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10 on Sunday

Posted: 12/9/2012 4:49 PM

10 on Sunday 


1)  It was a game where the guy living in Delia Estates goes slumming in a drive down Crosby in the residential neighborhood just west of LeBron's alma mater, looks at the dumpier houses, and says to himself, "I am livin' LARGE!"

When was the last time the Browns had such a large fourth quarter lead that the scrubs came in for mop up action?  That's how bad it is for the Chiefs.  Their one very good receiver is out, Charles is hobbled, and they've time to think about the tragedy that hit them eight days earlier.  Hard to imagine that a team can win 30-7, and yet their win, while not ugly, was a tad on the homely side.

2)  The defense may have trouble getting hats out to the perimeter, but their hats have tended to lay some punishing hits on their opponents.  Too often in the past, an opposing receiver could make a catch a few yards short of the first down marker and bull his way forward to the move the chains.  The hit by Robertson on the third yard completion stopped the receiver like a ton of bricks and made it 4th and 1.  Not game changing plays, but ones that help mold an identity.  1-2 more big hitters and guys who can make a real impact on defense, and this unit becomes respectable.  As it is, it seems to start their first series the last couple of weeks like it just got out of bed missing the alarm clock.  They settle down fine, but look frazzled the first series or two.

3)  Gordon gets the ball on the crossing route and has one guy to beat with a full head of steam at about the 10.  You're thinking in that millisecond that he should be able to somehow, someway, get it in the end zone.  He just looks lackadaisical and settles for a spot around the 2.  Unfortunately, the Browns had to settle for a fg.  Gordon needed to watch Cribbs effort to try and put it in the end zone (don't think he quite made it, but the ball should have been spotted on about the 4 inch line.  But TR scored anyway). 

On the third & goal pass attempt, Gordon needed to go up and fight for the ball.  Instead he thought he could sneak his hands up at the last second, and the short defender easily defensed the ball.  Weeden's throw needed to be higher and a little more to the outside, but Gordon still could have made a better effort.

Still, he displays considerable talent, so you hope that stuff slowly recedes.

4)  Interesting play to switch out Benjamin and Cribbs on the punt.  The Chiefs have to stay home and protect, and Benjamin gets to show his speed.  Cribbs also had a nice punt return, but switch them, and the defender doesn't catch Benjamin, and don't think Cribbs can sustain the speed to take it to the house on the one that Benjamin scored.  That td return may have spelled the end for Cribbs in Cleveland, unless two things happen:

a)  a new st coach (and there WILL be one) insists that Cribbs is needed on st defense
b)  Benjamin makes enough headway as a receiver that they don't want to give him too much work.

But on that return and the double reverse, we finally saw Benjamin's speed exploited.

5)  Good to see Romeo Crennel, Brady Quinn and Peyton Hillis be non-factors for someone else for a change. 

6)  To Steve Tasker:  just because the Browns haven't had to make roster moves in a while doesn't make them "the healthiest team in the NFL."  They win that distinction when the starting 22 at the start of the season has accrued the most starts.  They've had starters out for long stretches, but they've just been back for a couple of weeks now.

And no, it wasn't a miscommunication between Weeden and Little on that third down incompletion in the second quarter.  Little was simply never open, so Weeden overthrew him.

Stat said the Browns were 8th in the league in drops as a way of propping up Weeden.  Okay, but I wonder if stats are kept on interception drops.  I'm betting Weeden is top 3 in the league.  Once again, he has two wtf Hickory Farms gift baskets served up on a silver platter... only to see defenders drop them.  In fact, Weeden owes Ben Watson a strip steak dinner for his reach around.  That kept the drive going and resulted in a td.

7)  Loved the play where Little came into the backfield and relived his old rb days.  The guy is a load and knows something about making cuts.  Hope he translates that to catches.  He does tend to try too hard to go east west to make something happen and just doesn't have the speed for it.  But he does have the power to bull forward and gain an extra 2-3.  Was hoping that both Gordon and Little with their slant patterns could open something up for Cameron downfield, but that hasn't happened yet.

8)  Okay, son, we know you took some nasty spills on your bike, so we put the training wheels back on.  You've been doing well, so now... it's time...

