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GOP Media Bubble

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Posted: 11/13/2012 4:42 PM

GOP Media Bubble 


So... After a week of hand wringing and a bunch of self examination after the big defeat to Obama and the Dems (pretty much across the board) much has been made from serious conservatives about how they get, disseminate and consume media, news and political commentary.

Clearly the marching orders, polling and general misinformation coming from Rushbo and Fox has begun to have a reverse effect from what was once a positive in the partisan Bush era that worked so well. The constituency that makes up and falls for this type of BS (a fantasy world where conservative thoughts and ideas are always right and rarely seriously challenged) are dying fast and can no longer win a national election.


Fox has taken a lot of heat. Deservedly so. Apparently the bosses over there at Fox plan on dialing back the hardcore right-wing partisanism. Ehe.. We'll see if that ever happens. But in a land where it is all candy and no vegetables you will inevitably just end up lying to yourself which is what happened in a stunning fashion one week ago.

I count the moment this thing flipped was Karl Roves meltdown. It was a memorable and telling moment. When an entire movement realizes the lies they have been telling themselves are not, in fact, reality.


When Megyn Kelly asks
Rove... " is this just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better

You almost could not phrase the entire 10 years of conservative media into a better soundbite.

I think this happened because the revolt to "liberal media" went so far the other direction. 


So a few questions..

-- Do you see the conservative media bubble as a serious problem for the GOP? Whom only go to the DrudgeReport or Fox. You see it here. There are at least 5 people here who literally go to Drudge, and SPRINT here to re-post as gospel.

-- Should FOX change it's style a bit.? You know... Like maybe not showing one unarmed black panther outside a voting office 35 times over 24 hours again and again on your network to play up race-baiting and stuff like that garbage.

-- Will the SERIOUS GOP voices be able to do anything about the Rushbo's? They have never ever shown themselves to be able to do so.

-- Is it no problem at all and the GOP should continue to cater to old, white, southern, angry men who watch FOX and go to Drudge for ALL their news and opinion?

Last edited 11/13/2012 4:46 PM by Hottbirdz

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Posted: 11/13/2012 8:14 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


-- Do you see the conservative media bubble as a serious problem for the GOP? Whom only go to the DrudgeReport or Fox. You see it here. There are at least 5 people here who literally go to Drudge, and SPRINT here to re-post as gospel.

For those who vote GOP, most definitely.  They tend to rarely go to Democrat havens like MSNBC, Huffington.  An important practice of politics is to know thy opponent.  The left is far more familiar with right wing media outlets than the other way around.  Standing back and bitching about bias, no matter how blatant (and it doesn't get much more blatant than it was this election cycle), does not constitute knowing thy opponent.

Should FOX change it's style a bit.? You know... Like maybe not showing one unarmed black panther outside a voting office 35 times over 24 hours again and again on your network to play up race-baiting and stuff like that garbage.

Yes.

Will the SERIOUS GOP voices be able to do anything about the Rushbo's? They have never ever shown themselves to be able to do so.

Probably not.  The serious voices of the Democratic Party were squelched long ago, and they were never able to do anything about the shills in their party that finally all but did them in during the 2010 elections.  I don't see the GOP faring much better.

 Is it no problem at all and the GOP should continue to cater to old, white, southern, angry men who watch FOX and go to Drudge for ALL their news and opinion?

It's not a catering problem, it's a reach out problem.  The values of the vast majority of Hispanics are far more in line with the GOP platform than the Democratic platform - one of the reasons why the GOP has more Hispanics holding elected office than the Democrats.  The Democratic machine, specifically the Obama machine, will go down as a model to follow in grass roots efforts to get out the vote.  They went door to door and talked to the voters and registered those who were not registered.  The GOP relied on stuffing mailboxes and filling the airwaves with "Democrats suck" ads.  That doesn't earn votes - face time earns votes.  I mentioned before the election that the Dems had been by my place - TWICE.  Last presidential election, same thing.  The GOP?  I've lived in VA for 30+ years, and have NEVER had a GOP canvasser knock on my door.  The GOP needs to get boots on the ground - and, as stated above, at least check out MSNBC, Huffington, et al.
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Posted: 11/13/2012 9:03 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


Conservative media has a larger base than liberal media.  This election was lost due to Obama's politicking surpassing Romney's.  Explained in more thorough detail above ^^^^^^.


