I am back in Santa Clarita and had an opportunity to watch the Valencia-Hart recording last night.  Before I get to a summary, a couple of thoughts.

First and foremost, thank you for the kind condolences regarding our family’s loss.  My mother-in-law’s passing was cheerlessly comforting as she had suffered from dementia and severe physical limitations for some time.  Passing from this life was a release for her sweet spirit.

Second, thank you to Oldie for starting a thread and for all those who contributed posts and sent me text messages to keep me abreast of the game in real-time.  My perspective is somewhat different this week because I not only knew the outcome but had your comments before I watched the game.  I had a very long day on Friday and a Hart loss was not the way I had hoped it would end.  One of my sons picked me up at the Salt Lake City airport and we drove to Idaho Falls, ID where we picked up his family and then headed for Twin Falls, ID about game time (in the snow!).  I was reading posts all the way there.  About the only problem is that I-84/86 goes through a very sparsely populated area so I had only 2G speeds most of the time which means it takes forever to download the updates.  Made the trip pretty interesting.

So now to my commentary and summary: 77.  As in 77 seconds.  77 seconds from 9:59 in the second quarter to 8:42 in the second quarter was outcome determinative.  Two picks and two Viking TDs on only four plays.  Statistically, the game was very even. Valencia had  less than 20 yards more from scrimmage than Hart.  The teams had almost identical passing yards. Neither team had any return yards.  It was that 77 seconds that made the difference.

So here’s the summary.

Valencia started at the 20 following a touchback.  Murphy was flushed from the pocket and ran for 24 yards on first down but it was three and out from there.

There was no return on the punt.  Hart started on the 16 and embarked on a laborious 18-play, 9 and a half minute drive, three times converting on third-and-long to a score a TD on a one-yard run by Wingenroth.   Hart 7-0 at 1:01 in the first quarter.

Valencia again started on the 20 following a touchback (I should note that both of Hart’s kickoffs where with a significant following wind – a factor that becomes important later).  Valencia drove down to the Hart 3 but just could not get it in and settled for a 20-yard field goal. 7-3 Hart at 10:58 in the second quarter.

Following a touchback (Valencia now had the following wind), Hart started the 20.  On first down, Valencia was tagged for encroachment, making it first and five.  On the repeat of first down, White ran for no gain, on second down, Wingenroth caught a 6-yard pass for a first down.

Then the beginning of the 77 seconds.  White tossed a pass down the left side which looked like a TD to Irwin.  However, the pass was into the wind, hung a bit and on a perfectly timed leap, Valencia’s Carter picked it off and returned it to the Hart 34.  Murphy connected with Wilson for a 32-yard gain to the Hart 2 and Stone Jackson (great football name – please tell me his middle name is Wall) took it in from there.  Valencia 10-7 at 9:27 in the second.

Once again the kickoff became a touchback and Hart started on the 20.  On first down, Wingenroth ran for 14 yards on a very nifty counter play.  On second down, Costleigh moved in front of the Hart receiver, picked off the pass and returned it about 15 yards to the Hart 24.  On first down, Murphy threw a long (overhand) pitch to Jake Solley, a lineman, who took it 21 yards down the left sideline to the Hart 3.  Jackson ran for the TD on the next play. Valencia 17-7 at 8:42 in the second.

77 seconds.

Hart again started at the 20 and again embarked on a grueling, 80-yard, 9-minute, 18-play drive.  This time, Hart converted one fourth-and-long and two third-and-longs and made the Vikers pay dearly for running into the punter.  Hart scored on a 1-yard (really more like 1-foot) pass play to Koppenhaver at the back of the endzone.  Valencia 17-14 with :04 left in the first half.

The first half stats were a close match to the score.  White was 12 of 16 for 100 yards and a TD, and of course, two picks.  Valencia’s Murphy was 6 of 8 for 111 yards with no TDs or picks.  Hart had 80 yards rushing.  Valencia had 44.  Neither team had a single return yard.

Hart started the second half, via a touchback, at the 20 and got to the Valencia 31 when a pass to Koppenhaver was tipped by Tedric Thompson on a terrific defensive effort.  The third down pass was slightly beyond Wingenroth’s reach. Fourth down was a sack which ended a promising drive.

