courses you teach can change each semester (although, that makes long-term planning a nightmare for the department and faculty member).

Sometime ago, it was recognized that something similar to a contract needed to be in place. The question kept coming up in the promotion and tenure process, what does the university expect of me and what do I expect in return. We refer to those as Statement of Mutual Expectations (NCSU's SME policy: http://policies.ncsu.edu/regulation/reg-05-20-27).

Some departments use the SMEs quite effectively. Others, it is just another piece of paper. As part of promotion and tenure discussions, you technically can only evaluate the faculty member against what is in the SME. If that document says you will teach 6 courses, you better be teaching 6 courses. If you are teaching only 3, you are considered under performing in the view of some administrators. From the faculty perspective, I've seen SMEs where the faculty said the university will provide a safe & healthy work environment that includes an office, X sq. ft of lab space, 2 graduates student stipends, a phone, email, computer and laptop. Once both the university and the faculty sign the document, the university is expected to provide those resources. If not, the faculty can not be held accountable for not meeting the university's expectations of the faculty member... that is why it is called a Statement of Mutual Expectations. I know of two cases where people have included the "healthy work environment" clause in their SME. Once signed, they used that mutually agreed expectation to force the university to address the mold issues in their damp offices. The university had no choice but to address the problem or relocate the faculty member. One person I know ended up in rented space at Centennial Campus because the university couldn't practically solve the mold problem. Their office is in some of our top-dollar real estate (i.e., price per sq ft).

Since 2002, Statements of Mutual Expectations have been policy at all campuses of the UNC system. Wonder what is included in Dr J's SME? Statements of Mutual Expectations are part of our personnel files... not sure if they are subject to FOIA or not.

Dear God he wont even be indicted.....

Treyvon wrote:

ProfessorWolf wrote:

Treyvon wrote: Correct me if I am wrong but, only Prof Kangaroo can be indicted for taking money and not teaching. Crowder just forged signatures, she wont be indicted at all. She is free and clear.
Indict Prof Kangaroo and he stays in Africa....no one squeels like a pig in this SBI probe.

All we have is SACS, and I dont hold out any hope for that one. Drake, I have no clue.

As strange as it seems, I think the only classes in question for Dr J regarding financial remuneration are the summer school courses. It is hard to explain... basically, he was a state employee nine months of the year and then a contract employee the months he was teaching summer school. I think the question asked was did he fulfill the conditions of his summer contract. The other nine months, there really is no contract in place. Basically we (faculty) get paid to get the job done recognizing the definition of what that job is changes (sometimes frequently). The number of courses you teach and which courses you teach can change each semester (although, that makes long-term planning a nightmare for the department and faculty member).

Sometime ago, it was recognized that something similar to a contract needed to be in place. The question kept coming up in the promotion and tenure process, what does the university expect of me and what do I expect in return. We refer to those as Statement of Mutual Expectations (NCSU's SME policy: http://policies.ncsu.edu/regulation/reg-05-20-27).

Some departments use the SMEs quite effectively. Others, it is just another piece of paper. As part of promotion and tenure discussions, you technically can only evaluate the faculty member against what is in the SME. If that document says you will teach 6 courses, you better be teaching 6 courses. If you are teaching only 3, you are considered under performing in the view of some administrators. From the faculty perspective, I've seen SMEs where the faculty said the university will provide a safe & healthy work environment that includes an office, X sq. ft of lab space, 2 graduates student stipends, a phone, email, computer and laptop. Once both the university and the faculty sign the document, the university is expected to provide those resources. If not, the faculty can not be held accountable for not meeting the university's expectations of the faculty member... that is why it is called a Statement of Mutual Expectations. I know of two cases where people have included the "healthy work environment" clause in their SME. Once signed, they used that mutually agreed expectation to force the university to address the mold issues in their damp offices. The university had no choice but to address the problem or relocate the faculty member. One person I know ended up in rented space at Centennial Campus because the university couldn't practically solve the mold problem. Their office is in some of our top-dollar real estate (i.e., price per sq ft).

Since 2002, Statements of Mutual Expectations have been policy at all campuses of the UNC system. Wonder what is included in Dr J's SME? Statements of Mutual Expectations are part of our personnel files... not sure if they are subject to FOIA or not.

Dear God he wont even be indicted.....

As crazy as it sounds, it is hard to see what he did during his 9 month appointment that is ILLEGAL (regarding the way the classes were taught). Now, did he teach them in accordance with the syllabus that was used during the accreditation of the classes/department/college/university? If not, then that might open a can of worms. Certainly SACS won't be happy (which we already know).

