Free Trial Ad
Why Subscribe?
  • Player/Prospect News
  • Exclusive Insider Info
  • Members-Only Forums
  • Exclusive Videos
  • Subscribe Now!
InboxChat RoomChat Room (0 fans in chatroom)
Reply to TopicPost New Topic
  Page of 2  Next >

Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking offense

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:16 PM

Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking offense 


Every loss is a team loss.  There is no I in team, blah blah blah.

But so many people I've seen are talking offense after this loss.  Really?   a 28 point game ON THE ROAD and we're faulting the offense?

This defense just gave up game winning drives to Kirk Cousins and Charlie Batch in back to back weeks.

28 points is supposed to get the Job done.  This defense HAS to be able to make a stop when one is needed.

Can Flacco improve?   Certainly.   Can Cam call a better game?   Certainly.   But 28 points on the road is a good outing, and this defense has to do better when the game is on the line.   This is seriously becomming concerning.  I think Paul Kruger and Cary Williams might be your best 2 players on the field right now on defense - that is scary.

Reply | Quote
  • BMann
  • Raven Veteran
  • 4187 posts this site

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:20 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


You bury the opposition 85 yards (and a 2-point conversion) from the tying score with under 5 minutes to play, you must win that game.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:22 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



BMann wrote: You bury the opposition 85 yards (and a 2-point conversion) from the tying score with under 5 minutes to play, you must win that game.
Especially once the starting QB limps off the field.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:23 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


And not one time did you mention "turnovers"

How many did Cousins and Rg3 committ??

yea..my point exactly. You DONT TURNOVER THE BALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ON THE ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. What is so hard to understand??? With a very weak defense you DO NOT turnover the ball and put them back out on the field to be exposed more than they have to be. On top of that HOW MANY 3 and outs did they have???

25th ranked defense, you give them enough cushion by making it a multiple possession game by SCORING in the redzone. Period.
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:24 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


Those Redskin receivers were WIDE open in the game.  WIDE open.  It was funny because Gannon said at this level receivers don't get wide open.  And the defense couldn't stop them when it counted.  Plus the special teams let down in overtime didn't help the cause.  We really need to get some pass rushers for next year.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:27 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


Exactly a TEAM loss. Everybody contributed. COACHES were bad, Cam was probably the best. Defense was bad. If your name isn't Anquan Boldin, Rice or Peirce I don't think you can be very happy with how you played.

Joe Flacco is the QB. He will get dissected moreso than any other player on the team because he' the QB. If you don't think he has culpability, and a significant share, I can't help you. The dude has NO pocket or situation awareness.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:28 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



theravenkidd wrote: And not one time did you mention "turnovers"

How many did Cousins and Rg3 committ??

yea..my point exactly. You DONT TURNOVER THE BALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ON THE ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. What is so hard to understand??? With a very weak defense you DO NOT turnover the ball and put them back out on the field to be exposed more than they have to be. On top of that HOW MANY 3 and outs did they have???

25th ranked defense, you give them enough cushion by making it a multiple possession game by SCORING in the redzone. Period.
You really come unglued after the Ravens lose, settle down a bit.

Anyways, I'm trying to understand your logic.  Any defense in the league should be able to hold an 8 point lead against a second stringer coming off the bench with under 2 minutes to go.  It seems to me that you don't think the defense should be held accountable, because they aren't a great defense.  Is that correct?
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:29 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



dobermangang wrote: Those Redskin receivers were WIDE open in the game.  WIDE open.  It was funny because Gannon said at this level receivers don't get wide open.  And the defense couldn't stop them when it counted.  Plus the special teams let down in overtime didn't help the cause.  We really need to get some pass rushers for next year.
Ive been saying it for the last few weeks now, Hamilton needs to play, i dont care if he isnt a "complete" player, eff that. If he can rush the passer and bring some heat, play him.
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:32 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



RchmondRvnsFan wrote:
theravenkidd wrote: And not one time did you mention "turnovers"

How many did Cousins and Rg3 committ??

yea..my point exactly. You DONT TURNOVER THE BALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ON THE ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. What is so hard to understand??? With a very weak defense you DO NOT turnover the ball and put them back out on the field to be exposed more than they have to be. On top of that HOW MANY 3 and outs did they have???

