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Re: Alex Smith, #11

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Posted: 2/11/2013 2:07 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 



poppa9601 wrote: Here's the bottomline Dude, a better judge of QB talent than you or I has already decided that Alex Smith isn't good enough to win a championship with.

That judge was Jim Harbaugh.

If Smith wasn't considered good enough to win it all with the 9ers, why would you or anyone else want him in Cleveland? Let him go be the lovable loser for somebody else. We've had our share.

Brandon Weeden might not be the answer we need at QB, but no one can say with any confidence that he isn't. Atleast no one with any credibility. He was good enough to be drafted in the first round despite his advanced age, even if he was a reach, and he clearly has a top ten arm.

With no clear upgrade available it would be folly and an act of shear ego driven lunacy to replace him at this point. Bring in competition yes, but to make a change for change sake, no.

As for Smith his best fit is in the WCO, in case you haven't notice we just threw that offense out.
Remember when the 9ers had Montana and Young, and Young couldn't get on the field? Did that mean Young was NFG? ITs an anomaly, SF has an embarassment of riches at QB. Doesn't mean that Smith is a piker. Guy has had as many co-ordinators as years in the league, and he was doing pretty well. He got pushed aside by an uber talent in Kaepernick, doesn't make him a schlub, imo. Sign him, and if he's as bad as you all think, Weeden will wipe the field with him.
>>> Decleater <<<
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  • DG624
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Posted: 2/11/2013 3:08 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


We all agree that QB is our weakness...now not as bad but still a weakness.  Weeden has shown some passing ability and is durable but he has also shown an inability to know when to throw and avoid the rush.  Maybe he will improve...probably he will improve but his age is another isue.  I would like to see him get better.

The alternative is to wait and build slowly and give this team and coaches time.  That has  been a fan/owner weakness...changing the team because we lose.  There are really no great draft picks available at QB and all will require time.  Smith is ready now but we will have to pay.  Weeden is here and still must have practice.  Either way Smith or Weeden we will have a learning period with the WRs.  IF we stay with Weeden be prepared to lose 8 or more.

Last edited 2/11/2013 3:10 PM by DG624

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Posted: 2/11/2013 5:59 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 



DG624 wrote: We all agree that QB is our weakness...now not as bad but still a weakness.  Weeden has shown some passing ability and is durable but he has also shown an inability to know when to throw and avoid the rush.  Maybe he will improve...probably he will improve but his age is another isue.  I would like to see him get better.

The alternative is to wait and build slowly and give this team and coaches time.  That has  been a fan/owner weakness...changing the team because we lose.  There are really no great draft picks available at QB and all will require time.  Smith is ready now but we will have to pay.  Weeden is here and still must have practice.  Either way Smith or Weeden we will have a learning period with the WRs.  IF we stay with Weeden be prepared to lose 8 or more.
Smith is just 7mos younger than Weeden, so if age is an issue with BW, it's an issue with Smith as well.

Yeah Smith is ready now, to play in the WCO. A vertical passing offense? not so much.

This would be just like the Browns we all know and bang our heads against the wall over, to go from round peg in square hole to square peg in round hole. Smith isn't a fit for the offense that Turner and Chud run. Had we kept Shurmur or hired another WCO type HC, then yes, but vertical offense,no.

And really,what is it you expect AS to be able to do? win 8 games? the division? make a playoff run? None of that is going to happen, none.

If they are determined to change QB's then they should use the first pick in the draft and stop dickin everyone around. Spending draft picks and money to get Smith makes no more sense than spending the 22 overall pick on a 28 yo rookie.

Asking Weeden to run the WCO is like drafting Matt Barkley and asking him to run the pistol read option and then complain that he didn't do it like Wilson, RG3 or Kaepernick. It just doesn't make sense. And to pass judgement on BW based solely on his perfromance in an ill fitting offense is shortsighted at best.

Banner said it wouldn't take long for the fans to see smart moves being made. Ditching BW after one year in Shurmur's offense isn't a smart move, it's a arrogant one.
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  • vdubble
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Posted: 2/11/2013 7:05 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


Dude you on fie-ya!  I agree completely.  I just posted about potential competition to Weeden but he is still our guy until whipped.  We do have to give him a chance as that offense fit him so poorly and the playcalling, well you know.  Just a solid competitive QB  needs to be brought in as well as a developmental guy that push both guys at some point.  You think it didn't make Smith better to have Kaepernick breathing down his neck, you bet it did.  For us, the only real keeper is Weeden.  McCoy and Lewis are gone.  They just don't have the arm strength required.
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  • redright
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Posted: 2/11/2013 8:09 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


game.

Remember when the 9ers had Montana and Young, and Young couldn't get on the field? Did that mean Young was NFG? ITs an anomaly, SF has an embarassment of riches at QB. Doesn't mean that Smith is a piker. Guy has had as many co-ordinators as years in the league, and he was doing pretty well. He got pushed aside by an uber talent in Kaepernick, doesn't make him a schlub, imo. Sign him, and if he's as bad as you all think, Weeden will wipe the field with him.


rr.......not analagous.  Montana wasn't dumped because Young was uber allus. Smith was dumped because a near rookie showed a lot more. I'm thinking Bledsoe and Brady. Even then, IMO, Bledsoe was a much better QB than Smith.  Perhaps dumping Dilfer is in keeping with benching Smith.
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Posted: 2/12/2013 3:22 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


"Smith isn't a fit for the offense that Turner and Chud run."