Hardesty does well with some limited carries, so now it's time to see if he can mimic TR in the receiving department.  Crap, he went into the ditch again.

Same with fumbling on the 1.  Hardesty looked like Matt Forte on that 25 yarder to the left, and then he reverted to another bad habit.

9)  Is Hodges still hurt?  Whatever mojo he had 2 years ago seems to have dried up. 
It's teeth gritting when the club is punting at midfield and there's a fair catch at the 18.
Dawson is a Brown until he can't do it anymore, but the Browns may want to do more than just a cursory search for another punter in the off season.

10)  Three in a row and 5-8.  And now the Browns have to show just how the infectious winning can be against their final three opponents.  If they can play them all competitively and even steal one, then they can say they made real progress this year. 

If they play the next three as they played the last three, they won't win.  Even if the Steelers play their way out of the playoffs, they may still be itching for a beat
down in the finale at home just to carry over the feeling through the off season.

They'll have their work cut out for them chasing after Griffin.  And if the Browns can take it up a notch over the last three games, they won't need to be slumming to make themselves feel better.
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Posted: 12/9/2012 5:25 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


Little suddenly has velcro hands. He's just snatching the ball out of the air.

Not sure that I see Gordon as slack. I think he and Little are going to be a real 1-2 punch. I think you're nit picking a bit Vark.

When it's first and goal from the 2 or 3 yard line, why is Gordon not in the game? Really?

Quinn's got a dorky helmet.

Thank you Soucoup, that doink off the upright was a momentum killer for your team.

Likewise, thank you Travis Benjamin, for that game changing punt return.

Somebody was greasing Josh Cribbs' squeaky wheel this game, yeah? And good for them, because you should use all the weapons you've got.
>>> Decleater <<<
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Posted: 12/9/2012 5:43 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


When it's first and goal from the 2 or 3 yard line, why is Gordon not in the game? Really?

Why isn't Cameron...? he's the one who can sky

"Its always easier to sell them some sh.it than it is to tell them the truth"
Baba Fats

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Posted: 12/9/2012 5:53 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


This defense as is, is plenty respectable, add a few more players and it will be a top notch D.

Gordon needed to catch that early ball he dropped, despite it being a bit behind him.  A top flight WR makes that catch, and if the catch is made it is a big gain and quite possibly a TD.

Loved using Little in the backfield.   We're going to need a guy to step up and take on the special package role from time to time when Cribbs is gone, Little can be that guy.  He rarely gets to display that running talent after the catch.

No reason Benji can't return punts full time, let Cribbs handle KOR until he leaves.

Weeden still had a few plays in which he held on to the ball too long, he's just getting better at not allowing it to hurt us every time.  His pass to the back of the EZ (that was almost picked) was so close to being a perfect throw, defender had to make an excellent play to pick it off, and he still didn't get the INT.

TRich shouldn't have to be used that late in a blowout, he needs rest, gotta find a guy you can rely on to carry the ball and protect your valuable talent.
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Posted: 12/9/2012 6:24 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


1)      I love watching mop-up action, when it is ours.

 

2)      Our Defense will need to adjust if RG3 is playing (I love our hard hittin’ defense).

       Keep him in the middle of field boys

 

3)      Gordon is slowly improving and getting better.

 

4)      Browns coaching staff showed me something on that Punt return

 

5)      Good to see the three amigo’s on the other side of the field

 

6)      We may not be the healthiest team in the NFL, but we got a roster full of young legs, that are now experienced and hungry.

 

7)      The Browns coaching staff showed me some more on that Little running play.  It is an easy to execute, and safe play that is deceiving (to the competition).

 

8)      Hardesty shows us why he is a good change of pace guy, (not a red-zone guy).

 

9)      Why aren’t we trying out street Free Agent Punters every Monday morning?

 

10)   It is time to tighten up the chinstraps boys, these last three games are the closest thing to the playoffs for all 53, plus the staff.  Play every play tough, block and tackle like you mean it.