25th ranked defense, you give them enough cushion by making it a multiple possession game by SCORING in the redzone. Period.
You really come unglued after the Ravens lose, settle down a bit.

Anyways, I'm trying to understand your logic.  Any defense in the league should be able to hold an 8 point lead against a second stringer coming off the bench with under 2 minutes to go.  It seems to me that you don't think the defense should be held accountable, because they aren't a great defense.  Is that correct?
Im trying to understand YOUR logic. So you're saying an NFL QB with TIME shouldnt be able to move the ball downfield against ANY defense??? Especially one LACKING in the pass rush department....is that correct???

Are you relieving the "elite" Qb & the offense he is suppose to lead from criticism??? The same "elite" qb that has the ball over twice in the last two games????? Am i understanding that correctly???
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:36 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



theravenkidd wrote:
RchmondRvnsFan wrote:
theravenkidd wrote: And not one time did you mention "turnovers"

How many did Cousins and Rg3 committ??

yea..my point exactly. You DONT TURNOVER THE BALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ON THE ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. What is so hard to understand??? With a very weak defense you DO NOT turnover the ball and put them back out on the field to be exposed more than they have to be. On top of that HOW MANY 3 and outs did they have???

25th ranked defense, you give them enough cushion by making it a multiple possession game by SCORING in the redzone. Period.
You really come unglued after the Ravens lose, settle down a bit.

Anyways, I'm trying to understand your logic.  Any defense in the league should be able to hold an 8 point lead against a second stringer coming off the bench with under 2 minutes to go.  It seems to me that you don't think the defense should be held accountable, because they aren't a great defense.  Is that correct?
Im trying to understand YOUR logic. So you're saying an NFL QB with TIME shouldnt be able to move the ball downfield against ANY defense??? Especially one LACKING in the pass rush department....is that correct???

Are you relieving the "elite" Qb & the offense he is suppose to lead from criticism??? The same "elite" qb that has the ball over twice in the last two games????? Am i understanding that correctly???
The offense did all of what you said, this wasn't one of those games where they didn't score.  If you read my other posts you'll see that I haven't made excuses for the way Joe played in the 3rd quarter and most of the 4th.  I don't think I've ever called Joe elite either, so I'm not sure what that's all about.  Anyways, can you answer my question please, I'm seriously trying to understand where you're coming from.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:46 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


The defense did what it could to make this game "close", its up to the "offense", you know the unit with the "elite" QB & top 5 Quarterback, to "protect" the ball first and foremost, extend drives, & keep its weak counterpart OFF the field.

i mean, is this a foreign language im speaking???? If you're on the road you dont expose your weak defense, ESPECIALLY if you have the talent on offense. And even IF the talent was HORRIBLE on offense (which, i would think majority agree thats not the case) a "Top 5" Qb is suppose to make everyone around him better, put his foot on the pedal, and make plays when hes in the redzone against A HORRIBLE SECONDARY.

i mean we're not talking Pittsburgh here, we're talking about a secondary thats worse than ours, is arguably much worse than its counterpart in New Orleans, and yet, 2 drives stalled because he doesnt have a clock in his head, and allowed to costly turnovers but yea, this is on the defense for allowing Kirk Cousins a late score, playing without their stars & already hurt in the pass rush department. But i digress.
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:51 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


The point is, this teams problem is the defense for the most part, with Suggs being hurt.

Ed Reed is invisible.  The only person in the secondary making plays is Cary Williams, which is HILARIOUS because I think we all had him buried on the depth chart as #3

These LBs are so attrocious right now that Ray coming back will be a HUGE boost, both mentally and physically.  And I can't believe I'm saying that because I'm not sure Ray has much left physically.

Ravens fans need to stop giving this defense a pass.  And I put that less on Pees, and more on the players on the field who need to show some pride (Ed Reed), and on the GM for a lack of depth at LB behind Ray Ray.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:55 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



ClericBlackDave wrote:

The point is, this teams problem is the defense for the most part, with Suggs being hurt.

