I'm not taking anything away from Snyder but please go back and look at the mans career before you label him a genius. Arguably the best coach he has ever beaten is Bob Stoops and he is 2-9 vs Stoops after that it is probably Mack Brown then ??? Maybe Pete Carrol before USC was cheating with Bush or Phil Fulmor at Tenn in the 2001 Cotton Bowl when Tenn had a true Fr at QB.

My point is not that Snyder is a bad coach he is in fact a very good coach, but before we all just accept that GIVEN SIX WEEKS TO PREPARE Bill Snyder will out execute any coach in Football lets remember he is 6-7 in Bowl Games has not won a Bowl game since 2002 and speed is not exactly the overall team strength of KSU.

Bill Snyder is not perfect but he is a great coach.  Your shots at him remind me of those who point out Self's Elite 8 record to take him down.

Troll so hard homie, troll sooo hard.

I'm not taking shots at Snyder. I just find it interesting that when you look at other threads many fans feel Snyder given 6 Weeks will magically lead KSU over any team. If his Bowl record was 6-7 and he had beaten/lost to a Spurrier, Saben, Meyer etc I would agree with the narrative of Snyder as a great tactiicion who out coaches everyone but its just not as cut and dried as people make it out to be IMO.

This is an interesting (though old) discussion; I suppose this season might be cause to reevaluate it. I'll preface it by saying I hate the man because he single-handedly kept the Purple Tumor alive in this conference. They were a gnat's ass away from being the Missouri Valley today---in all sports, which, I think, would have changed KU's AD significantly over the last 20 years.

That said, you'll never hear me say the man isn't one of the most impressive coaches I've seen. But, whether he's great or not is sort of a different question. I say he is. While he only has two conference titles in 21 seasons (and two BCS-type game appearances), he also had that shitty program ranked in the final AP top 20 for a DECADE. He won 11 games in six of seven seasons at one point. But that's only half the story. He does it, every time, with two or three pros and handful of other great college level players and the rest basically replacement level starters, at best. The rest is just sheer preparation and execution. According to ANY recruiting service, KU's recruiting classes have been better than KSU's for the past four or five seasons, at least not markedly different. Yet his team looks 10 times better. Either he's got an uncanny eye for talent (the most underrated part of recruiting) or he coaches em up; either way, he gets the credit.

So, while he doesn't have the hardware to be per se great, he does pass the test on a closer inspection for me. That said, I am not in the camp that thinks his act would necessarily translate to a program like Bama or Ohio State, but I think he could have won multiple national titles at a place like Michigan State. A place without pedigree that he could sort of be let operate as he pleases.

Well I take it you are a KU fan that isn't in the camp when Snyder retires that K-State will just fall to the bottom of the conference and KU will rise to the top.  You can't have it both ways.  Which is it? Snyder is the greatest coach to ever walk the sidelines and is the only reason K-State is good or Snyder really isn't that great of coach and he will easily be replaced?  Looking at it from an outsiders view I would say somewhere in between.  His assistants have ALOT to do with both success and failures.  Look at all the successful coaches that have gone on to lead productive coaching careers.  I think that there were more factors than Snyder coaching that has propelled the football program; namely people started caring about football at K-State and money started flowing into the program to support Snyder's initiatives. 

cgmoney wrote: I'm not taking anything away from Snyder but please go back and look at the mans career before you label him a genius. Arguably the best coach he has ever beaten is Bob Stoops and he is 2-9 vs Stoops after that it is probably Mack Brown then ??? Maybe Pete Carrol before USC was cheating with Bush or Phil Fulmor at Tenn in the 2001 Cotton Bowl when Tenn had a true Fr at QB.

My point is not that Snyder is a bad coach he is in fact a very good coach, but before we all just accept that GIVEN SIX WEEKS TO PREPARE Bill Snyder will out execute any coach in Football lets remember he is 6-7 in Bowl Games has not won a Bowl game since 2002 and speed is not exactly the overall team strength of KSU.

ksustephens wrote: Well I take it you are a KU fan that isn't in the camp when Snyder retires that K-State will just fall to the bottom of the conference and KU will rise to the top.  You can't have it both ways.  Which is it? Snyder is the greatest coach to ever walk the sidelines and is the only reason K-State is good or Snyder really isn't that great of coach and he will easily be replaced?  Looking at it from an outsiders view I would say somewhere in between.  His assistants have ALOT to do with both success and failures.  Look at all the successful coaches that have gone on to lead productive coaching careers.  I think that there were more factors than Snyder coaching that has propelled the football program; namely people started caring about football at K-State and money started flowing into the program to support Snyder's initiatives. 

cgmoney wrote: I'm not taking anything away from Snyder but please go back and look at the mans career before you label him a genius. Arguably the best coach he has ever beaten is Bob Stoops and he is 2-9 vs Stoops after that it is probably Mack Brown then ??? Maybe Pete Carrol before USC was cheating with Bush or Phil Fulmor at Tenn in the 2001 Cotton Bowl when Tenn had a true Fr at QB.