How does it play out with regards to financial aid? Theoretically, I could see where financial aid could have been used to pay for a course that was part of an accredited program, yet that program might not have been accredited had a syllabus been used that described the courses as they were actually being taught. That is an awful slippery slope to head down though. Honestly, I've probably deviated quite a bit over the years from the last official syllabus I've submitted. Course objectives are still the same, but maybe the assignments and grade weightings have changed some. That is not excusing Dr J for what he did, rather, I'm raising the question, you have to draw the line somewhere, so where do you draw it? He is obviously over the line, but am I? How much deviation from the syllabus is acceptable? These are issues someone will have to resolve as SACS comes to town.  

Back to the original point... his real issues are the summer classes. That is why when the university went to reclaim the salary dollars paid to him, it was only for the summer courses where he was paid as an independent contractor. Might the SBI have something on him for the 9-months he is an employee, maybe, but the low hanging fruit is certainly summer school. Add to that, we still don't know much about the forged signatures. Was it Dr J or Ms. Crowder... so that issue still lingers.

If he is out of the country, you can be SURE witnesses will say Nyangoro did all the forgery alone, leaving no one to charge for the crime

Prediction:
Woodall sends the SBI case straight to the grand jury. A grand jury comprised of between 12 and 18 people from Orange County. Some most likely work at unc. Others, who don’t work at unc, proudly wear their baby blue sweat gear and t-shirts from Wal Mart. All listen to evidence presented by the SBI and refuse to indict anyone. The SBI case is closed. Woodalls' hands are washed because he did all he can. The cheaters pound their chests and continue to proclaim their holier than thou righteousness.

I think this story was briefly discussed on this board, here is the latest:


College Rape Victim Faces Expulsion for Speaking Out
A sophomore at the University of North Carolina is facing potential expulsion from her school for what the college calls 'intimidating' behavior.

www.alternet.org/news-amp-poli...etter800175&t=7

The grand jury system in NC is a comical rubber-stamping farce. It's literally one-sided and secretive. It should be changed or abolished. It's a waste of tax dollars.

"The grand jury system in NC is a comical rubber-stamping farce. It's literally one-sided and secretive. It should be changed or abolished. It's a waste of tax dollars."

It will also give Woodall his out from the unc mess.

This one is all over the web. Maybe it deserves it's own thread? The comments section on these articles is a good place to toss a little education for those that may otherwise be unaware.

And before anyone sanctimoniously crucifies me for using this platform to get the "athletic scandal" word out....I'm attacking the insanity of rape even being an honor court issue....not rape itself. The fact is that a whole new world of people we read these articles as opposed to another unc scandal article. They have become numb.

Any thoughts? I've already hit the N&O article.

---------------------------------------------
--- wuffapotamus wrote:

I think this story was briefly discussed on this board, here is the latest:


College Rape Victim Faces Expulsion for Speaking Out
A sophomore at the University of North Carolina is facing potential expulsion from her school for what the college calls 'intimidating' behavior.

www.alternet.org/news-amp-poli...etter800175&t=7

---------------------------------------------

All it would take would be the Governor to publicly demand that all UNC staffers, BOT, BOG, amswe any and all questions of the SBI, any judge involved, and Dan Kane. I would like to ask a few questions as well.
---------------------------------------------
--- JKReading wrote:

packwad97 wrote: I keep hearing “this is over” and “nothing is going to happen to the Cheats”. To the folks that have this belief, what more do you think could/should have happened by now? I am talking in realistic terms, not “burn the place to the ground” type stuff.

I agree that this is a slow and frustrating process to watch unfold, I would love to see them get the Death Penalty too, but the Cheats have a team of lawyers, PR machine, and are some obfuscating SOB’s. They have threaded the needle for 3 years now and continue to do so. They refuse to do an independent investigation and come clean like Penn State did.

When Martin presented his report, the media had an opportunity to ask them why they weren't interested in getting to the bottom of this scandal.  Everyone in that room could see how ridiculous that whole show was.  The sigh of relief after Martin's first statement announcing this was not an athletic scandal should have really brought out the wolves, but it didn't.  They just sat there and asked a few polite questions.  Kane was the only one that took the opportunity to have them explain their illogical logic and even he let them dance around his questions.  Maybe justice will come some day.

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http://m.newsobserver.com/obse...ntguid=CYa8n8Rc

She says she won't be silenced and nor should she be...let's hope the scum on the hill get exposed for the garbage they are. All typical hatred of the holes aside, after reading this why would anyone want to send their daughter, sister, niece, etc to chapel hill? Unbelievable.

