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Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue

Posted: 4/26/2013 7:54 PM

Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Sorry guys but I think this is a terrible pick.  Not because its a defensive tackle but because of who it is.  

Below is one game.  Open a notepad file an mark a "l" for every time he beats a block (not makes a play but just beats a block) without question.  He's a Panther now and I wish him the best but I basically hate the pick. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wWOpR_t0TM
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:11 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Short is a disruptive playmaker who leaves Purdue with 48 tackles for loss as a four-year starter. It has been a steady development for the former three-star recruit out of the Chicago area who redshirted in 2008.

He enjoyed his best statistical season as a junior with 54 tackles, 17.0 tackles for loss and 6.5 sacks. Short was the focus of every team's offensive gameplan in 2012, but still managed 14.5 tackles for loss and 6.0 sacks despite battling an ankle injury for several games.

STRENGTHS: Large human being with a huge wingspan, using his long arms to bat down passes and make plays on special teams. Showed determination and team-first attitude in playing through ankle injury in 2012. Can be an immovable object in the middle of the field when he plays disciplined and generates power from his lower body.


WEAKNESSES: Too often gives streaky effort and doesn't consistently play with leverage. Saw a lot of double-teams, but scouts want to see more of a mean streak and less passiveness. While Short will be an attractive pro prospect because of his natural size and tools, he needs to prove he can be consistently more than just a plugging space-eater.



Put him beside Star with no double teams and let that ankle heal,let's see what he can do.

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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:32 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 



Realguyjeff wrote: Sorry guys but I think this is a terrible pick.  Not because its a defensive tackle but because of who it is.  

Below is one game.  Open a notepad file an mark a "l" for every time he beats a block (not makes a play but just beats a block) without question.  He's a Panther now and I wish him the best but I basically hate the pick. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wWOpR_t0TM
don't apologize i agree but for different reasons.like I said in another thread the absence of a 3rd pick makes this one a bad pick.
The Power of Life and Death are in the Tongue.

"we are heading in the direction of a National Championship"   Butch Davis  April 14,2007    
 - To be continued. Larry Fedora  12/09/2011
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:56 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Ok so we have 2 DT's who have eaten DOuble teams there entire college careers.  And the kid from Purdue when they played ND everytime the didnt double him he was in the backfield.  I think it gives a hell of a rotation in the middle.  Jeff wasnt it you complaining all year least year about getting gashed up the middle? Now we sign two 310 lbs DT's and your complaing starting to sence a pattern here!! With Hardy and Johnson on the ends and a 4 man rotation in the middle.  Sounds good to me!
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Posted: 4/26/2013 8:59 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


“He’s the most natural pass rusher of all the defensive tackles in the draft," Panthers GM Dave Gettleman said. "He was at the top of our board. We worked him out, we brought him in, spent time with him... and we feel really good about this pick. It gives us a tremendous defensive line rotation."
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Posted: 4/26/2013 9:07 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


I couldn't tell you the first thing about this guy, But a few points about our picks:

1) Gettleman was with the Giants last year....when they played us. He saw the Gians OL and Andre Brown and others completely destroy our D-line. Just manhandle it for the entire game. After seeing that, his first goal could've very easily been that he's gotta stuff this line. Very understandable and I agree it was necessary.

2) Star is clearly a stud, but what the investment in the first two rounds to the DL allows us to do is something special. It allows our BEST players on defense to be better. Way better. In the NFL, teams always have a successful player that they expect to be successful the following year. But then other teams watch tape and prepare for them. That was my fear for Kuechly and to a smaller extent Greg Hardy. Now, with Beason coming back, Kuechly, Johnson, and Hardy can take that next step without having that fear.
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Posted: 4/26/2013 9:13 PM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


This isn't to "bash" Kawann Short I think we just need to know what we just got here.  He has some ability and at times shows real skills.  However, MOST of his tape is him standing around looking at other guys play football.  

Below I've pasted a video from the Senior Bowl of the offensive line vs the defensive line.  There is also timestamps on where you can Watch Kawann Short pass rush.  I know this is a small sample but it should give some idea of the ability this guy has.  I know the NFL.com grading system is nowhere near the end all be all of player evaluation but again it gives a rough idea.  Short faced 3 different lineman.   Joe Madsen, Braxton Cave, and Brian Winters.  Two of these guys are barely draftable and 1 has SOME ability.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpjCaXaPm1A

Video Marker

Result

Offensive Lineman

Offensive Lineman Grade

notes

 

4:22

Won

Winters

71.1 NFL.com

 

 

 

Lost

Winters

71.1 NFL.com

 

 

8:20

Lost

Cave

57.3 NFL.com

Fell down

 

 

Won

Cave

57.3 NFL.com

Good hands

 

15:15

Won

Cave

57.3 NFL.com

 

 

19:10

Lost

Madsen

54 NFL.com

Got Dominated

 


If Kawann Short is supposed to be our pass rushing Defensive lineman this is going to go 1 or two ways.  

