16isles wrote: I never said he caught it or he didn't. I was just wondering if you were just saying it or if you had any actual credible evidence that he caught it. Kind of silly to pin your opinion on something you can't see, isn't it?

Yes and the NFL came out and backed that Tate call, that should give you and idea of what the Referee's Association's opinion of Porter's call means.

Well, there's a logical deduction if there ever were one.  The NFL supported the Golden Tate call, therefore the Big 12, the National Organization of Sports Officials, and Referee Magazine are wrong.

OSU84 wrote:

16isles wrote: I never said he caught it or he didn't. I was just wondering if you were just saying it or if you had any actual credible evidence that he caught it. Kind of silly to pin your opinion on something you can't see, isn't it?

Yes and the NFL came out and backed that Tate call, that should give you and idea of what the Referee's Association's opinion of Porter's call means.

Well, there's a logical deduction if there ever were one.  The NFL supported the Golden Tate call, therefore the Big 12, the National Organization of Sports Officials, and Referee Magazine are wrong.

haha right?

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

Not sure if serious. 

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

OSU81 wrote: ObjectiveCane = Cocksmoker

ObjectiveCane wrote:

SurfOhio wrote: OSU already handed Miami sanctions in 2002.

Yep and the Terry Porter = Mark Emmert

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000000000000000000......

16isles wrote: Do you have a picture of Gamble catching that ball or are you just going by the shot from behind him?

 

the ruling was catch but out of bounds (in today's replay era its 1st down)

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.  HA!  I'm pretty sure they have more that ONE picture and 4 30 second phone calls!

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does  Like I havn't heard this before
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place  So? Deaf ears.  Sure you are all supportive of USC and PSU NOW that YOUR neck is in the noose.
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

I'm saying Paul Dee and co made sure USC was fried based on the testimony of Lake and dispite them not being able to prove a damn thing either, beyond a few $K in hotel and limo bills to Reggie.


The NCAA better not let off Miami because Shapiro is "questionable"

It has nothing to do with the witness when it comes to the NCAA.  The witness they crucified us with on Mayo was found to be unreliable in a court of law.  McNair is going to win his case as well.  All too late to provide ANY releaf for USC football.  The NCAA is making sure of that too.


I have ZERO love for the NCAA but this one is personal, Cane

TroyKidd wrote:

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.  HA!  I'm pretty sure they have more that ONE picture and 4 30 second phone calls!

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does  Like I havn't heard this before
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place  So? Deaf ears.  Sure you are all supportive of USC and PSU NOW that YOUR neck is in the noose.
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

I'm saying Paul Dee and co made sure USC was fried based on the testimony of Lake and dispite them not being able to prove a damn thing either, beyond a few $K in hotel and limo bills to Reggie.


The NCAA better not let off Miami because Shapiro is "questionable"

It has nothing to do with the witness when it comes to the NCAA.  The witness they crucified us with on Mayo was found to be unreliable in a court of law.  McNair is going to win his case as well.  All too late to provide ANY releaf for USC football.  The NCAA is making sure of that too.


I have ZERO love for the NCAA but this one is personal, Cane

Wrongfully punish Miami, because you wrongfully punished USC. STUPENDOUS logic.

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.  HA!  I'm pretty sure they have more that ONE picture and 4 30 second phone calls!

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does  Like I havn't heard this before
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place  So? Deaf ears.  Sure you are all supportive of USC and PSU NOW that YOUR neck is in the noose.
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

I'm saying Paul Dee and co made sure USC was fried based on the testimony of Lake and dispite them not being able to prove a damn thing either, beyond a few $K in hotel and limo bills to Reggie.


The NCAA better not let off Miami because Shapiro is "questionable"

It has nothing to do with the witness when it comes to the NCAA.  The witness they crucified us with on Mayo was found to be unreliable in a court of law.  McNair is going to win his case as well.  All too late to provide ANY releaf for USC football.  The NCAA is making sure of that too.


I have ZERO love for the NCAA but this one is personal, Cane

Wrongfully punish Miami, because you wrongfully punished USC. STUPENDOUS logic.

Hey like I said, it's personal.  I won't pretend otherwise.

Be glad I'm not on the COI 
It's too late for USC to hope for vindictive people to be prevented from participating.


Pray the NCAA has changed since USC was dealt with.  So far, indications are good.

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

DBushwhacker wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

USNAVYCANE wrote: Jon Solomon ‏@jonsol
New COI member Bobby Cremins tells Sirius that NCAA should have been "really, really skeptical" of Nevin Shapiro as a source.

Wow and ex-ACC coach said that? 


Why would Nevin Shapiro be any more questionable than Loyd Lake?

Are you saying that the NCAA was right to work off of the testimony of Lloyd Lake? 

See this is why the NCAA gets off. You only look at the NCAA as the rogue organization that it is when it's arrows are directed at you, but you put the blinders back on when other programs are getting crushed. There is actually evidence that supports them being more wrong in this case than they were in the 'SC case, due to the audio recordings, but that's of no consequence. 

The fact of the matter is that the NCAA has nothing more than the word of a convicted felon. The Yahoo article was lazily sourced and extremely shoddy. There is nothing that can be proven by it. The NCAA new the PR backlash would be outrageous if they could only prove minor offenses and gave Miami a slap on the wrist. They got antsy and decided they would go the unethical route. 

