1321wolf wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

The way the refs have done NC State this year has taken a toll.  I think that's what Wood is saying is part of the problem.  CJ's game focuses on driving and hopping to the rim.  It's his signature move.  The refs decided at various times in the season to let the players decide the game by allowing other teams to maul him with impunity.

CJ say BS, they hatin'.  

In the game in Raleigh Macadoo boddied him up twice and got 2 quick fouls. In the game yesterday 2 people bodied him up all game and nothing was called. Sometimes they even got him on the arm (the tv crew made a point of showing a couple of them in slow motion replay).

There is a reason they have these rules, you can keep anybody from making a shot if you body block them and hit them on the arm while they are shooting. That's why it is illegal.

And when you consider how CJ-Calvin has a demonstrated history of fragility on the court, you have the makings for an interesting discussion--if we can somehow get the women around here to restrain their emotional outbursts.

If the refs were that smart, they'd be working for the government, not reffing games to break people down. In fact, I bet Swofford told them to break down Leslie's will as a way of showing 'who's the man' in this conference.

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote: Yep, the refs have systematically broken down CJ's will to play and be a team player.

Come on? Do you really believe this?

Why does it matter what I believe?  My theory is both possible and plausible.  It explains a lot.  Before you kneejerk react like a female again, how about dealing with what Wood is quoted as saying.

I bet Wood is talking about CJ.  I would hope that's the case anyways.  It would be ridiculous for Gott to be whining about the officials after that game.

Personally, someone on that team needs to step up and call someone out in public.  Maybe that will get their attention.

Honestly i hope it's not. But we do NOT want anything played out in public. That is not good for our university, our program, or players.

It needs to be worked out privately, if there is a problem, and it needs to be done NOW.

Gott may have taken the first big step by benching him yesterday.

Maybe with some time to think it will get thru to him.

I tell you- I would NOT want Gott's job dealing with him....

*And, no, wolfbreath buddy - I do not think it is coaching at all.

We are lucky to have a coach of this caliber.

I'll say this. It was called pretty evenly, but the sheer lack of fouls called clearly benefits the smaller team. They could only defend our bigs by hacking them. Had the refs called a ticky tack game we would have won by 20. I thought we tried to adjust by being aggressive but got frustrated in the process.

badweatherpackfan wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote: Yep, the refs have systematically broken down CJ's will to play and be a team player.

Come on? Do you really believe this?

Why does it matter what I believe?  My theory is both possible and plausible.  It explains a lot.  Before you kneejerk react like a female again, how about dealing with what Wood is quoted as saying.

I bet Wood is talking about CJ.  I would hope that's the case anyways.  It would be ridiculous for Gott to be whining about the officials after that game.

Personally, someone on that team needs to step up and call someone out in public.  Maybe that will get their attention.

Honestly i hope it's not. But we do NOT want anything played out in public. That is not good for our university, our program, or players.

It needs to be worked out privately, if there is a problem, and it needs to be done NOW.

Gott may have taken the first big step by benching him yesterday.

Maybe with some time to think it will get thru to him.

I tell you- I would NOT want Gott's job dealing with him....

*And, no, wolfbreath buddy - I do not think it is coaching at all.

We are lucky to have a coach of this caliber.

Oh I'm glad we have Gott, but putting CJL back in yesterday was a bad coaching decision.

You gravitate to that which you secretly love most. You meet in life the exact reproduction of your own thoughts

Fans and players need to stop blaming refs for these pitiful performances. Sound like losers and excuse makers. Pack sux on the road. That is confirmed.

Leslie doesn't finish well with contact. I think the way to play him is with a little guy who can stay in front of him...expose his ballhandling, shooting and footwork problems...body him a little and you have the makings of a bad day for Leslie.

Coach Gott (after ACCT):  "Can't talk about it. You get fined."

Scott Wood 2/23/2013: "I'm not allowed to say."

GregMarmalard wrote: Fans and players need to stop blaming refs for these pitiful performances. Sound like losers and excuse makers. Pack sux on the road. That is confirmed.

It's almost like some fans have a victim mentality.

You gravitate to that which you secretly love most. You meet in life the exact reproduction of your own thoughts

Heels played better and made the plays to win. That is why state lost (just like every other road game against a decent team).

Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

MountainWolfNC wrote:

XxPack18xX wrote: bunch of drama queens on here. relax guys. Damn

Says Mr. "OMG! I HEARD JULIUS RANDLE'S MOM ISN'T PICKING UP OUR PHONE CALLS!!!!!1"

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

We will never be a good (or great) team until we are mentally tough enough to understand that we are not going to get the "CALL", ever. We need to be relentless and play like Wolves, not kittens, when things don't go our way. We play soft and we seem to get our feelings hurt.  Screw that and act like men!

sbofree wrote: Leslie doesn't finish well with contact. I think the way to play him is with a little guy who can stay in front of him...expose his ballhandling, shooting and footwork problems...body him a little and you have the makings of a bad day for Leslie.

That's why he needs to shoot the 12-15 footer. It boggles the mind he doesn't shoot the shot at least 3-4 times a game.

Zulu as Kono wrote: We will never be a good (or great) team until we are mentally tough enough to understand that we are not going to get the "CALL", ever. We need to be relentless and play like Wolves, not kittens, when things don't go our way. We play soft and we seem to get our feelings hurt.  Screw that and act like men!

Agreed.

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

I think the other fellas are correct - he's talking about the refs. Saying that he's "not allowed" to say it kinda spells it out.

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

And when did he start playing his best basketball, Armand?

If he shot it 4 times, he'd be lucky to make 1. It boggles my mind more that he hasn't worked on his shot more to the point where it is a weapon opponents have to fear. I'd give him those shots all day long if I'm an opponent guarding him. I'd rather Howell take 12-15 footers than Leslie.

rswilli2 wrote: I think the other fellas are correct - he's talking about the refs. Saying that he's "not allowed" to say it kinda spells it out.

In that case, it's a bit concerning that Gottfried thinks that the refs were a particular issue in THIS game.  If anything, you can say that they gave us the benefit of the doubt.  It wasn't their fault we were allergic to baskets.

rswilli2 wrote: I think the other fellas are correct - he's talking about the refs. Saying that he's "not allowed" to say it kinda spells it out.

Yeah, but that isn't "Oxygen Channel"-esque enough for the ladies on here so it probably will be disregarded.

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

And when did he start playing his best basketball, Armand?

With the UNC game in Raleigh.  That's when he emerged, IMO.

Back and to the left.

Back and to the left.

Back and to the left.

Where is the cheapest gas?

We had 17 fouls they had 12.
We shot 13 fts they shot 16

Not a big discrepancy from the stats.

wolfbreath wrote:

badweatherpackfan wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote: Yep, the refs have systematically broken down CJ's will to play and be a team player.

Come on? Do you really believe this?

Why does it matter what I believe?  My theory is both possible and plausible.  It explains a lot.  Before you kneejerk react like a female again, how about dealing with what Wood is quoted as saying.

I bet Wood is talking about CJ.  I would hope that's the case anyways.  It would be ridiculous for Gott to be whining about the officials after that game.

Personally, someone on that team needs to step up and call someone out in public.  Maybe that will get their attention.

Honestly i hope it's not. But we do NOT want anything played out in public. That is not good for our university, our program, or players.

It needs to be worked out privately, if there is a problem, and it needs to be done NOW.

Gott may have taken the first big step by benching him yesterday.

Maybe with some time to think it will get thru to him.

I tell you- I would NOT want Gott's job dealing with him....

*And, no, wolfbreath buddy - I do not think it is coaching at all.

We are lucky to have a coach of this caliber.

Oh I'm glad we have Gott, but putting CJL back in yesterday was a bad coaching decision.

I agree with you there. We were up 4 or 5 when Leslie went back in. What did he have after that - 1 dunk? Should have left him on the bench.

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

And when did he start playing his best basketball, Armand?

With the UNC game in Raleigh.  That's when he emerged, IMO.

We were in the middle of a 4 game losing streak and playing horrible basketball this time last year. We lost two of those by double digits.

hunwolf wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

And when did he start playing his best basketball, Armand?

With the UNC game in Raleigh.  That's when he emerged, IMO.

We were in the middle of a 4 game losing streak and playing horrible basketball this time last year. We lost two of those by double digits.

We played three ranked teams during that stretch including two top 10 teams.

ArmandJ wrote:

hunwolf wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Never rule out a conclusion unless a premise it is based upon can be proven false.

When the refs were arguably a lot worse last year, why did CJ Leslie start playing some of his best basketball...?

And when did he start playing his best basketball, Armand?

With the UNC game in Raleigh.  That's when he emerged, IMO.

We were in the middle of a 4 game losing streak and playing horrible basketball this time last year. We lost two of those by double digits.

We played three ranked teams during that stretch including two top 10 teams.

We also lost a 20+ point lead with under 10 minutes to go in one game, and we were completely humiliated at home by FSU.

This board had given up completely on any tourney hopes by February 26th. Any hopes at all.