1.  He's going to mostly end up stopped at the line of scrimmage by NFL caliber offensive guards and not be able to regain any momentum.

2.  He's going to improve by LEAPS AND BOUNDS and prove that he's not a bust waiting to happen.  

My money is on number 2 but I sincerely hope I am somehow very wrong about him.  

Here is a little more tape on Kawann short and them I am done with my evaluation of him and moving on to the welcome party noidea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wWOpR_t0TM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0_ueLOWGdU
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Posted: 4/26/2013 9:22 PM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


I like the idea behind this pick, but I'm not sure how much I like taking two DTs in a row with other needs. My philosophy on corners and defensive backs is that they don't mean jack unless you have a defensive line that can help them out. I think we now have that for sure, and we've taken care of the age issue on the line by leaps and bounds.

I think my biggest concern moving forward is the offensive line, and the offensive side of the ball, which we've done little to address. Right now Cam is still going to take a lot of hits. I feel like our 3 key pass catchers are able, in Smith, LaFell, and Olsen, but I really want someone to plug in at the slot, and Smith isn't getting any younger. I have faith that Gettis or Adams could make a difference, but I've sold the Pilares down the river. Is Ginn really the answer?

how confident are we in our safeties?

 




Your 2013 National Champion Louisville Cardinals!
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Posted: 4/26/2013 11:17 PM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Love it. Biggest weakness is now a strength.

Hopefully we can bag a RG now.

"I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use. "

Galileo
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Posted: 4/27/2013 12:37 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 



MadCard05 wrote: I like the idea behind this pick, but I'm not sure how much I like taking two DTs in a row with other needs. My philosophy on corners and defensive backs is that they don't mean jack unless you have a defensive line that can help them out. I think we now have that for sure, and we've taken care of the age issue on the line by leaps and bounds.

I think my biggest concern moving forward is the offensive line, and the offensive side of the ball, which we've done little to address. Right now Cam is still going to take a lot of hits. I feel like our 3 key pass catchers are able, in Smith, LaFell, and Olsen, but I really want someone to plug in at the slot, and Smith isn't getting any younger. I have faith that Gettis or Adams could make a difference, but I've sold the Pilares down the river. Is Ginn really the answer?

how confident are we in our safeties?
curious why you would give up on Pilares who played well? He is a good young receiver who can catch and return kicks. He has shown much more than Adams at this point.
The Power of Life and Death are in the Tongue.

"we are heading in the direction of a National Championship"   Butch Davis  April 14,2007    
 - To be continued. Larry Fedora  12/09/2011
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Posted: 4/27/2013 1:54 AM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


love the picks, star plays right away and short rotates in.  now on passing downs wecan play johnson in the middle and hide him , while keeping others fresh!??
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Posted: 4/27/2013 5:01 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


The Giants have a history of making good WR's out of guys who don't really look like they'd make it.

I think Pilares, Adams, Edwards, Gettis, LaFell, Olsen, and Smith are enough weapons to have a very successful offense. It just wasn't being run correctly the first half of last season. Not to mention Cam, Stewart, Williams, and Tolbert. We have a TON of talent on offense. We just need to learn how to use it. This is the same offense that put up a whole lotta points Cam's first year, and stepped it up 2nd half of last season too. The only concern I have on offense is with the OL. I'm not sold on Silo or Bell, and Kalil needs to stay healthy. Gross will be fine for another year or two, but maybe at RT instead. I really think we need a new LT and 2 new OG's.

As for the draft picks so far, I'm super happy with the IDEA of solidifying the DL. This game is won at the line of scrimmage and we now theoretically have a very good DL vs what we had last season. That is, IF Short can become what we want. He's a boom or bust pick, as McShay put it last night. If he busts, we still have Star and it was just a wasted pick. If he booms though, we have one of the youngest and best DL's in the NFL. Where have I seen that before? Oh yea, NYG...

Once the DL is solid, our Pro Bowl LB Beason and ROTY LB Keuchly will look even better, if that's possible. And our DB's won't have as difficult of a task every play because our DL will be getting more pressure on the QB than before, and our front 7 will be shutting down the run game sufficiently.

Falcons fan: What worries me? That one day Cam will grow up and become a leader of men, focus on others instead of himself, and show courage.

