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Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame?

Posted: 9/28/2012 2:49 PM

Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (1 vote)


  The Hall of Fame candidates for this year have been released, and former Patriots quarterback Drew Bledsoe is eligible for induction. Though his name has often been forgotten in this town because of Tom Brady, it is a fact that Bledsoe had a very good, if not excellent, NFL career. He was far from perfect, and sometimes many remember him for making a bad throw as opposed to the many great ones that he did make. Here are some of Bledsoe's career stats and NFL rank all time:

Yards Passing: 44,611 ( 8th all time )
Passing TD'S: 251 ( 15th )
Pass Attempts: 6717 ( 6th )
Passes Completed: 3839 (6th)
Passes Intercepted: 206 (22nd)
Passer Rating: 77.1 ( 85th)
Passing Yards Per Game: 230 (18th)
Pass Attempts Per Game: 34.6 (2nd)
Passes Completed Per Game: 19.8 (11)
Passing Completion %: 57.2 (82nd)

  Yes, some of these numbers aren't that great. But some are. It is a wonder how good Bledsoe's numbers could have been if he didn't have many different coaches and offensive coordinators. Sure, those stats don't count in any Hall of Fame consideration, but it is interesting that his numbers could have been even better. And he has better numbers than some quarterbacks already in the Hall of Fame, like Joe Namath and Dan Fouts. 
  It is in my opinion that Bledsoe DOES in fact belong in the Pro Football Hall of Fame. His numbers back this up. Sure, he had his faults, but so does every other quarterback. I think too if Tom Brady, arguably one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time, does not replace him in Foxboro I think Bledsoe's numbers would be appreciated more. Opinions obviously will vary, but Drew Bledsoe clearly belongs in the Pro Football Hall of Fame.
 

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Posted: 9/28/2012 4:25 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Gotta think that over for awhile, - but I do agree with your take about having too many OC's & coaches. It HAS to have an effect on his career.
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Posted: 9/28/2012 4:54 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



Hunter07 wrote: Gotta think that over for awhile, - but I do agree with your take about having too many OC's & coaches. It HAS to have an effect on his career.
I think so too Hunter. Imagine if he had Parcells for longer than he did as opposed to Pete Carroll. Yeesh.
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  • DerekLarsson2
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Posted: 10/1/2012 2:33 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (3 votes)




Absolutely NOT.

If the Hall of Fame is going to mean anything, then it should be reserved for players that really stand out head and shoulders above their peers. 

And to be factual, Drew Bledsoe simply does not fit that description:


    • Drew Bledsoe's won-loss record was just 98 - 95.  A .500 won-loss record is an undistinguished level of performance.


    • Unlike the Bradys, the Mannings, the Rogers, the Montanas, etc. of the NFL, Bledsoe never won an MVP award (never even close), and never even won any single postseason game related MVP award.


    • Bledsoe never played well in any of the big games. He played very badly in his one Super Bowl appearance, throwing 4 Interceptions -- which was a record (negatively) at that time. He played badly in the AFC win against Jacksonville that preceeded it (defense and special teams scored the points). And he was responsible for just 1 TD in the 2001 AFC game (Troy brown, special teams, defense put up 20-points).


    • He threw a career 206 Interceptions, compared to 251 TDs, which is almost a 1-to-1  INT-to-TD ratio.  Most decent quarterbacks have at least a 1 - 2  INT-to-TD ratio, and Tom Brady has a better than 1 - 3  INT-to-TD ratio.   One year, Brady had 39 TDs and only 4 INTs for example, but Drew Bledsoe never, at any time ever played at that type of level.


    • Drew Bledose was the starting QB for three different teams, and Lost his Job on each one of them.  That doesn't fit the description of a true "Franchise QB", much less a "Hall-of-Fame" or legendary QB.


    • Finally, if you had one game to win and your choice of Quarterback was either Johnny Unitas, Terry Bradshaw, Tom Brady, Joe Montana, John Elway, Drew Brees, or Drew Bledsoe ...... no one would ever pick out Bledsoe among that company as the guy that you want to have.   Nobody!   ..  

 

 

Bledsoe simply does not belong in that type of category.

____

There are lots of decent to good QBs that aren't in the Hall-of-Fame.
But the Hall should be reserved for the genuine Legends





     

Last edited 10/3/2012 8:19 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 10/1/2012 2:37 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (1 vote)


I agree Derek - Patriots Hall of Fame....sure.  NFL Hall of Fame....really not even close.
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Posted: 10/3/2012 12:28 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Bledsoe was feared early in his career as a QB and really carried that Pats team for a few years. Yet I agree he falls short of the NFL Hall simply on win percentage.
It is the NFL...Not a knitting class.
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Posted: 10/3/2012 1:30 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (3 votes)




 
> "Bledsoe was feared early in his career as a QB and really carried that Pats team for a few years"

I always disagree with that myth.  The more accurate statement is: Bledsoe was hyped early in his career (by the Media), despite generally poor QB performance. 

People projected greatness on him, before he even did anything, just because he was a #1 draft pick.   But his turnover ratio was always unacceptably high (Interceptions).  His completion percentage was only in the 50s.  He had no pocket awareness or instincts, and so avoidable sacks and busted plays would mount up. He never threw the deep ball accurately.  He just didn't move the chains too much.

