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Tyler Bray Improved?

Posted: 8/8/2014 3:07 PM

Tyler Bray Improved? 


I can't tell yet.   If he has a good couple of preseasons will that make him as good as Chase?

Too risky to release Chase?

Last edited 8/8/2014 4:17 PM by ChiefsInsider

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Posted: 8/8/2014 3:30 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.

Does anyone really feel more comfortable with Bray or Murray (did not play yesterday...hmm...) taking over if Smith gets banged up?

Look, we are keeping Chase, Bray will be #3 and Murray will be on the IR for some mysterious injury that probably caused him to "miss"last night's game.

This isn't a new strategy to keep a developmental QB on your team and not risk some other team scooping him up before you can put them on your PS. 

I come in peace. I didn’t bring artillery. But I’m pleading with you, with tears in my eyes: If you f### with me, I’ll k!!! you all. -Gen. Mattis

Last edited 8/8/2014 3:30 PM by claytonadam

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Posted: 8/8/2014 3:33 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 



claytonadam wrote:

Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.

Does anyone really feel more comfortable with Bray or Murray (did not play yesterday...hmm...) taking over if Smith gets banged up?

Look, we are keeping Chase, Bray will be #3 and Murray will be on the IR for some mysterious injury that probably caused him to "miss"last night's game.

This isn't a new strategy to keep a developmental QB on your team and not risk some other team scooping him up before you can put them on your PS. 

why hold back murrays development for a player who is not part of the future of this team. chase is not going to be that guy for us. he is doing nothing but holding a place till the next guy passes him. give that spot to somebody that could help us. i don't want to cut some other kid on the team so we can keep a safety net for 1 year. he needs to go
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Posted: 8/8/2014 3:54 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


We are not releasing Chase so there's no rush for either youngster. Obviously we need one of them to step up for 2015 but there's still time for that.
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Posted: 8/8/2014 5:13 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 



We are not going to downgrade our chances of winning this year by going with QB who isnt ready as the main backup. Thats just plain silly. That said these coaches are evaluating these players every day and not just in preseason games. When a younger, cheaper player gains the coaches trust. The veteran gets replaced. Where are we right now in that process?

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--- sithlord13 wrote:

We are not releasing Chase so there's no rush for either youngster. Obviously we need one of them to step up for 2015 but there's still time for that.

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  • timmy62
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Posted: 8/8/2014 6:03 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 



Murray played last night didn't do anything but he did play.

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--- claytonadam wrote:

Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.

Does anyone really feel more comfortable with Bray or Murray (did not play yesterday...hmm...) taking over if Smith gets banged up?

Look, we are keeping Chase, Bray will be #3 and Murray will be on the IR for some mysterious injury that probably caused him to "miss"last night's game.

This isn't a new strategy to keep a developmental QB on your team and not risk some other team scooping him up before you can put them on your PS. 



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Posted: 8/9/2014 8:49 AM

Re: Tyler Bray Improved? 


You guys can seriously say that if Smith goes down Chase can lead this team into the playoffs? Exactly!!!!! Plus saving a little money doesn't hurt when trying to resign Houston and Smith.

Yes Chase seems to be the better QB ATM of the three, but Some things Bray does, like stay in the pocket and go through looks! Just makes him right there with Chase and IMO you cut ties with Chase and REALLY let Bray and Murray battle it out. Nothing wrong yo see how this kids perform under perssure

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Posted: 8/9/2014 9:15 AM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 



claytonadam wrote:

Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.
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Posted: 8/9/2014 9:43 AM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


You cant sabatoge the short term for potential that coaches do not trust to step in at this point. Its that simple. All things being even remotely equal then you absolutely dump the expensive veteran for the cheaper, younger, higher upside veteran. But there is a clear tipping point here especially with a position as important as QB. Notion we should just sacrifice a few games this season to keep a guy with potential who coaches believe isnt ready, is not something a good organization would do. This all comes down to where Murray and Bray really are. And thats hard to say.

Reid targeted Chase for a reason and he showed why in week 17 last year. In the short term we can win and most importantly wouldnt have to change offense much for Chase. With our very young oline thats important and his mobility again helpful. It again though is all incumbent on how much, if at all, the coaches trust Murray or Bray.


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--- Adamixoye wrote:


claytonadam wrote:Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.