Everybody was up in arms over the baseless allegations and never paid attention to the fact that NOTHING else came out about those allegations afterwards. Not only could the NCAA not tie any of the alleged transgressions to the University being complicit in wrongdoing, but they cant even prove that any of these outlandish claims took place.  HA!  I'm pretty sure they have more that ONE picture and 4 30 second phone calls!

Shapiro probably sounded something like this:

"Yeah, I paid for an abortion that this hooker got. Honest I did. I don't have any receipts or anything like that, because it isn't like hookers run around with a logbook, but you gotta believe me"

"Yeah, I paid for Willis McGahee, Vince Wilfork, DJ Williams, and other players in this nightclub. Look at this receipt. I know the receipt doesn't have their name on it, but you gotta believe me."

No one is saying that Miami is without fault. The problem is three-fold

1) They are trying to punish Miami for transgressions that everyone else in the country does  Like I havn't heard this before
2) They cant prove that any of these things took place  So? Deaf ears.  Sure you are all supportive of USC and PSU NOW that YOUR neck is in the noose.
3) The law of the NCAA doesn't effectively govern it's clients

The witch hunt for PSU was wrong. The witch hunt for USC was wrong. The witch hunt for Shabazz Muhammad was wrong. The witch hunt for Terrelle Pryor was wrong and this is no different.

I'm saying Paul Dee and co made sure USC was fried based on the testimony of Lake and dispite them not being able to prove a damn thing either, beyond a few $K in hotel and limo bills to Reggie.


The NCAA better not let off Miami because Shapiro is "questionable"

It has nothing to do with the witness when it comes to the NCAA.  The witness they crucified us with on Mayo was found to be unreliable in a court of law.  McNair is going to win his case as well.  All too late to provide ANY releaf for USC football.  The NCAA is making sure of that too.


I have ZERO love for the NCAA but this one is personal, Cane

Wrongfully punish Miami, because you wrongfully punished USC. STUPENDOUS logic.

The sad truth of the matter is that my kind of attitude toward Miami is what gives the NCAA their power. 

My feelings toward Dee/Miami mirror how most fans feel about PSU/USC etc.  Most fans DON'T feel this way about... SCar or UNC let's say.

So when action is called for against, say USC, the NCAA has cart blanch to do what they want. 


The NCAA should be above this.  Paul Dee made sure it wasn't.  Emmertt is following in Dee's footsteps. 


The NCAA's mandate has been usurped by vindictive people that feel they can and SHOULD act vindictivly to "teach people a lesson" under the guise that they are "getting tough".  Time and time again since the USC ruling we've seen that the NCAA is only interested in being tough west of the Rockies (except for PSU).


My hope is that the NCAA will change.  It is too late to help USC.  The best we can hope for is to be the martyr for change so that the next time our kids mess up and trade stuff for tats we can expect something other than justice at the end of a rope.

TroyKidd wrote:

My hope is that the NCAA will change.  It is too late to help USC.  The best we can hope for is to be the martyr for change so that the next time our kids mess up and trade stuff for tats we can expect something other than justice at the end of a rope.

The problem here was  not the kids!!! It was a lying coach that got TOSU in trouble.
How quick we try to forget that!!

I know your not implying this but!!
It's the same ole same ole!! Two wrongs don't make a right. Miami was wrong, the Ncaa sounds like there in the wrong. So don't set em' both free. FCS !!!

The thing that struck me was ....

"NCAA President Mark Emmert announced the findings Wednesday. The sports governing body said former enforcement staff members worked with the criminal defense attorney for former Miami booster and convicted Ponzi scheme architect Nevin Shapiro "to improperly obtain information ... through a bankruptcy proceeding that did not involve the NCAA.""

Thus, they don't want to impose penalties based on information illegally obtained. Yet, they wanted Tressel to use information that someone gave him illegally. Yes, Tressel was wrong for no disclosing thr information once it was out. But, I always thought Tressel was in a catch-22 on disclosing information that shouldn't have been sent to him. Yet, he should vave looked into and stopped the booster based on the tip.

NewOrleansBuckeye wrote:

TroyKidd wrote:

My hope is that the NCAA will change.  It is too late to help USC.  The best we can hope for is to be the martyr for change so that the next time our kids mess up and trade stuff for tats we can expect something other than justice at the end of a rope.

The problem here was  not the kids!!! It was a lying coach that got TOSU in trouble.
How quick we try to forget that!!

 

Not true  OSU kids had to sit because they did something.  Something small but still something.

But when your kids did something teh NCAA didn't take it out of your hide. 


JT also did something and paid the price as he should have.

petes9999 wrote: 
Thus, they don't want to impose penalties based on information illegally obtained. Yet, they wanted Tressel to use information that someone gave him illegally. Yes, Tressel was wrong for no disclosing thr information once it was out. But, I always thought Tressel was in a catch-22 on disclosing information that shouldn't have been sent to him. Yet, he should vave looked into and stopped the booster based on the tip.

There are no actual rules with the NCAA and that is the problem because then the wind will drive them.  These are real world issues with hard $$$ impact not just some giant playground for the rich and powerful.



The extent that the "tainting" is applied to the case by the NCAA remains to be seen.

Miami thinks the whole thing should be thrown out now.  I see their point... but this one's personal


Injustice must not be left to stand.  Since there is no forum to address wrongs, and there was a wrong, outside the NCAA...



So it's to be an eye for an eye till the world is blind?