My point is not that Snyder is a bad coach he is in fact a very good coach, but before we all just accept that GIVEN SIX WEEKS TO PREPARE Bill Snyder will out execute any coach in Football lets remember he is 6-7 in Bowl Games has not won a Bowl game since 2002 and speed is not exactly the overall team strength of KSU.

Who ever said this?  Yes, you most likely will start sucking again; history says so.  But us rising to the top...now you're just being nonsensical and making things up. 

And I think Snyder is a great coach, and it would be hard to argue otherwise.  Anyone that can win at the clip he has at kansasst is a great coach in my book.  It's not exactly the easiest place to sell, and we know it has serious recruiting limitations.

Don't bowl teams only get 15 practices?

Snyder is a great coach for KSU.  His loss to TX am in 98  and the recent loss to Baylor when they were favorites to go on and play in the national championships has taken some of the shine of him. The two biggest games of his career and in the history of KSU  he was the favorite and has lost.  If he gets stomped by Oregon his reputation will take another hit. 
  A large part of his success has been because he stayed at KSU so long.   Most coaches leave a schools like KSU,  KU, ISU  to a better job when they have some success.  
Two Conference championships and no National Championship games in 21 years is not that great for a lot of schools. 
Is there anther coach that has stayed at a second tier school like KSU for 20 years and has the same results?

Weis and his staffs super bowl rings >>>>> Bill Snyder. Fo sho!

He's 6-7 in bowl game, but he's made it to 14 bowl games at freaking K-State.  It's not like they are in some easy conference like Boise, he's done it in the Big 8 and the Big 12.     Give the man his due, what he's done there is unbelievable. What's even more amazing is that on paper his recruiting classes suck. 

Everybody here thinks Mangino is the greatest coach in the world because he took KU to an Orange Bowl and Mangino's accomplishments don't hold a candle to Snyder.  

cgmoney wrote: I'm not taking anything away from Snyder but please go back and look at the mans career before you label him a genius. Arguably the best coach he has ever beaten is Bob Stoops and he is 2-9 vs Stoops after that it is probably Mack Brown then ??? Maybe Pete Carrol before USC was cheating with Bush or Phil Fulmor at Tenn in the 2001 Cotton Bowl when Tenn had a true Fr at QB.

My point is not that Snyder is a bad coach he is in fact a very good coach, but before we all just accept that GIVEN SIX WEEKS TO PREPARE Bill Snyder will out execute any coach in Football lets remember he is 6-7 in Bowl Games has not won a Bowl game since 2002 and speed is not exactly the overall team strength of KSU.

SillyWillie7 wrote: Weis and his staffs super bowl rings >>>>> Bill Snyder. Fo sho!

Hey Willie. You better get your cheap shots in now. The man is in his 70's. K-State IMHO has the 9th ranked talent level in the Big 12, possibly ahead of only Iowa State. It takes a guy like Snyder to do what he's done. After that, well you already saw what happened when he retired the first time. Grow up a little. You sound like a grade school kid.

ku super fans dissecting Bill Snyder is the gift that keeps on giving......

Dumb thread premise aside, people are looking at the "extra weeks to prepare" the wrong way.

Snyder's advantage is greatest during the course of the season when K-State's opponent only has the standard week to prepare. Snyder can get in as much preparation in that week as most other coaches can in two or three. The longer the prep time prior to a game, the more Snyder's advantage is diminished, as it gives the opposing coach more time to "catch up."

Hence, the mediocre bowl record.

---------------------------------------------
--- kougar24 wrote:

Dumb thread premise aside, people are looking at the "extra weeks to prepare" the wrong way.

Snyder's advantage is greatest during the course of the season when K-State's opponent only has the standard week to prepare. Snyder can get in as much preparation in that week as most other coaches can in two or three. The longer the prep time prior to a game, the more Snyder's advantage is diminished, as it gives the opposing coach more time to "catch up."

Hence, the mediocre bowl record.

---------------------------------------------

Not to mention KSU is usually playing teams with superior talent.

Snyder is arguably a top 10 coach of all time. He's managed to win a lot of regular season games and only two conference championships. That must suck knowing that's as good as it gets for KSU.

moosehawk wrote:

That must suck knowing that's as good as it gets for KSU.

Not really.

So you're ok with never winning a national championship?

Probably could have come up with a better title for the thread as I'm not bashing Snyders accomplishments as a coach...More then anything I'm questioning the perceived advantage that fans seem to think Snyder having six weeks to prepare offers KSU and stating that its really not as significant as fans want to make it out to be.

There isn't a coach in the country who does more with less than Snyder - period.

Snyder is a great coach in every sense of the word - organization, work ethic, game planning, etc.

However, when you give a team more than a week to look at film and game plan it becomes much easier to find the flaws and inefficiencies in other teams. Give other coaches the extra time to game plan against KSU's defense and to find an answer to the KSU offense and typically the more talented team will win.

I do think Snyder also has a few losses when teams fell just short during the regular season and were less than inspired to play in their particular bowl game.