The Patriots Offense rarely scored in big numbers (by which I mean 30s or better). He never once had a season where his TD count exceeded the 20s. He never once had a season where his passer rating exceeded just the 80s (and it was often in the 70s).  These were average results, at best.

Hall-of-Fame running back Curtis Martin, and Ben Coates were the reasons why the Pats had some success, and I would argue that they were the true "super stars" who carried the Offense. 

For example, even in the year where they gave Bledsoe a pro bowl appearance, he threw 28 interceptions in that same year, his completion percentage was only in the 50s, and his passer rating was low. 

Had Belichick been the coach back in the early days instead of Bill Parcells (who was a more loyal person), Bledsoe may have well just been a journeyman QB in the NFL (which is where his career eventually headed anyway). 

There is a big difference between having a good arm, and being a good QB.  A lot of people would melt over Bledsoe's arm physically, and then just assume the rest-of-the QB portfolio was there too, but it really wasn't   (to be honest).
 

Last edited 10/9/2012 5:03 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 10/3/2012 4:54 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Bledsoe ranks fifth all-time in completions (3,839), seventh in passing yards (44,611), and 13th in touchdown passes (251). Bledsoe's career (57.2) completion percentage is lower than all recent Hall of Fame quarterbacks with the exception of John Elway. - Bledsoe's NFL career passer rating of (77.1) surpasses nine Hall of Fame Quarterbacks. - Bledsoe's 37 regular season 300-yard passing games ranks 9th in league history. He also ranks 6th (with 6) in most career regular season 400-yard passing games by NFL quarterback. He was selected to the Pro Bowl four times (in 1994, 1996, 1997, 2002). Bledsoe was eligible for the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 2011.

Last edited 10/3/2012 4:56 PM by Hunter07

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Posted: 10/3/2012 9:40 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (3 votes)




Okay, so let's then address these points:


> "Bledsoe's NFL career passer rating of (77.1) surpasses nine Hall of Fame Quarterbacks."

First of all, that is a very low passer rating in the modern era of the NFL.  This is not a rating that you want to brag about.  Even Mark Sanchez of the NY Jets, to take one example, had a higher passer rating than that of:   78.2   in 2011.  By your implication, then Mark Sanchez surpassed the Hall-of-Famer's as well?  I don't think so.

Now, the reason why some of the old-time Legends that are in the Hall-of-Fame indeed had a lower passing rating, was because the NFL rules and the game were much different then. The League didn't protect NFL QBs the way that they do in the modern era, and they would get really beaten up. The NFL playbooks were much simpler then, and based upon lower-percentage plays from a passing perspective  (the whole "west coast" passing game did not yet exist -- it hadn't been invented yet, and low-percentage plays like "the bomb" were also a more common occurrence).  In modern era, passing ratings across-the-board are higher, and completion percentages across-the-board are also higher. And the yardages are higher too, because the old NFL had only 14-game seasons.  So the Stats are different now.

But I guarantee you this, all of those those handful of Hall-of-Fame QBs with lower passing ratings were players of historical significance to the game -- and that's why they're there.

Bledsoe was not in any way a historical player or historical figure.  The Hall should be reserved for the Legends, and the historical figures that defined the game.
  


> "Bledsoe ranks fifth all-time in completions (3,839), seventh in passing yards (44,611), and 13th in touchdown passes (251).  Bledsoe's 37 regular season 300-yard passing games ranks 9th in league history...."

Okay, you're quoting longevity statistics here.  Longevity statistics are always misleading, because they only reflect how much a player played ... not how excellant they played. 

For example  -- yes, Bledsoe had 251 TDs,  but he also had 206 INTERCEPTIONS.  So his TD-to-INT ratio is poor -- almost a 1-to-1 ratio.  This is a high turnover rate. Most decent QBs have a 2-to-1 ratio.  And, as I pointed out before, Bledsoe never once ever led the League in TDs, and he never once even had one single year where his TDs for the season exceeded the 20s.  So if not even one year was great, then the total cannot be called "great".  If you play average/medicore for many years .. the grand totals may look good when you add them up, especially if you cherry-pick Stats, and only look at half the story

But the  year-by-year performance here was only avereage/mediocre each year, but with poor ball security and no NFL leading TD numbers to be found.

Bledsoe also threw many attempts in his games, often 40 pass-attempts or more. So yes, when you do that then your accumulated passing yards will be high, but it doesn't mean too much here -- if you did not put many points on the scoreboard, and had a pass-completion ratio that was only average (in the 50% range), and you also never made the "big play" at the critical moment in the game.  This is what we call empty statistics.  

    

> "He was selected to the Pro Bowl four times (in 1994, 1996, 1997, 2002)."

Right but in 1994, he threw for 28 Interceptions, and his completion percentage was only in the 50s, and his passer rating was unspectacular.  Probably his best year was 1997 (Pete Carrol's first year), when he got off to a good start -- but then he really faded down the stretch, and a team which had a lot of talent, and was supposed to win the Super Bowl just wilted away in the playoffs (with poor Offensive performance even though the Defense played well).

Secondly, lots of players make the "Pro Bowl".  Big deal.  Many of the players selected, don't even care enough about it to bother playing.  It would impress me a whole lot more here  if you could say:  "he won the MVP award some number of times (in 199x, 199y ... etc.)".  But you cannot say that about Bledsoe.

The facts are, as I pointed out before, Bledsoe never won any MVP award of any kind (not either a season MVP, and not a playoff-game MVP either).   He simply was not a great player.  A fair or mediocre player who is healthy enough to play a lot of games, and have a high number of pass attempts -- is going to necessarily acccumlate some numbers. 