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Posted: 8/9/2014 10:23 AM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.

I'm also not convinced that Reid wouldn't go with Chase as our QB if Alex walks.. The guy is 27 not 33...

Bray and Murray, if they want that #2 spot they are going to have to earn it. Reid isn't just going to say "You are younger and cheaper so I don't care how you play in preseason. Here is the job"

Ideally Bray or Murray outplay Daniels which makes him expendable but you can't force the issue.

If they don't outplay him and Daniels offers more than Bray or Murray then there's no way he should get cut. He could be our next QB if Smith walks. I still think Smith will get resigned but you never know.
Adamixoye wrote:
claytonadam wrote:

Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.

Last edited 8/9/2014 12:03 PM by NiceGuy890

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Posted: 8/9/2014 12:05 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Can't compare Last years Bray to this years Bray.

Could Bray if lost last years Chargers game too? Ya probably hahahahaha

You seriously think Reid/Dorsey would roll with Chase if Alex walked? Seriously man? I'm mean really????? I just can't see any way that KC would turn to Chase as our starter if Alex walks.

Odds would be that Reid goes with Bray or Murray OR even spend a higher draft pick on a QB.

0%, no I mean -1 billion trillion % chance KC would make. Base the starter next year if they let Alex walk! Just ain't gonna happen brah.


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--- NiceGuy890 wrote:

Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.

I'm also not convinced that Reid wouldn't go with Chase as our QB if Alex walks.. The guy is 27 not 33...

Bray and Murray, if they want that #2 spot they are going to have to earn it. Reid isn't just going to say "You are younger and cheaper so I don't care how you play in preseason. Here is the job"
Adamixoye wrote:
claytonadam wrote:Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.


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Posted: 8/9/2014 12:21 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


if Bray is better or even close to being as good as Daniels then why isn't he No 2 on the depth chart right now? He's a whole lot cheaper and younger so if Bray was as good as Daniels I'm pretty sure Reid would not hesitate to put him as our backup. I just don't think he is there yet.

The only reason people are even talking about this is because Bray plays QB.. Just like a lot of people wanted us to pick Geno Smith #1. It's like because a player is a QB and has some potential you risk everything and don't make logical decisions.

I don't know if Reid would go with Daniels. Probably not but you never know. If Daniels plays well in preseason and Alex Smith gets hurt and he starts and does a good job then yes I do think Reid would consider it.

The point I was trying to make is just because he is 27 doesn't mean he can't start in the NFL.

Either way I don't think this is a big issue. Reid will make the right decision whether it is Bray, Daniels or Murray who is our #2 QB. I support and trust Reid when it comes to that position even if I don't necessarily agree with what he decides..

IMO there's no way we should say Daniels should be cut right now. Let the preseason play out first.

But trust me I am rooting for Bray and Murray as much as you guys are!
balto wrote: Can't compare Last years Bray to this years Bray.

Could Bray if lost last years Chargers game too? Ya probably hahahahaha

You seriously think Reid/Dorsey would roll with Chase if Alex walked? Seriously man? I'm mean really????? I just can't see any way that KC would turn to Chase as our starter if Alex walks.

Odds would be that Reid goes with Bray or Murray OR even spend a higher draft pick on a QB.

0%, no I mean -1 billion trillion % chance KC would make. Base the starter next year if they let Alex walk! Just ain't gonna happen brah.


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--- NiceGuy890 wrote:

Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.

I'm also not convinced that Reid wouldn't go with Chase as our QB if Alex walks.. The guy is 27 not 33...

Bray and Murray, if they want that #2 spot they are going to have to earn it. Reid isn't just going to say "You are younger and cheaper so I don't care how you play in preseason. Here is the job"
Adamixoye wrote:
claytonadam wrote:Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.


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Last edited 8/9/2014 12:44 PM by NiceGuy890

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Posted: 8/9/2014 12:56 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Sounds good to me


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--- NiceGuy890 wrote:

if Bray is better or even close to being as good as Daniels then why isn't he No 2 on the depth chart right now? He's a whole lot cheaper and younger so if Bray was as good as Daniels I'm pretty sure Reid would not hesitate to put him as our backup. I just don't think he is there yet.

The only reason people are even talking about this is because Bray plays QB.. Just like a lot of people wanted us to pick Geno Smith #1. It's like because a player is a QB and has some potential you risk everything and don't make logical decisions.