A conservative must read is Saul Alinsky on just about anything.  An interesting aside, Alinsky's last book "rules for Radicals" was dedicated to Satan in the forward. 



A few Alinsky quotes,


"There's another reason for working inside the system. Dostoevsky said that taking a new step is what people fear most. Any revolutionary change must be preceded by a passive, affirmative, non-challenging attitude toward change among the mass of our people. They must feel so frustrated, so defeated, so lost, so futureless in the prevailing system that they are willing to let go of the past and change the future. This acceptance is the reformation essential to any revolution."

"From the moment the organizer enters a community he lives, dreams... only one thing and that is to build the mass power base of what he calls the army. Until he has developed that mass power base, he confronts no major issues.... Until he has those means and power instruments, his 'tactics' are very different from power tactics. Therefore, every move revolves around one central point: how many recruits will this bring into the organization, whether by means of local organizations, churches, service groups, labor Unions, corner gangs, or as individuals."

"The end is what you want, the means is how you get it. Whenever we think about social change, the question of means and ends arises. The man of action views the issue of means and ends in pragmatic and strategic terms. He has no other problem; he thinks only of his actual resources and the possibilities of various choices of action. He asks of ends only whether they are achievable and worth the cost; of means, only whether they will work. ... The real arena is corrupt and bloody."

"An organizer working in and for an open society is in an ideological dilemma to begin with, he does not have a fixed truth -- truth to him is relative and changing; everything to him is relative and changing.... To the extent that he is free from the shackles of dogma, he can respond to the realities of the widely different situations...."

 "A Marxist begins with his prime truth that all evils are caused by the exploitation of the proletariat by the capitalists. From this he logically proceeds to the revolution to end capitalism, then into the third stage of reorganization into a new social order of the dictatorship of the proletariat, and finally the last stage -- the political paradise of communism."

"The organizer’s job is to inseminate an invitation for himself, to agitate, introduce ideas, get people pregnant with hope and a desire for change and to identify you as the person most qualified for this purpose."

Is this last quote reminiscent of anyone?  The "change and Hope" doesn't even have a basis in reality, no need for goals or standards.  It is simply, "hope and Change", hey who doesn't like that!  Whatever it happens to be....
Baltimore Ravens 2014 mojo!  Here we go!
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Posted: 11/14/2012 11:01 AM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


Good post 12th.

Crow.. Not so much. I don't think the problem is that the GOP needs to read more Saul Alinsky.

In fact I think a main part of the problem with the GOP is they spend too much time speaking about scary sounding characters that they try to demonize and scare people with.

People like this guy Saul Alinsky. And it seems like some are still buying it hook line and sinker.


It's generally just stupid. It's certainly not winning. All Obama does is beat the GOP.

A change is needed. Even Jindal has recently pleaded that the GOP "stop being the stupid party".
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Posted: 11/14/2012 11:58 AM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


Conservatives need to get boots on the ground in our cities and convince Blacks and Hispanics that their message is better.  Time to stop conceding big cities during every election.
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  • Mohara
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Posted: 11/14/2012 1:45 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 



Hottbirdz wrote: So... After a week of hand wringing and a bunch of self examination after the big defeat to Obama and the Dems (pretty much across the board) much has been made from serious conservatives about how they get, disseminate and consume media, news and political commentary.

Clearly the marching orders, polling and general misinformation coming from Rushbo and Fox has begun to have a reverse effect from what was once a positive in the partisan Bush era that worked so well. The constituency that makes up and falls for this type of BS (a fantasy world where conservative thoughts and ideas are always right and rarely seriously challenged) are dying fast and can no longer win a national election.


Fox has taken a lot of heat. Deservedly so. Apparently the bosses over there at Fox plan on dialing back the hardcore right-wing partisanism. Ehe.. We'll see if that ever happens. But in a land where it is all candy and no vegetables you will inevitably just end up lying to yourself which is what happened in a stunning fashion one week ago.

I count the moment this thing flipped was Karl Roves meltdown. It was a memorable and telling moment. When an entire movement realizes the lies they have been telling themselves are not, in fact, reality.


When Megyn Kelly asks
Rove... " is this just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better

You almost could not phrase the entire 10 years of conservative media into a better soundbite.