Brett Favre has the craziest numbers of anybody (70,000 passing yards), but the truth is that Brett Favre only had a handful of excellant years, and a whole lot of mediocre years. 

But because Brett Favre did have some excellant years -- including an MVP year, and because he also won the Super Bowl (easily outperforming  Drew Bledsoe), he did then distinguish himself -- but Drew Bledsoe played poorly in his Super Bowl (and AFC games), and Bledsoe did not distinguish himself ever as a top QB, and the point again is that longevity statistics here alone do not equate to "greatness".

In order to be one-of-the-greats, you need to do great things, be memorable and stand above your peers, and have a level of consistent excellance.  Will anyone remember Drew Bledsoe 20 years from now?  For what?  Where was the greatness? What would the highlight film look like???   Being benched from three different teams, or his 4 Interceptions in his only Super Bowl-?   This just isn't greatness here.

_______

Finally, the Hall-of-Fame is not a popularity contest.  Baseball suffers from the same thing.  Mediocre players with .280 batting averages are put in the Hall-of-Fame just because they played a long time, and have some superficial "stat" that looks good in isolation.  I disagree with that whole mindset.

It diminishes the Babe Ruth's, the Johnny Unitas's, the Joe Montana's, the Michael Jordan's etc. -- the true Legends of the Sport --- if it is cluttered-up with every popular player to come along whether or not they ever did anything spectacular or not.

The Hall-of-Fame should be reserved for the true Legends of the game, including the rare individuals who shaped the Sport, and were the Sport's greatest of Champions

That's what it's all about.  That's the whole point. And that's the only reason to pay money to visit it.

Does Drew Bledsoe fit the description of one of the Sport's "greatest of Champions"?
Absolutely Not!

Case Closed.

Last edited 10/5/2012 7:56 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 10/4/2012 6:30 AM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


I personally don't give a rats rear whether Drew ends up in the HOF or not. - His numbers are not anything unusual for a QB in the HOF, - case closed. - I've watched the NFL since the Rams were in L.A. .... todays' game IS NOT the same game folks saw "back then". - One of the most called penalties was "piling on" - doesn't exist today. That was when a qb was down, often barely conscious, with about 8 guys already on him, - and a couple more "piled on" for the heck of it.  No face masks, or maybe one bar at most. - Quite common to see a team use two qb's in most games, - sometimes a third. It was tough for a qb to make it through a game uninjured. - In those days, a guy like Brady would be carried off on his shield by the end of the first quarter, - with his style of play his only records would be for broken bones.

Last edited 10/4/2012 6:43 AM by Hunter07

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Posted: 10/4/2012 1:04 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


If he'd won the Tuna Bowl, it'd be no debate.
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Posted: 10/4/2012 6:42 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



stealthdog666 wrote: I agree Derek - Patriots Hall of Fame....sure.  NFL Hall of Fame....really not even close.

Not even close Stealth? Really? If you want to say he isn't a Hall of Famer that's fine, but to say not even close is a bit of a stretch.
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Posted: 10/4/2012 6:45 PM

RE: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



Hunter07 wrote: Bledsoe ranks fifth all-time in completions (3,839), seventh in passing yards (44,611), and 13th in touchdown passes (251). Bledsoe's career (57.2) completion percentage is lower than all recent Hall of Fame quarterbacks with the exception of John Elway. - Bledsoe's NFL career passer rating of (77.1) surpasses nine Hall of Fame Quarterbacks. - Bledsoe's 37 regular season 300-yard passing games ranks 9th in league history. He also ranks 6th (with 6) in most career regular season 400-yard passing games by NFL quarterback. He was selected to the Pro Bowl four times (in 1994, 1996, 1997, 2002). Bledsoe was eligible for the Pro Football Hall of Fame in 2011.
Good work Hunter!
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Posted: 10/4/2012 7:32 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (2 votes)


Derek, Derek, Derek here we go again. I still cannot understand why you have so much hatred for Bledsoe. It is none of my business, but I don't think I have ever seen so much hatred for one person under any conditions. Geesh calm down. However, I knew it would come to this so I need to defend myself, especially since I started the post. I will take as many of your points and counter to the best of my ability. However, this will likely be my last response to you because, quite frankly, the argument is getting quite boring. We obviously need to agree to disagree.

A. Bledsoe had a career record of 98-95. While factually correct, it is a little unfair. Bledsoe was drafted in 1993, and the 1992 Patriots were one of the worst teams of all time. So, since he was on a terrible team, it is very unrealistic to expect Bledsoe to start wining 12 or 13 games right away. So that plays a part. Also, when he went to Buffalo, the Bills were 3-13 the year before, again a terrible team. So it was also very unrealistic to expect Drew to win 12-13 games every year. When he went to Dallas, the Cowboys were 6-10 the previous year. Not dreadful, but not good. Again, a little unfair to expect miracles from Bledsoe. These situations obviously played a negative part in Drew's record. So, yes the 98-95 is statistically correct, but quite skewed when the bigger picture is portrayed.