I don't know if Reid would go with Daniels. Probably not but you never know. If Daniels plays well in preseason and Alex Smith gets hurt and he starts and does a good job then yes I do think Reid would consider it.

The point I was trying to make is just because he is 27 doesn't mean he can't start in the NFL.

Either way I don't think this is a big issue. Reid will make the right decision whether it is Bray, Daniels or Murray who is our #2 QB. I support and trust Reid when it comes to that position even if I don't necessarily agree with what he decides..

IMO there's no way we should say Daniels should be cut right now. Let the preseason play out first.

But trust me I am rooting for Bray and Murray as much as you guys are!
balto wrote: Can't compare Last years Bray to this years Bray.

Could Bray if lost last years Chargers game too? Ya probably hahahahaha

You seriously think Reid/Dorsey would roll with Chase if Alex walked? Seriously man? I'm mean really????? I just can't see any way that KC would turn to Chase as our starter if Alex walks.

Odds would be that Reid goes with Bray or Murray OR even spend a higher draft pick on a QB.

0%, no I mean -1 billion trillion % chance KC would make. Base the starter next year if they let Alex walk! Just ain't gonna happen brah.


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--- NiceGuy890 wrote:

Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.

I'm also not convinced that Reid wouldn't go with Chase as our QB if Alex walks.. The guy is 27 not 33...

Bray and Murray, if they want that #2 spot they are going to have to earn it. Reid isn't just going to say "You are younger and cheaper so I don't care how you play in preseason. Here is the job"
Adamixoye wrote:
claytonadam wrote:Why does everyone want to get rid of Chase? He's our only experienced backup.


Simple...because that's ALL he is, and if we really have to rely on him, we'll be in trouble.  A lot of people here favor the upside play.  It's not that hard to understand, even if you disagree.


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Posted: 8/9/2014 3:55 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Bray didn't need much physical work entering the league but had mental issues as the leader on offense. So it's not easy to make an assumption of when he'll be ready. I think Reid will give him as much time as he can, which is basically when Dorsey lets Chase leave. I think Bray will get some major look in the preseason as the main backup to see where he's at, could even start the last game. No matter the final result the only way I think Chase leaves is if Bray moves up to the backup spot as the better QB and we get a nice trade offer for Chase, which is probably but unlikely. 
mloe68 wrote:
We are not going to downgrade our chances of winning this year by going with QB who isnt ready as the main backup. Thats just plain silly. That said these coaches are evaluating these players every day and not just in preseason games. When a younger, cheaper player gains the coaches trust. The veteran gets replaced. Where are we right now in that process?

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--- sithlord13 wrote:

We are not releasing Chase so there's no rush for either youngster. Obviously we need one of them to step up for 2015 but there's still time for that.

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Posted: 8/9/2014 9:47 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


We LOST against a pretty mediocre team, and after a hot start in the game we were completely stifled for most of the last three quarters.  The mythology that Chase is a solid QB completely baffles me.

NiceGuy890 wrote: Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.
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Posted: 8/9/2014 9:58 PM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Don't see why going from 3rd to 2nd in practice is gonna be more mental for Bray? I see what you mean if Bray was taking over for Alex but not the #2, because even at #3 he is still a backup!

Mentally being #2 vs #3 doesn't matter IMO.


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--- sithlord13 wrote:

Bray didn't need much physical work entering the league but had mental issues as the leader on offense. So it's not easy to make an assumption of when he'll be ready. I think Reid will give him as much time as he can, which is basically when Dorsey lets Chase leave. I think Bray will get some major look in the preseason as the main backup to see where he's at, could even start the last game. No matter the final result the only way I think Chase leaves is if Bray moves up to the backup spot as the better QB and we get a nice trade offer for Chase, which is probably but unlikely. 
mloe68 wrote:
We are not going to downgrade our chances of winning this year by going with QB who isnt ready as the main backup. Thats just plain silly. That said these coaches are evaluating these players every day and not just in preseason games. When a younger, cheaper player gains the coaches trust. The veteran gets replaced. Where are we right now in that process?

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--- sithlord13 wrote:

We are not releasing Chase so there's no rush for either youngster. Obviously we need one of them to step up for 2015 but there's still time for that.