Armand, are you saying that since CJ had an awesome game come tournament time, that the refs aren't affecting his play this year?  I'm just trying to clarify your argument.

---------------------------------------------
--- ack8ar wrote:

1321wolf wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:The way the refs have done NC State this year has taken a toll.  I think that's what Wood is saying is part of the problem.  CJ's game focuses on driving and hopping to the rim.  It's his signature move.  The refs decided at various times in the season to let the players decide the game by allowing other teams to maul him with impunity.

CJ say BS, they hatin'.  

In the game in Raleigh Macadoo boddied him up twice and got 2 quick fouls. In the game yesterday 2 people bodied him up all game and nothing was called. Sometimes they even got him on the arm (the tv crew made a point of showing a couple of them in slow motion replay).

There is a reason they have these rules, you can keep anybody from making a shot if you body block them and hit them on the arm while they are shooting. That's why it is illegal.

every ******* loss this board turns into a bunch of pansies, awwww the refs let them touch me! man up, blame the fact they got outplayed by a worse team.

---------------------------------------------


And every loss results in comments like these from you, you tiresome dickchancre.

RaleighBound wrote: Armand, are you saying that since CJ had an awesome game come tournament time, that the refs aren't affecting his play this year?  I'm just trying to clarify your argument.

Pretty much.  Last year he seemed to be a lot less selfish than this year.  I honestly don't think the refs are impacting that.

hunwolf wrote:
We also lost a 20+ point lead with under 10 minutes to go in one game, and we were completely humiliated at home by FSU.

This board had given up completely on any tourney hopes by February 26th. Any hopes at all.

And it was a reasonable assumption to make.  We had one quality win and were on the bubble.

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote: Armand, are you saying that since CJ had an awesome game come tournament time, that the refs aren't affecting his play this year?  I'm just trying to clarify your argument.

Pretty much.  Last year he seemed to be a lot less selfish than this year.  I honestly don't think the refs are impacting that.

Thank you.  Go Pack.

wolfbreath wrote:

badweatherpackfan wrote:

ArmandJ wrote:

RaleighBound wrote:

ArmandJ wrote: Yep, the refs have systematically broken down CJ's will to play and be a team player.

Come on? Do you really believe this?

Why does it matter what I believe?  My theory is both possible and plausible.  It explains a lot.  Before you kneejerk react like a female again, how about dealing with what Wood is quoted as saying.

I bet Wood is talking about CJ.  I would hope that's the case anyways.  It would be ridiculous for Gott to be whining about the officials after that game.

Personally, someone on that team needs to step up and call someone out in public.  Maybe that will get their attention.

Honestly i hope it's not. But we do NOT want anything played out in public. That is not good for our university, our program, or players.

It needs to be worked out privately, if there is a problem, and it needs to be done NOW.

Gott may have taken the first big step by benching him yesterday.

Maybe with some time to think it will get thru to him.

I tell you- I would NOT want Gott's job dealing with him....

*And, no, wolfbreath buddy - I do not think it is coaching at all.

We are lucky to have a coach of this caliber.

Oh I'm glad we have Gott, but putting CJL back in yesterday was a bad coaching decision.

Agreed. Then again, he only has 7 guys...??

It's not rocket science. If he has the 12-15 foot jumper he needs to take it. We also need to start giving him the ball at the elbow, and stop posting him up so much on the low block.

Part of his problem is we're setting him up to fail IMO. It's not all on him.

It wasn't the ref's that lost the game against Wake.  It wasn't the refs that lost the Maryland and Miami games.  Time to quit blaming refs and take an objective look at the weaknesses of this team.

PicklePacker wrote: We weren't in foul trouble and there was no one questionable call that cost us the game. We got drilled. He's not blaming the refs.

 Backwards way of looking at it.  We got called for fouls that went uncalled the other way. Even the female announcer talked about the disparity of the officiating. Had the calls been evenly handed out I think eweNc would have had to alter their lineup a bit.  But I do agree we got drilled because a few of our players played sloppy. There are times when Leslie, Brown and Howell get the ball and you know they are not going to pass to anyone. They are intent on scoring the basket no matter how badly out of position they are in.

hunwolf wrote:

MountainWolfNC wrote:

XxPack18xX wrote: bunch of drama queens on here. relax guys. Damn

Says Mr. "OMG! I HEARD JULIUS RANDLE'S MOM ISN'T PICKING UP OUR PHONE CALLS!!!!!1"

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

LOL pwned.

We should reverse roles for Warren and Leslie...set plays for Warren to take a shot and let Leslie get his without the ball running through him.