B. He never won an MVP or post season award. Really, who cares.

C. You say Drew played very badly in the postseason. Yes, his numbers don't look great, but he actually has a better postseason winning % better than Dan Marino, Warren Moon or Dan Fouts. You say he was terrible in the Super Bowl. Not really. The Patriots were winning the game late into the second quarter because of Bledsoe's two TD passes. Yes, he ended up with four INT's, but the last one was absolute garbage time. You and I both know the Patriots lost that game because of special teams. The Jacksonville game? Not great, but terrible is a real stretch. The Pittsburgh game? I think it must have been awfully tough for Bledsoe to be great since he had been sitting on the bench for three months prior to going into the game. Let us not forget, he also threw a bomb that David Patten dropped. If Patten catches that, the game wouldn't have been that close.

D. Yes, his TD to INT ratio isn't great, but compared to other QB'S it isn't that bad. By the way, your hero, Terry Bradshaw, had 212 TD's to 210 INT's, a much worse %.

E. Yes, Bledsoe played for three different teams, but who cares really. He was only let go from the Patriots because of Brady ( and I am willing to bet he stayed on as QB if Brady wasn't there ), and he was replaced in Buffalo because of money. JP Losman? Really? He was terrible. And Tony Romo in Dallas? Don't even go there. So playing for three teams really is irrelevant.

F. One game to win is a flawed argument too, because you are comparing Drew with some of the ALL TIME greats ( except for Bradshaw) which really isn't fair. Drew had 24 4th quarter comebacks in his career, and 31 game winning drives. Not too shabby. And your hero, Terry Bradshaw, only had 19 and 27 respectively. So I am note sure your argument holds any water there either.

G. Curtis Martin and Ben Coates were the stars of the Patriots offense? Really? Is it me or does Coates need someone to throw him the ball? This is like saying Jerry Rice was the star of the 49ers even though Montana was throwing him the ball. It makes no sense. Curtis Martin was a star I will give you that. But let me say that MOST QB'S in the league need a good RB to help them win. Name ONE ( just one ) good RB that Bledsoe had for the Patriots after Martin left. I will give you a hint...there isn't one. So because of that, Bledsoe had to do most of the offense by himself. You don't believe me? Ask Charlie Weis, who said in his book that the team expected Drew to win EVERY game for them. And more often than not, he did. Weis also said that the team asked every player to step up their game once Bledsoe went down. Obviously they did. And by the way, Ben Coates DEMANDED the ball on EVERY single play. That didn't make it easier for Bledsoe either.

H. He can't throw the ball deep. That is just stupid.
I. He would have been a journeyman QB if he didn't have Parcells. Again, more stupidity. Bledsoe brought the worst team in the NFL to the Super Bowl in three years, something that I don't believe has been done before. So don't tell me he had NOTHING to do with it. He had set many team and NFL records when he played ( for Buffalo too ) so he must have done something right.

J. You keep comparing Bledsoe to many of the all time greats, which isn't fair. He has better stats in EVERY category than your hero Terry Bradshaw. Yes, Bradshaw has the Super Bowl wins, but it had to do a lot more with the Steelers Steel Curtain defense than anything else. Bradshaw was good, but really just along for the ride. Remmeber Trent Dilfer? Enough said. Dan Marino, Jim Kelly, Warren Moon and Dan Fouts never won a Super Bowl either so I guess that means they don't belong in the Hall of Fame.

We will agree to disagree. I think Bledsoe deserves to be in the HOF. Many don't, and that is fine. The numbers are there, and that is an indisputable fact. Longevity or not, it doesn't matter. Bledsoe retired relatively young at 35. His numbers would have been better if he played a couple of more years. You or anybody else cannot deny the numbers. Continue to make excuses as you wish. Most of them don't make any sense. But Bledsoe's numbers do.
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Posted: 10/4/2012 8:06 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


  • His 4,452 pass attempts in his first eight seasons rank second to Brett Favre whose 4,456 attempts are the most by a quarterback during any eight-year period in NFL history
  • Prior to 1994, the Patriots' single-season record for passing yards was 3,465 yards. Bledsoe eclipsed that mark six consecutive seasons.
  • At the age of 22, he became the youngest quarterback in NFL history to play in the Pro Bowl.
  • Bledsoe is the only QB in NFL history with 4 seasons of 600+ pass attempts, including 3 straight from 1994–96
  • Led 31 career 4th quarter/OT game-winning drives and holds the record for most TD passes in overtime with 4.
  • Bledsoe was durable during his career, playing in 126 of his first 132 games since entering the league in 1993, and never missing a start after leaving NE until benched in 2006.
  • In 1994, he set Patriots franchise single-season passing records for attempts (691), completions (400) and yards passing (4,555; surpassed by Tom Brady in 2007).
  • In 1998, he directed the Patriots to the playoffs for the fourth time in six seasons.
  • 4-3 record in post-season
  • 2-0 in AFC Championship games (in last Patriots appearance came off bench for injured Brady to win at Pittsburgh January 2002)
  • 1 Super Bowl Championship (2001, New England Patriots) (If it weren't for Bledsoe, the Patriots don't win 3 Super Bowls, they'd be 2-4 instead of 3-5)
  • He passed for 3,291 yards in 2000, his seventh consecutive season with at least 3,000 yards passing.
  • At the age of 23, he became the youngest player in NFL history to surpass the 10,000-yard passing plateau when he connected with Ben Coates on a 6-yard completion just before the half vs. the Jets (12/10/95).
The time has come and gone, Here's to the 2014 Season.