I think this happened because the revolt to "liberal media" went so far the other direction. 


So a few questions..

-- Do you see the conservative media bubble as a serious problem for the GOP? Whom only go to the DrudgeReport or Fox. You see it here. There are at least 5 people here who literally go to Drudge, and SPRINT here to re-post as gospel.

-- Should FOX change it's style a bit.? You know... Like maybe not showing one unarmed black panther outside a voting office 35 times over 24 hours again and again on your network to play up race-baiting and stuff like that garbage.

-- Will the SERIOUS GOP voices be able to do anything about the Rushbo's? They have never ever shown themselves to be able to do so.

-- Is it no problem at all and the GOP should continue to cater to old, white, southern, angry men who watch FOX and go to Drudge for ALL their news and opinion?
Media bubble baloney.  God you guys all read the same talking points from your own media bubble.  It was a close election.  Very close.  The polls said as much.  A few marginal commentators went out on a limb and made silly predictions based on enthusiasm but I don't think anyone really believed they were true. 

The left wing bubble is as bad or worse.  I spend most of my time on RCP linking to the various left and right wing oulets/links mainly to see what the talking points are.  RCP had Romney down across the board.  I also visited CNN, Fox and Drudge.  I don't go to Huffpost.  That's one site I just can't really find any merit in.

But this baloney about the right wing having a bubble is just absurd.  The left wing has one too and when they got whooped in 2010 you could be making all the same arguments.

I have to say also, I don't know anyone that listens to Rush or Hannity.  That's not news or even information, it's propoganda.

Last edited 11/14/2012 1:47 PM by Mohara

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  • BMann
  • Raven Veteran
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Posted: 11/14/2012 3:35 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 



Mohara wrote:
Hottbirdz wrote: So... After a week of hand wringing and a bunch of self examination after the big defeat to Obama and the Dems (pretty much across the board) much has been made from serious conservatives about how they get, disseminate and consume media, news and political commentary.

Clearly the marching orders, polling and general misinformation coming from Rushbo and Fox has begun to have a reverse effect from what was once a positive in the partisan Bush era that worked so well. The constituency that makes up and falls for this type of BS (a fantasy world where conservative thoughts and ideas are always right and rarely seriously challenged) are dying fast and can no longer win a national election.


Fox has taken a lot of heat. Deservedly so. Apparently the bosses over there at Fox plan on dialing back the hardcore right-wing partisanism. Ehe.. We'll see if that ever happens. But in a land where it is all candy and no vegetables you will inevitably just end up lying to yourself which is what happened in a stunning fashion one week ago.

I count the moment this thing flipped was Karl Roves meltdown. It was a memorable and telling moment. When an entire movement realizes the lies they have been telling themselves are not, in fact, reality.


When Megyn Kelly asks
Rove... " is this just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better

You almost could not phrase the entire 10 years of conservative media into a better soundbite.

I think this happened because the revolt to "liberal media" went so far the other direction. 


So a few questions..

-- Do you see the conservative media bubble as a serious problem for the GOP? Whom only go to the DrudgeReport or Fox. You see it here. There are at least 5 people here who literally go to Drudge, and SPRINT here to re-post as gospel.

-- Should FOX change it's style a bit.? You know... Like maybe not showing one unarmed black panther outside a voting office 35 times over 24 hours again and again on your network to play up race-baiting and stuff like that garbage.

-- Will the SERIOUS GOP voices be able to do anything about the Rushbo's? They have never ever shown themselves to be able to do so.

-- Is it no problem at all and the GOP should continue to cater to old, white, southern, angry men who watch FOX and go to Drudge for ALL their news and opinion?
Media bubble baloney.  God you guys all read the same talking points from your own media bubble.  It was a close election.  Very close.  The polls said as much.

But isn't that a big cause for concern, if you're a Republican?  Wasn't Obama a very vulnerable President?  By just about all Conservative accounts, Obama isn't just bad, he's historically awful.  Yet the GOP still couldn't get him ousted.
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Posted: 11/14/2012 3:38 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


Media bubble baloney.  

Yeah. Apparently a bunch of people on the right are finally beginning to disagree.

Just read 12th's take. It was pretty spot on.