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Posted: 12/9/2012 6:43 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


Shurmur is gradually letting the offense do a few things. Last week he went for it on 4th down - twice! This week he dusted off the Wildcat, motioned Little into the backfield and pitched out to him, ran a double reverse to Benjamin, and did a never-seen-before punt returner switch that resulted in the longest punt return TD in franchise history.

I don't know if he trusts his team a little more or if he figures he's got nothing to lose so why not try something different.

After the first play of the game the Browns outscore the Chiefs 30-0. They got a break when Bowe went down and their Suck Up missed a chip shot. With both Bowe and Charles out the Chiefs offense had no chance and the Browns seized momentum.

Weeds made some "first round draft pick" throws and overall did a nice job. He got sacked three times when he held the ball too long and he had a couple of potential picks dropped, but in general he's slowly making progress. Getting some continuity with his receivers is helping as each week it seems the timing is better. 

That defense line rotation is very, very nice. Winn, Hughes, Taylor and Rubin all made plays, and Sheard and Parker got sacks from the edge. Jauron seems comfortable keeping his backs in coverage and rushing with four 95% of the time. 

The Redskins beat the Ravens in OT, scoring 31 points. The Browns defense is really going to be tested next week. No more living large on the Steelers without Ben, the Raiders without McFadden, and the Chiefs without Bowe.
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  • redright
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Posted: 12/9/2012 7:25 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


My imaginary friend, Dennis Green, said, " Quinn?  Brady Quinn? He is what we thought he is".
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Posted: 12/9/2012 8:51 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


AA>

3)  Gordon gets the ball on the crossing route and has one guy to beat with a full head of steam at about the 10.  You're thinking in that millisecond that he should be able to somehow, someway, get it in the end zone.  He just looks lackadaisical and settles for a spot around the 2.  Unfortunately, the Browns had to settle for a fg.  Gordon needed to watch Cribbs effort to try and put it in the end zone (don't think he quite made it, but the ball should have been spotted on about the 4 inch line.  But TR scored anyway). 

On the third & goal pass attempt, Gordon needed to go up and fight for the ball.  Instead he thought he could sneak his hands up at the last second, and the short defender easily defensed the ball.  Weeden's throw needed to be higher and a little more to the outside, but Gordon still could have made a better effort.

SD:

Pass was late and low and thrown with too flat of a trajectory , Gordon was tapping toes as the ball got there without an inch to spare .

That he raised his hands at the last possible second is the only reason the defender didn't turn and intercept it as he only had a split second to react and get a finger in the mi , any sooner and thats chiefs ball .

Only the best receivers have mastered the Randy Moss trick , to keep your hands calm and not alert the defender until its too late .

Only guys with the best hands can use that move .

On the dig route , he simply ran before he caught it , it happens .

But for a guy who was on idaho's practice squad and started ball without a spring training to become our number one receiver and pass up all others , that trip has been truly remarkable , albeit he's still a work in progress.

His play has inspired Little  and right now in tandem they are a real weapon .

AA>



9)  Is Hodges still hurt?  Whatever mojo he had 2 years ago seems to have dried up. 
It's teeth gritting when the club is punting at midfield and there's a fair catch at the 18.
Dawson is a Brown until he can't do it anymore, but the Browns may want to do more than just a cursory search for another punter in the off season.

SD:

Inside the 18 is a plus 2 net , because anything inside the 20 is golden .

Certainly the ideal pinspot is inside the ten , but you can lose 7  8 yards easy kicking into the wind and high .

Also of note , you will find Hodges employs a nine iron chip shot style from that disatnce , and unlike that doofus Savage was so high on rarely if ever kicks one into the endzone for a touchback .

Watch him drop the ball down by the point and kick the one inch area with his toe to produce that sand bag drop effect and you'll gain a better appreciation of those kicks .

When we needed distance he boomed one 54 from the goal line with a 6 yard return producing a 48 yard net .

SoulDawg
WAR : OUR TIME HAS COME
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Posted: 12/9/2012 10:54 PM

RE: 10 on Sunday 


I would not be surprised to see 5-11, but considering we were 0-5, then had a tough row of teams and went 5-6, I would not be totally disappointed. 6-10 would be much better (6-5 finale).
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Posted: 12/9/2012 11:38 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


As far as the Hardesty fumble goes...did anybody see it? I couldn't see it from the tv view and Hardesty said he never lost possession. He reached the ball out for the goal line and brought it back in. He said he didn't know why they thought it was a fumble.