Last edited 10/4/2012 8:20 PM by Division

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Posted: 10/4/2012 9:42 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


As has been pointed out, he does compare favorably with a number of current HOF'ers statistically.  However, even though I have always been a big Bledsoe fan, I don't really think he should be in the HOF.  I actually believe there are quite a few players that are in the HOF who don't deserve it, and that includes a number of QB's who played during Bledsoe's career.  I just think the standard has been lowered quite a bit over the last couple decades. 

To me a Hall of Fame player is one who is among the best ever to play.  Someone who not only is considered one of the best while he played, not only someone who is remembered 5 or 10 or 15 years after they have retired, but I think it's someone who is one of the legends of the game that people 30 years from now who never came close to seeing him play, will know about the guy's great career.  That, to me, is what a Hall of Famer should be.

In that context, I don't believe guys like Warren Moon and Jim Kelly should be in the HOF.  Nor do I believe WR's like Michael Irvin or Tim Brown (a finalist this year) belong there.  These guys had good statistical careers.  But they weren't any better than half a dozen or more players at their position that played at the same time they did.  And how Dan Hampton from the Bears ever made the HOF still baffles me.  He was only the fifth or sixth best player on his own defense.  I would consider Bledsoe similar to these types of players.  Maybe my standards for the HOF are too high, but I just feel like it dilutes the credibility of a "hall of fame" when you induct everyone who ever had an above average statistical career.
**
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  • DerekLarsson2
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Posted: 10/5/2012 1:33 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (3 votes)




> "You keep comparing Bledsoe to many of the all time greats, which isn't fair."
   
It is completely fair, if you wish to  place him  right with the all-time greats (which is what the Hall-of-Fame is all about).  


> "He never won an MVP or post season award. Really, who cares."

But that would be one clear measurement and proof of a player who played the game at the top level, which is the whole objective.   If Larry Bird never in his life played well-enough to win MVP awards, and somebody else excelled instead and won them -- then Bird would no longer have been that top guy and that #1 type-of-player that we all remember.  You cannot both be one-of-the-greats, and then yet fail to have even one single season where you distinguished yourself from your peers as a top player.  I always thought that putting Jim Rice in the HOF was a weak (and at best a borderline) case.  But at least he did have 1 MVP season.  Bledsoe never did.


> "I still cannot understand why you have so much hatred for Bledsoe."

I don't.  I think he is a nice guy personally, and he was a popular player with the fans.  But I just do not buy into all the hype written about Bledsoe, and I feel the points that I have already made demonstrate why the HOF criteria is clearly not met in his case.

Bledsoe was a #1 draft pick, and then just 2 years later Peyton Manning was a #1 draft pick. Now look at the huge, huge, huge difference between their levels of performance and abilities.  This illustrates my point very clearly.  One of them has indeed had an ellite career (Manning), and the other one (Bledsoe) is clearly not anywhere close to that level of play.  Bledsoe's on-field performance was never at an ellite level.  He was never a 'Peyton Manning' (or a Tom Brady).  While I don't 'hate' anybody, I will say that I was never impressed with his turn-over oriented (and terrible pocket-awareness) style of on-field play, and he never played ... large ... in the big, important games (Playoffs).


>  "You and I both know the Patriots lost that game because of special teams."

Wrong. That's another myth, which is totally untrue, and which also proves my point.  When Desmond Howard had the kickoff runback, there was still the entire 4th-Quarter of the game still left to play.  They were only down by 9 points or something, with a whole quarter of Football still left to go. There was plenty of time to make several scoring drives.  It is commonplace to see Tom Brady make mulitple scoring drives in a single quarter.   Now, would Tom Brady in that situation just fold-up like a wilted flower, or would we see a real down-to-the-wire battle to the finish?  What about Johnny Unitas?  What about even ....Terry Bradshaw?

So it is precisely these critical moments of games that define the player. Can they bring the team back? Can they make the big play when they need it the most?  Will some spectacular play be made? But under Bledsoe the Patriots Offense just wilted away throughout the whole 4th-Quarter without a fight. Neither the special teams, nor the defense played great, but clearly the Offense also did not play great either.  At some point, a so-called "great quarterback" has to do really great things.  But Bledsoe never did.  There was no moment of "greatness" in his career.  What was the legendary moment that you would put on his highlight film?  I can't think of any.

  
> "Yes, Bledsoe played for three different teams, but who cares really."

The point is that Bledsoe was unable to fulfill even the role of the position of starting QB, for three different teams.  So how can he then be considered "one-of-the-greats"?  It makes no sense.

And it does not matter who followed him (Loseman, Romo, etc.) or whether they were just as bad or not.  The point is, in Buffalo there was disatisfaction with his QB play. In Dallas, even the very loyal Bill Parcells had to finally bend into the pressure to bench Bledsoe because of poor QB play.  In 1997 (Pete Carroll's first year), The Patriots were predicted to win the Super Bowl by many people,  and they had the talent, but the Offense was a washout in the playoffs (despite the Defense playing great), and Bledsoe failed to lead there as well.  He was never a "winner".  He never made big plays in big games.   There were plenty of Interceptions, and plenty of deer-in-the-headlights reactions by him in the clutch. But there was no Brady-esque or Montana-esque or Unitas-esque "greatness" going on here.  


   
> "Curtis Martin and Ben Coates were the stars of the Patriots offense? Really?"