Valencia went three and out but appeared to have set up a great field position situation with a 59-yard punt down to the Hart 2 (no return).  Hart then went on a 98-yard, 13-play, 6-minute drive with Wingenroth running it in from the 4.  Hart 20-17 at 11:53 in the fourth quarter.  (The PAT snap and hold went awry.)

For the first and only time during the game, a kick/punt was returned.  Michael Carter had a very nice return of about 36 yards that was wholly negated by a holding penalty forcing Valencia to start at the 8, the Vikers worst field position of the night.  Valencia got as far as the Hart 25 but then backed up 13 yards on a holding penalty and then five more when the receiver was nailed well behind the line of scrimmage.  On second and forever, a Valencia pass was picked off by Wingenroth and returned to the Hart 31.

The turnover went for naught as Hart went three and out.

Valencia started at the 35 and moved quickly down the field: 15 yards via a pass interference penalty; 15 more on a pass to Townsend, 14 more on a pass to Thompson, followed by 20 on a run by Berkley to the 1-yard line.  The Vikers ran into some tough going, taking three whacks but finally got it in on a 1-yard run by Wallace.  Valencia 24-20 at 4:47 in the fourth.

Once again at the 20, Hart was unable to move and went three and out.  (This series had my only real quarrel with the officiating.  I thought there was a very clear PI on a long pass down the middle to Irwin.)

Valencia got the ball at the Hart 42 on a fair catch.  Jackson ran for 2 on first down and then on what was probably the finest play of the night, Thompson caught a short pass over the middle and turned it into a 37-yard gain to the Hart 3, in the process running around, through and over the bulk of the Hart defense.  Valencia backed up to the 8 on a false start and it appeared that Hart’s coaches called the “Ole” defense and let Jackson run it in order to get the ball back with a little time let.  Valencia 31-20 with 1:30 left.

Hart started again at the 20, advanced to the 45 but the game ended with a sack and two incompletes.

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Hart stats

Passing

B White 21 of 32 for 206 yards, 1 TD and 2 ints
Wingenroth 1 for 1 for 12 yards

Rushing

Wingenroth 29 carries for 107 yards and a TD (that’s a lot of carries for a Hart RB, 4th on the all-time list and particularly impressive given that Wings had only 72 carries in the previous 8 games)
Holmes 5 for 25
White 8 for -29
Rehard 1 for 0

Receiving

Irwin 7 for 120 yards
Wingenroth 7 for 23 yards (can anyone say “spy”)
Koppenhaver 5 for 39 yards
C White 2 for 22
Fitzpatrick 1 for -2

Valencia

Passing

Murphy 15 for 20 for 219 yards, 0 TDs, 1 INT

Rushing

Murphy 4 carries for 70 yards
Berkley 2 for 20 yards
Jackson 5 for 15 yards and 3 TDs
Solley 1 for 21 yards
Wallace 2 for 1 yard and a TD
Team 1 for -6 (bad snap)

Receiving

Townsend 5 for 72
Thompson 4 for 59
Wilson 3 for 76
Yoo 1 for 16
Jones 1 for 1
Berkley 1 for -5

---

Random comments:

Valencia won fair and square.  Clearly, the Vikers were able to move the ball quickly in big chunks, something Hart did not do nearly as well.  Conversely, Hart moved the ball persistently and but for that 77 seconds, the outcome might have been different.

Some anti-Hart posters seem to think any commentary by a Hart fan is whining.  Explain to me where I whine. Unquestionably, Hart was in the game until the final 1:30.  Doesn’t that warrant comment as to why things turned out the way they did?  Isn’t that exactly why coaches and players review films of last week’s game and not just next week’s game?  Folks speculate following the close games and just move on following a blow out.  In Mike Herrington’s tenure as head coach at Hart, the Indians have rarely been in a position that the Indians had no chance to win at the end. For example: in 2009, Hart was buried in the first quarter and dominated throughout the game and lost 56-7. Not much to discuss on the message boards.  Conversely, the last three Hart-Valencia games have all been decided in the last three or four minutes. Lots of commentary and analysis of what Hart or Valencia could have done to win, some very astute.  Commenting upon and lamenting on how a loss occurred ain’t whining.