I truly would like to know if this the "I finally have faith in my offense" Pat or the "what the hell do I have to lose Pat". If he, by some miracle of God, stays employed here and turns out to be that latter......not good.

I have no gripes about Gordon. Any complaints at this point is nit picking. I'm glad he's on our side.

Weeden is still looking like a rookie. I mean honestly what can you say? He's no Luck. He's going to have ups and downs. Its not like its 2 or 3 good balls out of 40 like previous QB's.

Playoff hopes still alive.
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Posted: 12/10/2012 9:01 AM

RE: 10 on Sunday 


Browns spotted Charles 100 yards early in the game..go ahead get yer big play then we'll show up after that.
It actually was a mistake by the interior D as Rubin and the other DT moved left,got stoodup and Charles cuts back into the hole and Nyquil allows himself to be blocked further downfield while Ward takes a horrible angles and whiffs, actually he breaks ankle and the back cruises past.
After that little embarrasement the D including TJ play solid.
Someone said in here that Quinn would be a good QB..I haven't seen it since he was drafted .
He's no threat to do much of anything let alone throw 5 yard passes.


The offense could have put up more numbers if they wouldn't call some dumb plays down there and if the execution was better.
On the Dawson FG they had 2 TD's called back. The PI on TR was bogus as he was trying to separate from the LB but it wasn't flagarent.
Silly call.
The Weeden force into the endzone was him trusting he could get the ball in but he really should have thrown it away.
Young receivers are developing nicely.
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Posted: 12/10/2012 9:29 AM

RE: 10 on Sunday 


WAR:

Browns spotted Charles 100 yards early in the game..go ahead get yer big play then we'll show up after that.

AA:

Charles had 17 carries for 85 yards the rest of the way.  That's 5 yards per carry, and included four runs of over 10 yards, and only two for losses.  So I don't know who exactly showed up other than the Browns gained a big lead, so the Chiefs had to rely far more on Quinn.  Had the Chiefs been able to keep a lid on the Browns offense, they could have relied on Charles a lot more, and he was plenty productive apart from the opening run.

WAR:

It actually was a mistake by the interior D as Rubin and the other DT moved left,got stoodup and Charles cuts back into the hole and Nyquil allows himself to be blocked further downfield while Ward takes a horrible angles and whiffs, actually he breaks ankle and the back cruises past.

AA:

And the dl was washed down the line plenty of times to open up the cutback for Charles. 

WAR:

Someone said in here that Quinn would be a good QB..I haven't seen it since he was drafted .
He's no threat to do much of anything let alone throw 5 yard passes.

AA:

Other than the sideline toss to Bowe, Quinn has pretty much cemented his backup status for the remainder of his career.

WAR:

The offense could have put up more numbers if they wouldn't call some dumb plays down there and if the execution was better.
On the Dawson FG they had 2 TD's called back. The PI on TR was bogus as he was trying to separate from the LB but it wasn't flagarent.

AA:

I think what happened was that Richardson made the motion of pushing off, but hit air.  The defender was slightly out of reach, cuz he certainly didn't react to any contact (and as a Browns coach knows, when TR pushes you, you get pushed).  But the ref saw the pushing movement, so flagged him anyway.  It wasn't a good call.
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Posted: 12/10/2012 9:37 AM

Re: 10 on Sunday 



soldiersFryeAndWinslow wrote: 

Weeden is still looking like a rookie. I mean honestly what can you say? He's no Luck. He's going to have ups and downs. Its not like its 2 or 3 good balls out of 40 like previous QB's.


Have you watched Luck the past 4 weeks, b/c he isn't looking like anything special most of the game.  He's making plays you expect the #1 pick to make, but he's missing reads and making bad throws like every other rookie as well.  Luck obviously has more upside but there's plenty to criticize lately.  Moral of the story is Luck and Weeden are rookies and will play like rookies.  We can't go back and change anything about the 2012 draft, and Weeden has shown enough to be satisfied we made that move to upgrade our QB position for now.
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Posted: 12/10/2012 9:40 AM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


GF:

Not sure that I see Gordon as slack. I think he and Little are going to be a real 1-2 punch. I think you're nit picking a bit Vark.

