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Bad year for Malaysian airlines

Posted: 7/17/2014 11:58 AM

Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


Last edited 7/17/2014 12:08 PM by ParkinJacket

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Posted: 7/17/2014 12:05 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 



Article made it sound like the Ukrainians shot it down?
--
Moderatus Emeritus
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Posted: 7/17/2014 12:08 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


Article changed. I suspect it will be in flux for a while.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 12:27 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


What we're going to find is that the Russians have been using large mobile SAMS to plink Ukrainian aircraft and have been claiming that it is militants in Ukraine with manpads (rebels, if you will). This tears the cover off of Russia's plausable deniability and is going to get them a "Naughty Commies" slap on the wrist from the UN and maybe a few sanctions.

Their response will probably be to further ratchet up the heat on the Ukrane and to further blackmail Gasprom's customers in Europe.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:20 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


I suspect you're right.  The Ukraine forces would have big SAM's, but no way the separatists should.

Some idiot on CNN just said wordsTTE that "It's suprising that this would happen because the 777 looks obviously like an airliner, it'd be hard to mistake".  Doe he really think that SAM batteries identify targets visually?  Are wars only allowed on clear days?
OracleJacket wrote: What we're going to find is that the Russians have been using large mobile SAMS to plink Ukrainian aircraft and have been claiming that it is militants in Ukraine with manpads (rebels, if you will). This tears the cover off of Russia's plausable deniability and is going to get them a "Naughty Commies" slap on the wrist from the UN and maybe a few sanctions.

Their response will probably be to further ratchet up the heat on the Ukrane and to further blackmail Gasprom's customers in Europe.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:23 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


wow.

I heard on the radio that a plane was missing and now I hear it was shot down.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:31 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 



GTMule wrote: I suspect you're right.  The Ukraine forces would have big SAM's, but no way the separatists should.

Some idiot on CNN just said wordsTTE that "It's suprising that this would happen because the 777 looks obviously like an airliner, it'd be hard to mistake".  Doe he really think that SAM batteries identify targets visually?  Are wars only allowed on clear days?
OracleJacket wrote: What we're going to find is that the Russians have been using large mobile SAMS to plink Ukrainian aircraft and have been claiming that it is militants in Ukraine with manpads (rebels, if you will). This tears the cover off of Russia's plausable deniability and is going to get them a "Naughty Commies" slap on the wrist from the UN and maybe a few sanctions.

Their response will probably be to further ratchet up the heat on the Ukrane and to further blackmail Gasprom's customers in Europe.
You answered your own question.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:39 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


I am surprised that any of the airlines are still flying in this airspace. There have been several cargo planes shot down recently. This gave every indication that something like this was bound to happen. I bet that this airspace will be off limits in the very near future.

Closing the barn door after the cows have gotten out.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:45 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 





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--- Peachtreebuzz40 wrote:

I am surprised that any of the airlines are still flying in this airspace. There have been several cargo planes shot down recently. This gave every indication that something like this was bound to happen. I bet that this airspace will be off limits in the very near future.

Closing the barn door after the cows have gotten out.

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There have been some NOTAMS (notices to airmen) listed advising re-routing around the airspace, but depending on who issued them and who the Malaysians use to collect data for flight briefings, there is the chance that they were oblivious to the issue or discounted it. After all "Who would shoot at an airliner that is in contact with the local air traffic control and is on a designated, scheduled route?"
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:50 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


reports now that 23 US citizens were aboard the flight.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 1:52 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 



RoswellBuzz wrote:
GTMule wrote: I suspect you're right.  The Ukraine forces would have big SAM's, but no way the separatists should.

Some idiot on CNN just said wordsTTE that "It's suprising that this would happen because the 777 looks obviously like an airliner, it'd be hard to mistake".  Doe he really think that SAM batteries identify targets visually?  Are wars only allowed on clear days?
OracleJacket wrote: What we're going to find is that the Russians have been using large mobile SAMS to plink Ukrainian aircraft and have been claiming that it is militants in Ukraine with manpads (rebels, if you will). This tears the cover off of Russia's plausable deniability and is going to get them a "Naughty Commies" slap on the wrist from the UN and maybe a few sanctions.

Their response will probably be to further ratchet up the heat on the Ukrane and to further blackmail Gasprom's customers in Europe.
You answered your own question.

reports suggesting an SA11 or SA17.  not a handheld missle.

It could be the pilots thought they could fly high enough to be out of danger
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:01 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 



BornAJacket wrote: reports now that 23 US citizens were aboard the flight.
Red Flag Alert.

Alex Jones and his friends will have a field day with this.  (Note: I'm talking about conspiracy theorists not people of a political bent.  Alex happens to be both.)

GH
"01110111 01101001 01101110 01101110 01101001 01101110 01100111"
Chris Bosh
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:04 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


wreckage site supposedly covers 9 square miles, including the victims, being found at multiple locations.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:37 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


Said at lunch that pilots radio'd that there had been some kind of scuffle onboard.  Possibility of onboard terrorism (explosion from within maybe?) ?????
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:40 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 





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--- GTJT622 wrote:

Said at lunch that pilots radio'd that there had been some kind of scuffle onboard.  Possibility of onboard terrorism (explosion from within maybe?) ?????

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Who reported that and what was their source?
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:51 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


In this case - unlike the Malaysian Air plane that went down in the middle of the Indian Ocean - there has to be a ton of radar coverage of this area and the ability to look at the history files to see if there was a missile and if so where it came from.  This should be pretty cut and dried.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 2:56 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 





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--- YlJacket wrote:

In this case - unlike the Malaysian Air plane that went down in the middle of the Indian Ocean - there has to be a ton of radar coverage of this area and the ability to look at the history files to see if there was a missile and if so where it came from.  This should be pretty cut and dried.

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The problem is that everyone has an agenda and national interests are at stake. Occam's razor would suggest that one side has been shooting down a lot of aircraft, so they are likely responsible.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 3:15 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


Truly, what are the odds of this small country's airline being involved in TWO major disasters within a period of weeks?
It seems eventually all mysteries surrounding this flight will be solved given how closely this area was monitored by the international community.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 3:24 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 


And to extend that, one side has a history of sending guys to man SAM batteries and fly interceptors in other people's wars...

Also, in response to someone above, it's unlikely that ATC radar would see the missile (or if not unlikely, it's very possible that it wouldn't) but military radar should, but who knows if anyone was watching (though I wouldn't be surprised to find out we're flying electronic recon aircraft of some kind over there.....)
OracleJacket wrote:


---------------------------------------------
--- YlJacket wrote:

In this case - unlike the Malaysian Air plane that went down in the middle of the Indian Ocean - there has to be a ton of radar coverage of this area and the ability to look at the history files to see if there was a missile and if so where it came from.  This should be pretty cut and dried.

---------------------------------------------

The problem is that everyone has an agenda and national interests are at stake. Occam's razor would suggest that one side has been shooting down a lot of aircraft, so they are likely responsible.
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Posted: 7/17/2014 3:39 PM

Re: Bad year for Malaysian airlines 



OracleJacket wrote:


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--- GTJT622 wrote:

Said at lunch that pilots radio'd that there had been some kind of scuffle onboard.  Possibility of onboard terrorism (explosion from within maybe?) ?????

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Who reported that and what was their source?
NBC News Pentagon reporter...didn't catch who his source was.  It was in the context of the Malaysian Airlines said this and said that, but I can't confirm he specifically stated a rep from MA said that.
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