It was a close election.  Very close.  The polls said as much.  A few marginal commentators went out on a limb and made silly predictions based on enthusiasm but I don't think anyone really believed they were true.  


Yeah, I don't call 125 electoral votes and sweeping pretty much every. single. swing. state... "close". Hell, certainly not "very close". 2000 was "very close". As a matter of fact this election was a relative blowout. Especially telling by how stunned the conservative media was and has been since last week. Plus, I think a lot of people believed the predictions  did not call them "silly" and thought Mitt was going to win and win comfortably. 

Dick Morris called "Romney by 100" and that was considered a blowout. Obama wins by 125 and now you call that "very close"?!?... Whatever.


The left wing bubble is as bad or worse.  

No. Its not. Actually. Libs do not JUST watch MSNBC. Libs do not even listen to left wing radio since there is no such thing. We end up listening to right wing radio. After Howard Stern is over that is the next funniest thing on air.


 I also visited CNN, Fox and Drudge.  I don't go to Huffpost.  That's one site I just can't really find any merit in.

OK. Wow. So you go to Fox and Drudge.. and.... CNN!rolleyes

The point is many on the right do exactly that except they don't go to CNN. They admit as much. Plus CNN is hardly a liberal oasis. So you are still hardly getting the other side.


Huff Post is a good, quality site. Politics aside...they do a good job. They are essentially the Drudge of the left. So if you can find merit in one and not the other than that is just pure partisanism. It's not really done out of any phony sense of "merit".




I have to say also, I don't know anyone that listens to Rush or Hannity.  That's not news or even information, it's propoganda.

Well... I don't  know what to tell you, guy... There are millions upon millions that are. Oh and they are running your party. You might want to be informed on what, not ONLY the left are saying, but what these clowns that run your party are saying.

Try reading this to help you understand a bit better.

Last edited 11/14/2012 3:42 PM by Hottbirdz

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Posted: 11/14/2012 3:55 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 



Hottbirdz wrote: Good post 12th.

Crow.. Not so much. I don't think the problem is that the GOP needs to read more Saul Alinsky.

In fact I think a main part of the problem with the GOP is they spend too much time speaking about scary sounding characters that they try to demonize and scare people with.

People like this guy Saul Alinsky. And it seems like some are still buying it hook line and sinker.


It's generally just stupid. It's certainly not winning. All Obama does is beat the GOP.

A change is needed. Even Jindal has recently pleaded that the GOP "stop being the stupid party".
Obama's entire game plan is in "Rules for Radicals", of course you would prefer the right not delve into the liberal/socialist "playbook".
Baltimore Ravens 2014 mojo!  Here we go!
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Posted: 11/14/2012 4:14 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


The left are pros at demonization, "soft euphemisms", and baseless rhetoric, it is their bread and butter. Conservatives can use the some of the same tactics without giving up base principles.

We must assert that we are "pro-life" AND "pro-choice" although we are "anti-abortion".

Does anyone understand that simply stating that I am not "pro-choice" is self demonization?! Words have power, especially when dealing with the uneducated, and those who are prone to denial based on their limited character.

Conservatives must maintain that the opposition is the enemy of the working class, via various means. If you do not think this works look at Obama's demonization of the "ultra rich". Conservatives were painted as the party of a select few, and the vote lies with the masses.

Baltimore Ravens 2014 mojo!  Here we go!
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Posted: 11/14/2012 5:55 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


I think a huge part of the problem comes with the GOPs relatively hardcore alignment with Christian fundamentalists and big business. Many independents or those more in the middle of the political spectrum are turned off by that. I'm not saying the GOP is evil and the Dems are angels. But this current conservative movement has been an abysmal failure.

If the GOP would go to more of a TRUE conservative, republican viewpoint, I'd certainly support them more. For someone like me, I perceive the GOP as quite hypocritical...and perception is everything. How can a true conservative push issues with religious overtones, like anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage, when they should be saying "These issues are for the individual states to decide, not the federal government".

And call it "liberal media spin" but the perception of the average, non-right-winger, is that the GOP could care less about the middle and lower class. Even if the GOP can back up their reasoning as to why the upper class shouldn't get a lower tax rate than the middle class, the perception is "The GOP only wants to protect the rich".