Yes, Curtis was a genuine NFL-leading Hall-of-Famer, who did carry the Offense.  Go look at the entire 2nd-half of the 1997 Super Bowl, and the only time the Patriots ever moved the ball was when Curtis Martin ran, and ran his butt off.  He ran for 200-yards all by himself in one of their other playoff games that year (clearly the Star of the Offense).   And there was never a debate about Martin belonging to the HOF, which also makes my point.  He was dominant, and so consistently good.

Homework assignment:  How many times did a Bledsoe-run offense ever put up 30 or more passing points?  (not counting the special teams points, or defensive points). The answer is:  Not many, and zero in any of his Playoff games.

So where was the greatness
How is this a "Legendary" player?
___

Finally, let me put it to you this way:  Numbers, whatever they are, don't make greatness.

Moments make greateness.
Being the #1 performer makes greatness
(yes MVPs).
Leadership makes greatness
(the intangibles).

All the other QBs in the HOF had their shinning and defining moments.

In the end, all we have are the memories.  I'll remember Tom Brady, and all the special things that he did, and how many times he did them again and again...to produce victory when defeat had seemed certain. 

That's the kind of thing, we're looking for here -- the Legendary players and the Legendary moments  ---  not a few cherry-picked longevity "numbers", from somebody ... with only just a .500 won-loss record, a low completion rate (50s), a High Interception Rate, who had cement feet in the pocket, who was benched by three different teams for unsatisfying performance, and who never played real strong ....in the big games.

"You are ... what you are"   -- Bill Parcells
"It is ... what it is"    -- Bill Belichick 

Last edited 10/5/2012 10:44 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 10/9/2012 9:57 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (2 votes)


Drew absolutely belongs in Canton. He's had a career similar to Kelly, Foutse and Moon. He was more successful in the post-season than Moon or Fouts If he ended playing 2 more seasons, he would have had more yards than Elway and probably just as many TDs. He took 3 teams from the dumps and made them competitive. He has a winning record in both regular and postseason , with 2 Conference championships. He threw the only passing TD to that point. in that postseason , which by no coincidence was the same TD Brady threw in the Superbowl to Patten . Bledsoe has a hall of fame career . Is he Brady? No, but he is a hall of famer.
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Posted: 10/10/2012 2:05 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


I think as stated above and by others that a case can def. be made he is worthy of consideration for the HOF.
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Posted: 10/10/2012 2:43 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


As much as all Pats fans love Drew Bledsoe, Im not sure if he will make it into the HOF.
Its an honor to even be discussed for inclusion but,,,,  I don't know,  I'm leaning away from selecting.  Drew was a team guy and a very good player but he also was a system guy.  Tuna got the most out of him I think and even then I would have to hesitate.
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Posted: 10/10/2012 8:53 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (4 votes)




 
Drew Brees
may be worthy of consideration, but Drew Bledsoe....No way, not even close.

Come on folks:


. In the modern age of the pass-oriented NFL, he (Bledsoe) had an embarassingly bad QB-Rating (70s) which doesn't even pass the sniff test, a low completion-percentage (50s), and an unacceptably high Interception-rate (206).  As pointed out earlier, Bledsoe had a nearly one-to-one Interception-to-TD ratio which was his downfall.  

. He was benched from three different teams for inadequate QB play, and lost his job to backups because of it.  If you're truthfully really one-of-the-greats of all-time,   then you don't get outplayed  by the other players in the League.......much less the backups on your own team.  This just does not fit the definition of a #1 performer (i.e. "greatness").

. He was a completely one-dimensional, mistake-prone QB, who held the ball too long (or lost it), had cement-feet, slow decision-making ability, and always looked straight at his primary receiver (and patted the ball in the same direction) before he would throw it. His game was a simple game with no surprise, no invention, or artfullness (and which fooled nobody).

While the great QBs are out there on the field playing a game of Chess (and winning it), Bledose could only play a game of checkers.  And the result was just a disappointing, very mediocre/average:  .500 won-loss record (despite having the blessing of 2 HOF Legendary Coaches).   
 
. He never had one season where he was the MVP, and he never had one post-season game where he was the best performer of the game.   Yet you're going now claim that he was one of the greatest ever to live, and place his name right along side the Legends of all-time ???    For what???  

This just simply makes no sense at all.

___

Come on folks.....The Hall-of-Fame is not a popularity contest, nor is it about the few empty, meaningless  longevity stats ... like pass-attempts (which prove nothing), or raw yardage (which prove nothing).

It is about being a model of excellance, and being the #1 performer on the field, and being a true champion that all others look-up to at critical moments of the game, and about being one of the Legends of the game. 

Bledsoe was a #1 draft pick, and then 2 years later Peyton Manning was a #1 draft pick.  One guy did live up to the hype, and one did not - and is not in that lofty category. One guy was a true Franchise QB who drives Defenses crazy, and the other guy failed to hold his job for three different teams, lost his job to backup players each time, and never played well in the clutch.

Last edited 10/10/2012 10:20 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 10/10/2012 9:26 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


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Posted: 5/16/2013 12:13 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Drew Bledsoe - Hall of Fame?  Absolutely & this is why:

I mean no disrespect to the following named player for he had a great career.  Warren Moon is in the Hall of Fame.  If you compare stats, it's hard to deny Drew a place in the Hall.

