Free Trial Ad
Why Subscribe?
  • Player/Prospect News
  • Exclusive Insider Info
  • Members-Only Forums
  • Exclusive Videos
  • Subscribe Now!
Inbox

Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER played?

Posted: 7/15/2013 12:36 PM

Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER played? 


Criteria
--------
* Each listed team has to be from the same era or at most 5 years apart

* Each games is played at a neutral site/on a neutral field

* Each team has to be from the midwest region

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------

Make Believe Match-up #1= 1997 Michigan VS. 1994 PSU?

#2= 2002 Ohio State VS. 1997 Michigan

#3= 1973 Ohio State VS. 1973 Michigan?  (rematch)

#4= 1951 Illinois VS. 1951 Michigan State?

#5= 1947 Notre Dame VS. 1947 Michigan?

#6= 1966 Michigan State VS. 1968 Ohio State?

#7= 1966 Michigan State VS. 1966 Notre Dame?  (rematch)

-------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------

Q:  What are some others that I didn't list (IYO)?

Last edited 7/15/2013 12:37 PM by buki919

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 12:59 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 


1994 Penn State
1997 Michigan
1973 Michigan
1951 Michigan State
1947 Notre Dame
1968 Ohio State
1966 Notre Dame

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 1:28 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



buki919 wrote: Criteria
--------
* Each listed team has to be from the same era or at most 5 years apart

* Each games is played at a neutral site/on a neutral field

* Each team has to be from the midwest region

-------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------
Q:  What are some others that I didn't list (IYO)?
1994 Nebraska vs 1994 Penn State
1997 Nebraska vs 1997 Michigan
1993 Nebraska vs 1993 Notre Dame

1982 Nebraska vs 1982 Penn State (rematch)

1970 Nebraska vs 1970 Ohio State

1973 Penn State vs 1973 tOSU or 1973 Michigan

1971 Penn State vs 1971 Michigan
1968 Penn state vs 1968 Ohio State

"Not the victory but the action; Not the goal but the game; In the deed the glory."

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 2:14 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 


  • 1994 PSU:  The 1997 Michigan Team was good, but 1994 PSU was out of this world. 
  • 1997 Michigan:  As a fan I'd love to say that '02 tOSU would find a way but by any objective standard the 1997 Michigan team was better. 
  • 1973 tOSU:  How can anyone argue against this?  The tie happened in Ann Arbor, tOSU had a much better scoring differential against common opponents.  Objectively you have to go with tOSU on this, emotionally is a different thing. 
  • 1951 MSU:  The only common opponent that Illinois did better against was IU.  MSU did better against tOSU and M. 
  • 1947 Michigan:  Michigan 69, Pitt 0: ND 40, Pitt 6; Michigan 49, NU 21, ND 26, NU 19; Michigan 49, USC 0, ND 38, USC 7
  • 1968 tOSU:  Given what this team did to USC, Purdue, and Michigan: I have trouble imagining a near-contemporary team that could take them out. 
  • 1966 . . . no idea:  It is really hard to know what to make of these two teams because their schedules (largely through no fault of their own) were not very good.  The next best team that either played was probably Purdue and MSU did better (41-20 v 26-14).  For both teams the rest of the schedule sounds good until you look at the records that year.  tOSU, Michigan, Okla, and USC all lost at least four games leaving only Purdue and each other as quality opponents for these two in 1966.  MSU did better in the common-opponent game, but ND was on the road for the tie.  Coinflip. 
HelmetHead.jpg image by dirham1GO BUCKS!!!
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 2:22 PM

RE: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER played 


I can't really comment on the old games, but I'd take '94 PSU comfortably over '97 Michigan, and '97 Michigan all day over '02 Ohio State.

Head Full of Doubt, Road Full of Promise
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 2:30 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



FearlessF wrote:
1994 Nebraska vs 1994 Penn State
1997 Nebraska vs 1997 Michigan
1993 Nebraska vs 1993 Notre Dame
I'd take '94 Nebraska, although I don't think you could go wrong either way.

'97 Michigan

I'm much more familiar with '93 Nebraska than I am with '93 Notre Dame.  Just looking at the schedules, both seem inferior to '93 FSU, yet ND beat em and Brasky got screwed.  So flip a coin I guess.

Head Full of Doubt, Road Full of Promise
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 3:22 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



medinabuckeye1 wrote: 

1973 tOSU:  How can anyone argue against this?  The tie happened in Ann Arbor, tOSU had a much better scoring differential against common opponents.  Objectively you have to go with tOSU on this, emotionally is a different thing. 
The idea of a thought experiment rematch probably assumes all players start and finish the game healthy. If Franklin doesn't break his clavicle, there's a good chance the first one doesn't finish in a tie. Michigan was driving in Ohio State territory with 2:00 remaining.