-- Turner was Smith's OC in SF before SD. Smith did pretty well with him. Not sure of the schemes used, but there is that history. 

"And really,what is it you expect AS to be able to do? win 8 games? the division? make a playoff run? None of that is going to happen, none."

-- Smith seems to be a smart game manager- not a game changer. He is a piece of the puzzle at best. While the Niners may have done better with him in the red zone towards the end of the SB, there is no proof that the Browns would do better with him going forward. 

But he does have some experience and some talent.

"And to pass judgement on BW based solely on his perfromance in an ill fitting offense is shortsighted at best."

-- True. But you never know how a new regime may think. However, as you say, if the Browns give up significant items to get Smith, he better produce. It's the same thing that has to be factored into RG3 and an evaluation of his career eventually. Or any player. (All Browns fans should be glad that RG3 ended his season face down on the field with a leg injury. Runnng QBs can become targets... Just ask Vick.)

" Ditching BW after one year in Shurmur's offense isn't a smart move, it's a arrogant one."

-- Smart/arrogant. The old saying: It aint bragging if you can do it.Or as a beer commercial says: It's not magic if it works. It aint a dumb and arrogant move if it's based on insider knowledge and results in a better QB.

Otherwise, it is dumb and arrogant.

Since BW was drafted, the owner and the FO and the coaches have all changed. That gives a certain flexibility to decisions.
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Posted: 2/17/2013 4:05 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


Everybody keeps saying Weeden fits the offense Chud and Norv will run and Smith doesn't because Weeds has a strong arm.

Well, last year he completed only 20% of passes thrown 21 yards or more downfield. He has not been accurate on the deep throws. It doesn't matter how far you can throw it if it's off target.

I don't expect the Browns to trade for Smith but he's due a $1 million roster bonus next month and a $7 million salary this year. Will the Niners spend $8 million on their backup QB? Not likely. If they release him it will be interesting to see how hard the Browns pursue him. Just in terms of his experience and superior athleticism he would be an upgrade over Weeden. I'll be surprised if they don't go after him since they've announced they will bring in competition for the starting job. Who else is out there? Matt Flynn?
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Posted: 2/17/2013 4:43 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


If they do get rid of Weeden, I doubt it will be based solely on his 2012 season's work.  The folks who are in charge now surely formed judgments of some sort of the top QB prospects in the last draft.  What Weeden showed on film (in both practices, which we didn't get to see, and games) during the season could well have confirmed exactly the "issues" they thought they saw from his college film.  If that's the case, it would hardly be knee-jerk to move on from him.  In fact, if that's the case, it might be malpractice to go another year with Weeden as the top option at QB. 

I imagine it's also possible that most of the scouting department did not put a high value on Weeden, but that Holmgren insisted he be taken at 22.  I know I saw some reports around the draft saying Heckert, at least, had Weeden rated second round and Holmgren insisted he be taken earlier in order not to "miss out."  If that's true, now that Holmgren's gone, there might not be anybody in the building who thinks Weeden is a viable option as starting QB going forward.

1/6/04 Rest in peace "Daddy Wags." May perpetual light shine upon you.

"It's alright to have a hitch in your swing, but when you have a flaw in your hitch, you're in trouble." - Leon Wagner

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Posted: 2/19/2013 5:36 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


" If that's the case, it would hardly be knee-jerk to move on from him.  In fact, if that's the case, it might be malpraitctice to go another year with Weeden as the top option at QB."

-- As Shakespeare said: There's the rub.

If you are well informed and convinced that Weeden aint it, it would be malpractice not to move on. On the other hand, if you are poorly informed it would be malpractice to give up on a good QB.

And to complicate matters, maybe it's possible that Weeden is "good enough" to handle the QB position and win if the right team is built around him. Or maybe it's only possible that he can take the team just so far no matter what.

Sometimes people can be so informed and so connected that they screw up. (Glad to see you as a coordinator, Norv!). The old "Can't see the forest for the trees" kind of thing. Judgment can be more indicative about real things than "facts" can be at times.
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  • redright
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Posted: 2/19/2013 7:25 PM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 


HH

Sometimes people can be so informed and so connected that they screw up. (Glad to see you as a coordinator, Norv!). The old "Can't see the forest for the trees" kind of thing. Judgment can be more indicative about real things than "facts" can be at times.

rr......It is good to have Norv and Chud. Likely they are superior in evaluating QBS and know better than Banner and Lombardi how Weeden or ANY other QB projects in their system. If Weeden is the QB in 13, it may not mean he is the guy, it just may mean he was as good as was available.  To be the champ, you have to beat the champ. The bar may be low but right now Weeden has the belt.
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Posted: 2/22/2013 10:57 AM

Re: Alex Smith, #11 



HeadHole wrote: "Smith isn't a fit for the offense that Turner and Chud run."

-- Turner was Smith's OC in SF before SD. Smith did pretty well with him. Not sure of the schemes used, but there is that history.
It was the "Frank Gore rushes for 1,600 yards" scheme.
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