Different issue: Is it that hard to express a point without being vulgar, profane or obscene?  Here’s a simple rule for those with a limited vocabulary.  Before you touch fingers to the keyboard ask yourself, what would your mother think?  It’ll keep you out of a lot of trouble.  You may even sound intelligent.  Self-censorship can be a virtue.

I was really surprised to read (and hear) several negative comments about Hart’s Brady White.  Some seem to perceive that he had a bad game.  Whoa! Take a few steps back.  He completed 2/3's of his passes for over 200 yards with a TD against a very tough pass defense.  Yeah, the picks hurt but (a) his first pick was a good decision; the wind held it up a bit and the Valencia defender made a perfectly timed leap to intercept it, (b) White went 7½  games without a pick which is impressive in anyone’s book; only Sean Norton in 2002 went that many games without an INT – no other QB in the Foothill League or the Northern Section is close, (c) he’s completing over 70% for the season, substantially above the Hart record, and (d) the second pick was not a good decision but having seen every pass he’s thrown this season that’s the first questionable throw in over 180 attempts.  Sometimes stuff happens.  He is a formidable QB.

I have noted on several occasions three systemic problems, two on offense and one on defense at Hart.  The defensive issue became noticeable starting in 2003. The offensive issues caught my attention beginning 2004.  Valencia’s current offensive and defensive schemes are just about perfectly designed to exploit Hart’s basic offensive and defensive stratagems (note: Valencia's basic schemes are also just about the exact wrong setups to deal with Palmdale, Chaminade and Loyola, Valencia's three losses).  One Hart poster inevitably attacks my comments, intimating that only one who is or has been a coach at Hart can possibly have sufficient knowledge to comment upon such things and that the rest of us, particularly lowly Hart Dad, ought to leave such complicated stuff to our betters. Well, pal, on Friday, in the Fox broadcast, Jay Schroeder made the exact same observations I’ve made for the last several years with regard to those same issues. Mr. Schroeder has very little coaching experience and none at all at Hart so I assume he too must be ignored. But then maybe comments from  a former NFL QB might just have some validity.

So let me pose a question.  Hart’s offensive weapons are on a par with Canyon. . Yet the 'Boys managed to put up 41 points against Valencia, more than doubling Hart’s 20 against the Vikers, and doing so even with more turnovers (2 picks and a fumble) and a far lower passing percentage (51% v. 66%).  The Cowboys managed to keep their QB much safer from marauding Scandinavians even though Hart has a significant O-line talent edge.  Both teams run a spread and are pass-oriented.  So why was Canyon so much more successful in getting into the endzone?   Mr. Schroeder spotted the issues the first time he covered a Hart game (I am far slower in the uptake).

Another question: Through the first ten games in the Hart-Valencia series, the Indians’ offense scored a median of 38 points a game.  In the most recent nine games, Hart has averaged only 17 points and has never scored more than 3 TDs in a game in that time.  Why the huge downturn in scoring given the fact that Hart has been running pretty much the same offensive setup from 1996 through 2012?

Another question: Through the first nine games of the Hart-Valencia series, Valencia had a median score of 13.5.  For the most recent 10 games, the Vikers have exactly doubled their offensive output to a median of 27.  Why the difference given that Hart has run the same base defense over the entire span of the series?  Is it just talent differentials? In part. But other factors are also in play.

At least some of the cures are in the playbook and were in evidence on Friday but Hart used them sparingly and then returned to the base.

Finally, the comments regarding Hart’s schedule are tiresome.  If one repeats a story enough times, it becomes the truth, regardless of the underlying facts.  First, Hart’s slate of league opponents is fixed.  Nothing the Indians can do about it.  The order in which Hart has played league games is unfortunate with all three of the lightweights in a row at the beginning.  Hart’s preleague: Can we agree that Tesoro is a very solid team?  The Titans will finish 7-3 with a power-rating over 50 (though they are unlikely to get a playoff spot in the Pac-5 with consecutive losses to undefeated El Toro and Mission Viejo and a third loss to San Clemente).  We can all agree that Kennedy is dismal (can’t understand how they beat anyone or how their power ranking is higher than GV’s).  Ridgeview will finish the regular season at 8-2, league champion and quite likely a seeded team in the Central Division 2 playoffs.  Birmingham will finish 8-2 and league champs (losing only to Hart and Notre Dame).  Santa Monica will finish as 7-3 league champs with losses to Hart, Valencia and Mater Dei.  Clearly, not Hart’s toughest pre-league schedule by a long shot – but not nearly as weak as some posters suggest.