Ed Reed is invisible.  The only person in the secondary making plays is Cary Williams, which is HILARIOUS because I think we all had him buried on the depth chart as #3

These LBs are so attrocious right now that Ray coming back will be a HUGE boost, both mentally and physically.  And I can't believe I'm saying that because I'm not sure Ray has much left physically.

Ravens fans need to stop giving this defense a pass.  And I put that less on Pees, and more on the players on the field who need to show some pride (Ed Reed), and on the GM for a lack of depth at LB behind Ray Ray.

Yea blame the GM for neglecting the lb & defense for the last few seasons because you know, hes been trying to build talent around his "elite" qb people have been making excuses for (especially with the talent surrounding him the last few years) so yea, we need ot get rid of Ozzie for trying to put too many resources around his elite Qb. He clearly should have stuck with the "Acquire Vet FA's for the offense and draft defense defense defense" approach since our QB can make up for the lack of talent that surrounds him.

he's THAT elite.
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 7:56 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


It's really hard to understand your point with all the hyperbole and extra punctuation, but I think I get it. First of all, no one here calls Joe Flacco elite or a top 5 QB, so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Second, the offense did reasonably well, they put up 28 points on the road and put the team in a position to win. Before you go all crazy on me again I'm not discounting what happened earlier in the 2nd half, I'm just saying what happened at the end of the game. The offense finally got it together and had the Ravens ahead by 8 points. That should be enough even a below average defense, especially once the starting QB gets hurt.

Anyways, using your logic, you shouldn't be blaming Flacco either. According to you and a lot of other folks, he's an average to below average QB that can't be counted on to win games. Flacco did what he always does, play great for part of the game and play terrible for the other part of the game. He and the offense came through at the end of regulation and put the team in a position to win. If you don't want to hold the defense accountable since they just aren't that good, then how can you hold the QB accountable when he just isn't that good either?
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 8:03 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


Did anyone watch the replay on the Cousins td pass? The corner Chris Johnson had man coverage on Garcon. Johnson was looking in the backfield instead of the receiver and Garcon was wide open.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 8:09 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


Paintballs it is correct...that jerk cost us the play by watching the QB then his man.... If he would have done his job and stayed with his man the game would have been over and we win the division today and get a home playoff game... Now we probably won't even get to the playoffs...
Reply | Quote
  • PSURaven
  • Raven Veteran
  • 4038 posts this site
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 8:13 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 




---------------------------------------------
--- RchmondRvnsFan wrote:

It's really hard to understand your point with all the hyperbole and extra punctuation, but I think I get it. First of all, no one here calls Joe Flacco elite or a top 5 QB, so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Second, the offense did reasonably well, they put up 28 points on the road and put the team in a position to win. Before you go all crazy on me again I'm not discounting what happened earlier in the 2nd half, I'm just saying what happened at the end of the game. The offense finally got it together and had the Ravens ahead by 8 points. That should be enough even a below average defense, especially once the starting QB gets hurt.

Anyways, using your logic, you shouldn't be blaming Flacco either. According to you and a lot of other folks, he's an average to below average QB that can't be counted on to win games. Flacco did what he always does, play great for part of the game and play terrible for the other part of the game. He and the offense came through at the end of regulation and put the team in a position to win. If you don't want to hold the defense accountable since they just aren't that good, then how can you hold the QB accountable when he just isn't that good either?

---------------------------------------------

Lol. Maybe its because Flacco said he's elite and is refusing to sign a contract unless it puts him in the top 5 for qbs. He's bottom 5 when it comes to 2 of the most important factors in QB play.....pocket awareness and leadership.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 8:32 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



RchmondRvnsFan wrote: It's really hard to understand your point with all the hyperbole and extra punctuation, but I think I get it. First of all, no one here calls Joe Flacco elite or a top 5 QB, so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Second, the offense did reasonably well, they put up 28 points on the road and put the team in a position to win. Before you go all crazy on me again I'm not discounting what happened earlier in the 2nd half, I'm just saying what happened at the end of the game. The offense finally got it together and had the Ravens ahead by 8 points. That should be enough even a below average defense, especially once the starting QB gets hurt.