Additionally, there's the fact that even Woody Hayes felt, after the game, that Michigan would be the Big Ten's Rose Bowl rep. At the very best, there's a great objective case for Michigan winning the rubber match. At the very least, you can't help but admit it's more than just emotions.
I celebrate myself and sing myself 
And what I assume you shall assume 
For every atom belonging to me as good belongs to you. 
I loafe and invite my soul
I lean and loafe at my ease 
observing a spear of summer grass.
~Walt Whitman

Last edited 7/15/2013 3:24 PM by dudekd

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 3:31 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



medinabuckeye1 wrote:
  • 1947 Michigan:  Michigan 69, Pitt 0: ND 40, Pitt 6; Michigan 49, NU 21, ND 26, NU 19; Michigan 49, USC 0, ND 38, USC 7 
Thank you. Both finished 9-0. Michigan's margins were better. After the bowl season (Michigan toppled USC 49-0), the AP filed an unofficial poll for #1 overall and Michigan garnered almost double as many votes as Notre Dame (226 versus 119).
I celebrate myself and sing myself 
And what I assume you shall assume 
For every atom belonging to me as good belongs to you. 
I loafe and invite my soul
I lean and loafe at my ease 
observing a spear of summer grass.
~Walt Whitman

Last edited 7/15/2013 3:32 PM by dudekd

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 3:58 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



dudekd wrote: Additionally, there's the fact that even Woody Hayes felt, after the game, that Michigan would be the Big Ten's Rose Bowl rep. At the very best, there's a great objective case for Michigan winning the rubber match. At the very least, you can't help but admit it's more than just emotions.
I've always assumed that Woody felt that way because the BigTen had only recently dropped the 'no-repeat' rule.  Also, subsequently the BigTen adopted the 'longest loser' rule that broke ties by sending the team that hadn't been to Pasadena for the longest. 

Both of those indicate a conference preference for not sending the same team year-after-year but neither of those had anything to do with quality.  Thus I do not buy the idea that Woody's feeling had anything to do with his assesment of the quality of the two teams. 

tOSU had better MoV's and that fact has nothing to do with Franklin's Clavicle.  tOSU also tied on the road.  I just don't see it.
HelmetHead.jpg image by dirham1GO BUCKS!!!
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 4:09 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



dudekd wrote:
medinabuckeye1 wrote:
  • 1947 Michigan:  Michigan 69, Pitt 0: ND 40, Pitt 6; Michigan 49, NU 21, ND 26, NU 19; Michigan 49, USC 0, ND 38, USC 7 
Thank you. Both finished 9-0. Michigan's margins were better. After the bowl season (Michigan toppled USC 49-0), the AP filed an unofficial poll for #1 overall and Michigan garnered almost double as many votes as Notre Dame (226 versus 119).

Although, I think only the Northwestern one carries much weight.  I don't like to compare MOV when both games were blowouts.  28 is obviously more impressive than 7, but both teams blew out Pitt and USC, at that point the variance of the blowout means little.

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/15/2013 4:16 PM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



IAhawk15 wrote:

I'm much more familiar with '93 Nebraska than I am with '93 Notre Dame.  Just looking at the schedules, both seem inferior to '93 FSU, yet ND beat em and Brasky got screwed.  So flip a coin I guess.
Still remember Boo Hoo Lou whining while wearing his neck brace.  Just wish the Huskers could have had a shot at the Irish that season.

"Not the victory but the action; Not the goal but the game; In the deed the glory."

Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/16/2013 1:31 AM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 



EastLansingAdam wrote:
dudekd wrote:
medinabuckeye1 wrote:
  • 1947 Michigan:  Michigan 69, Pitt 0: ND 40, Pitt 6; Michigan 49, NU 21, ND 26, NU 19; Michigan 49, USC 0, ND 38, USC 7 
Thank you. Both finished 9-0. Michigan's margins were better. After the bowl season (Michigan toppled USC 49-0), the AP filed an unofficial poll for #1 overall and Michigan garnered almost double as many votes as Notre Dame (226 versus 119).

Although, I think only the Northwestern one carries much weight.  I don't like to compare MOV when both games were blowouts.  28 is obviously more impressive than 7, but both teams blew out Pitt and USC, at that point the variance of the blowout means little.
Agreed, and my proposal to correct the lack of MoV in the BCS formula without encouraging teams to run it up was to average the lead at half, end 3rd, and end, and cap the MoV at 21.  I included those though because it shows consistency.  They played three common opponents and Michigan did better against all three.
HelmetHead.jpg image by dirham1GO BUCKS!!!
Reply | Quote
Avatar

Posted: 7/17/2013 8:53 AM

Re: Who wins these (7) best Midwest [region] games NEVER 


1. Michigan
2. Michigan
3. Michigan won the first one.  Lantry's field goal was good. 
4. Illinois
5. Michigan
6. Ohio State
7. Michigan State

A decade of Victory over Penn State.

All in since 1969

Reply | Quote