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Posted: 4/27/2013 6:34 AM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


I agree totally.  I was really thinking WR / DB with our 2nd last night, but if Star and Short can live up to their billing our defense just got much better.  You can have the best offense in the league but if you can't stop the run and get pressure on the Qb, your not going to win many games by having to outscore the opposition.
QCHeel wrote: I couldn't tell you the first thing about this guy, But a few points about our picks:

1) Gettleman was with the Giants last year....when they played us. He saw the Gians OL and Andre Brown and others completely destroy our D-line. Just manhandle it for the entire game. After seeing that, his first goal could've very easily been that he's gotta stuff this line. Very understandable and I agree it was necessary.

2) Star is clearly a stud, but what the investment in the first two rounds to the DL allows us to do is something special. It allows our BEST players on defense to be better. Way better. In the NFL, teams always have a successful player that they expect to be successful the following year. But then other teams watch tape and prepare for them. That was my fear for Kuechly and to a smaller extent Greg Hardy. Now, with Beason coming back, Kuechly, Johnson, and Hardy can take that next step without having that fear.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 8:01 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


The kids very athletic and quick.... Just needs to get in better shape to sustain his level of play.... I mean he can dunk... Guys his size aren't supposed to be able to dunk....

 

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Posted: 4/27/2013 8:34 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 



BravesfanNChar wrote: The kids very athletic and quick.... Just needs to get in better shape to sustain his level of play.... I mean he can dunk... Guys his size aren't supposed to be able to dunk....
He is quick (when he actually plays) on the football field but I'm not impressed by side show type tricks.  Remember Jarron Gilbert jumping out of a pool a few years back.   Remember Kyle Boller throwing the ball 50 yards through the uprights from his knees.  Not trying to steal his thunder because he's got some athletic ability but I'm just very careful about guys who's stock improve because they can juggle oranges while singing the national anthem.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 8:58 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


The Good


- Natural Talent and ability
- I believe in Eric Washington (Panther's Defensive line coach)
- This kid is going to be surrounded by Studs.  Every starter on the defensive line is a Pro Bowler

The Bad

- He's the laziest defensive tackle I've seen drafted in a long time
- 70% of his tape is him getting beat by blocks, the rest is him showing what he could do when he's motivated.
- Gets absolutely destroyed by down blocks.  Not sure if its vision or what but he gets completely washed out on a HIGH percentage of down blocks.

Overall I understand this pick.  We wanted an aggressive 3 technique tackle, with some pass rush ability, to put in the rotation to take over for Edwards once he's done.  However, this was truly a boom or bust pick.
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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:21 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Im not sure hes an every down DT.  Im thinking he might be more of a run stuffer like 1st anjd 2nd downs.  I like the fact were addressing defense.  We lost more games with the lead last year than any team.  Now if we can plug up that hole in the middle with two big bodies on running downs we can stop some of that and get the couple extra wins to make the playoffs.  We went out and got 2 slot receivers in Ginn and the kid from giants. Ginn is also a special teamer with speed.    Maybe put a clause in his contract for playing time. ANd if hes standing around un motivated hes not gonna play, Therefore hes not gonna make as much money.  Nothing motivates a pro athlete like "MONEY".
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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:33 AM

RE: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 



Realguyjeff wrote:
BravesfanNChar wrote: The kids very athletic and quick.... Just needs to get in better shape to sustain his level of play.... I mean he can dunk... Guys his size aren't supposed to be able to dunk....
He is quick (when he actually plays) on the football field but I'm not impressed by side show type tricks.  Remember Jarron Gilbert jumping out of a pool a few years back.   Remember Kyle Boller throwing the ball 50 yards through the uprights from his knees.  Not trying to steal his thunder because he's got some athletic ability but I'm just very careful about guys who's stock improve because they can juggle oranges while singing the national anthem.

And there's nothing wrong with that view....  No way, right now, we can say who is right or wrong...  He was at Purdue, double teams and knew they were going no where....  Could be part of the laziness...  If he doesn't realize his potential here than it wouldn't of happened anywhere...  I hope he lives up to his vast potential.

I don't think they were going to take a DB there just to take one....  they obv iously didn't like anyone at 44....  Mathieu would've been nice but not at 44...  same goes for WR....  but I think we will draft Steadman Baily today..

 

Last edited 4/27/2013 9:36 AM by BravesfanNChar

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Posted: 4/27/2013 9:38 AM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


Can't edit my other post but baily was picked by St Louis.   .  Def missed that yesterday.......   Dang....

 

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Posted: 4/27/2013 10:41 AM

Re: Panther Draft KAWANN SHORT / DT Perdue 


I am not happy with this pick, I rather have drafted a starting CB. But it does make sense when you look at the drafting history of the Giants. They have always focused on a very very very strong defensive line. Linebackers and secondary has always been a last edit thing. Our linebacker core is great and we have a nasty defensive line. Maybe our young secondary will be able to make the necessary plays so we dont lose games.

I Don't Usually Punch My Teammates, But When I Do,
I Make Sure It's Ken Lucas.....

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