Anyways, using your logic, you shouldn't be blaming Flacco either. According to you and a lot of other folks, he's an average to below average QB that can't be counted on to win games. Flacco did what he always does, play great for part of the game and play terrible for the other part of the game. He and the offense came through at the end of regulation and put the team in a position to win. If you don't want to hold the defense accountable since they just aren't that good, then how can you hold the QB accountable when he just isn't that good either?
Never said Joe was below average, i said time and time and time again, hes a very good "game manager", but game managers dont force balls and cause 2 turnovers on the road, especially "game managers" that expect Elite, top 5 money, and stated, from HIS MOUTH that he is the BEST QB IN THE LEAGUE, yes, he said this, excluding his past performances he made this claim. 

Despite his shortcomings as a QB i want him here, for about 5 years 60 mill. I think thats too much to be honest, but i think that is a suitable contract for his strengths and weaknesses and shortcomings as an NFL starter. When joe didnt turnover the ball in Pittsburgh, what happened?? We Won.

What happened when he turned the ball over the last two games??? we Lost. What happened in the playoffs last year when we beat Houston and he didnt turn the ball over??? We won. What happened when he threw a stupid INT to Spikes in the AFCCG??? We lost. You DO NOT turn the ball over in critical situations & big games, and multiply that if you're on the road. His role is to protect the football, first and foremost. The 3 and outs irritate me, but they can be,for lack of a better term, absorbed in the scope of a game if the defense is keeping the score close.

But what canNOT occur are turnovers on the road, especially when momentum shifts MUCH quicker on the road than at home.
Posted Image
"Its like...Someone Created him on Madden."
~Jacoby on Joe~
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/9/2012 8:53 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



RchmondRvnsFan wrote:
theravenkidd wrote: And not one time did you mention "turnovers"

How many did Cousins and Rg3 committ??

yea..my point exactly. You DONT TURNOVER THE BALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL ON THE ROAAAAAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD. What is so hard to understand??? With a very weak defense you DO NOT turnover the ball and put them back out on the field to be exposed more than they have to be. On top of that HOW MANY 3 and outs did they have???

25th ranked defense, you give them enough cushion by making it a multiple possession game by SCORING in the redzone. Period.
You really come unglued after the Ravens lose, settle down a bit.

Anyways, I'm trying to understand your logic.  Any defense in the league should be able to hold an 8 point lead against a second stringer coming off the bench with under 2 minutes to go.  It seems to me that you don't think the defense should be held accountable, because they aren't a great defense.  Is that correct?
Except Cousins only had what three snaps?  So it's not like he lead the entire drive.  I agree the defense folded on that drive.  We still have to look at the fact that the game coming down to that drive was due to turnovers by a QB in his 5th year that still can't read the damn line of scrimmage.  I disagree with kidd alot, but one thing is a fact here, RGIII had 0 turnovers and that's why his team had a shot at the end.  Had Flacco done the same the Skins would have been buried.

I wouldn't be as frustrated if Joe's mistakes were just things that he couldn't help.  But this is a 5th year QB that isn't paying a damn tention.  I certainly don't want to put the loss completely on him.  He is starting to really get under my skin with his mistakes.  It's a damn shame, RGIII, Cousins, Luck are rookies and they are not making those mistakes that he makes like not counting the damn box.  That's the thing that's most frustrating with him.

They have put the weapons around him for the offense to carry the team and he's in a contract year and showing that he does not deserve top 5 money.  Now watch what's going to happen.  NE will probably beat the Texans on Monday and we are looking at the damn 4 seed.  All of that happened in two weeks and it starts at the QB position IMO.  The defense is not off the hook.  To me though it starts with the damn turnovers committed by the QB. Turnovers that you just cannot have.  To me Flacco is playing himself out of a big contract.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/9/2012 9:57 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


28 points.  That should be enough.

Talking about QB issues obscures the fact that this defense has given up game changing / winning drives to Charlie Batch and Kirk Cousins.   

28 points on the road should be enough.   20 points against the Rothelisberger-less Steelers, HONESTLY should be enough.

Yes, there were offensive mistakes.   But in both games you have defensive opportunities to make a stop tied or with the lead, and we could not.