Look for me on Friday against Canyon.  I’ll be in my usual seat.  It's good to be back home.

excellent breakdown as usual.  welcome back and my families prayers are with you and your family during your time of grieving and loss.

Sorry for your loss and glad to see you are back...

I will be looking forward to your updates Friday night!

So let me pose a question. Hart’s offensive weapons are on a par with Canyon. . Yet the 'Boys managed to put up 41 points against Valencia, more than doubling Hart’s 20 against the Vikers, and doing so even with more turnovers (2 picks and a fumble) and a far lower passing percentage (51% v. 66%). The Cowboys managed to keep their QB much safer from marauding Scandinavians even though Hart has a significant O-line talent edge. Both teams run a spread and are pass-oriented. So why was Canyon so much more successful in getting into the endzone? Mr. Schroeder spotted the issues the first time he covered a Hart game (I am far slower in the uptake).

Canyon put up 41 points against Valencia because:
1. They have more explosive skill players able to take easy completions to the end zone.
2. They have Wolitarsky who must be doubled freeing up everyone else to make the explosive plays.
3. Cade Apsay is the best qb in the league and is a threat through the air and on the ground.
4. Cade Apsay will stand in and take shots to deliver the ball vs the blitz.

Canyon had their chances to score additional points but valencia stepped when they had to. Canyon had a fumble at the Valencia 15 and one of the int's was on the Valencia 1 yd line.

That being said Valencia played their game and made the plays they had to to win the game. Murphy delivered the ball and the Val wr's made plays Thompson was a man child when muir needed him most. Valencia deserved to win the game and they did, just as they did against hart.

This weeks game will be very entertaining. Having seen the foothill's big three play a few times each I would say if canyon can get a couple of stops a game I wouldn't want to play them. They have proven they will put up point but will they stop anyone. Can't wait til Friday.

Welcome back HartDad.
Heartfelt sympathy to you and your Family.

Nice to see you haven't lost your touch reporting and analyzing the Hart Indians.
Thanks for all your good info. and insights.
Keep up the good work.

Welcome back hartdad, sorry for being rude.

Jay must read your blog.
I am undeterred.I stand by my comments about you. I stand firm.
I sincerely hope all is well.

scvrook wrote: So let me pose a question. Hart’s offensive weapons are on a par with Canyon. . Yet the 'Boys managed to put up 41 points against Valencia, more than doubling Hart’s 20 against the Vikers, and doing so even with more turnovers (2 picks and a fumble) and a far lower passing percentage (51% v. 66%). The Cowboys managed to keep their QB much safer from marauding Scandinavians even though Hart has a significant O-line talent edge. Both teams run a spread and are pass-oriented. So why was Canyon so much more successful in getting into the endzone? Mr. Schroeder spotted the issues the first time he covered a Hart game (I am far slower in the uptake).

Canyon put up 41 points against Valencia because:
1. They have more explosive skill players able to take easy completions to the end zone.
2. They have Wolitarsky who must be doubled freeing up everyone else to make the explosive plays.
3. Cade Apsay is the best qb in the league and is a threat through the air and on the ground.
4. Cade Apsay will stand in and take shots to deliver the ball vs the blitz.

Canyon had their chances to score additional points but valencia stepped when they had to. Canyon had a fumble at the Valencia 15 and one of the int's was on the Valencia 1 yd line.

That being said Valencia played their game and made the plays they had to to win the game. Murphy delivered the ball and the Val wr's made plays Thompson was a man child when muir needed him most. Valencia deserved to win the game and they did, just as they did against hart.

This weeks game will be very entertaining. Having seen the foothill's big three play a few times each I would say if canyon can get a couple of stops a game I wouldn't want to play them. They have proven they will put up point but will they stop anyone. Can't wait til Friday.