AA:

I only think it bears watching. 

No question Gordon has talent and is productive.  He's as strong as Little but longer and better hands.  But on certain plays, he looks like George Hendrick.  Even in football, players have to pick and choose their spots to avoid contact or go all out.  The latter is when the end zone is right there.  IMO TR has the typically great nose for the end zone.  Don't see another player on the squad with that kind of will.  And, of course, the drawback with Gordon coming up short was that the Browns had to settle for a fg. 

And, Brandon, what's with the slide when nobody's within five yards of you? 
Yea, it's better than waiting a little too long and taking a needless hit.  But still...

In the big picture of this game, Gordon not fighting for the end zone as Cribbs did wasn't impacting a one sided game.  In a tight game against a good opponent, it can represent a significant difference.
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  • oblong
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Posted: 12/10/2012 10:15 AM

RE: 10 on Sunday 



Aardvark wrote:
....................................
WAR:

Browns spotted Charles 100 yards early in the game..go ahead get yer big play then we'll show up after that.

AA:

Charles had 17 carries for 85 yards the rest of the way.  That's 5 yards per carry, and included four runs of over 10 yards, and only two for losses.  So I don't know who exactly showed up other than the Browns gained a big lead, so the Chiefs had to rely far more on Quinn.  Had the Chiefs been able to keep a lid on the Browns offense, they could have relied on Charles a lot more, and he was plenty productive apart from the opening run.

WAR:

It actually was a mistake by the interior D as Rubin and the other DT moved left,got stoodup and Charles cuts back into the hole and Nyquil allows himself to be blocked further downfield while Ward takes a horrible angles and whiffs, actually he breaks ankle and the back cruises past.

AA:

And the dl was washed down the line plenty of times to open up the cutback for Charles. 

...............
JCharles appeared to be on his way again late in the first half, as the front seven again was caved, on the offensive left side this time. He broke into the secondary with a head of steam and I was already groaning, but either he slipped or, I think, a defender on the ground got a couple of fingers on his ankle. Following his little stumble, Sheard pounced from behind, smothered JCharles and in the process injured his ribs. I couldn't determine who got the contact on his foot, if that's what happened, but it was a game-changing play.

Last edited 12/10/2012 3:19 PM by oblong

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Posted: 12/10/2012 12:55 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


SD:

Pass was late and low and thrown with too flat of a trajectory , Gordon was tapping toes as the ball got there without an inch to spare .

AA:

He wasn't that close to the sideline, and the pass kept him parallel to it.  Considering the less than stellar location of the pass, Gordon needed to use his size advantage and go up for the ball.  Lulling the defender with the last second reach can work if Gordon's up against a big physical guy. 

SD:

On the dig route , he simply ran before he caught it , it happens .

AA:

Sure, but had no problem with that one.  It DOES happen, and at least Weeden had good location on both balls.

SD:

But for a guy who was on idaho's practice squad and started ball without a spring training to become our number one receiver and pass up all others , that trip has been truly remarkable , albeit he's still a work in progress.

AA:

For a guy who has so little college experience, he's done as well as anyone could hope for along those lines.

But my concern in this thread is not his learning routes and technique, but showing a little more effort on certain plays.  When the end zone is involved, a receiver can't just half ass it and expect TR to take it in the rest of the way.  Gordon needs to see the effort put forth by Cribbs on his attempt to get in the end zone.

And speaking of showing a little more effort on certain plays, what the hell is up with Weeden and his premature slides?  No one wasaround him for 5 yards!  Nobody wants him getting too greedy and taking an unnecessary hit, but he bales out awfully early. 

Let's see what he does when it's 3rd & 8 late in a close game, and he takes off and is three yards from a collision AND a first down.  Don't think we'll be getting John Ellway's helicopter move.

SD [on Hodges]:

Inside the 18 is a plus 2 net , because anything inside the 20 is golden .