This ain't your father's Ravens defense.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:02 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


The defense has blown the last 2 games. That is a fact. The defense had a 7+ point lead, and the steelers and deadskins drove down the field to score an easy touchdown both times. That is unacceptable. Blame the offense all you want, but the defense needs to make a stop. They just needed to keep them out of the endzone.
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:05 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


Yes we are talking about offense.  I'm going to check the numbers but I believe the Ravens defense has dealt with the Skins Pistol attack better than anyone else this season although we gave up quite a bit in the first half and part of that was guys overcompensating for RGIII rather than trusting their teammates and the defense.  They shut the Pistol attack down for the majority of the second half so while the defense gave it up at the end, I don't want to hear all of these excuses about defense.  This is supposed to be Joe Flacco's team now and he can't drive the damn car.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:09 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


This entire team makes me sick. I knew the game was lost when they over turned the fumble recovery. To watch them march down the field like that made me ill.

PS- Nobody will say this out loud-But RG3 finally got blasted into next year. That should have ended their run right there. But no.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:25 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



theravenkidd wrote:
RchmondRvnsFan wrote: It's really hard to understand your point with all the hyperbole and extra punctuation, but I think I get it. First of all, no one here calls Joe Flacco elite or a top 5 QB, so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Second, the offense did reasonably well, they put up 28 points on the road and put the team in a position to win. Before you go all crazy on me again I'm not discounting what happened earlier in the 2nd half, I'm just saying what happened at the end of the game. The offense finally got it together and had the Ravens ahead by 8 points. That should be enough even a below average defense, especially once the starting QB gets hurt.

Anyways, using your logic, you shouldn't be blaming Flacco either. According to you and a lot of other folks, he's an average to below average QB that can't be counted on to win games. Flacco did what he always does, play great for part of the game and play terrible for the other part of the game. He and the offense came through at the end of regulation and put the team in a position to win. If you don't want to hold the defense accountable since they just aren't that good, then how can you hold the QB accountable when he just isn't that good either?
Never said Joe was below average, i said time and time and time again, hes a very good "game manager", but game managers dont force balls and cause 2 turnovers on the road, especially "game managers" that expect Elite, top 5 money, and stated, from HIS MOUTH that he is the BEST QB IN THE LEAGUE, yes, he said this, excluding his past performances he made this claim. 

Despite his shortcomings as a QB i want him here, for about 5 years 60 mill. I think thats too much to be honest, but i think that is a suitable contract for his strengths and weaknesses and shortcomings as an NFL starter. When joe didnt turnover the ball in Pittsburgh, what happened?? We Won.

What happened when he turned the ball over the last two games??? we Lost. What happened in the playoffs last year when we beat Houston and he didnt turn the ball over??? We won. What happened when he threw a stupid INT to Spikes in the AFCCG??? We lost. You DO NOT turn the ball over in critical situations & big games, and multiply that if you're on the road. His role is to protect the football, first and foremost. The 3 and outs irritate me, but they can be,for lack of a better term, absorbed in the scope of a game if the defense is keeping the score close.

But what canNOT occur are turnovers on the road, especially when momentum shifts MUCH quicker on the road than at home.
Yes, and despite the mistakes, he still drove them down the field at the end of the game to give them an 8 point lead, which should be enough.  That's more than I'd expect from an average game manager.  Flacco played like he always does.  He made some bad mistakes but at the end of the day the offense put this team in a position to win.  

Game managers certainly don't lead game winning drives over and over again.  And since apparently game managers don't force balls and cause 2 turnovers on the road (I'm not sure what that has to do with this, since none of those turnovers were due to him forcing the ball, but whatever), then it doesn't really sound like Joe is a game manager.  

If you're not gonna blame a bad defense when they play poorly, how can you blame an average QB that plays like he's always played?
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:29 PM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 



PSURaven wrote:

---------------------------------------------
--- RchmondRvnsFan wrote:

It's really hard to understand your point with all the hyperbole and extra punctuation, but I think I get it. First of all, no one here calls Joe Flacco elite or a top 5 QB, so I'm not sure why you keep bringing that up. Second, the offense did reasonably well, they put up 28 points on the road and put the team in a position to win. Before you go all crazy on me again I'm not discounting what happened earlier in the 2nd half, I'm just saying what happened at the end of the game. The offense finally got it together and had the Ravens ahead by 8 points. That should be enough even a below average defense, especially once the starting QB gets hurt.