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Posted: 8/10/2014 12:49 AM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Well then Murray or Bray shouldn't have a hard time beating him out for the #2 spot. So I wouldn't worry about it.
Adamixoye wrote: We LOST against a pretty mediocre team, and after a hot start in the game we were completely stifled for most of the last three quarters.  The mythology that Chase is a solid QB completely baffles me.

NiceGuy890 wrote: Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.
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Posted: 8/10/2014 5:26 AM

Re: Tyler Bray. Improved? 


Two things to consider here that are not myths at all.

1. Andy Reid targeted Chase to be the backup rather than some 33 year old journeyman and Dorsey had to pay handsomely to get that done for him. The Saints thought enough of Chase they didnt even have a third QB on the roster.

2. Chase Daniels first NFL start, on the road, in essentially a playoff game for the opponent and surrounded by backups played an outstanding game. Certainly the type of effort you want from a backup. 200 plus passing yards, 50 rushing yards. The guy is really an ideal backup that fits Relds background of flipping for a draft pick after a few solid performances. Most importantly Daniels style, skill set and mental makeup, means we dont have to change the offense too much in a short term stint with him.


After the Pioli years of rolling worthless backups through here that nobody wanted, its really amazes me people want to downgrade the competition level of the position. Again though with all that said. If the coaches trust Bray or Murray to be the backup, there is no doubt an expensive backup like Chase will get moved out. Contract wise it was clear to me anyway that Andy Reid felt he needed two years to backstop the position adequately behind Chase.


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--- Adamixoye wrote:

We LOST against a pretty mediocre team, and after a hot start in the game we were completely stifled for most of the last three quarters.  The mythology that Chase is a solid QB completely baffles me.

NiceGuy890 wrote: Were we in trouble when we relied on him against SD when he was throwing to backup WRs? No we weren't.


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Posted: 8/10/2014 7:30 AM

Re: Tyler Bray Improved? 


I don't find any of those points all that compelling. I am not even disputing that, right now, Chase is a better QB and one that would give us a better chance of winning than Bray or Murray. What I am disputing is that the gap is so large that we can't consider taking on a little risk in order to give us better long term options, and get a little bit of cap relief in the meantime. Again, that's a cost/benefit analysis that shouldn't be that hard to understand even if you disagree.

Even with those concessions I will once again reiterate that I didn't find Chase's performance against San Diego to be anything special. Even though the stakes were high for San Diego, they were a terribly inconsistent team that didn't have a shutdown defense by any stretch. Even though Chase was playing with backups it's obvious those backups were PUMPED for their opportunity, so if anything Chase was probably in a better situation than if he had been playing with the starters (in that particular game).
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Posted: 8/10/2014 9:56 AM

Re: Tyler Bray Improved? 


You don't think Andy Reid/Dorsey knows this? Pretty sure if the gap wasn't that big Bray or Murray would be #2.

They probably are not ready yet. Maybe they'll light it up in one of the preseason games and that'll change things. But until then I'm going to trust Reid on this issue. He's the one constantly practicing and coaching these guys, not us.

I thought during the Chiefs-Bengals playoff game Trent Green did a really good job explaining why Daniels is our #2 QB right now. Peter King also made it pretty clear that Daniels will be our #2 QB..

Also SD's defense started out slow but finished pretty strong. After they gave up 41 pts to us they didn't give up more than 24 pts the rest of the year and that includes two games against the Broncos and  playoff game where they made Dalton look like a HS QB.

I'm not saying they were great but they weren't as bad as you make them sound.
Adamixoye wrote: I don't find any of those points all that compelling. I am not even disputing that, right now, Chase is a better QB and one that would give us a better chance of winning than Bray or Murray. What I am disputing is that the gap is so large that we can't consider taking on a little risk in order to give us better long term options, and get a little bit of cap relief in the meantime. Again, that's a cost/benefit analysis that shouldn't be that hard to understand even if you disagree.

Even with those concessions I will once again reiterate that I didn't find Chase's performance against San Diego to be anything special. Even though the stakes were high for San Diego, they were a terribly inconsistent team that didn't have a shutdown defense by any stretch. Even though Chase was playing with backups it's obvious those backups were PUMPED for their opportunity, so if anything Chase was probably in a better situation than if he had been playing with the starters (in that particular game).

Last edited 8/10/2014 10:00 AM by NiceGuy890

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