Not to mention, the right wing pundits are just SO unlikeable!! Folks like Rush, O'Reilly, Coulter and Beck just come off as crazy, irrational conspiracy theorists. Of course the left has its ultra-liberals like Maher, Maddow and Huffington, but they also have very likeable people like John Stewart. So because of this, I think the average "moderate" sees the message of the right wing pundits as messages of hate, anger, religious fundamentalism and big business where the view of the left wing pundits message is that of "acceptance and equality".

I think a big part of the problem also comes with the GOP pressuring moderate republicans to "tow the company line". I would have found it SO refreshing to hear any prominent GOp member say something like "Obama is not a socialist....he hasn't been a terrible president...the country doesn't need to be 'taken back', it just needs to go in a different direction" etc.

What this country needs (and what BOTH parties need) are moderates and less extremists. Both parties need to come closer to the center rather than further to the left or right. All that does is promote the divide this country currently has. The fact is, both parties have excellent ideas and ideologies in certain situations. But not every viewpoint from either party is right.

So in summary, I think the GOP could see a HUGE rise in support if they: rid themselves of their current crop of major pundits, show that "conservative" does not equal "Christian only laws", take a step back from the big business mindset" and promote some Republicans that aren't going to just "tow the company line" and actually reach across the isle instead of just saying it.

So there are my thoughts....from a registered Independent.
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Posted: 11/14/2012 7:05 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 



magnified wrote: I think a huge part of the problem comes with the GOPs relatively hardcore alignment with Christian fundamentalists and big business. Many independents or those more in the middle of the political spectrum are turned off by that. I'm not saying the GOP is evil and the Dems are angels. But this current conservative movement has been an abysmal failure.

Of course you do, it is your party line, the failure is letting the libs draw distinctions that are easily quelled by logic.  The liberal stance is a free ride vs self reliance, the libs have made the issue into rich vs poor.  

If the GOP would go to more of a TRUE conservative, republican viewpoint, I'd certainly support them more. For someone like me, I perceive the GOP as quite hypocritical...and perception is everything. How can a true conservative push issues with religious overtones, like anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage, when they should be saying "These issues are for the individual states to decide, not the federal government".

You are "pro-abortion", that is your choice Mag, women should be protected from people like you who propose that they go through such a traumatic experience.  

And call it "liberal media spin" but the perception of the average, non-right-winger, is that the GOP could care less about the middle and lower class. Even if the GOP can back up their reasoning as to why the upper class shouldn't get a lower tax rate than the middle class, the perception is "The GOP only wants to protect the rich".

Of course this is your "perception" you swallowed it hook, line, and sinker. 

Not to mention, the right wing pundits are just SO unlikeable!! Folks like Rush, O'Reilly, Coulter and Beck just come off as crazy, irrational conspiracy theorists. Of course the left has its ultra-liberals like Maher, Maddow and Huffington, but they also have very likeable people like John Stewart. So because of this, I think the average "moderate" sees the message of the right wing pundits as messages of hate, anger, religious fundamentalism and big business where the view of the left wing pundits message is that of "acceptance and equality".

Where does one of your points end and the other begin?  If you even have a point.

Hate and anger?  Religious fundamentalism?  This is your claim, with no basis, just hot air, could you define this "acceptance and equality"?  You know, with examples based in fact.  

I think a big part of the problem also comes with the GOP pressuring moderate republicans to "tow the company line". I would have found it SO refreshing to hear any prominent GOp member say something like "Obama is not a socialist....he hasn't been a terrible president...the country doesn't need to be 'taken back', it just needs to go in a different direction" etc.

Obama is a socialist, how do you feel about George Bush?  

What this country needs (and what BOTH parties need) are moderates and less extremists. Both parties need to come closer to the center rather than further to the left or right. All that does is promote the divide this country currently has. The fact is, both parties have excellent ideas and ideologies in certain situations. But not every viewpoint from either party is right.

What this country needs is for the right to catch up with the left when it comes to dividing the country.    

So in summary, I think the GOP could see a HUGE rise in support if they: rid themselves of their current crop of major pundits, show that "conservative" does not equal "Christian only laws", take a step back from the big business mindset" and promote some Republicans that aren't going to just "tow the company line" and actually reach across the isle instead of just saying it.