Anyways, using your logic, you shouldn't be blaming Flacco either. According to you and a lot of other folks, he's an average to below average QB that can't be counted on to win games. Flacco did what he always does, play great for part of the game and play terrible for the other part of the game. He and the offense came through at the end of regulation and put the team in a position to win. If you don't want to hold the defense accountable since they just aren't that good, then how can you hold the QB accountable when he just isn't that good either?

---------------------------------------------

Lol. Maybe its because Flacco said he's elite and is refusing to sign a contract unless it puts him in the top 5 for qbs. He's bottom 5 when it comes to 2 of the most important factors in QB play.....pocket awareness and leadership.
I don't know why you guys keep obsessing over that comment, IIRC he only said it once.  I guess Joe should've said he's average, that would've gone over real well.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/9/2012 10:48 PM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


Probably already mentioned, but I don't feel like reading the entire thread. FACT: Flacco's turnovers are the difference in the outcome the past two weeks. That is indisputable! Two errant throws and two strip fumbles because FLACCO still can't adjust the protection when teams overload their pass rush.
Momma says, "Foosball is the Devil!
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 9:36 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



Thedailydose wrote: Probably already mentioned, but I don't feel like reading the entire thread. FACT: Flacco's turnovers are the difference in the outcome the past two weeks. That is indisputable! Two errant throws and two strip fumbles because FLACCO still can't adjust the protection when teams overload their pass rush.

Both games came down to defensive stops not made.  

Obviously, everyone has their agenda, and you think Flacco is a problem.  The problem is, he led the offense to 28 points on the road, turnovers or not.

He and the offense had us in a position where we had an 8 point lead with 5 minutes left.   The defense failed us.

They even knocked out RG3, and then quickly succumbed to the GREAT KIRK COUSINS.



Look - when you lose Lardarius Webb and Jimmy Smith, your top 2 corners - your secondary is going to be a mess.  When you lose Suggs to Achiles and then Torn Bicep, your run stopping and pass rush will take a hit.  When Pollard isn't laying the wood and Ed Reed is invisible, and when at ILB you're down to Ayanbedjo and some Practice squader - you're in trouble.

Its incredible that the talk isn't about the issues above and is about an offense that generated 28 points on the road.   Turnovers or not, there was an 8 point lead to protect, and this group on the field isn't getting it done.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 9:47 AM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


Exactly...with the exception of the KC game, this offense has put enough points on the board to win all the games this season. But the final recap doesnt represent the entire game and the mistakes that were made in each. Besides that, the defense needs to find the winning ways to keep teams from finishing

         

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 9:51 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


This team was built for offense over the past few off seasons  This is clearly what we have been told. When you take an offensive **** in the second half, you can't blame the defense, especially when you have practice squad guys playing in the LB position. Turnovers and inept offensive series after series in the third quarter cost us the game. You can't put your defense on short fields and flip field position with turnovers. Those momentum shifts IMO cost us the game.

You can continue to believe Joe is an elite QB. I would ask you to look at other QB's in the league, let's say the "elite" QB's and watch the fundamentals. Joe has to be a leader, stop drinking the little cup of Gatorade on the sideline when you screw up. How about you step up in tough times and make a play. It seems to me that all too often Joe pulls a Boller moment rather than an elite moment.
Momma says, "Foosball is the Devil!
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 9:56 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



Thedailydose wrote: This team was built for offense over the past few off seasons  This is clearly what we have been told. When you take an offensive **** in the second half, you can't blame the defense, especially when you have practice squad guys playing in the LB position. Turnovers and inept offensive series after series in the third quarter cost us the game. You can't put your defense on short fields and flip field position with turnovers. Those momentum shifts IMO cost us the game.