                                                   Warren           Drew        
Yards Passing:                               49,325          44,611
Passing TD'S:                                     291               251
Pass Attempts:                                 6823             6717
Passes Completed:                           3988             3839
Passes Intercepted:                            233              206  
Passer Rating:                                      80.9            77.1
Passing Yards Per Game:                     237.1          230
Pass Attempts Per Game:                     32.8             34.6
Passes Completed Per Game:                19.1            19.8
Passing Completion %:                         58.4            57.2
Playoff Record                                   3 - 7            3 - 3
Wins vs Losses                               102 - 101      98 - 95
SuperBowl Appearances                         0                 1

Warren played 3 more years than Drew so his totals are a little more but not much.  The yards passing is the biggest spread but when you're comparing 49,000 to 44,000, 5,000 is not enough to say the Warren should but Drew should not.

To say that Drew should not you would almost have to say that Warren should not as well.  It's hard to argue with the numbers.
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Posted: 5/16/2013 12:54 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (1 vote)


Bledsoe's numbers look an awful lot like Vinny Testaverde's

Drew:

Yards Passing: 44,611 ( 8th all time )
Passing TD'S: 251 ( 15th )
Pass Attempts: 6717 ( 6th )
Passes Completed: 3839 (6th)
Passes Intercepted: 206 (22nd) 
Passer Rating: 77.1 ( 85th) 
Passing Yards Per Game: 230 (18th)
Pass Attempts Per Game: 34.6 (2nd)
Passes Completed Per Game: 19.8 (11) 
Passing Completion %: 57.2 (82nd)

Vinny:

Yards Passing: 46,233 ( 7th all time )
Passing TD'S: 275 ( 10th )
Pass Attempts: 6701 ( 7th )
Passes Completed: 3787 (9th)
Passes Intercepted: 267 (4th) 
Passer Rating: 75.0 ( 107th) 
Passing Yards Per Game: 198.4 (47th)
Pass Attempts Per Game: 28.8 (46th)
Passes Completed Per Game: 16.3 (54) 
Passing Completion %: 56.5 (102nd)



Last edited 5/16/2013 12:58 PM by MachinaVerde

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Posted: 5/16/2013 1:23 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (1 vote)


If you go to football reference and see whose career numbers his compare to you will see the likes of

Terry Bradshaw, Jim Kelly, Len Dawson, Bob Griese, Phil Simms and Ken Stabler

I like him but am not sure if he belongs. It is sort of like  Dale Murphy in baseball, he was really good but is he HOF good? I think you could argue for both sides
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Posted: 5/16/2013 1:32 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



Gronktastic wrote: 

I like him but am not sure if he belongs. It is sort of like  Dale Murphy in baseball, he was really good but is he HOF good? I think you could argue for both sides
agreed

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Posted: 5/17/2013 8:49 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Here's two cents worth.  The only reason there is a Bledsoe HOF thread on this site at all is because he played as a patriot.    Few football fans elsewhere in the nation would put him in the HOF.  

I was never a big Bledsoe fan.  Sure he had some good games but was he ever dominant in the league.  Sadly if we're honest, ya have to say No.  He rose above average in many of the stats that Hunter put up but I don't feel he could have got there on his own.  He needed the intimidating coaching style of a guy like Parcells.  He needed to be pushed towards a higher level of play.  The great ones like Brady and Wilfork push themselves to that next level.
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Posted: 5/17/2013 12:30 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Drew had definite skills, but he was never really "The Guy." There were a few clutch games, but I never felt he could produce real magic on a consistent basis the way Brady or Manning The Elder can.
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Posted: 5/17/2013 3:43 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Even though he wasn't great to me I think he inspired the Krafts to be great. He helped give them a taste of the big time and made the transition to Brady a special one that Brady brags about to this day. I wouldn't of liked our chances in the second half of that game against Pittsburgh to start out this so-called Dynastic run without Drew. He was a valuable building block for what we have now.
Patriot Hall Of Fame....;-)
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Posted: 5/18/2013 7:32 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Bledsoe won't make it to the HOF. He had many great moments in his career, but he didn't win enough games or make enough big plays to be regarded as elite. I agree that if he had beaten the Packers in the SB, it would be different.
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Posted: 5/18/2013 8:24 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Revive old threads much?? 

Oh well, gives us something to talk about I guess.

I'm pretty sure I expressed my thoughts on the Drew Bledsoe HOF subject, and on the HOF in general, way back when this thread was active.

But to keep the discussion going I think there are two ways to look at it.  

I was a big Bledsoe fan and even I don't think he belongs in the Hall.  He may compare very well statistically with others who are in the HOF, but I sincerely believe that there are a lot of players in the HOF who don't belong there.  I see someone compared him to Moon a few posts back.  I don't think Moon belongs in the HOF.  Sure he put up big numbers.  But that's all he did.  He didn't win a SB either.  So that's the first way to look at it.  Stats alone shouldn't put a guy in the Hall.  