Wrong Mag, what you suggest is for the GOP to alienate its base.  What needs to be done is for the GOP to use the same tactic the libs use.  

So there are my thoughts....from a registered Independent.
You are registered independent, well so am I!
Baltimore Ravens 2014 mojo!  Here we go!
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  • drkraven
  • Chief Bottlewasher
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Posted: 11/14/2012 7:43 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


So out of all us registered Independants and Libertairians here wants to run for office to shake up the establishment ?

"When you go in the lion's den, you don't tippy toe in.You carry a spear, you go in screaming like a banshee, you kick whatever doors in, and say, 'Where's the son of a bitch!'If you go in any other way you're gonna lose.
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Posted: 11/14/2012 7:44 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


Trying to address your points on an iPhone isn't easy but ill try.

"Of course you do, it is your party line, the failure is letting the libs draw distinctions that are easily quelled by logic. The liberal stance is a free ride vs self reliance, the libs have made the issue into rich vs poor. "

I disagree. Maybe the extreme left standpoint is "free ride vs self reliance" but that isn't what an average democrat believes. If you've read anything I've typed, you should have noticed that I said there are extremes on both sides and pandering to those extremes is not working. In fact, it's making the divide worsen.

"You are "pro-abortion", that is your choice Mag, women should be protected from people like you who propose that they go through such a traumatic experience."

This is absurd and I take serious offense to this statement. First off, being "pro-choice" does not mean that doctors are going to go around performing random abortions on women to the point that they need protected from "people like me". And secondly, my wife and I recently lost a child to a miscarriage and im sure many people around here have suffered this same type of horrible circumstance, so you have a lot of nerve talking about an elective procedure being a traumatic experience that women need protection from.

"Hate and anger? Religious fundamentalism? This is your claim, with no basis, just hot air, could you define this "acceptance and equality"? You know, with examples based in fact."

My point is about how the average moderate views the GOP message. I never said that the Reps actually hate anyone or anything like that. The view of those against equal rights for homosexuals, those that think gays are 'faking it', those that think there is something called 'legitimate rape' and those that think they need to 'take their country back'
is, to many, many people, one of hatred and anger.

"Obama is a socialist, how do you feel about George Bush? "

I respected him as our president and tried to give him the benefit of the doubt. However, I think he was in over his head as president. I think Bush was the type of person that was handed everything to him throughout his life, never had to work to get what he had, and honestly, wasn't that smart. I think he meant well and wanted to do what was best for this country but because of his personality, he was able to be used by others around him for political gain. Doesn't make him a bad guy at all. But I believe his regime started the swing towards a more extreme right in the GOP.

"What this country needs is for the right to catch up with the left when it comes to dividing the country."

So essentially you're saying that you'd rather further divide the country because the Dems have, rather than try to unite us. The old, "two wrongs make a right" mindset. Nice. Classy. Mature.

"Wrong Mag, what you suggest is for the GOP to alienate its base. What needs to be done is for the GOP to use the same tactic the libs use."

Nope. What I'm suggesting is that the right-wing extremists are NOT the GOPs base. A "base" is where the majority sit, and I think the majority in this country are nearer the middle. And that majority is forced to chose which extreme is the lesser evil every 4 years. And yes, let me be very clear on this. The left does this too. (Insert shocked face and dramatic music here!) But if you've actually been reading what I've typed, you would have seen that I have criticized the left for doing much of the same things as the right.
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Posted: 11/14/2012 8:12 PM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 



magnified wrote: Trying to address your points on an iPhone isn't easy but ill try.

"Of course you do, it is your party line, the failure is letting the libs draw distinctions that are easily quelled by logic. The liberal stance is a free ride vs self reliance, the libs have made the issue into rich vs poor. "

I disagree. Maybe the extreme left standpoint is "free ride vs self reliance" but that isn't what an average democrat believes. If you've read anything I've typed, you should have noticed that I said there are extremes on both sides and pandering to those extremes is not working. In fact, it's making the divide worsen.

The basis of the divide made by Libs/Dems was class warfare, war on women, etc.  It sure worked for the liberal/dems. 

"You are "pro-abortion", that is your choice Mag, women should be protected from people like you who propose that they go through such a traumatic experience."