You can continue to believe Joe is an elite QB. I would ask you to look at other QB's in the league, let's say the "elite" QB's and watch the fundamentals. Joe has to be a leader, stop drinking the little cup of Gatorade on the sideline when you screw up. How about you step up in tough times and make a play. It seems to me that all too often Joe pulls a Boller moment rather than an elite moment.

Dude I dont care about labelling Flacco.  That is your personal crusade.

I care that we gave us 8 points to Kirk Cousins.  how can you not see that?

This defensive unit, to use a Chapelle Show reference, "is like Afghanistan: Bombed out and Depleted"

Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:03 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


Defense is what it is.

Flacco is seeking $15 million per.

We could have won this game with 24 or 27 points with better QB play. Frankly, I don't care that we scored 28.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:05 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



ClericBlackDave wrote:
Thedailydose wrote: This team was built for offense over the past few off seasons  This is clearly what we have been told. When you take an offensive **** in the second half, you can't blame the defense, especially when you have practice squad guys playing in the LB position. Turnovers and inept offensive series after series in the third quarter cost us the game. You can't put your defense on short fields and flip field position with turnovers. Those momentum shifts IMO cost us the game.

You can continue to believe Joe is an elite QB. I would ask you to look at other QB's in the league, let's say the "elite" QB's and watch the fundamentals. Joe has to be a leader, stop drinking the little cup of Gatorade on the sideline when you screw up. How about you step up in tough times and make a play. It seems to me that all too often Joe pulls a Boller moment rather than an elite moment.

Dude I dont care about labelling Flacco.  That is your personal crusade.

I care that we gave us 8 points to Kirk Cousins.  how can you not see that?

This defensive unit, to use a Chapelle Show reference, "is like Afghanistan: Bombed out and Depleted"

The same team that made Charlie Batch look like a pro bowler. Get it through your head... this team was built to score points.. enough to win... enough to compensate for a bad defense... do you understand???? Do you realize how bad the Redskins secondary is??

We should have scored 40 or 50 yesterday. We scored 21 points in 1-1/2 quarters... you can't take a crap the rest of the game. You can't sit on leads. Do you think we don't know what we have on defense? Do you think we don't have an understanding of the talent level in our LB corp? Joe put the ball in the other teams hands on the opponents 13 yard line. 

When it comes down to blame, you have a choice. Blame a group of untalented young defensive players, who have no business playing for a win? Or you blame the team you put your money in, the team you invested in. This offense is where our leadership is now. They have to step up and make plays. Did they do that in the 3rd Qtr? NO! Did they do that in the 4th Qtr? No! Did they do that in OT? No!

So you put all the blame ona group of undrafted rookies who are by no means better than average, but place no blame on Flacco, Rice, the o-line, Boldin, Torrey Smith? All the $$ for well over 2 years we dumped in this offense, but this unit can't muster a FG in OT against one of the worst pass defenses in the league!!??!! This is pointless....

Done with this topic!
Momma says, "Foosball is the Devil!

Last edited 12/10/2012 10:10 AM by Thedailydose

Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:08 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


I know we shouldn't sit on leads.   And of course you want more points.  And of course you don't want turnovers.

We all want the perfect offense.

But eitehr way, we had an 8 point lead with one drive to go, basically.   Defense couldn't get it done against Kirk Cousins.  PATHETIC.  period.

Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:14 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



ClericBlackDave wrote:

I know we shouldn't sit on leads.   And of course you want more points.  And of course you don't want turnovers.

We all want the perfect offense.

But eitehr way, we had an 8 point lead with one drive to go, basically.   Defense couldn't get it done against Kirk Cousins.  PATHETIC.  period.


Like I said, in the case of yesterday I don't care about points. All I know is that because of Flacco's mistakes we needed to score 6 additional points, at a minimum, to win.

I honestly think we could have won yesterday's game with 27 points had Flacco not fumbled or thrown the INT. I think if we had gone up 24-14 things turn out much, much differently.
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:19 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



RavenzNTerps wrote:
ClericBlackDave wrote:

I know we shouldn't sit on leads.   And of course you want more points.  And of course you don't want turnovers.

We all want the perfect offense.

But eitehr way, we had an 8 point lead with one drive to go, basically.   Defense couldn't get it done against Kirk Cousins.  PATHETIC.  period.