AA:

Well, not really.  Not when you're punting from mid-field.  Not expecting a pin inside the 5, but two yards short of a touch back and a 30 yard net isn't even getting the job done, much less golden.

Hodges had two kicks for distance.  But he had one kick that was positively anemic (33 yards) and gave KC great field position just before the half.  But thankfully Romeo had no faith in Quinn picking up 15-20 yards on 1-2 plays and set up for a fg, so the Chiefs just conceded and ran out the clock.

Two other kicks came from midfield and really resulted no better than touch backs.

Two years ago, Hodges drew admiration for fans for more than just his fake punt run for daylight ("Run, Reggie, run!").  He was very adept at pinning teams back,
He was 9th in the league in net average.

This year, he's 29th in net average.  His opponent Sunday (Colquitt) has 12 more punts inside the 20 on 12 fewer kicks.

Meanwhile Zastudil has reemerged in Arizona where he's 9th in net average and got over his maddening number of touch backs.  He's second in the league in punts inside the 20.

Hodges was definitely outclassed by Colquitt yesterday and just doesn't seem to have his mojo from two seasons back.
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Posted: 12/10/2012 11:49 PM

Re: 10 on Sunday 




---------------------------------------------
--- donnyunitas wrote:


soldiersFryeAndWinslow wrote: 

Weeden is still looking like a rookie. I mean honestly what can you say? He's no Luck. He's going to have ups and downs. Its not like its 2 or 3 good balls out of 40 like previous QB's.


Have you watched Luck the past 4 weeks, b/c he isn't looking like anything special most of the game.  He's making plays you expect the #1 pick to make, but he's missing reads and making bad throws like every other rookie as well.  Luck obviously has more upside but there's plenty to criticize lately.  Moral of the story is Luck and Weeden are rookies and will play like rookies.  We can't go back and change anything about the 2012 draft, and Weeden has shown enough to be satisfied we made that move to upgrade our QB position for now.

---------------------------------------------

My point being that overall Luck is playing l like a #1 overall with a record to back it up. Weeden is playing like QB that should have been drafted in round two. Upside with rough patches along the way.
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Posted: 12/11/2012 8:08 AM

Re: 10 on Sunday 



soldiersFryeAndWinslow wrote:

My point being that overall Luck is playing l like a #1 overall with a record to back it up. Weeden is playing like QB that should have been drafted in round two. Upside with rough patches along the way.

Sounds like U didn't do yer homeywork on BW before the draft.
I watched a lot of OSU games, infact I watch a lot of college ball. I thought he would be a good second round pick as he  he was a first round talent  and still don't.
While MH/TH pulled the trigger early his skillset was not a first round prospect and I'm not factoring in his age .
He's not as polished as Luck/Griff..
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Posted: 12/11/2012 8:55 AM

Re: 10 on Sunday 



Wardawg11 wrote:
soldiersFryeAndWinslow wrote:

My point being that overall Luck is playing l like a #1 overall with a record to back it up. Weeden is playing like QB that should have been drafted in round two. Upside with rough patches along the way.

Sounds like U didn't do yer homeywork on BW before the draft.
I watched a lot of OSU games, infact I watch a lot of college ball. I thought he would be a good second round pick as he  he was a first round talent  and still don't.
While MH/TH pulled the trigger early his skillset was not a first round prospect and I'm not factoring in his age .
He's not as polished as Luck/Griff..
Isn't that what I basically said?
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Posted: 12/11/2012 9:07 AM

Re: 10 on Sunday 


Isn't it great to spend the week nitpicking things like Weeden sliding a little too early and Gordon trying to snatch the ball rather than jumping and ripping it out of the air, as opposed to bitching about plays that lost the game for the Browns? 

I agree that Hodges is not the same punter he was before the Achilles injury and I'll bet they bring in some real competition for him next year. He did have a nice 54-yard punt from deep in his own end, however. 

I didn't see any evidence of Gordon not trying to score on that play. He's been outstanding in the RAC category this year, along with Little. 

Anybody notice Richardson is not getting passes thrown to him anymore? The reason is that the game is slowing down for Weeden and he's finding the open receiver more quickly so he doesn't need to check down to the RB.
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