This is absurd and I take serious offense to this statement. First off, being "pro-choice" does not mean that doctors are going to go around performing random abortions on women to the point that they need protected from "people like me". And secondly, my wife and I recently lost a child to a miscarriage and im sure many people around here have suffered this same type of horrible circumstance, so you have a lot of nerve talking about an elective procedure being a traumatic experience that women need protection from.

I am "pro-choice" I am also "pro-life".  I do not sponsor penalizing women for having an abortion, I am for promoting the rights of unborn humans.  It was a horrible circumstance for YOU to lose a child through miscarriage(and yes it is common and I do not diminish your grief), but do you think that a woman should go through a WORSE experience of having to willfully destroy her own child that is forced on her through socioeconomic means?  The vast majority of planned parenthood clinics are in minority neighborhoods.  


"Hate and anger? Religious fundamentalism? This is your claim, with no basis, just hot air, could you define this "acceptance and equality"? You know, with examples based in fact."

My point is about how the average moderate views the GOP message. I never said that the Reps actually hate anyone or anything like that. The view of those against equal rights for homosexuals, those that think gays are 'faking it', those that think there is something called 'legitimate rape' and those that think they need to 'take their country back'
is, to many, many people, one of hatred and anger.

I disagree, this is how the average left leaning moderates view of the GOP has been eschewed by demonization tactics.  

"Obama is a socialist, how do you feel about George Bush? "

I respected him as our president and tried to give him the benefit of the doubt. However, I think he was in over his head as president. I think Bush was the type of person that was handed everything to him throughout his life, never had to work to get what he had, and honestly, wasn't that smart. I think he meant well and wanted to do what was best for this country but because of his personality, he was able to be used by others around him for political gain. Doesn't make him a bad guy at all. But I believe his regime started the swing towards a more extreme right in the GOP.

You do realize that the "tax cuts and relief to the middle class Obama took credit for during his first term were the tax cuts G.W. Bush pushed through congress?  And that those cuts effect/ed 88% of population?   

"What this country needs is for the right to catch up with the left when it comes to dividing the country."

So essentially you're saying that you'd rather further divide the country because the Dems have, rather than try to unite us. The old, "two wrongs make a right" mindset. Nice. Classy. Mature.

Yes divide the country, 99% who see things conservatively and 1% who see things as a liberal. 

"Wrong Mag, what you suggest is for the GOP to alienate its base. What needs to be done is for the GOP to use the same tactic the libs use."

Nope. What I'm suggesting is that the right-wing extremists are NOT the GOPs base. A "base" is where the majority sit, and I think the majority in this country are nearer the middle. And that majority is forced to chose which extreme is the lesser evil every 4 years. And yes, let me be very clear on this. The left does this too. (Insert shocked face and dramatic music here!) But if you've actually been reading what I've typed, you would have seen that I have criticized the left for doing much of the same things as the right.
If you could better define "right-wing extremist" I could comment, as it stands I cannot.  

Ideology is the "battlefield".  All the buzz words are clutter, yet effective clutter when used properly to justify an ends.
Baltimore Ravens 2014 mojo!  Here we go!
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Posted: 11/14/2012 11:24 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


I was actually watching Fox and saw this live:

When Megyn Kelly asks Rove... " is this just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better


I think I replayed that five times just to make sure that I heard it correctly.  Most of what Fox focuses on is so obviously misdirection tactics that folks like Megyn Kelly knows the script.  In this instance though, she appeared genuinely confused.  It was like she was asking Rove:

"Wait a second....we have already obviously lost and you are still playing the misdirection game???  Is what you are suggesting now actually reality or are you still on script?  I'm like totally confused....I didn't think we were supposed to keep this going beyond Ohio?" 

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Posted: 11/15/2012 10:02 AM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


Great post by Magnified. Spot on.

Crow has generally swung and missed again in this thread. He is clearly the problem with the current GOP and not the solution. They will go nowhere fast with his "independent rolleyes" mindset. 

The sooner they come back to reality. Back to the center. The better for them.

I think, even people who lean left, would like to see a more sane party from the GOP. It helps the country. But, when your own opposition are calling themselves "the stupid party"... it's not really a fair fight.

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Posted: 11/15/2012 10:59 AM

RE: GOP Media Bubble 


I like how Karl Rove is now a "fringe analyst".

12ths post is spot on.