Like I said, in the case of yesterday I don't care about points. All I know is that because of Flacco's mistakes we needed to score 6 additional points, at a minimum, to win.

I honestly think we could have won yesterday's game with 27 points had Flacco not fumbled or thrown the INT. I think if we had gone up 24-14 things turn out much, much differently.
Exactly... you expect at times a young defense to give up a big play or two. You don't expect your veteran QB to consistently take a crap when the games on the line. Not a QB who calls himself "elite" and "top-5" on national T.V., and just so happens is demanding a huge contract...just saying!
Momma says, "Foosball is the Devil!

Last edited 12/10/2012 10:22 AM by Thedailydose

Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:21 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 


No accountability for the defense that gave up 8 points to Kirk Cousins.  Thats what I'm saying.

Certain people have their narrative of what is wrong with the team.  And you're going to put any loss into that narrative.  But when you can't stop the backup QB from getting 8, you're not going to win.

Its crazy to think we were able to stop Tom Brady TWICE to allow the comeback victory at home, but can't stop Charlie Batch or Kirk Cousins once.   You want to talk about Joe being inconsistent.  The defense is inconsistent as hell too.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:25 AM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


The Defense is getting somewhat of a pass since they are missing 2 corners and 3 linebackers. All starters.

Joe's turnovers cost us atleast 6 points. 28 should be enough, but on the road, with a beat up defense, you can't end drives with dumb turnovers.

"If ravens fans are confident you can win a playoff game, then I don't see where that confidence is coming from. Be realistic"

- rkn0720 
Reply | Quote

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:29 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



ClericBlackDave wrote:

No accountability for the defense that gave up 8 points to Kirk Cousins.  Thats what I'm saying.

Certain people have their narrative of what is wrong with the team.  And you're going to put any loss into that narrative.  But when you can't stop the backup QB from getting 8, you're not going to win.

Its crazy to think we were able to stop Tom Brady TWICE to allow the comeback victory at home, but can't stop Charlie Batch or Kirk Cousins once.   You want to talk about Joe being inconsistent.  The defense is inconsistent as hell too.

Of course there's accountability. Defense isn't inconsistent, though, it's just bad which reduces the margin of error for Joe Flacco. He can either stand the heat or get out of the kitchen.

Last year our defense was sliding a little and we lost 5 of our best 6 players. No Ray, Suggs, JJ, Webb, or Redding. Those are all huge losses. We pretty much have Ngata and a bunch of no ones on defense right now. What do you expect?

The defense is plain bad. No one is arguing otherwise. What I am arguing is that because the defense is plain bad it's up to the offense to pick up the slack, and that doesn't necessarily mean "points." It means control the game. Dictate the pace. Hold the ball. Win time of possession.

The Redskins defense, by the way, is horrendous.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:29 AM

RE: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking off 


The defense is ravaged by injuries even the Ngata who is playing isn't close to 100%

I give them a pass
...and don't call me Shirley
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 12/10/2012 10:33 AM

Re: Offense drops 28, defense gives up 31, and we're talking 



Thedailydose wrote:
RavenzNTerps wrote:
ClericBlackDave wrote:

I know we shouldn't sit on leads.   And of course you want more points.  And of course you don't want turnovers.

We all want the perfect offense.

But eitehr way, we had an 8 point lead with one drive to go, basically.   Defense couldn't get it done against Kirk Cousins.  PATHETIC.  period.


Like I said, in the case of yesterday I don't care about points. All I know is that because of Flacco's mistakes we needed to score 6 additional points, at a minimum, to win.

I honestly think we could have won yesterday's game with 27 points had Flacco not fumbled or thrown the INT. I think if we had gone up 24-14 things turn out much, much differently.
Exactly... you expect at times a young defense to give up a big play or two. You don't expect your veteran QB to consistently take a crap when the games on the line. Not a QB who calls himself "elite" and "top-5" on national T.V., and just so happens is demanding a huge contract...just saying!
You're right about Flacco, he shouldn't be fumbling like that, but he does.  Do you expect a HOF safety to give up a TD to Kirk Cousins?
Reply | Quote
Reply to TopicPost New Topic
  Page of 2  Next >