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--- amreep wrote:

m.newsobserver.com/obse...ntguid=CYa8n8Rc

She says she won't be silenced and nor should she be...let's hope the scum on the hill get exposed for the garbage they are. All typical hatred of the holes aside, after reading this why would anyone want to send their daughter, sister, niece, etc to chapel hill? Unbelievable.

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So I posted this comment in response to some heel asking "what evidence is there that unc is sinking into the sewers?".


A person bringing the treatment of victims of sex crimes to light at unc-ch, is now being threatened with expulsion...for making her situation public.

I have no idea what idiot decided sex crimes should be handled by the Honor Court. I also have no idea what idiot encouraged this young lady to pursue this avenue. I am not judging whether or not this event actually happened. I am very sensitive to "due process" and false accusations. However there are many loud voices coming out, and the fact that unc-ch is being sued by a group of victims speaks volumes.

When you add to that:
The mis-appropriations of Public Funds
The NCAA punishment of the football team for illegal benefits, revolving around runners for agents, an uncooperative Assoc Head Coach (that unc-ch paid off rather than forcing him to speak to the NCAA) and a tutor (previously let go because of her relationship with the athletes) employed by the Head Coach and that tutor then went way above and beyond in her relationship with the athletes.
The hundreds of bogus classes, in which less than 3% of the student body had 45% participation.
The hundreds of unauthorized grade changes (whom unc-ch still won't tell us who benefitted from that).
The steering of a yet undisclosed amount of athletes to these bogus classes.
The failure, after nearly 3 years to have one honest, independent investigation in the worst case of fraud in the history of American institutions.
The continued half-truths and lies by omission that have come from the unc-ch leadership, that were only discovered when fact checked by media and rival fan base message boards.

I don't know that unc-ch is "sinking" into the sewer. That predisposes that they aren't already there.

Read more here: www.newsobserver.com/2013/02/2...l#storylink=cpy

Excellent closing line...how unfortunate that it's probably too deep for the poster you were replying to!

dpanther wrote:

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--- amreep wrote:

m.newsobserver.com/obse...ntguid=CYa8n8Rc
She says she won't be silenced and nor should she be...let's hope the scum on the hill get exposed for the garbage they are. All typical hatred of the holes aside, after reading this why would anyone want to send their daughter, sister, niece, etc to chapel hill? Unbelievable.

---------------------------------------------

So I posted this comment in response to some heel asking "what evidence is there that unc is sinking into the sewers?".


A person bringing the treatment of victims of sex crimes to light at unc-ch, is now being threatened with expulsion...for making her situation public.

I have no idea what idiot decided sex crimes should be handled by the Honor Court. I also have no idea what idiot encouraged this young lady to pursue this avenue. I am not judging whether or not this event actually happened. I am very sensitive to "due process" and false accusations. However there are many loud voices coming out, and the fact that unc-ch is being sued by a group of victims speaks volumes.

When you add to that:
The mis-appropriations of Public Funds
The NCAA punishment of the football team for illegal benefits, revolving around runners for agents, an uncooperative Assoc Head Coach (that unc-ch paid off rather than forcing him to speak to the NCAA) and a tutor (previously let go because of her relationship with the athletes) employed by the Head Coach and that tutor then went way above and beyond in her relationship with the athletes.
The hundreds of bogus classes, in which less than 3% of the student body had 45% participation.
The hundreds of unauthorized grade changes (whom unc-ch still won't tell us who benefitted from that).
The steering of a yet undisclosed amount of athletes to these bogus classes.
The failure, after nearly 3 years to have one honest, independent investigation in the worst case of fraud in the history of American institutions.
The continued half-truths and lies by omission that have come from the unc-ch leadership, that were only discovered when fact checked by media and rival fan base message boards.

I don't know that unc-ch is "sinking" into the sewer. That predisposes that they aren't already there.

Read more here: www.newsobserver.com/2013/02/2...l#storylink=cpy

This "rape" story, or alleged rape story,whichever it may be, has the potential to go viral, while the other stuff has stayed off the radar. Maybe Kane needs to "link" these somehow.

In the academic and athletic probes, I see the link in the way Judges and DA's who are Alumni and possibly contributors or boosters seem to proceed with cases from which they SHOULD have recused themselves. Manning should not be Judging any cases involving UNC for example.

The question I would have at this point is, will we see a UNC Alumnus preside over this "rape" case too ?

People may be willing to look the other way over the UNC Football team or basketball team and their supposed academic performance, but this is different. This is somebody's little girl (and somebody's little boy too). There will be National interest in this and quite a bit of passion. The idea that in North Carolina we have Judges and DA's taking cases where they are clearly conflicted makes for mighty interesting reading.

Is it possible that the alledged rapist is an athlete?

I have no idea. I'm just throwing this out as a possibility.