Hart Dad was making the point that Valencia has made making themselves a nightmare for Hart's traditional offense their main motivation.  Hart and Canyon are very similar in skill players.  Apsay may stand in to take a hit and Wolitarsky is amazing, no one is taking that away.  But both teams have great receivers, great running back (at Hart, I'm gonna assume at Canyon just for being fair), QBs with good arms and decision making, and good lines.  Hart's defense is better than Canyons, but we don't need to go there.  The point is, the skill players on offense are very similar.  Canyon's were more explosive against Valencia, but thats playing right into the point Hart Dad was trying to make.  I think you simply missed it.  Anyways, looking forward to a great game friday night.

welcome back Hart Dad, sorry for your family's loss. Can't wait for this Friday's report

I read what hartdad said. I just have my own opinion why canyon scored more points. I don't think harts weapons are on par with canyons. Seeing both teams play live against Valencia, in my opinion hart has no one like Wolitarsky. Who did Valencia consistently double on hart? Valencia blitzed canyon early and Apsay burned them with a throw to mcafee that went 60 for a td. They did blitz a few more times but not nearly as much as they blitzed white. Why do you think the reason for that was? Cabrera scored an easy 50 yd td due to the attention Wolitarsky pulled away from him as he had one on one coverage. Prieto scored a 70 yd td because 3 defenders were around Wolitarsky and he was all alone. Also Wolitarsky being doubled most the game had 100 yds receiving. Hart does have very good wr's, they just didn't make explosive plays. Hartdad said that both offenses were similar in wr talent and that they run spread. I feel he got the spread part right and hart's wr are talented just not as explosive as canyons. Wolitarsky is in a class by himself with no equal on hart. Cabrera actually beat wings in the 400 at the frosh/soph foothill league championships and actually had more tds than Wolitarsky on half the catches. Mc Afee is a threat every time he has his hands on the ball. Also take into consideration stach was hurt and did not play and pennuchi has been hurt for weeks. Hopefully they are on the mend as the playoff are around the corner. .
Wings is a legit threat to go when ever he gets the ball in his hands I cant and wouldnt argue that. I've seen wings catch a swing make people look non athletic and score. Irwin, koppenhaver, and white I don't think are the type of wr that will house a slant or a hitch. They run good routes and catch the ball but not explosive in dumping the ball off and making people miss. Just my opinion. I really do hope Fitzpatrick can play because i think he is the next best explosive player but the way he went down did not look good. I also think Apsay is a better qb with more poise in the pocket, again my opinion. White did seem to get a little rattled when valencia was coming at him.
They key for hart and canyon to beat Valencia is to get easy scores and force valencia into long drives, easier said than done. Long sustaining drives at the hs level will favor the defense due to the offense making mistakes and failing to execute over multiple plays. Valencia's defense is always well coached so cheap scores (explosive plays) against them is the way to beat them. Everything said is how I feel based on seeing hart and canyon play Valencia A common opponent with a good defense. Feel free to disagree I'm okay with that. Looking forward to a great game.

---------------------------------------------
--- HartOnTheRise wrote:

scvrook wrote: So let me pose a question. Hart’s offensive weapons are on a par with Canyon. . Yet the 'Boys managed to put up 41 points against Valencia, more than doubling Hart’s 20 against the Vikers, and doing so even with more turnovers (2 picks and a fumble) and a far lower passing percentage (51% v. 66%). The Cowboys managed to keep their QB much safer from marauding Scandinavians even though Hart has a significant O-line talent edge. Both teams run a spread and are pass-oriented. So why was Canyon so much more successful in getting into the endzone? Mr. Schroeder spotted the issues the first time he covered a Hart game (I am far slower in the uptake).

Canyon put up 41 points against Valencia because:
1. They have more explosive skill players able to take easy completions to the end zone.
2. They have Wolitarsky who must be doubled freeing up everyone else to make the explosive plays.
3. Cade Apsay is the best qb in the league and is a threat through the air and on the ground.
4. Cade Apsay will stand in and take shots to deliver the ball vs the blitz.

Canyon had their chances to score additional points but valencia stepped when they had to. Canyon had a fumble at the Valencia 15 and one of the int's was on the Valencia 1 yd line.

That being said Valencia played their game and made the plays they had to to win the game. Murphy delivered the ball and the Val wr's made plays Thompson was a man child when muir needed him most. Valencia deserved to win the game and they did, just as they did against hart.