But the second way to look at it is this.  If guys like Warren Moon and such are in the Hall just because of stats, and if Bledsoe has similar stats to those guys, then why shouldn't Drew go in?  What's the criteria?  If it's simply having X career yards passing and Y career TD's, etc, then sure.  Bledsoe belongs in there with all the guys who have the same stat line he does.
**
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Posted: 8/5/2013 3:26 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? Post Rating (2 votes)


Drew Bledsoe should clearly be in the HOF without a question.
Have you ever heard of the house that Ruth built? "Yankee Stadium"
All you HATER PATRIOTS FANS get to go to the House that Drew Built. "Gillette Stadium"Before we had him as a QB we couldn't beat a High School Team. 1992 Starting QB Hugh Millen - a joke! Before that, worse. The last REAL QB we had was Steve Grogan. If anybody out there can remember him. I've had season tickets since 1984, Drew Bledsoe was the BEST thing to happen to this team since Porta Potties at Foxboro Stadium! Anybody who thinks Tom Brady is better than him just because of numbers and trophies is on drugs. Mr. Kraft wouldn't have his shiny new stadium and brand new parking lots where he now can charge everyone extra money - if it wasn't for Drew Bledsoe whose stats and his CLASS should alone send him to the HOF.
All you haters that forget what it means to lose in New England, because Drew changed the whole atmosphere in Patriot Nation, not Tom Brady. Brady got lucky in
2001 and Bledsoe helped him to win the Super Bowl that year. Bledsoe could have been a major distraction but he took the high road, unlike 99% of the players in the league, and helped his team win the Super Bowl. Again, his stats alone should put him in the HOF, not to mention Mr. Kraft letting Bill Parcells go to the Jets because he had to get in a pissing contest with him. Then, hiring Pete Carroll, who couldn't coach a pee wee football team. It was an utter joke to watch that team. Mr. Kraft does not know anything about the game, he is an owner and owners should stay in the owners box just like Bill Parcells said. I will leave it here, Drew Bledsoe led the worst team in the NFL from LAST PLACE to THE SUPER BOWL IN THREE YEARS. IT'S NEVER BEEN DONE BEFORE OR SINCE BY ANY OTHER PLAYER. It is now time to give this man his due.
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Posted: 8/5/2013 3:35 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


Please tell me you are not arguing that Drew Bledsoe is better than Brady. If so you are beyond crazy!!

Look I like DB(as demonstrated in this threads) but he is not even in the same  breath as Brady
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Posted: 8/5/2013 8:58 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



> "...go to the House that Drew Built "Gillette Stadium".....


Oh lord, This is just more phony, dishonest, myth-making.  

And to compare a mistake-prone, bumbling QB like Bledsoe to the great legend of Babe Ruth (perhaps the greatest Sports figure in all of History) is both laughably pathetic, and really downright offensive to any thinking person. 

Gillette Stadium is the House that Mr. Money man Robert Kraft and coach Bill Parcells built.   

Yes Bill Parcells.  For it was Bill Parcells (Hall-of-Fame Coach) who took over this struggling, disgraced, and confused franchise at a time when it had no personnel, no respect, and no infrastructure.  Bill Parcells instantly gave the franchise credibility, and he put into place an across-the-board organizational makeover, and made The Patriots a properly-run, disciplined, well-prepared Football franchise.

Now Bill Parcells was given the keys to The Patriots by James Orthwein.  Businessman Robert Kraft never would have never bothered to look to buy the team, had it not been for that critical anchor already being available and in place, and Bill Parcells putting The Patriots on the map.  So without Bill Parcells, there would be no Robert Kraft-era here at all.

And please.....Drew Bledose, rejected by 3 different teams as a starting QB,  did not lead anything at all.  

There was never even one single Playoff Game, or Super-Bowl game in his career where Drew Bledsoe actually carried the Team, or even played very well.  

. In 1996-7 when The Patriots won against Pittsburg, Curtis Martin ran for over 200-yards and had 3 or 4 TDs.  That game was all Curtis Martin.  

. When they won against Jacksonville, Drew Bledsoe did absolutely nothing and it was the Defense forced turnovers and scored or setup all their points (for the inept QB). Bledsoe was a liability and scored 0 points.
 
. And when Bledose played in his only Super Bowl, he chucked-up 4 INTs and just wilted away without a fight all throughout the whole 4th Quarter of the game.

And that was his so-called "best" season.  Yikkes!  
(Come on, even Tim Tebow would have been more effective in those games than Bledsoe ever was).

Surrounded by great talent most of his life (Curtis Martin, Ben Coates, Terry Glenn, David Meggett, Keith Byers, etc.), Bledsoe could still never score any points.  The Patriot Teams from 1996-1999 all had the talent level to be Championship teams.  But the Bledsoe-run Offense would always be the weak link and be embarassingly bad and fail in the clutch.  

Bledsoe even lost one Playoff game to Pittsburg by a score of 7 -6!!  Talk about an inept Offense.   Two field goals isn't even respectable much less Hall-of-Fame material.

And then, of course, his playing became so bad that the Team compiled a 5 - 13 won-loss record with Bill Belichick as the coach.  The coaching staff is on record as publicly saying that backup QB Tom Brady was outperforming Bledsoe even before the injury. The injury was a wonderful gift from above.  Tom Brady then took that same team and went 14 -3 the rest of the season, and showed everybody what a real QB looks like.

One guy was a winner, and one guy never, never was.

    
   

Last edited 8/5/2013 9:19 PM by DerekLarsson2

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Posted: 8/6/2013 12:11 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 



---------------------------------------------
--- dokgonzo wrote:



---------------------------------------------

Bump
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Posted: 8/6/2013 8:07 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


LOL
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Posted: 8/6/2013 8:07 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


I'd comment on this but I'm busy looking for another year old thread to bump up.
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Posted: 8/6/2013 8:57 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


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Posted: 8/6/2013 11:45 PM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


What the hell movie is that animation from?
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Posted: 8/7/2013 8:08 AM

Re: Drew Bledsoe Hall of Fame? 


I think it was from the Wendy's commercial
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