Like HB, I'd like to see a more reasonable GOP.

"If ravens fans are confident you can win a playoff game, then I don't see where that confidence is coming from. Be realistic"

- rkn0720 
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Posted: 11/15/2012 12:14 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 


2 more wonderful articles on this same subject. Hmm.. more respected journalists who don't think of this as "Media bubble baloney"... Go figure.


The first one nails it. How the conservative media lost to the MSM

You haven't just been misinformed about the horse race. Since the very beginning of the election cycle, conservative media has been failing you. With a few exceptions, they haven't tried to rigorously tell you the truth, or even to bring you intellectually honest opinion. What they've done instead helps to explain why the right failed to triumph in a very winnable election.

Why do you keep putting up with it?

Conservatives were at a disadvantage because their information elites pandered in the most cynical, self-defeating ways, treating would-be candidates like Sarah Palin and Herman Cain as if they were plausible presidents rather than national jokes who'd lose worse than George McGovern.

How many months were wasted on them?

On the biggest political story of the year, the conservative media just got its a$$ handed to it by the mainstream media. And movement conservatives, who believe the MSM is more biased and less rigorous than their alternatives, have no way to explain how their trusted outlets got it wrong, while the New York Times got it right. Hint: The Times hired the most rigorous forecaster it could find.   

It ought to be an eye-opening moment.   




Then, another article about this TORCHES Jennifer Rubin (right-wing blogger at the WashPo) and all of her partisan hack predictions and opinions of the past year. Point by point. Both of these articles are spot on and should be required reading for the right. LINK: The Rights Jennifer Rubin problem

Last edited 11/15/2012 12:15 PM by Hottbirdz

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Posted: 11/15/2012 3:45 PM

Re: GOP Media Bubble 



Hottbirdz wrote: 2 more wonderful articles on this same subject. Hmm.. more respected journalists who don't think of this as "Media bubble baloney"... Go figure.


The first one nails it. How the conservative media lost to the MSM

You haven't just been misinformed about the horse race. Since the very beginning of the election cycle, conservative media has been failing you. With a few exceptions, they haven't tried to rigorously tell you the truth, or even to bring you intellectually honest opinion. What they've done instead helps to explain why the right failed to triumph in a very winnable election.

Why do you keep putting up with it?

Conservatives were at a disadvantage because their information elites pandered in the most cynical, self-defeating ways, treating would-be candidates like Sarah Palin and Herman Cain as if they were plausible presidents rather than national jokes who'd lose worse than George McGovern.

How many months were wasted on them?

On the biggest political story of the year, the conservative media just got its a$$ handed to it by the mainstream media. And movement conservatives, who believe the MSM is more biased and less rigorous than their alternatives, have no way to explain how their trusted outlets got it wrong, while the New York Times got it right. Hint: The Times hired the most rigorous forecaster it could find.   

It ought to be an eye-opening moment.   




Then, another article about this TORCHES Jennifer Rubin (right-wing blogger at the WashPo) and all of her partisan hack predictions and opinions of the past year. Point by point. Both of these articles are spot on and should be required reading for the right. LINK: The Rights Jennifer Rubin problem
 You guys are out of your minds if you think Palin or Cain are considered plausible candidates by anything but a sliver of GOP voters.  This is like 2004 when Democrats where freaking out and both sides were jumping to all kinds of crazy/wrong conclusions.

Explain to me how the hell Al Gore lost to George Bush in 2000.  You guys always talk about what prosperity we had and how great thing were under Clinton.  How did Gore lose what should have been a slam dunk?  I'll tell you, he was a lousy candidate and he ran a lousy campaign.  More importantly he was a dolt.  You can't teach charisma.  Mitt does not have it.

Now go back to your ultra left wing bubbles and continue your own mass reaffirming circle jork.

Like Bush Kerry in 2004, I don't think this election affirms either sides Ideology.  It affirms the country is split right down the middle.  What are you guys thinking?  That large groups of people will start dropping Rush and Fox for Ed Schultz and MSNBC because of this?  Like you guys, HB and Galen, those aren't the people that are open to original thought and change anyway.    The bubble people will always live in there bubbles.  There are people that will actually pull the lever not based on the letter R or D, and they don't live in those bubbles.

Stupid thread.
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