This weeks game will be very entertaining. Having seen the foothill's big three play a few times each I would say if canyon can get a couple of stops a game I wouldn't want to play them. They have proven they will put up point but will they stop anyone. Can't wait til Friday.

Hart Dad was making the point that Valencia has made making themselves a nightmare for Hart's traditional offense their main motivation.  Hart and Canyon are very similar in skill players.  Apsay may stand in to take a hit and Wolitarsky is amazing, no one is taking that away.  But both teams have great receivers, great running back (at Hart, I'm gonna assume at Canyon just for being fair), QBs with good arms and decision making, and good lines.  Hart's defense is better than Canyons, but we don't need to go there.  The point is, the skill players on offense are very similar.  Canyon's were more explosive against Valencia, but thats playing right into the point Hart Dad was trying to make.  I think you simply missed it.  Anyways, looking forward to a great game friday night.

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scvrook wrote: I read what hartdad said. I just have my own opinion why canyon scored more points. I don't think harts weapons are on par with canyons. Seeing both teams play live against Valencia, in my opinion hart has no one like Wolitarsky. Who did Valencia consistently double on hart? Valencia blitzed canyon early and Apsay burned them with a throw to mcafee that went 60 for a td. They did blitz a few more times but not nearly as much as they blitzed white. Why do you think the reason for that was? Cabrera scored an easy 50 yd td due to the attention Wolitarsky pulled away from him as he had one on one coverage. Prieto scored a 70 yd td because 3 defenders were around Wolitarsky and he was all alone. Also Wolitarsky being doubled most the game had 100 yds receiving. Hart does have very good wr's, they just didn't make explosive plays. Hartdad said that both offenses were similar in wr talent and that they run spread. I feel he got the spread part right and hart's wr are talented just not as explosive as canyons. Wolitarsky is in a class by himself with no equal on hart. Cabrera actually beat wings in the 400 at the frosh/soph foothill league championships and actually had more tds than Wolitarsky on half the catches. Mc Afee is a threat every time he has his hands on the ball. Also take into consideration stach was hurt and did not play and pennuchi has been hurt for weeks. Hopefully they are on the mend as the playoff are around the corner. .
Wings is a legit threat to go when ever he gets the ball in his hands I cant and wouldnt argue that. I've seen wings catch a swing make people look non athletic and score. Irwin, koppenhaver, and white I don't think are the type of wr that will house a slant or a hitch. They run good routes and catch the ball but not explosive in dumping the ball off and making people miss. Just my opinion. I really do hope Fitzpatrick can play because i think he is the next best explosive player but the way he went down did not look good. I also think Apsay is a better qb with more poise in the pocket, again my opinion. White did seem to get a little rattled when valencia was coming at him.
They key for hart and canyon to beat Valencia is to get easy scores and force valencia into long drives, easier said than done. Long sustaining drives at the hs level will favor the defense due to the offense making mistakes and failing to execute over multiple plays. Valencia's defense is always well coached so cheap scores (explosive plays) against them is the way to beat them. Everything said is how I feel based on seeing hart and canyon play Valencia A common opponent with a good defense. Feel free to disagree I'm okay with that. Looking forward to a great game.

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Not having seen Canyon play in person I can't disagree!  I can agree that Irwin white and Koppenhaver are less likely to catch a short pass and turn it into a TD than wings, simply because wings is considerably faster and "shiftier" than the rest of them.

And with what you said about the Canyon offense I'm starting to agree with you more.  

Either way, we'll get to see how it plays out Friday night.  Looking forward to it!

My condolences on your loss.  Having been at both the Canyon- Valencia & Hart- Valencia games I saw 2 completely different offensive strategies.  Canyon completely went to the air against Valencia & Hart tried to ground & pound Valencia.   I think Hart does have the slight edge this week because they play better defense but I would not count out Canyon.  Apsay is a good QB & Woli is the real deal.

Hart Dad in all of this you failed to mention anything about the defense that Valencia ran against Hart. That is what gave them the ability to slow Harts offense down. No one saw that coming and it was a strong game plan by coach Waters and company. (Malik Townsend and MLB spying Wingenroth was a strong move)

FoothillFtbll wrote: Hart Dad in all of this you failed to mention anything about the defense that Valencia ran against Hart. That is what gave them the ability to slow Harts offense down. No one saw that coming and it was a strong game plan by coach Waters and company. (Malik Townsend and MLB spying Wingenroth was a strong move)

No one did see it coming but they probably should have!  

Which team has given Hart the most trouble year in and year out, no matter how talented they are?  Saugus.  What do they run?  A 3-4.  Only a matter of time till someone else decided to run it against Hart, and with more talent and better coaching!  

Great move by Valencia

Valencia has run a 3-4 in the past, or variants of a 4-3, such a zone blitz that look a whole lot like it.  I say the gravamen of the Valencia front 7 versus Hart is basically a lot of very fast kids going after the quarterback when the Vikers know or strongly suspect a pass -- sometimes 4, far more often 5, sometimes 6 and on rare occasions 7.

I think the package of players that Valencia put on the field, and not necessarily their alignment, is the key.  It puts more pressure on the O-line and the QB because there is almost always an additional kid rushing.

It appears that Hart caught on to the 3-4 almost immediately and chose to run straight into it.  On the running plays, it was sometimes hard to tell precisely what Valencia had called as far as a blitz because, frequently, the blitz was delayed a count or so and by that time, the defense had recognized "run." 

On the first Hart possession, it appeared that Valencia brought at least 4 most of the time, 5 at least three times and 6 twice (not counting when everyone was stacked at the goal line). On the second long drive, Valencia brought only 3 a number of times but did have 5 twice, 6 once and 7 once.  The number rushing the QB was pretty consistent with Valencia's defense in previous years regardless of whether it was a 4-3 or 3-4.

HartOnTheRise wrote:

FoothillFtbll wrote: Hart Dad in all of this you failed to mention anything about the defense that Valencia ran against Hart. That is what gave them the ability to slow Harts offense down. No one saw that coming and it was a strong game plan by coach Waters and company. (Malik Townsend and MLB spying Wingenroth was a strong move)

No one did see it coming but they probably should have!  

Which team has given Hart the most trouble year in and year out, no matter how talented they are?  Saugus.  What do they run?  A 3-4.  Only a matter of time till someone else decided to run it against Hart, and with more talent and better coaching!  

Great move by Valencia

CALL COACH 1 AND SEE IF YOU CAN GET A WHISTLE!  YOU ARE AWESOME!

It is the first time I recall Valencia running a true 3-4, but they have run variations on the theme.
It was indeed in the mold of the Saugus look, relying on bringing pressure from different spots, presumably to confuse a young QB.

---------------------------------------------
--- Hart Dad wrote:

Valencia has run a 3-4 in the past, or variants of a 4-3, such a zone blitz that look a whole lot like it.  I say the gravamen of the Valencia front 7 versus Hart is basically a lot of very fast kids going after the quarterback when the Vikers know or strongly suspect a pass -- sometimes 4, far more often 5, sometimes 6 and on rare occasions 7.

I think the package of players that Valencia put on the field, and not necessarily their alignment, is the key.  It puts more pressure on the O-line and the QB because there is almost always an additional kid rushing.

It appears that Hart caught on to the 3-4 almost immediately and chose to run straight into it.  On the running plays, it was sometimes hard to tell precisely what Valencia had called as far as a blitz because, frequently, the blitz was delayed a count or so and by that time, the defense had recognized "run." 

On the first Hart possession, it appeared that Valencia brought at least 4 most of the time, 5 at least three times and 6 twice (not counting when everyone was stacked at the goal line). On the second long drive, Valencia brought only 3 a number of times but did have 5 twice, 6 once and 7 once.  The number rushing the QB was pretty consistent with Valencia's defense in previous years regardless of whether it was a 4-3 or 3-4.

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finally got around to watch the game.. i was out of town last weekend.
it was a good game. valencia out coached hart and that vhs D grinded and slowed down the hart O enough to get the W.
but hart cant worry about valencia now. Huge game against canyon in a few days. which will decide important playoff positioning!

foothillmagic wrote: finally got around to watch the game.. i was out of town last weekend.
it was a good game. valencia out coached hart and that vhs D grinded and slowed down the hart O enough to get the W.
but hart cant worry about valencia now. Huge game against canyon in a few days. which will decide important playoff positioning!

Gee thanks stu! What would we do without you?

dude shut the fvck up. do we really need you to make cliche smartass replies to every other comment?